I am more concerned with our ability to get stops next year than our ability to score...If we find ourselves in a lot of half court offensive sets I will be upset that we aren't playing quick enough....Look at UNC this year....They are bigger faster and more athletic than everyone they match up against....Why not put the pedal to the metal? It will be our ability to get stops that most concerns me....DT was a solid defender...Hopefully we have a rim presence next year like we had somewhat in Justise and like we had in........it's been a while.
Are there any potential transfers?
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Show -- I understand your point. I am of the opinion that a strong "pass-first" point guard is a (the) key position. I am hoping that DT can fit that bill. I have always been more excited to see 6-8 assists in the box scores for a PG then 20 points.
I am enthusiastic about next year's squad too! I think it's going to be a great season.
I look at Matt, Amile, DT, and Grayson and I think "Can these guys play defense?" Yeah. They can play.
Chov, I agree. i'm less concerned with Duke's ability to score, and more with their ability to get stops and get defensive rebounds. My FEAR is that these young kids won't have the same drive to get stops as they have to get buckets. Getting stops seems to drive upperclassemen, getting buckets seems to drive underclassmen.
Amile, Harry, Jeter (a very good per 40 rebounder, maybe Marques). On top of that, your basis of Luke and Grayson's inability is based off of one season, a season in which Duke stayed in the top 10 in the nation in offensive efficiency.
Let's continue, Luke handled the ball enough at the end of the season to instill confidence moving forward, another reason why Duke isn't even sniffing at PG recruits or grad school transfers. Let's not forget Luke's 2/1 assist to turnover ratio. Pretty good for a backup.
Offense is not and aside from one or two seasons in the past 20 years, will not ever be the problem. It's the defense. Can Grayson guard PG's? He would certainly hold a nice advantage at 6'5 with decent lateral quickness. Luke is in the same boat. Will they even have to? Can we get the post help inside to help curb drives?
This year's team, despite lacking a traditional "Duke PG" was offensively brilliant, but lacked rebounding and defense. With some added length and interior size and depth can we be better? The consensus everywhere but on this board, for some reason, is pretty high on Duke's national title prospects.
Lets not forget that one of the biggest reasons for poor defense was initially new players and then new/young guys and not depth. Early on the team was young and new. It is very hard to play good D under those circumstance. Look at last year. End year D was way better than earlier in the year and even the middle of the year. When the D should/could have been maturing, Amile got hurt. Our best and most experienced defender, and our best talker. Also left of with no depth and no versatility roster wise. Plum couldn't foul out. Period. The rest of the guys couldn't foul out either. That hurt this team's D a ton.
Next year's depth should be a lot better. Additionally, next year we have a lot more length. Next year we can start 6 10, 6 9, and 6 9 and still have 4 guys on the court who can hit shots, handle the ball, attack the basket, and spread things out. Next year. playing a team that can defend and rebound won't kill our offense.
Next year's depth should be a lot better. Additionally, next year we have a lot more length. Next year we can start 6 10, 6 9, and 6 9 and still have 4 guys on the court who can hit shots, handle the ball, attack the basket, and spread things out. Next year. playing a team that can defend and rebound won't kill our offense.
There are an unusual amount of things up in the air right now, with decisions looming for Allen, Bolden, DT, and even Capel.
There are some things we know about next year with 100% certainty: Mike Krzyzewski will be the coach, and Duke will have Harry Giles, Jayson Tatum, Frank Jackson, Luke Kennard, Matt Jones, Amile Jefferson, and Chase Jeter, among others. That alone is easily one of the five best teams in the country. If one or more of the aforementioned things breaks Duke's way, then holy cow.
There are some things we know about next year with 100% certainty: Mike Krzyzewski will be the coach, and Duke will have Harry Giles, Jayson Tatum, Frank Jackson, Luke Kennard, Matt Jones, Amile Jefferson, and Chase Jeter, among others. That alone is easily one of the five best teams in the country. If one or more of the aforementioned things breaks Duke's way, then holy cow.
Agreed on the rebounding front; next year could be a beastly rebounding team, especially if bolden commits (I still say he's UK bound). I really think you're missing my point on Luke: he wasn't a primary handler, including the NCAA's. It was Derryck, Matt, Ingram, and a bit of Grayson, so no, I'm not comfortable with Luke being a PG. You say he can improve, so why can't Derryck, a kid who's already a natural PG? And the A/T for any Duke player this past year is deceiving because of the offensive isolation scheme.
