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Vaccine required for fans

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canebreak

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Jan 26, 2004
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So according to our Governor, he needs a vaccine or an effective treatment before fans can return. This was stated in context of football but it would certainly apply to basketball.

Does this governor not understand that ain’t gonna happen this year and it might never happen. There has never been a vaccine for any previous coronavirus. At best it’s 18 months away. He is pinning everything on a vaccine. He wants certainty in life. It’s a fools errand. I understand his desire to make life safe but he is living in a fantasy. This virus is going to run it’s course....period. Whether we hide or not.

I’m not hating on this governor. He has a terrible job. But I just don’t understand how we can continue. It’s not about me watching sports. It’s about getting the world back before we lose it all, thus making Corona the least of our problems.
 
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DocPT

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Feb 10, 2010
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canebreak said:
So according to our Governor, he needs a vaccine or an effective treatment before fans can return. This was stated in context of football but it would certainly apply to basketball.

Does this governor not understand that ain’t gonna happen this year and it might never happen. There has never been a vaccine for any previous coronavirus. At best it’s 18 months away. He is pinning everything on a vaccine. He wants certainty in life. It’s a fools errand. I understand his desire to make life safe but he is living in a fantasy. This virus is going to run it’s course....period. Whether we hide or not.

I’m not hating on this governor. He has a terrible job. But I just don’t understand how we can continue. It’s not about me watching sports. It’s about getting the world back before we lose it all, thus making Corona the least of our problems.
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He can KMA. F’ing miniature hitler thinks kentuckians are his little puppets. Him and Stalin can share a room in hell
 
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chroix

chroix

Heisman
Jul 22, 2013
10,022
25,206
113
There are too many unknowns for a responsible person to say for things to proceed as normal with large gatherings of thousands of people. Anybody saying otherwise isn’t really thinking through the ramifications. We all want sports back and we all want something closer to normal. Calling the governor Hitler doesn’t get you any closer to it just like blaming Trump won’t either. Just makes you harder to take seriously.
 
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S

sluggercatfan

Heisman
Aug 17, 2004
35,953
29,630
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canebreak said:
So according to our Governor, he needs a vaccine or an effective treatment before fans can return. This was stated in context of football but it would certainly apply to basketball.

Does this governor not understand that ain’t gonna happen this year and it might never happen. There has never been a vaccine for any previous coronavirus. At best it’s 18 months away. He is pinning everything on a vaccine. He wants certainty in life. It’s a fools errand. I understand his desire to make life safe but he is living in a fantasy. This virus is going to run it’s course....period. Whether we hide or not.

I’m not hating on this governor. He has a terrible job. But I just don’t understand how we can continue. It’s not about me watching sports. It’s about getting the world back before we lose it all, thus making Corona the least of our problems.
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"Does this governor not understand that ain’t gonna happen this year and it might never happen"...gotta hold on that that power!
 
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HagginHall1999

HagginHall1999

Heisman
Oct 19, 2018
15,814
28,212
113
In the context of sports I just want them back...if the fans cannot be there for a while, so be it. It will be weird watching it on TV but we have enough technology to where the networks will make it enjoyable.

I am not sure how many fans would even go to games if it was open today.
 
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TankedCat

Heisman
Nov 8, 2006
22,792
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the intent of restrictions wasn't to eliminate the virus, it was to control the numbers of infected until the country was prepared to deal with it.

that doesn't translate to wait until a vaccine is available in 2021 or later.

its inevitable as we try to return to normal that the % of cases will increase. Why would anyone be shocked at this?
 
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canebreak

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chroix said:
There are too many unknowns for a responsible person to say for things to proceed as normal with large gatherings of thousands of people. Anybody saying otherwise isn’t really thinking through the ramifications. We all want sports back and we all want something closer to normal. Calling the governor Hitler doesn’t get you any closer to it just like blaming Trump won’t either. Just makes you harder to take seriously.
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I’m 100% thinking thru ramifications and a 1% death toll (of those infected) is horrible but shutting down livelihoods is on magnitude far worse. You realize the implications of Kentucky’s 40% unemployment? It’s death alright. And lots of it.
 
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chroix

chroix

Heisman
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When you watch football how much attention do you really pay to the fans? Basketball would be weirder because the fans line the court but football they’re set back so far anyway they’re barely ever in the shot.
 
chroix

chroix

Heisman
Jul 22, 2013
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canebreak said:
I’m 100% thinking thru ramifications and a 1% death toll (of those infected) is horrible but shutting down livelihoods is on magnitude far worse. You realize the implications of Kentucky’s 40% unemployment? It’s death alright. And lots of it.
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You realize that very few of those jobs revolve around sports right? We can probably have sports without fans in the stands so what’s the issue for you? You are conflating two things that don’t lineup.
 
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DocPT

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sambowieshin said:
Good Lord.....what a drama queen hissy fit.
https://www.foxnews.com/health/u-s-...ity-rate-20-fold-greater-than-influenza-study
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Good lord look closer at the studies. More than 1/2 of the deaths have occurred in nursing homes/LTC facilities because governors thought it would be smart to put the sick with the sick/fragile. Look at the whole picture and do some true research and you’ll find the true answer. Then look at how they confirm corona deaths. For example if you are on hospice and you die but tested positive to corona it still have positive case. So please put your big boy pants on and look into valid information and make your own conclusion. Glad I could inform you on the true numbers.
 
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CatPatrick13

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Oboro3 said:
In South Korea And China, Loosening Restrictions Brings Coronavirus Resurgence

https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...covid-19-resurgence-after-easing-restrictions
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The article really makes the case from the South Korean experience that bars should wait a while before opening back up. Wuhan went 35 days without a case? Now they have some more? This Covid won’t go away and there should not be linear thinking that it will. From the article it really sounds contained.
 
seccats04

seccats04

Heisman
Dec 6, 2004
13,947
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Deeeefense

Deeeefense

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Aug 22, 2001
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canebreak said:
There has never been a vaccine for any previous coronavirus. At best it’s 18 months away. He is pinning everything on a vaccine.
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Going by what you said in the previous paragraph he said "or an effective treatment". An effective treatment could be right around the corner. And what is the definition of an effective treatment? Right now you could say remdesivir is an effective treatment. It obviously isn't a cure, but it has been proven to help some, so it fits the definition of an "effective treatment".

Politicians sometimes use what I call "weasel words" to answer tough questions. That is an answer that seems to give a response but in actuality is somewhat open ended and can mean almost anything. I think this may be the case here.

Hang in their fans we will have football and I'm sure at some point we will have some fan participation. Maybe not packed stadiums on Sept 6 but we'll eventually get back to normal.
 
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HagginHall1999

HagginHall1999

Heisman
Oct 19, 2018
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sambowieshin said:
Good Lord.....what a drama queen hissy fit.
https://www.foxnews.com/health/u-s-...ity-rate-20-fold-greater-than-influenza-study
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I have a hard time wrapping my head around this as an apples to apples comparison.

COVID has been responsible for 80k deaths in US right? This has been in the states since early January by all accounts and more people will die obviously, but there is no vaccine.

Seasonal flu killed 70 or 80k in 2017-2018 flu season....no social distancing but a widespread vaccination...yet that many people still died.

It is also widely thought that way more people have had COVID than have either been tested or reported...those with asymptomatic response.

It is hard for me to understand how death rate is 20x greater due to the above.

We don't have a vaccine...regardless of social distancing people were meandering around as normal for 2 months in January thru mid to late March while this virus was already in the states spreading.

It seems far too early to tell on any of this and anything being reported regardless if it is Fox or CNN is pure fear mongering.
 
