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Mossreportdos

Redshirt
Jun 21, 2015
133
3
18
Does anyone know what they do at other schools when they have a situation like the Cats have with Johnnie Vassar taking up a scholarship and not playing on the team?

It would be logical to somehow buy the player off with a different scholarship to get the Basketball one back. Or do we just not have the resources to make this happen.

Thoughts.
 
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NJCat

All-Conference
Mar 7, 2016
21,326
1,501
113
Mossreportdos said:
Does anyone know what they do at other schools when they have a situation like the Cats have with Johnnie Vassar taking up a scholarship and not playing on the team?

It would be logical to somehow buy the player off with a different scholarship to get the Basketball one back. Or do we just not have the resources to make this happen.

Thoughts.
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I think it doesn't matter what other schools do. NU's policy is scholarships are a 4 year commitment and unless/until he transfers he has a free education.
 
M

Mossreportdos

Redshirt
Jun 21, 2015
133
3
18
Can't they move it to an academic scholarship or need based scholarship? Just very frustrating how NU seems to never have a full basketball squad.
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
Mossreportdos said:
Can't they move it to an academic scholarship or need based scholarship? Just very frustrating how NU seems to never have a full basketball squad.
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No. Maybe they should have recruited a different player. They knew his history and gambled on him. He's merely taking advantage of a poor recruiting decision by Coach, who has made many good ones but this was just not one of them.
 
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willycat

Junior
Jan 11, 2005
21,448
318
0
YesterdaysCat said:
No. Maybe they should have recruited a different player. They knew his history and gambled on him. He's merely taking advantage of a poor recruiting decision by Coach, who has made many good ones but this was just not one of them.
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That's probably true but he is being very selfish and is hurting his former teammates in the process.
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
willycat said:
That's probably true but he is being very selfish and is hurting his former teammates in the process.
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What should he do? He was given a 4-yr scholarship to a prestigious university. Should he give that up and go to Mississippi Valley State?

This was the Coach's mistake, offering a scholarship to a player who was not a good fit. The player should not pay for the coach's error.
 
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Gocatsgo2003

All-Conference
Mar 30, 2006
46,624
2,983
78
YesterdaysCat said:
What should he do? He was given a 4-yr scholarship to a prestigious university. Should he give that up and go to Mississippi Valley State?

This was the Coach's mistake, offering a scholarship to a player who was not a good fit. The player should not pay for the coach's error.
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One could argue that Vassar staying at NU for the education despite not playing basketball is evidence that he's a great fit.
 
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M

Medill90

Junior
Jan 30, 2011
6,910
321
0
YesterdaysCat said:
What should he do? He was given a 4-yr scholarship to a prestigious university. Should he give that up and go to Mississippi Valley State?

This was the Coach's mistake, offering a scholarship to a player who was not a good fit. The player should not pay for the coach's error.
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I don't have a problem with Vasser wanting the NU sheepskin. And I don't have a problem with Collins not wanting him back on the team.

When NU gets three four-star players to commit and a five-star says he wants to come perhaps I'll change my mind. But I've seen Vasser play and I've seen Malnati play and I'd rather have Malnati than Vasser so no biggie.
 
ThePurpleKnight

ThePurpleKnight

Junior
Jan 7, 2012
595
210
38
Time to change the policy. Four year guarantee should only be apply to non roster player if an injury or serious medical issue arises. The current policy can benefit a quitter or lazy player who simply doesn't meet his end of the deal, while hurting the program and preventing another player from getting a scholarship. Time for Vassar's deal to end.
 
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T

thewildcat2011

Senior
Jul 25, 2011
7,670
537
113
xxjfgxx said:
Time to change the policy. Four year guarantee should only be apply to non roster player if an injury or serious medical issue arises. The current policy can benefit a quitter or lazy player who simply doesn't meet his end of the deal, while hurting the program and preventing another player from getting a scholarship. Time for Vassar's deal to end.
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******* millenials, smdh.
 
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W

willycat

Junior
Jan 11, 2005
21,448
318
0
xxjfgxx said:
Time to change the policy. Four year guarantee should only be apply to non roster player if an injury or serious medical issue arises. The current policy can benefit a quitter or lazy player who simply doesn't meet his end of the deal, while hurting the program and preventing another player from getting a scholarship. Time for Vassar's deal to end.
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"I Predict"! The deal is over, per Ecat.
 
