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Very interesting read about Sandusky's case

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saturdaysarebetter

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Essentially, the Cliffs notes of John Ziegler's podcasts on the subject.

Frederick Crews: Saint Sandusky? - Frank Report

Author's note: This essay was accepted for publication two years ago by the religious magazine First Things. The editors, anticipating trouble, asked me to collect endorsements from prominent people. This I did. Strong letters of support arrived from Noam Chomsky, Elizabeth Loftus, Carol Tavris...
frankreport.com frankreport.com
 
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bdgan

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My personal opinion is that Sandusky is guilty of some things but I also believe that many of the "victims" were motivated by lawyers offering easy money.

I struggle to believe that Dottie heard kids screaming for help and she ignored them. If that's true she should also be in jail. I also struggle to believe that Joe knew what was going on for decades but elected to do nothing. And that amazingly the governor and BOT members who were affiliated with TSM knew nothing. Nobody at TSM either.
 
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fairgambit

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saturdaysarebetter said:
Essentially, the Cliffs notes of John Ziegler's podcasts on the subject.

Frederick Crews: Saint Sandusky? - Frank Report

Author's note: This essay was accepted for publication two years ago by the religious magazine First Things. The editors, anticipating trouble, asked me to collect endorsements from prominent people. This I did. Strong letters of support arrived from Noam Chomsky, Elizabeth Loftus, Carol Tavris...
frankreport.com frankreport.com
Click to expand...
I have no idea if Jerry is guilty or innocent, but I do have doubts about the fairness of the process. The System in not perfect. Innocent men and women are sitting in jail, often with little recourse. Perhaps you have heard of the Innocence Project. Since their founding in 1992 they have helped free hundreds of wrongfully convicted individuals, primarily based on DNA evidence, yet they have received 10's of thousands of requests for help. Certainly not all those requests have merit, but many do. How difficult it must be spending years in jail and knowing you are innocent. If you want further information about them, here is a link:
innocenceproject.org

Innocence Project

We work to free the innocent, prevent wrongful convictions, and create fair, compassionate, and equitable systems of justice for everyone.
innocenceproject.org innocenceproject.org
 
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OptionBob

OptionBob

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fairgambit said:
I have no idea if Jerry is guilty or innocent, but I do have doubts about the fairness of the process. The System in not perfect. Innocent men and women are sitting in jail, often with little recourse. Perhaps you have heard of the Innocence Project. Since their founding in 1992 they have helped free hundreds of wrongfully convicted individuals, primarily based on DNA evidence, yet they have received 10's of thousands of requests for help. Certainly not all those requests have merit, but many do. How difficult it must be spending years in jail and knowing you are innocent. If you want further information about them, here is a link:
innocenceproject.org

Innocence Project

We work to free the innocent, prevent wrongful convictions, and create fair, compassionate, and equitable systems of justice for everyone.
innocenceproject.org innocenceproject.org
Click to expand...
My younger son is the Executive Director of the Innocence Project at Loyola Law School. He and his team have been instrumental in freeing several innocent prisoners.
 
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Bwifan

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bdgan said:
My personal opinion is that Sandusky is guilty of some things but I also believe that many of the "victims" were motivated by lawyers offering easy money.

I struggle to believe that Dottie heard kids screaming for help and she ignored them. If that's true she should also be in jail. I also struggle to believe that Joe knew what was going on for decades but elected to do nothing. And that amazingly the governor and BOT members who were affiliated with TSM knew nothing. Nobody at TSM either.
Click to expand...

I heard everything I needed to hear about Joe "knowing" from Jay. He stated how the Sandusky's babysat the Paterno children when Joe and Sue would go away over weekends. Jay asked does anyone really think Joe would leave his children at the Sandusky's for overnight sleep overs knowing all that about Jerry?
 
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Ironman2

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I have no idea if Jerry is innocent or not but if he's innocent and has to spend his remaining years behind bars there will be people answering for this one day. And I mean Big Time!
 
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psu31trap

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About six months ago while getting some physical therapy for my back I got into a Sandusky conversation with my therapist. He told me that Dick Anderson who is a 3rd cousin to his wife and someone they see on occasion at family functions told him that Sandusky was royally screwed and setup. Coach Anderson does not believe him to be a saint, but definitely not someone who should have been handed a life sentence.
 