I'm not sure on defense with Grayson and Luke, time will tell. We will miss Derrycks D regardless. He's a strong defender.
I'm not missing your point. My point is that for next season's team, a Tyus Jones, dominate the ball point guard isn't necessary.
This past season was one of the worst passing Duke teams we've had and Luke was really one of the few bright spots in terms of passing ability. The kid is a division 1 college basketball player that saw and will see major time for a national title contender, so do I feel confident that he can dribble the ball up court, pressure or no pressure? Absolutely.
I'm not sure why it's so out of the realm of possibility for you. And excluding Luke's name from the people who helped bring the ball up doesn't prove anything. He inbounded most of the time and was the secondary recipient in our press break. He dribbled up as the offensive starter especially in games where his number was called (that was our O for the most part by the way, if your number was called, you bring the ball up). So to pretend like Luke never touched the ball beyond half court is strictly ignoring part of skill set and something he was asked to do at times. Remember back before the season started about two months after he signed his letter. He was asked by K to learn the role of point guard because he would be needed. That doesn't mean he would be THE point guard, but it does mean he's need to know the role and understand it to be a guard in Duke's system.
Volume does not necessarily dictate capability.
Feel like Derryck's season changed the Clemson game(away). He took an ill advised shot before 1st half was over and a third foul reulted on Brandon...
Just my two, but thought there was a turning point that nite....I wish him well regardless and will never forget him if he departs. Neither will Joel Berry from the Dean Dome finish!!!
OFC
Just my two, but thought there was a turning point that nite....I wish him well regardless and will never forget him if he departs. Neither will Joel Berry from the Dean Dome finish!!!
OFC
I guess I am seeing differently because, without a true PG, other teams will press the heck outta Duke, and IMO Luke would be exposed quickly. Derryck really calmed things against the press this year, and would be huge with it again next year. Can Luke pass the ball? Sure, but is he a penetrate and distribute guy? I just don't see it man, I really don't. I respect your view, but I'll disagree. All good here.
Good memory I almost forgot about. He was all over Berry on that play! Great D!
The press will be broken, much like this year with a big wing in the middle of the floor. Don't forget, before he went out and all of last season, Amile was used as a catch and pass guy in the press in the middle of the of the floor even when Derryck was on the floor, so I can see that happening again too.
Do I necessarily want Luke on the ball? No, because his talent is spinning the rock in the basket, but should Derryck vanish, IMO he's our best option behind Grayson until Frank is comfortable.
Look at each Duke national championship team. Then look at the point guard. Without exception each team had a quality ball control PG.
Each team had someone who could handle the ball, distribute and also score - when needed.
Sorry but the PG by committee just doesn't cut it. Not sure what DT could become. Showed some great talent, also made some freshman like errors. What encouraged me was that he was becoming a very good defender.
I remember when the 5 starters were the 5 best defenders......
Each team had someone who could handle the ball, distribute and also score - when needed.
Sorry but the PG by committee just doesn't cut it. Not sure what DT could become. Showed some great talent, also made some freshman like errors. What encouraged me was that he was becoming a very good defender.
I remember when the 5 starters were the 5 best defenders......
Interesting on Twitter last night from Laura Keeley the beat reporter for Duke Athletics during the MCD Game.
Someone asked her if they could pencil in Frank as a starter and she replied "use a pen".
Then someone asked if he would be running PG next year and she replied "yep".
She usually doesn't respond much so I thought it interesting.
Someone did ask her about the transfer rumors but she didn't reply.
Someone asked her if they could pencil in Frank as a starter and she replied "use a pen".
Then someone asked if he would be running PG next year and she replied "yep".
She usually doesn't respond much so I thought it interesting.
Someone did ask her about the transfer rumors but she didn't reply.
If Grayson comes back, who are the captains. Amile and Matt for sure right? And possibly Grayson a third captain?
Ok, do you guys believe her because she is the Duke beat writer or do believe everything a cute girl says?
df I stopped believin everything they said a long time ago, lol!!! She went out on a limb there somewhat and Laura normally isnt "out there" all over the place with her opinions...
Obviously Frank looks good, and I am excited about him in a Duke uniform! However it also makes you think theres real traction to the DT trending story....
Lets not kick the kid out the door...He reclassified to fill "our need", played hard and very much like a HS senior, what do expect...a Tyus or Jwill every year. Good luck to you Derryck.