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canebreak

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chroix said:
You realize that very few of those jobs revolve around sports right? We can probably have sports without fans in the stands so what’s the issue for you? You are conflating two things that don’t lineup.
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no. I’m not in the least confused. And I’m not conflating. I don’t think you read what I said. I could really care less. I go to one or two games a year. The issue is if folks can’t gather it goes way beyond sports. I think maybe your confused or else you can’t understand the implications without it being specifically extrapolated beyond sports.
 
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sluggercatfan

Heisman
Aug 17, 2004
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HagginHall1999 said:
In the context of sports I just want them back...if the fans cannot be there for a while, so be it. It will be weird watching it on TV but we have enough technology to where the networks will make it enjoyable.

I am not sure how many fans would even go to games if it was open today.
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Would be there in a heart beat mask and all and I'm one of the so called vulnerable ones age wise.
 
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canebreak

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Deeeefense said:
Going by what you said in the previous paragraph he said "or an effective treatment". An effective treatment could be right around the corner. And what is the definition of an effective treatment? Right now you could say remdesivir is an effective treatment. It obviously isn't a cure, but it has been proven to help some, so it fits the definition of an "effective treatment".

Politicians sometimes use what I call "weasel words" to answer tough questions. That is an answer that seems to give a response but in actuality is somewhat open ended and can mean almost anything. I think this may be the case here.

Hang in their fans we will have football and I'm sure at some point we will have some fan participation. Maybe not packed stadiums on Sept 6 but we'll eventually get back to normal.
Click to expand...

agree with much. An effective treatment seems far more likely. Assuming it is a drug like remdesivir that has already been tested and approved.
 
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chroix

chroix

Heisman
Jul 22, 2013
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canebreak said:
no. I’m not in the least confused. And I’m not conflating. I don’t think you read what I said. I could really care less. I go to one or two games a year. The issue is if folks can’t gather it goes way beyond sports. I think maybe your confused or else you can’t understand the implications without it being specifically extrapolated beyond sports.
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ok. What other gatherings occur where there are thousands of people? Concerts? What other events? Probably going to have to hold off on those.

Do sports events and concerts not happening lead to 40% unemployment? You sure you’re thinking through the ramifications?
 
HagginHall1999

HagginHall1999

Heisman
Oct 19, 2018
15,814
28,212
113
chroix said:
I’d bet if the flu killed 80,000 people in three months with every one social distancing we’d take it just as seriously.
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It killed 80k in 6 months two years ago with a vaccine...primarily inflicting death upon same age group and more toddlers/infants. Again, with a vaccine.

Social distancing is a deterrent but we didn't even start it until at least 2 months after COVID was in the states...and that is AT LEAST. Isn't a vaccine more of a deterrent than social distancing?

Way more people have COVID than has been reported and they are signing off death certificates as caused by COVID when a guy had a .55 BAC in Colorado.

It shouldn't be blown out of proportion either way and it has been.
 
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chroix

chroix

Heisman
Jul 22, 2013
10,022
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HagginHall1999 said:
It killed 80k in 6 months two years ago with a vaccine...primarily inflicting death upon same age group and more toddlers/infants. Again, with a vaccine.

Social distancing is a deterrent but we didn't even start it until at least 2 months after COVID was in the states...and that is AT LEAST. Isn't a vaccine more of a deterrent than social distancing?

Way more people have COVID than has been reported and they are signing off death certificates as caused by COVID when a guy had a .55 BAC in Colorado.

It shouldn't be blown out of proportion either way and it has been.
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So 40k in three months with no social distancing. You can see how there is a difference right? I don’t like the way things are either but there are some issues with a bunch of the logic being applied to reopening. I’m sure you’ll counter and say it’s hyped or whatever but the reality is we don’t know enough to make definitive statements about much anything related to this and anybody doing so most likely has an agenda attached.
 
S

sluggercatfan

Heisman
Aug 17, 2004
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canebreak said:
agree with much. An effective treatment seems far more likely. Assuming it is a drug like remdesivir that has already been tested and approved.
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My PC told my wife and l If we become symptomatic he would put us on hydroxychloroquine and zpack in a heart beat.
 