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EricStratton-RushChairman

EricStratton-RushChairman

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Bwifan said:
I heard everything I needed to hear about Joe "knowing" from Jay. He stated how the Sandusky's babysat the Paterno children when Joe and Sue would go away over weekends. Jay asked does anyone really think Joe would leave his children at the Sandusky's for overnight sleep overs knowing all that about Jerry?
Click to expand...
Jay literally said exact same thing to me in person during a small alumni event in Dallas few years back
 
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Zenophile

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Ironman2 said:
I have no idea if Jerry is innocent or not but if he's innocent and has to spend his remaining years behind bars there will be people answering for this one day. And I mean Big Time!
Click to expand...
EricStratton-RushChairman said:
Jay literally said exact same thing to me in person during a small alumni event in Dallas few years back
Click to expand...
There is no version of this story where any of the named players from the Freeh Report suspected (much less believed) Sandusky to be an abuser of children until they were made aware of the charges. That notion is entirely revisionist history.
 
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Pennst8

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The man is a guilty effing monster. As a graduate and proud alumnus of Penn State, I find it sickening people coming to his defense. Guilty as Manson. For God's sake, stop! Also, please know, when/if you bring this up with your friends and community as if you have some "new" information on his innocence, when you walk away, people realize they have just spoken with a fool. The man raped children.
 
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Midnighter

Midnighter

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Pennst8 said:
The man is a guilty effing monster. As a graduate and proud alumnus of Penn State, I find it sickening people coming to his defense. Guilty as Manson. For God's sake, stop! Also, please know, when/if you bring this up with your friends and community as if you have some "new" information on his innocence, when you walk away, people realize they have just spoken with a fool. The man raped children.
Click to expand...

Manson never killed anyone.
 
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MacNit

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Pennst8 said:
The man is a guilty effing monster. As a graduate and proud alumnus of Penn State, I find it sickening people coming to his defense. Guilty as Manson. For God's sake, stop! Also, please know, when/if you bring this up with your friends and community as if you have some "new" information on his innocence, when you walk away, people realize they have just spoken with a fool. The man raped children.
Click to expand...
How do you know so much?
 
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bdgan

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Pennst8 said:
The man is a guilty effing monster. As a graduate and proud alumnus of Penn State, I find it sickening people coming to his defense. Guilty as Manson. For God's sake, stop! Also, please know, when/if you bring this up with your friends and community as if you have some "new" information on his innocence, when you walk away, people realize they have just spoken with a fool. The man raped children.
Click to expand...
  1. Most people believe JS is guilty of some things. The argument is about what Joe and the administrators knew. IMO it's unlikely that Joe and the administrators knew but MM's dad, Dranov, TSM staff, and our own BOT didn't know.
  2. Many are skeptical of "victims" who never said anything until lawyers promised easy money. That doesn't mean those who are skeptical think JS is completely innocent.
P.S. Nobody witnessed rape.
 
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LB99

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bdgan said:
  1. Most people believe JS is guilty of some things. The argument is about what Joe and the administrators knew. IMO it's unlikely that Joe and the administrators knew but MM's dad, Dranov, TSM staff, and our own BOT didn't know.
  2. Many are skeptical of "victims" who never said anything until lawyers promised easy money. That doesn't mean those who are skeptical think JS is completely innocent.
P.S. Nobody witnessed rape.
Click to expand...
Tom Corbett doesn’t get a free pass here either. What he knew and when, as well as, how long he sat on it to preserve his run for governor is questionable and shady as hell. Not to mention the campaign contributions from TSM and the subsequent help he gave them after he was elected.
 
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Pennst8

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MacNit said:
How do you know so much?
Click to expand...
How can you defend a child rapist?
bdgan said:
  1. Most people believe JS is guilty of some things. The argument is about what Joe and the administrators knew. IMO it's unlikely that Joe and the administrators knew but MM's dad, Dranov, TSM staff, and our own BOT didn't know.
  2. Many are skeptical of "victims" who never said anything until lawyers promised easy money. That doesn't mean those who are skeptical think JS is completely innocent.
P.S. Nobody witnessed rape.
Click to expand...
"Most" believe he is guilty of everything. "Most" people know he is a child rapist. Mike McQuery saw him raping a boy in the shower. The fact I am typing this sickens me that there are people like you out there still spewing this crap.
 
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bdgan

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LB99 said:
Tom Corbett doesn’t get a free pass here either. What he knew and when, as well as, how long he sat on it to preserve his run for governor is questionable and shady as hell. Not to mention the campaign contributions from TSM and the subsequent help he gave them after he was elected.
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Yes. I don't blame him for failing to catch JS because I think Jerry's activities were difficult to prove. I blame Corbett for being quick to throw others under the bus in order to protect his own rear end.
 
