She also claimed to have never had that happen right after she admitted it had already happened twice on this set. Clearly she is lying.
Alec Baldwin kills someone on movie set
- Thread starter TortElvisII
- Start date
From a recent article:
The attorneys went on to state that the armorer herself has never had an accidental discharge of a firearm on set. However, they admit that two took place on "Rust" that were not her fault.
"The first one on this set was the prop master and the second one was a stunt man after Hannah informed him his gun was hot with blanks."
The attorneys went on to state that the armorer herself has never had an accidental discharge of a firearm on set. However, they admit that two took place on "Rust" that were not her fault.
"The first one on this set was the prop master and the second one was a stunt man after Hannah informed him his gun was hot with blanks."
Yes it is very clear that she lied, and that is by using her own words.
"The attorneys went on to state that the armorer herself has never had an accidental discharge of a firearm on set. However, they admitted that two took place on "Rust" that were not her fault.
"The first one on this set was the prop master and the second one was a stunt man after Hannah informed him his gun was hot with blanks," they said."
How does she tell a guy that his gun is loaded with blanks and when he pulls the trigger it's live ammo and then claim that has never happened on one of her sets? Both cannot be true at the same time.
The round that the actor shot was in fact the third live round on this very set that she was in charge of. People were already walking off because it became too dangerous. I think it's fair to fault Baldwin for not firing her after the first two but she is the expert on the set and in control of weapons, there is no way she isn't responsible for that gun being loaded with real ammo.
Wrong. See post #473.
So the guy who pulls the trigger is completely blameless? Just amazing.
I did not hear that she said a gun was loaded with blanks, but had live ammo. That is a brand new fact that I have not read. Do you have a link?
Good grief. Some of you are really pitiful. So Baldwin should have fired her, he's at blame for that but not for firing a gun without checking it.
Nevermind the first crew quit because of unsafe conditions. Baldwin not at fault for that either?
So you believe everything that you feel acquits Baldwin, but nothing the set armorer says? Hmmmm
That is a direct quote from your link. The same exact quote you used in fact a few post up.
No way that Baldwin lied, but very clear she did? It will come out, hopefully, what really happened.
No matter who handed him what and who said what, he is the one who pulled the trigger. That is not in dispute. It is clear who is at fault for pulling the trigger.
Do you understand it to mean there were 2 prior incidents of a gun being loaded with live ammo on this set and Baldwin the actor/producer still pulled the trigger without checking it. If that's the case, it increases Baldwin's negligence X 1000000.
He's an actor not a gun professional hence the very existence of her job. He wouldn't know what a blank vs a live ammo looks like or have a ghost of and ideal how to check a gun.
Separate your hate for him and deal only with the facts. She is the person in charge of every single gun, every single bullet for that movie, no one else. Expecting him to know all of that is like him knowing how to drive a taxi he is riding in, it's not his job. Blame him for her is about all you can do.
Any idiot who has handled guns knows the difference between a blank and live ammo, especially someone who has been in the business as long as he. If you want to support him, that is not a good argument.
You are ignoring or misconstruing the facts of this case.
You're making assumptions. In no way am I supporting him, don't care for him or his family. I think it's clear that you are a witch hunt towards him personally though.
I'll gladly agree with anyone here and claim it's all on him when you can produce something suggesting that he loaded that gun. I don't assume he knows crap, that's how you get lost in conspiracies. I do know for 100% that it was her job to control that gun and what was loaded into that gun. Until something comes out suggesting a possibility that tampering was involved I have to assume she loaded the live ammo into it and told him it was either empty or had blanks.
While the armorer and assistant producer may both be partially responsible for being derelict in their duties, that in no way absolves Baldwin for his culpability. He and he alone took possession of the gun, pointed it at Halyna Hutchins, and, yes, pulled the trigger. Why this is so hard to accept is mind-boggling to me.
Had any of us done the same thing we would have been arrested by now.
Had any of us done the same thing we would have been arrested by now.
Earlier I linked to the Actors Equity Association's firearms safety page. The AEA is one of the two major actors unions. It states actors should treat every firearm as if it is loaded and deadly. It does not say self important actors are exempt. A thousand other people may have screwed up, but Baldwin pulled the trigger.
Exactly. If anything, it further proves the reason the first crew quit.
Every time I've heard or read a theatrical armorer give their opinion on this, an actual professional whose job this is, they all say they never point guns at people on set. If necessary for authenticity to use a real gun fully capable of firing a real bullet, they cheat the shot, compensate with camera angle. They don't even point directly when they load blanks.
They also train actors on gun safety.
I doubt they all made that up in unison just because of politics. Real guns don't stop being real because you are playing make believe.
There's blame (negligence or incompetence whatever) to go all around.
They also train actors on gun safety.
I doubt they all made that up in unison just because of politics. Real guns don't stop being real because you are playing make believe.
There's blame (negligence or incompetence whatever) to go all around.
What hate? You need to quit assuming. It astounds me how someone with any form of logic, could assign blame to her, but none for him.
Do you blame bartenders and liquor stores for drunk drivers? Are Distilleries at fault as well? Everyone but the driver correct?
So if someone were to hand you a gun and sad it was unloaded, you would just start pointing it at people and pulling the trigger?
Thousands and thousands of movies and TV shows have been made with guns in them. Westerns, cop movies, war movies, etc.
Do you know that she is the one who loaded the gun or handed him the gun? No you do not.
"I have to assume she loaded the live ammo into it and told him it was either empty or had blanks."
It is not fact when you are assuming. Show your proof she loaded the gun, handed it to him and told him it was a "cold gun".
This right here. Amazing how this is hard for some on here to grasp.