HagginHall1999

HagginHall1999

Heisman
Oct 19, 2018
15,814
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chroix said:
So 40k in three months with no social distancing. You can see how there is a difference right? I don’t like the way things are either but there are some issues with a bunch of the logic being applied to reopening. I’m sure you’ll counter and say it’s hyped or whatever but the reality is we don’t know enough to make definitive statements about much anything related to this and anybody doing so most likely has an agenda attached.
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Nah, I am not arguing seriousness of COVID but what I see is similar to a bad strain of the flu. I guess what I am saying is even if an effective vaccine presents itself this will be around to stay similar to flu virus. I think people uses the flu and act as if it is not serious when in fact it has produced serious results even with a vaccine.
 
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A

Atrain7732

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TankedCat said:
the intent of restrictions wasn't to eliminate the virus, it was to control the numbers of infected until the country was prepared to deal with it.

that doesn't translate to wait until a vaccine is available in 2021 or later.

its inevitable as we try to return to normal that the % of cases will increase. Why would anyone be shocked at this?
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Exactly. I love how the entire narrative changed once a certain segment of people realized that their “bombardment” of the health care industry that they continuously threatened was inevitable was not going to happen anywhere outside of NYC. If anything, this blanket quarantine has had dramatic financial repercussions on many of the smaller and more rural hospitals, as well as even the bigger ones in the 80-90% of the rest of the country that did not experience anywhere near what NY & NJ did.

Now, after telling us for weeks that the entire goal was to flatten the curve and protect the health care system, the narrative has now become that we are saving lives and even one life is too precious to lose. That argument would be more believable had they made the same stance in 2017 when 70-80k died from the flu. I don’t make the claim this virus is the same as the flu, but if ultimately the death toll is within the range of a bad flu season, the quarantine argument has no legs. Sweden and Japan made common sense distancing and precautionary measures while still keeping schools and most businesses open. Far as I have seen, there is no evidence they suffered any more or less than their surrounding neighbors who initiated these draconian lockdown measures that certain US cities and states have also adopted.

Now you have some of these jackasses advocating to extend this silliness for months longer. Wait until fall where we inevitably have another breakout and they will try this crap again. The only way this thing will go away is when we achieve herd immunity and that is not going to happen by declaring martial law and arresting people for walking on the beach.

I am thankful for my livelihood and family and the 25 employees who work for my business that I live in Florida and our Gov has enough sense to ignore the national media bombardment and do what was the most common sense safety measures without instituting a complete lockdown. Then allowing for things to open again in a reasonable way. It’s been largely business as normal here in SW Florida and our numbers are no different per capita than anywhere else. Funny how that works.
 
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UKGrad93

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Jun 20, 2007
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I don’t think we can compare covid deaths with flu deaths. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/new-coronavirus-compare-with-flu.html

So far, covid deaths have been counted (you can argue about how some are counted, but I doubt it greatly affects the numbers). Flu deaths are estimated, not counted. Not really a good comparison.

Looks like there are some other treatments that can be looked at. https://www.statnews.com/2020/05/14/gilead-should-ditch-remdesivir-and-focus-on-its-simpler-safer-ancestor/

[URL]https://www.biospace.com/article/sorrento-ids-antibody-against-covid-19-that-appears-100-percent-effective/

[/URL]
 
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wildcatwelder_rivals

Heisman
Jul 28, 2006
11,260
15,781
113
Here at UK our confirmed cases have risen in the past week or so. Why?...........

..........Because they're all prisoners from either the FCDC, or from the FMC. In jail/prison they're in close proximity to one another, so it, or ANY illness, spreads like wildfire.

We HAVE to stop acting like pansies and open the damn state/country back up, period. This is a prime example of the "cure" being much worse than the illness.
 