F

FeliSilvestris

Redshirt
Oct 21, 2004
3,493
22
0
YesterdaysCat said:
What should he do? He was given a 4-yr scholarship to a prestigious university. Should he give that up and go to Mississippi Valley State?
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Why MVS?
There are plenty of scholarship-granting academically strong schools that have decent basketball programs at lesser conferences. Hard to believe no such school (not even one) would take a chance on a player who at least coming out of HS was perceived as a B1G player, by at least one staff. So, he could probably get a free education of comparable (possibly slightly higher) value, while playing the sport he presumably loves at a level appropriate to his skill.

Not clear at all why he wouldn't go that route. Again, hard to believe not ONE single academic school with decent basketball would take him.

P.S. The Ivies technically do not offer athletic skoolies but their aid packages to qualifying student-athletes could be VERY generous.
 
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NJCat

All-Conference
Mar 7, 2016
21,326
1,501
113
xxjfgxx said:
Time to change the policy. Four year guarantee should only be apply to non roster player if an injury or serious medical issue arises.
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In fact, if a player has a serious injury or medical issue, he or she can be converted to a non-counting scholarship today. No need for a new policy in that case.
 
S

Styre

Senior
Oct 14, 2004
7,728
401
83
xxjfgxx said:
Time to change the policy. Four year guarantee should only be apply to non roster player if an injury or serious medical issue arises. The current policy can benefit a quitter or lazy player who simply doesn't meet his end of the deal, while hurting the program and preventing another player from getting a scholarship. Time for Vassar's deal to end.
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So just to be clear, you support coaches like Tom Crean cutting players from the roster and taking away their scholarships when better options come along, correct? Because that's what this policy is there to protect against.
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
VirginiaWildcat said:
So he's saying that bouncing around high schools makes him unrecruitable??
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Uh, no, he was recruitable--other schools offered him--but we may have reached on him based on his other offers. Also, if I remember correctly--and maybe I'm not--there was some concern about his transcript due to all of the transfers. Maybe the concern belonged only to NU fans here. Nonetheless, GoCatsGo said it well; Vassar's frequent transfers could have indicated that Vassar would be unlikely to stay put. As it turned out, it was a good indicator; Vassar did want to transfer from NU at one point. Strangely, Vassar has probably stayed at NU longer than any of HS stops by now.

In any case, whether it was the offer list or the frequent transfers, his recruitment may have been a mistake, and now in hindsight, we know it definitely was.
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
FeliSilvestris said:
Why MVS?
There are plenty of scholarship-granting academically strong schools that have decent basketball programs at lesser conferences. Hard to believe no such school (not even one) would take a chance on a player who at least coming out of HS was perceived as a B1G player, by at least one staff. So, he could probably get a free education of comparable (possibly slightly higher) value, while playing the sport he presumably loves at a level appropriate to his skill.

Not clear at all why he wouldn't go that route. Again, hard to believe not ONE single academic school with decent basketball would take him.

P.S. The Ivies technically do not offer athletic skoolies but their aid packages to qualifying student-athletes could be VERY generous.
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Yet he has not transferred, so he did not receive any offers or did not receive an offer that he liked or maybe he just loves it at NU.

So yes, I agree; you would think that he would have received some interest. What conclusion can you draw from the fact that he is still here?
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
xxjfgxx said:
Time to change the policy. Four year guarantee should only be apply to non roster player if an injury or serious medical issue arises. The current policy can benefit a quitter or lazy player who simply doesn't meet his end of the deal, while hurting the program and preventing another player from getting a scholarship. Time for Vassar's deal to end.
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That's why our coach has to take great care when extending offers. I'm sure that Coach will not offer a lightly-recruited prospect with so many HS stops again. Coach may have had a hard time getting a read on Vassar's personality because of the frequency of transfers.
 
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VirginiaWildcat

Junior
Aug 31, 2001
23,343
332
0
YesterdaysCat said:
Uh, no, he was recruitable--other schools offered him--but we may have reached on him based on his other offers.
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That's a bit of a stretch without having any inside information. Also, didn't you just say he was "lightly recruited"? If he was lightly recruited, I highly doubt that would be the sole reason we'd reach for him...
 
