2026 Rock and Roll HOF nominees.....
- Thread starter psuro
- Start date
Sounds like someone on a bullhorn trying to shout over the generator running in the background.
had dinner with Paul Simon a couple years ago, oh more than 10 years actually, had a very nice private meeting and dinner after a performance. Very smart and interesting guy. We were working on deep brain stimulation project at the time and he wanted to talk with us about it and implications for consciousness..........
You most definitely are....I guess that means you don't know sheeeeeeeetttt.....
What I Am
Song byEdie Brickell & New Bohemians
I'm not aware of too many things
I know what I know, if you know what I mean
I'm not aware of too many things
I know what I know, if you know what I mean
Philosophy is the talk on a cereal box
Religion is the smile on a dog
I'm not aware of too many things
I know what I know, if you know what I mean, d-doo yeah
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or?
Oh, I'm not aware of too many things
I know what I know, if you know what I mean
Philosophy is a walk on the slippery rocks
Religion is a light in the fog
I'm not aware of too many things
I know what I know, if you know what I mean, d-doo yeah
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what you are? And
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
Choke me in the shallow water
Before I get too deep
Don't let me get too deep
Don't let me get too deep
Don't let me get too deep
Don't let me get too deep
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what you are? And
What I am is what I am
Are you what you are or what?
Your line of work? Tell me you sell acid without actually telling me you sell acid
Garfunkel had a MA in Mathematics. He’d be a great dinner companion.
Weird fact about me: During my days of wearing a hearing aid (I don’t anymore) I could recognize three songs, Cecelia by S&G, School’s Out by Alice Cooper, and The Rose by Bette Midler. Just putting that out there.
Psychiatrist who works on novel treatments for depression. Acid selling days way in the past. But do work extensively with ketamine and experimental psychedelic medication in setting mood disorders, so I guess sorta sell acid........
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This is pretty good. But, for someone like Taylor Swift - who I would rate as an A+ songwriter and performer, less so on the ’musicality’ end of things - she fits a lot of the subjective criteria - it’s obvious why she is so well regarded. Popularity is another element. Tool is maybe the most accomplished band I’ve ever seen live (save Ellis Marsalis) but they’re not universally regarded in elite musical circles because they don’t pander to the mainstream. They probably have the best guitarist, drummer and bassist in modern rock. Vocalist too but not as definitive.
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The Rose is f*cking kncrefivle. They do not make them like that anymore.
I assume you despise The Replacements / Paul Westerberg based on those criteria.
They’re one of the most influential rock bands of the 80s.
I was fortunate enough to see Cream live in Philly many years (67 or 68) ago. To this day, the greatest band I've ever seen.
When Eric Clapton is arguably the least accomplished member of a band, it's something special.
When Eric Clapton is arguably the least accomplished member of a band, it's something special.
Swift is a very good song writer. I would definitely not give her an A+ though. Good performer - don't know, don't care, that has nothing to do with the music for me. She does write good melodies and is a good singer. However, she ain't writing all the songs herself. The guys producing them get a lot more credit than they deserve. You don't have to believe me, but you should believe Rick Beato, who knows a thing or two about music production.
Don't know much Tool, but they seem to be very good musicians and the songs I've heard are pretty good (better than Swift for me).
Not sure if you are saying that popularity is a factor in classifying something as good music, but I would would not consider a factor at all. More often than not, the best music is played to the smallest audiences.
I once got green pyramids (acid) from a man in Belfonte who called himself god.
It was a very good trip.
But I prefer shrooms.
Never been able to give into psychedelics, although I will see the Furs May 15 I believe
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The Beatles helped pioneer the Merseybeat sound, but they pretty much abandoned it after their 3rd album (btw, their first 3 albums included numerous covers of the fore-bearets of rock) and pretty much encompassed every genre/musical style, so you're dismissing the bulk of their catalog.
Which is why they continued to have a career long after the Merseybeat sound fell out of flavor, whereas bands like the Dave Clark 5 (the DC5 were emblematic of the similar Tottenham sound style) did not.
Oh, I don't know - being included on many worst bands lists (popularity means jack as McDonald's is the biggest and most successful burger chain), including at/near the top.
Hair metal isn't one of my preferred genres, but there are/were numerous bands that had better songs/were better musically (and didn't have the grating voice of Jon) and weren't generic for their genre.
There are bands like Oasis and the Red Hot Chili Peppers who do absolutely nothing for me, but at the same time, can still acknowledge that they are worthy of induction.
Going back to the Beatles, the member with the best post-Beatles career was George, in large part due to being a member of the Traveling Wilburys (they go beyond the definition of a "supergroup").
Just too bad that they didn't release more stuff due to the untimely passing of Roy
.
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Tool to me is an example of talent wasted. Amazing musicians, but their songs to my ear are kinda terrible. Danny Claire their drummer has outrageous hand talent drops in and out of various poly rhythms seamlessly. But put it all together and meh !
Youngest woman ever inducted into the songwriting hall of fame and she writes all of her songs. Sure, she has collaborators, but it’s all her. Andrew Lloyd Webber raved about her prowess as a writer too.
“We sat around the piano, I played her a melody,” Lloyd Webber recalled. “It was a joy. She’s a real pro. Talk about being a pro.” He elaborated, saying Swift took the time to dig into the source material. “Cats” is based on T.S. Eliot’s poetry collection “Old Possum’s Book of Practical Cats.”