I think many of us would prefer he stay and learn from the experiences of cook and Nolan smith and that is not everybody is going to be Tyus or kyrie. Nothing wrong with sticking it out work hard get better by playing against the best in college on your own team. There are different roads to a dream. But if he's not willing to do that then that's HIS decision and to that I say good luck but I will move on to support those who are coming in.
After watching last night's Mc'Donalds game, I have a few tid-bits...
1. Bolden is a monster, he is more athletic than I thought. He doesn't have the post moves that Okafor had, but I believe he is quicker on his feet and can jump higher. Which should make him a much better defender.
2. Tatum could play in the NBA next year, he is just that solid, seems to be good to great at EVERYTHING. I am sure the same could be said for Giles.
3. Frank obviously wow'd people showing off his athleticism and showed off his jumper. There is no doubt he will be a major contributor next year.
My only complaint about Frank is last night showed he is definitely not a pass-first point PG. He ran the floor looking to dunk instead of pass. He seems GREAT at getting buckets, but does next years team need him to score 12-15 ppg?? I would say no. His game appears to be more "Austin Rivers-ish" while our starting PG needs to be "Chris Duhon-ish." Again, Frank looked amazing, but I would love to have the luxury of bringing him off the bench as a weapon.
I really hope DT stays, I just think his game is more suited to start the PG for us next year. Frank may be the better player, but DT appears to be the better passer/defender...at this moment.
1. Bolden is a monster, he is more athletic than I thought. He doesn't have the post moves that Okafor had, but I believe he is quicker on his feet and can jump higher. Which should make him a much better defender.
2. Tatum could play in the NBA next year, he is just that solid, seems to be good to great at EVERYTHING. I am sure the same could be said for Giles.
3. Frank obviously wow'd people showing off his athleticism and showed off his jumper. There is no doubt he will be a major contributor next year.
My only complaint about Frank is last night showed he is definitely not a pass-first point PG. He ran the floor looking to dunk instead of pass. He seems GREAT at getting buckets, but does next years team need him to score 12-15 ppg?? I would say no. His game appears to be more "Austin Rivers-ish" while our starting PG needs to be "Chris Duhon-ish." Again, Frank looked amazing, but I would love to have the luxury of bringing him off the bench as a weapon.
I really hope DT stays, I just think his game is more suited to start the PG for us next year. Frank may be the better player, but DT appears to be the better passer/defender...at this moment.
Yes, I don't think Keeley would say what she said without some solid info about DT. With that said, JWill's comments were pretty encouraging about Grayson IMO -- i.e., when talking about how loaded Duke would be next year, reciting a list of returning players that includes Grayson (while wholly omitting DT). Certainly nothing definitive; but I don't think he'd have included Grayson in that list if people inside the program thought he were leaving -- particularly since it seems like he did go out of his way to intentionally omit DT and BI.
Laura Keely is a source on men's basketball? Really? Really? Any opinions from men who have actually played in college or the pros?
She's kinda cute.
I wouldn't be so sure about Frank starting though, not at all. Especially if Grayson comes back, I'd highly doubt it honestly.
Think about it...
HG3
TATUM
ALLEN
JEFFERSON
Those three are GOING to start, no if's or buts around that.
That leaves Luke, Frank and Matt to fight for the last guard spot. Now the smart money is on Matt jones. But you really cannot count out a second year Luke who will already have a lot of starting experience and be a much improved player. Then again, Frank COULD beat them both out. But it doesn't seem likely.
I wouldn't be so sure about Frank starting though, not at all. Especially if Grayson comes back, I'd highly doubt it honestly.
Think about it...
HG3
TATUM
ALLEN
JEFFERSON
Those three are GOING to start, no if's or buts around that.
That leaves Luke, Frank and Matt to fight for the last guard spot. Now the smart money is on Matt jones. But you really cannot count out a second year Luke who will already have a lot of starting experience and be a much improved player. Then again, Frank COULD beat them both out. But it doesn't seem likely.
Frank is much closer to Jason Williams style and quality of play than Austin Rivers IMHO. I get the reference, because he is not a Duhon type, with that said, Duhon's shooting was a big disappointment to me and held us back a bit. I think Frank is a steve francis, russell westbrook type PG, and he will play PG in the NBA.