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VirginiaWildcat

Junior
Aug 31, 2001
23,343
332
0
Styre said:
So just to be clear, you support coaches like Tom Crean cutting players from the roster and taking away their scholarships when better options come along, correct? Because that's what this policy is there to protect against.
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Wait...I thought you said Collins was Creaning people regardless?
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
VirginiaWildcat said:
That's a bit of a stretch without having any inside information. Also, didn't you just say he was "lightly recruited"? If he was lightly recruited, I highly doubt that would be the sole reason we'd reach for him...
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At the time of his commitment, this board talked about how he could be a steal due to his athleticism. A "steal" because he was not highly recruited. There was also quite a bit of discussion on whether or not other schools were scared off by his HS resume.

I don't know how you can argue that he was highly recruited when he was not. I don't know how you can say he was a good signing because he was not. That's just a fact. He was a bad sign, no matter whose fault it is that he didn't wind up contributing. Coach Collins would undoubtedly agree that the ultimate responsibility belongs with the head coach. You need not defend him so breathlessly, Chip.
 
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VirginiaWildcat

Junior
Aug 31, 2001
23,343
332
0
YesterdaysCat said:
Not Styre, but it sure looks like Collins was very encouraging of kids to leave the team so he could bring in his own guys.
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Every D1 coach has done that. That's not Creaning. That's being honest..."not sure you have the skill set we're looking for, but you're free to stick around. You need a lot of improvement before significant minutes come your way."
 
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VirginiaWildcat

Junior
Aug 31, 2001
23,343
332
0
YesterdaysCat said:
At the time of his commitment, this board talked about how he could be a steal due to his athleticism. A "steal" because he was not highly recruited. There was also quite a bit of discussion on whether or not other schools were scared off by his HS resume.

I don't know how you can argue that he was highly recruited when he was not. I don't know how you can say he was a good signing because he was not. That's just a fact. He was a bad sign, no matter whose fault it is that he didn't wind up contributing. Coach Collins would undoubtedly agree that the ultimate responsibility belongs with the head coach. You need not defend him so breathlessly, Chip.
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Defend him? I'm just trying to figure out how he was such a "gamble"? Chier Ajou? Melchior? Those were gambles. Vassar has talent, but he simply felt he deserved more minutes right away. Collins told him he had a lot of skills that needed polishing, and the rest is unfortunate history.
 
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loyolacat

Redshirt
Oct 21, 2006
2,697
47
48
Does anyone know if he is even presently staying in basketball shape? IS he seen around campus playing ball?
 
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YesterdaysCat

Junior
Dec 7, 2015
1,470
270
0
VirginiaWildcat said:
Defend him? I'm just trying to figure out how he was such a "gamble"? Chier Ajou? Melchior? Those were gambles. Vassar has talent, but he simply felt he deserved more minutes right away. Collins told him he had a lot of skills that needed polishing, and the rest is unfortunate history.
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We necessarily define "gambles" under Coach much differently from Carmody's gambles because Chris is going after blue-chip recruits. If Coach signs someone who isn't a well-known commodity with many solid offers, that's a gamble for him. You can't compare Coach's recruiting ambitions to Carmody's. Carmody may well be a better in-game tactician (is it debatable? maybe?), but Coach is a much more aggressive, ambitious recruiter.

If you want to equate Coach's gambles to Carmody's, you could say Coach's gambles are reaches while Carmody's gambles seemed to be total shots in the dark at times. Looking at the totality of Carmody's era, we had a few walk-ons who were better than a number of his scholarship players. I don't think that should happen very often. To be fair to Carmody, when he did have well-regarded players, sometimes that blew up in his face, too.
 
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Deeringfish

All-Conference
Jun 23, 2008
21,019
1,289
63
Mossreportdos said:
Can't they move it to an academic scholarship or need based scholarship? Just very frustrating how NU seems to never have a full basketball squad.
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Your assuming he would qualify for need based scholarships. I tried every which way to get my kids qualified and you have to be dirt poor to get even a low interest loan.
 
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