C

CatOfDaVille

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Mar 30, 2007
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seccats04 said:
Protect the vulnerable and the rest of us can take precautions. China opened back up and their cases have gone down. We can't stay hidden forever.
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seccats04 said:
I'm sorry but China has already lied about their numbers. I don't believe anything they say. They lied and then hoarded all the PPE. Who knows what their motivation is now. Not to mention how the media lies.
Click to expand...

Well, which is it? Do we believe China or not?
 
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Atrain7732

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UKGrad93 said:
I don’t think we can compare covid deaths with flu deaths. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/new-coronavirus-compare-with-flu.html

So far, covid deaths have been counted (you can argue about how some are counted, but I doubt it greatly affects the numbers). Flu deaths are estimated, not counted. Not really a good comparison.

Looks like there are some other treatments that can be looked at. https://www.statnews.com/2020/05/14...ivir-and-focus-on-its-simpler-safer-ancestor/
https://www.statnews.com/2020/05/14...ivir-and-focus-on-its-simpler-safer-ancestor/
https://www.biospace.com/article/so...-covid-19-that-appears-100-percent-effective/
https://www.statnews.com/2020/05/14...ivir-and-focus-on-its-simpler-safer-ancestor/
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To be clear I am not arguing that Covid-19 is equiv or even in the same ball park of the flu both regarding its mortality and ability to spread more quickly. I simply stated that strictly based on the death numbers if it ends up being akin to a bad flu season I don’t agree that this draconian quarantine where everyone is mandated to stay at home was warranted. There is also clear evidence that the states and countries who did not participate in these outrageous methods suffered no more or less than the ones who did.

We have to open things up and people who may be susceptible need to quarantine and be careful. That’s how every other quarantine has been done until now far as I can tell. I don’t fancy myself any more knowledgeable than others on this, it just seems that we have went way overboard and I’m very concerned we have wrecked the global economy, which—admit it or not—could possibly cause more dire effects and a higher death toll than this virus has so far. Again, it would be completely different to me if there was any type of clear evidence that the lockdown quarantines have worked in the US.

This is all JMHO. I respect others opinions who differ, and I sometimes even bounce back and forth. But, to me it seems we should be able to find a happy medium that includes extreme safety measures while also allowing for most businesses And schools to be open.

https://www.statnews.com/2018/09/26/cdc-us-flu-deaths-winter/
 
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U

UKGrad93

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Atrain7732 said:
To be clear I am not arguing that Covid-19 is equiv or even in the same ball park of the flu both regarding its mortality and ability to spread more quickly. I simply stated that strictly based on the death numbers if it ends up being akin to a bad flu season I don’t agree that this draconian quarantine where everyone is mandated to stay at home was warranted. There is also clear evidence that the states and countries who did not participate in these outrageous methods suffered no more or less than the ones who did.

We have to open things up and people who may be susceptible need to quarantine and be careful. That’s how every other quarantine has been done until now far as I can tell. I don’t fancy myself any more knowledgeable than others on this, it just seems that we have went way overboard and I’m very concerned we have wrecked the global economy, which—admit it or not—could possibly cause more dire effects and a higher death toll than this virus has so far. Again, it would be completely different to me if there was any type of clear evidence that the lockdown quarantines have worked in the US.

This is all JMHO. I respect others opinions who differ, and I sometimes even bounce back and forth. But, to me it seems we should be able to find a happy medium that includes extreme safety measures while also allowing for most businesses And schools to be open.

https://www.statnews.com/2018/09/26/cdc-us-flu-deaths-winter/
Click to expand...
Please do not take my post as arguing for continued lock down. I do think that covid deaths are far more than flu deaths and covid is much easier transmitted. That said, we have a lot of evidence that younger working age people fair pretty well with the disease and old frail people are especially at risk. Population density seems to play a big role in the spread. I think that we mostly should have opened up a month ago when those facts became clear. No way we can afford to wait for a vaccine (that may never come). We need to move on with learning how to live with the virus.
 
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