If BOlden comes, and Giles is healthy, Jefferson is far from a lock to start ALL season. Jefferson has started just over half his college games, and as a team we've been most successful with him coming off the bench. I think the size, length, hands, hustle, and athleticism from Bolden shocked some fans last night. He's not Jah, but he could fit in really well with this team at the 5.
You say smart money is on Matt Jones, is that because you're in the group that believes K plays favorites, because he clearly isn't one of the 5 best on the team next year? I don't think Frank is a lock to start from Day 1 if Grayson comes back, but I do believe he will be the starter, and stay the starter at some point.
I hope this Thornton stuff is bs man. I loved his defense and I know he has a long ways to go but I hope he stays and grinds it out.
I could be wrong here but hasn't just about every Duke player that has left the program in recent memory "missed out on a national championship"? I put that in quotes because I guess things technically could have played out differently if they would have stayed on the team.
I think Frank could do a more than adequate job as the starting PG -- but my one concern with him is his mentality. He's a bigtime scorer whose dad has described as having an "alpha dog" personality that can be tough to deal with at times -- even for friends and family. And, even at an all-star game with the best talent in the country, he was hardly bashful in looking for his offense. If he's willing to be more of a supporting PG who looks for his offense in spots, I think he could do a more than adequate job with the guys who'll be surrounding him. Particularly if Grayson comes back, we're not going to need a slashing PG to create offense for others However, I have a feeling there will be more than a few times where Frank will go look for his own shot when a lot of us are screaming at the TV -- give the ball to Allen, Tatum, or Giles.
Personally, the reason I prefer DT is that I think he's more of a natural PG who would be willing to fill a traditional PG role on a team like the one we'll have next year. IMO, while Frank can be extremely effective as a 15 minute instant offense guy off the bench, I do think K will have his hands full getting this team to play together if we run out a starting lineup of Jackson, Allen, Tatum, Giles, and Bolden/Jefferson. Just a lot of high-volume scorers. With that said, I'd rather have this problem than have last year's problem -- where we were overly reliant on a couple guys.
Personally, the reason I prefer DT is that I think he's more of a natural PG who would be willing to fill a traditional PG role on a team like the one we'll have next year. IMO, while Frank can be extremely effective as a 15 minute instant offense guy off the bench, I do think K will have his hands full getting this team to play together if we run out a starting lineup of Jackson, Allen, Tatum, Giles, and Bolden/Jefferson. Just a lot of high-volume scorers. With that said, I'd rather have this problem than have last year's problem -- where we were overly reliant on a couple guys.
He is one K's favorites and I believe healthy he'll bring a lot to the team. Him and Amile are the best on court communicators, and that counts for a hefty amount in K's book. I'm not saying him starting is a lock, just likely.
If Allen comes back, I don't think there's any chance Jones would be a regular starter (though spot starts could happen). With that said, as I mentioned in earlier post, one challenge for K will be to convince all of these guys to play as a team -- when they all have the individual talents to go one-on-one. That is made easier IMO when you have at least one or two guys on the court who are focused on playing off the primary creators, rather than having 4-5 guys who all want to get the ball and create their own shot. As complimentary pieces, I think Jones / Jefferson fit very well in stretches with the other guys -- b/c they do they play defense, do the dirty work, and create spacing to allow the other guys to make plays. While Jones is not someone you want being responsible for generating offense, he's a very solid role player when you limit his role to the things he's good at -- i.e, playing D, crashing the glass, hustling, hitting open spot-up 3s.
I'm not ready to call any incoming PG the next Jason Williams. However, I will concede that Frank's "style" does remind me a lot of Russell Westbrook (obviously at a different level.) The strange thing is Westbrook put up average numbers at UCLA (3.4 points as a frosh, 12.7 as a sophomore) I definitely expect Frank to eclipse those numbers.
I thought about the Austin Rivers comparison myself to be honest. I was genuinely worried about the hype of Rivers before he came here because I remember looking at Austin's high school stats - 29 ppg and 2 assists. Two assists a game seemed alarmingly low for someone who constantly has the ball in his hand. Frank's numbers are a little better, but not by much; he averaged 28 ppg and 3 assists per game. As long we don't resort to constant ISO, we should be alright. I imagine some of our guys are going to cause multiple defenders to sag off of their man a little - having offensive firepower is crucial because when defenses collapse on Giles/Tatum/Allen/Jackson it will create great looks for others with a simple kick out. A Tyus Jones-type point guard won't be necessary if we can just hit the open man and exploit mismatches.
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