Gobert21

Gobert21

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fairgambit said:
I have no idea if Jerry is guilty or innocent, but I do have doubts about the fairness of the process. The System in not perfect. Innocent men and women are sitting in jail, often with little recourse. Perhaps you have heard of the Innocence Project. Since their founding in 1992 they have helped free hundreds of wrongfully convicted individuals, primarily based on DNA evidence, yet they have received 10's of thousands of requests for help. Certainly not all those requests have merit, but many do. How difficult it must be spending years in jail and knowing you are innocent. If you want further information about them, here is a link:
innocenceproject.org

Innocence Project

We work to free the innocent, prevent wrongful convictions, and create fair, compassionate, and equitable systems of justice for everyone.
innocenceproject.org innocenceproject.org
Click to expand...
Having worked in the Michigan prison system for 25 years do you know how many convicts told me they were innocent. If I had a dollar for each one I would be a rich man.

Not really knowing if he did it or not it's extremely rare for this to happen. I never had one who was released being helped by the IP. If you read most predators files it always had a pattern. His accusers seem to me to have the same pattern of rape.
 
Gobert21

Gobert21

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As the article pokes holes in the prosecutors and the criminal justice system. His story also has some holes, one big hole IMO as many of them were religious, the guy next door, the school bus driver, camp counselors, the pastor and the one who won't hurt anyone. In fact someone who I knew (not well), would cook a turkey dinner for us during deer season. Now the group he cooked for worked in the prison system (me), my buddy was a State Trooper and the third guy was his brother-in-law for many years. He was a well liked very nice guy, went to church etc. Sounds like a Jerry type.

Allegations were brought up about him and his grandchildren. He admitted to raping his grand children for many years. We were all floored by his admission. He like Jerry will never see the light of day outside the walls,
 
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MacNit

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bdgan said:
  1. Most people believe JS is guilty of some things. The argument is about what Joe and the administrators knew. IMO it's unlikely that Joe and the administrators knew but MM's dad, Dranov, TSM staff, and our own BOT didn't know.
  2. Many are skeptical of "victims" who never said anything until lawyers promised easy money. That doesn't mean those who are skeptical think JS is completely innocent.
P.S. Nobody witnessed rape.
Click to expand...
“What people think” should have zero to do with innocence or guilt. How the case was tried and what was allowed as “evidence” stinks to high heaven.
 
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Rick76

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fairgambit said:
I have no idea if Jerry is guilty or innocent, but I do have doubts about the fairness of the process. The System in not perfect. Innocent men and women are sitting in jail, often with little recourse. Perhaps you have heard of the Innocence Project. Since their founding in 1992 they have helped free hundreds of wrongfully convicted individuals, primarily based on DNA evidence, yet they have received 10's of thousands of requests for help. Certainly not all those requests have merit, but many do. How difficult it must be spending years in jail and knowing you are innocent. If you want further information about them, here is a link:
innocenceproject.org

Innocence Project

We work to free the innocent, prevent wrongful convictions, and create fair, compassionate, and equitable systems of justice for everyone.
innocenceproject.org innocenceproject.org
Click to expand...

I agree. As I've said before, Jerry may be innocent, he may be guilty, but one thing is clear - he did not get a fair trial. A new trial should be granted immediately.
 
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PSU89er

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Rick76 said:
I agree. As I've said before, Jerry may be innocent, he may be guilty, but one thing is clear - he did not get a fair trial. A new trial should be granted immediately.
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While he probably does deserve a new trial, he ain't ever getting one.

All anyone has to do is read the original article posted in this thread to know there would be a great deal of reasonable doubt, and there is no way the state of PA is letting that happen.

Do you understand how bad the state would look if that conviction got overturned? 60 minutes and such would be all over people saying you understood how questionable some of these guys were yet you allowed them to put this man in jail.

Bright side, it would make Andrew Shubin look like the scum is truly is.

I'm like you. I really not sure that Sandusky didn't cross the line with these kids, but common sense. A lot of that testimony was made up. Its just way to extreme behavior to have gone on for years and nobody to have known about it. There would have been hundreds of victims they could have found over a lot of years from a lot of different places, and not most all of the witnesses. People who knew each other from one town that were are all similar in age. Further none of these guys ever talked to each other while growing up about what was happening, but all at the same time they remember horrific abuse from 10 to 12 years earlier. Something there never did add up. The only thing that added up was the money, and these guys all got paid off big time.
 
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