YMMV of course and I know you know your sh*t when it comes to music. But, the songs are not musically complicated and border on basic musically; they’re the vehicle for the lyrics which is what matters for her fans. She’s won more ‘Album of The Year’ Grammys than anyone too. As for what producers say, the best ever is Rick Rubin and he plays zero instruments and has written zero songs. Swift is more important to her music than any producer she’s ever worked with.
You are obviously a musician and know music, but....We'll agree to disagree....
Firstly, I would still label most of your criteria as subjective.
Melodies "creative/intricate"? By what measure? Both of those words are subjective ones.
I-IV-V songs can't be good? Between I-IV-V and I-IV-V-vi you're talking tens of thousands of songs. Are none of them any good? No songs written in 12 bar blues make the cut? I would argue a song with a bunch of sus2 and 7th chords isn't necessarily "better" than a 1 4 5...just different.
Talking Heads Life During Wartime is 2 chords and an incredibly simple and repetitive melody...but dayumn...it works. At least in my opinion.
If I sum up your criteria (with the possible exception of musicians), essentially you've labeled good music as "complex" music. I don't feel like every song needs to be Stairway to Heaven/Bohemian Rhapsody/LA Woman/Paradise by the dashboard light rock opera type songs with multiple moods, movements and tempos. Sometimes it just needs to be fun. Heck, by your criteria we are eliminating nearly all early rock and roll.
Analogy....not every movie should be The Godfather. Sometimes you need a Die Hard.
PS, I am NOT a guitar player, I am a singer that plays guitar
He can sound a bit arrogant at times but he knows his stuff. Great interviews. And he is a really good jazz guitarist.
Btw almost 2 million views of the AdP KEXP performance. The boys are blowing up.
There is still subjectivity. My initial rebuttal was to the poster that said it was entirely subjective. As I replied, it's not totally subjective.You are obviously a musician and know music, but....We'll agree to disagree....
Firstly, I would still label most of your criteria as subjective.
Melodies "creative/intricate"? By what measure? Both of those words are subjective ones.
I-IV-V songs can't be good? Between I-IV-V and I-IV-V-vi you're talking tens of thousands of songs. Are none of them any good? No songs written in 12 bar blues make the cut? I would argue a song with a bunch of sus2 and 7th chords isn't necessarily "better" than a 1 4 5...just different.
Talking Heads Life During Wartime is 2 chords and an incredibly simple and repetitive melody...but dayumn...it works. At least in my opinion.
If I sum up your criteria (with the possible exception of musicians), essentially you've labeled good music as "complex" music. I don't feel like every song needs to be Stairway to Heaven/Bohemian Rhapsody/LA Woman/Paradise by the dashboard light rock opera type songs with multiple moods, movements and tempos. Sometimes it just needs to be fun. Heck, by your criteria we are eliminating nearly all early rock and roll.
Analogy....not every movie should be The Godfather. Sometimes you need a Die Hard.
PS, I am NOT a guitar player, I am a singer that plays guitar
Melodies can be creative/intricate by using various techniques - surrounding target notes, using arpeggio runs mixed with scalar runs, using notes that are outside of the key, etc.
I did not say I-4-5 songs can't be good. A song doesn't have to have all of the characteristics that I mentioned. I just listed some that can make a song better. There are plenty of 2 chord vamps that are great songs, but they all have other characteristics that make up for simple harmonic structure.
Overall, music complexity often does make a song better. It's why The French Laundry is better than McDonalds. One diver is better than another. It's why SRVs version of Mary Had a Little Lamb is better than the version your kid sang at the 3rd grade class concert. Like, objectively better.
I'm certainly not "eliminating" nearly all rock and roll. I'm not eliminating anything. Like I said at the end of the post - Does it mean that a song that lacks many of these can't be an enjoyable song to listen to? Hell no.
What you are saying applies much more broadly than RR music, but to music writ large. But rock and roll also requires a certain element of heart or soul or drive or lust or raunch or pain or ecstasy that is emotional and visceral and not technical. I met Willie "Big Eye" Smith once who is a Chicago blues drummer (he is playing in the street scene with JLH in the Blues Brothers) and he holds his sticks in a very unusual way but plays with amazing soul. I play drums and was like how do you do that and he said "It aint what you do with your hands its what you do in here" and he starts hitting me in the middle of the chest. "its your heart boy". Peak moment for a hobby drummer..........
Yeah, I’m talking about all forms of music.
There definitely is an emotional element of all music, not just rock, that can’t really be defined by words and is subjective. True for jazz, classical, blues, etc. without a doubt something that can make a song better along with many other elements I mentioned.
The Beatles benefitted from timing as much as anything. People were looking for something different…rock and roll was being invaded by old timers that record companies were trying to turn into rock and roll idols. They brought in a whole new sound.
Billy Joel had some good stuff early in his career then Glass Houses was awesome. After that he went to crap.
Many lists have Jon as one of the best front men in the business. Like them or hate them, they deserve to be in the HOF.
All these lists are meaningless to me. The lists = top 40 lists. People are commenting on “they sold so many records” ffs
I’m listening to wet leg in the tub. Put down your top 40 and dig into their first 3 records DAMM
sidebar the wet leg drummer is a fvcking ing monster
I’m listening to wet leg in the tub. Put down your top 40 and dig into their first 3 records DAMM
sidebar the wet leg drummer is a fvcking ing monster
He did a really good interview with Jimmy Webb about Wichita Lineman. Really good.
If you like a band and no one else does, chances are pretty good that you’re the one that’s wrong about their talent. Every one of these unheard of bands would kill to be selling records, that’s why they’re doing it unless it’s a side gig.
He's not wrong, though. Record sales are a poor measure of quality.