It's clear a lot of folks don't understand guns well enough to be making comments on this subject. Real or fake, the same safety principles apply.
I was at Whitakers in Owensboro once with my dad. I picked up a rifle. I didn't intentionally point it at anyone. But I did do sort of sweeping motion while looking at it that inadvertently pointed at someone. I immediately was scolded by several people.
Absolutely. As a kid, I got a pretty good butt whooping for something similar with my BB gun. I was maybe a third grader.
My dad says his only regret about raising me and my brother was that he never taught us about gun safety. Mostly because my mother wouldn't allow it.
There's plenty of courses. I recommend everyone take a gun safety class and get professional training before owning or handling a gun.
He was also a producer -- and not some passive one, a producer on the set EVERY DAY to see how things are being done. The producer of a movie involving firearms has a responsibility to know those very things of which you say he is ignorant.
If it was an unsafe set, he had the responsibility to do something about it. He was responsible to oversee safety in general, and make sure it wasn't some chaotic scene where even the cops can't figure out why there were live rounds, blank rounds, and guns that could fire both.
And as a human being, he had the responsibility not to recklessly endanger another human. That means when handed a firearm -- one that as a producer he knew was real -- he had to observe basic safety rules: Check to see if its loaded, don't point it arbitrarily, and never pull the trigger unless you intend it to fire.
So, he had both the general responsibility as a producer to run a safe set, and the particular responsibility as the person with a deadly weapon in his hand. ITs hard to imagine how anyone could be MORE responsible.
Last edited:
So, if you tell me a gun is unloaded and I pull the trigger, while I have it pointed directly at someone, you're in a lot of trouble buddy.
Last edited:
Now that the Clown has effectively, succinctly, aptly, and mercifully closed the discussion, we've moved to the meme portion of the thread...
*
*h/t to a random Little Joe Cartwright twitter post
479 shots is not all that many for someone from Harlan.
Show me where I am on a “witch hunt.” I will wait.
I also know you have not paid attention to the facts, yet you have drawn conclusions.
The gun was supposed to have been a "cold gun" incapable of firing -- no live bullets or blanks. The scene called for a gun loaded with "dummy bullets". For authenticity, dummy bullets look almost exactly like real bullets but have no gunpowder. They have a tiny hole in the side of the casing to distinguish them from real bullets. When the sheriff inspected the gun after the shooting, he found 4 dummy bullets in the rotating drum and one spent casing from a live round.
It seems obvious the armorer loaded the gun incorrectly. Both the assistant director and Baldwin should also have checked and cleared the weapon, but a simple glance wouldn't be enough. They would have had to remove all the cartridges to inspect them. On a rushed movie set for a simple rehearsal it obviously didn't get done. Nor should Baldwin have pointed even a cold gun at another person and pulled the trigger.
AP Story: How it Happened
It seems obvious the armorer loaded the gun incorrectly. Both the assistant director and Baldwin should also have checked and cleared the weapon, but a simple glance wouldn't be enough. They would have had to remove all the cartridges to inspect them. On a rushed movie set for a simple rehearsal it obviously didn't get done. Nor should Baldwin have pointed even a cold gun at another person and pulled the trigger.
AP Story: How it Happened
Every actor I’ve ever heard of goes through very basic training before they are on camera….so that they are safe but also look like they know what they’re doing. Baldwin has handled various firearms many times throughout his career.
The gun was supposed to have been a "cold gun" incapable of firing -- no live bullets or blanks. The scene called for a gun loaded with "dummy bullets". For authenticity, dummy bullets look almost exactly like real bullets but have no gunpowder. They have a tiny hole in the side of the casing to distinguish them from real bullets. When the sheriff inspected the gun after the shooting, he found 4 dummy bullets in the rotating drum and one spent casing from a live round.
It seems obvious the armorer loaded the gun incorrectly. Both the assistant director and Baldwin should also have checked and cleared the weapon, but a simple glance wouldn't be enough. They would have had to remove all the cartridges to inspect them. On a rushed movie set for a simple rehearsal it obviously didn't get done. Nor should Baldwin have pointed even a cold gun at another person and pulled the trigger.
AP Story: How it Happened
Ahh, not exactly. If the item they used was “incapable” of firing live ammo as you claim…..then the death wouldn’t have happened. The term “cold gun” refers to a real firearms that is either unloaded or has blanks. But it is, in fact, a real firearm.
Also dummy rounds are not blank rounds. With a Colt revolver the only thing dummy rounds would be good for is practicing reloading. Blanks contain powder but no projectile. They are used to simulate firing.
The Wall Street J article said dummy rounds are also used for close-up shots to give the look of the real thing.
A dummy round is not a blank. Dummy rounds are inert. Blanks have powder.
I've read multiple times special effects experts say that they never point guns directly at human beings on set if they are capable of firing a real bullet.
Which seems like a very obvious and necessary safety measure to me.
But some people watched lethal weapon, so who knows really... probably just hate and politics at work here or some conspiracy theory.
Which seems like a very obvious and necessary safety measure to me.
But some people watched lethal weapon, so who knows really... probably just hate and politics at work here or some conspiracy theory.
Of course it was a real gun! I guess my explanation was a bit confusing. I was just saying it was announced as a "cold gun" because in SHOULD NOT have had cartridges with gunpowder -- i.e., no bullets or blanks. Only dummy bullets which do not fire, hence cold.
Yet somehow a live bullet got in the mix with the dummy bullets and got loaded. In a closeup shot, the dummies are made to look as authentic as possible. That made checking the gun a little more difficult. I don't own a .45 revolver, but I'd think you'd actually have to remove the cartridges from the chamber to see if they were indeed all dummies?
Last edited: