Bitcoin and other crypto currency......

Deeeefense

Heisman
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What's occurring to bitcoin and other CCs right now is what's called "consolidation". That normally occurs after a big run up. A lot of profit taking occurs and sends the price down, and people that got in late start panic selling. Others with a longer term view see a buying opportunity and start buying, but then comes a new round of sellers wanting to "get out while the can". All that back and forth can go on for a few months until the price forms what technical charters call a "bottom". Then it can move up again.
 

Get Buckets

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What's occurring to bitcoin and other CCs right now is what's called "consolidation". That normally occurs after a big run up. A lot of profit taking occurs and sends the price down, and people that got in late start panic selling. Others with a longer term view see a buying opportunity and start buying, but then comes a new round of sellers wanting to "get out while the can". All that back and forth can go on for a few months until the price forms what technical charters call a "bottom". Then it can move up again.

:joy:
 
May 6, 2004
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That's the way all stocks work, yo.

But with this the main question is do you believe in the tech or not? Because at some point you are still going to need an injection of buying volume to raise price. IBM showing blockchain commercials during the playoff game yesterday was shocking to me, and I believe in the tech (know it's real).

If IBM believes in the tech and you don't, well then it's maybe time to reevaluate.
 
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robh1975

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^that is ridiculous.

I bought a few litecoin right around the time this thread started, just because curiosity had got the best of me over the last few months... and for an investment less than $500, I was a nervous wreck.

Just curious....What is the value as of today?
 

theoledog

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Someone tell me why I would want to use a cryptocurrency?
Tell me why I'd want to use it and what I'd use it for, other than being a speculator.......
 
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He probably doubled his money... maybe tripled if he got out at the right time.. maybe lost some money if he didn't.

YOu shouldn't risk more than you are ok losing.. like drx treats it as gambling money, Deeefense like some portion of portfolio etc... You shouldn't risk to the point at any time you feel uncomfortable.
 
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Someone tell me why I would want to use a cryptocurrency?
Tell me why I'd want to use it and what I'd use it for, other than being a speculator.......

This is the same question like asking how FB and twitter etc were going to be actually profitable 10 years ago.

They were overinflated value with no revenue streams, they were a huge bubble and risk... where are they now?
 

theoledog

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This is the same question like asking how FB and twitter etc were going to be actually profitable 10 years ago.

They were overinflated value with no revenue streams, they were a huge bubble and risk... where are they now?
Both sell advertising.... You could start a blog and, lo and behold, if it were read by thousands you could make $ selling space to someone else... Think KSR.... So, to your point, who's making the money in cryptocurrency? I don't know. Does anyone know?
Google tells me the reason I'd want crypto is noninterreferance from government or banks..... Yeah, well how long you think the government is going to keep its paws out of this? No way they will let you make, keep, move, sell and buy.... something of value without getting some'a'dat..... Called TAX....
You can spend money how you wish and the speculation might be worth something?... I just happen to be more of a traditionalist and other factors being considered think crytocurrency should be bought with the same money you'd take to Vegas.
 
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Just curious....What is the value as of today?
No clue where it would stand right now... it gained a bit and I moved some to litecoin and some to ripple. Both of those jumped a bit, I considered myself lucky and cashed most of it out. I was really small time- but wasnt a big fan of how big the swings back and forth were with crypto.

I'd consider getting back into it if it were more stable, even if that meant me missing out on a huge gain- but I didnt really like having to keep an eye on something every single day, multiple times a day to see if it was way up or way down.
 
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I understand how FB makes money, just saying at one time it was entirely speculative... So was Amazon even ffs, they were hemorrhaging money quarter after quarter.

There are a myriad of ways this can go grow, only tests the limits of your imaginatoin at this point. There are always ways it could go wrong, from banks getting pissed to govts getting interventionist to NK dropping an EMP to LA... anything is possible.
 

Anon1640710541

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You left out the part about Facebook and Amazon being publicly traded companies with widely publicized, filed data regarding their revenue, expenses, debt obligations, etc, etc.
 
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That's an important difference... that is the difference between IPO and ICO, essentially. And it's not all bad, just higher risk... higher risk means higher reward too.

Like I've said from the start, this is a risk and this is a bubble. This is not where you put your IRA or reverse mortgage your house or whatever other idiocy.

But this is tech... tech is always a bubble and it is never the same thing day 1 as it is when fully matured.
 

UKnCincy_rivals

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Long term if you believe that the technological advantages of cryptocurrancy will result in widespread global acceptance, then the GFT theory doesn't apply. In the meantime, a lot of technical traders will make money from the greed/fear cycles of CCs. In the last couple of months we saw a huge spike in the price of bitcoin and other CCs as people raced in like the gold rush not wanting to be left out, then the smart technical traders sensed an overbought situation and a 30% selloff occurred as they took profit. You can expect similar types of cycles in the future until CCs are accepted by the general public.

Technological revolutions almost always go through three investment cycles:

Stage 1: Early visionaries. They are the investment capitals, angel investors, entrepreneurs that put their money in an infant technology like the personal computer, the smart phone, the internet search portal, video games etc.

Stage 2: Institutional Investors see the rise of a new technology and begin pumping money into it. This topically occurred when companies like Apple, Google, and Netflix issued their initial public offerings.

Stage 3: The general public becomes aware of the new technology and begins to invest in it as well as buy it and use it This is the final stage.

The way I see it right now CCs are in the process of moving from Stage 1 to the beginning of Stage 2.

There’s a fundamental error in your analogy that a lot of people are also making.

Throughout these stages you’ve laid out, people weren’t technically investing in a technology. They were investing in a company that was developing a technology which it used to sell either a service or good and generate revenue. The investment was in a security (i.e., equity) that the investor believed would grow in value based upon the decisions management would make.

That is not the case with cryptocurrencies. If you buy Bitcoin, you are not buying a share of Bitcoin company, you’re buying the Bitcoin itself.

Bitcoin is not a security. It’s closer to buying gold on a commodities market than it is to buying a share of Apple.
 
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UKnCincy_rivals

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That's the way all stocks work, yo.

But with this the main question is do you believe in the tech or not? Because at some point you are still going to need an injection of buying volume to raise price. IBM showing blockchain commercials during the playoff game yesterday was shocking to me, and I believe in the tech (know it's real).

If IBM believes in the tech and you don't, well then it's maybe time to reevaluate.

But you also shouldn’t confuse cryptocurrencies with blockchain. They are not one in the same. Cryptocurrencies are simply one application for blockchain.

IBM’s commercials are about helping IBM sell their blockchain cloud services to large corporate clients. It was not about endorsing cryptocurrencies.

In other words, it’s possible for some one to believe in the value of blockchain technology and to also be skeptical of the success of cryptocurrency as one of blockchain’s applications.
 
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May 6, 2004
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IBM’s commercials are about helping IBM sell their blockchain cloud services to large corporate clients. It was not about endorsing cryptocurrencies.

The rest of that is true, but this isn't... the companies involved in said services raise money through initial coin offerings, which relates their coin back to bitcoin.
 

UKnCincy_rivals

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The rest of that is true, but this isn't... the companies involved in said services raise money through initial coin offerings, which relates their coin back to bitcoin.

No, IBM is about building secure networks to enable more secure data transfer or new capabilities. For example, in healthcare, IBM is trying to apply Blockchain to the process of managing clinical trials and enabling outcomes based contracts.

None of those have anything to do with cryptocurrencies.
 

UKnCincy_rivals

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They are partnering with companies involved in the crypto space.

You are mistaken.

No I’m not. Here’s what IBM is selling with regards to Blockchain (links below). It’s not currency. It’s things like be able to track assets in the supply chain or record asset transfers for insurance companies.

ICOs are something startups do to get around SEC regulations on who can invest in a non-registered security. It’s about creating a hybrid mechanism that allows more of a crowdfunding approach so that you don’t have to be an accredited investor to buy in pre-IPO.

IBM is not focusing on that because start-ups are not IBM’s customers. They don’t have the cash on hand to be able to afford IBM’s services. It’s the same reason startups don’t use services from Big 3 consultancies or BIg 4 professional services firms. They can’t afford it.

https://public.dhe.ibm.com/common/s...infographic-general-ku912407usen-20171109.pdf

https://public.dhe.ibm.com/common/s...infographic-general-ku912408usen-20171122.pdf

https://public.dhe.ibm.com/common/s...hite-paper-external-iuw03050usen-20170912.pdf
 
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UKnCincy_rivals

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I'm not even gonna read that beyond the first sentence...

The fundamental issue here is how you are understanding the currency, how it is being used now, and how capital is being raised.

Maybe try to use your google machine harder.


http://fortune.com/2017/10/16/ibm-blockchain-stellar/

https://cointelegraph.com/news/ibm-invests-200-million-in-iot-blockchain-partners-with-unionpay

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...0..0j0i20i263k1j0i13k1j33i160k1.0.i6cbJrHHSNk

That’s great you posted articles, but what I posted is what IBM is selling to their customers.

Further, your links provide examples of what I’m talking about. Take the partnership with Stellar as an example. Stellar has both their own digital currency and a transactions processing network. This network also processes currency to currency transfers that never involve a cryptocurrency. That is what is being leveraged in that agreement.

Again, it has nothing to do with a cryptocurrency or with IBM facilitating non-regulated funding for startups.
 

Bill Cosby

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Blockchain will revolutionize the way business is done. Ten years from now, we'll all be able to explain blockchain technology.

Cryptocurrencies are one application of the blockchain technology, and are almost all purely speculative.

An unalterable ledger of transactions spread across a network has far more relevant and world changing applications than a goddamn token.
 

UKnCincy_rivals

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Blockchain will revolutionize the way business is done. Ten years from now, we'll all be able to explain blockchain technology.

Cryptocurrencies are one application of the blockchain technology, and are almost all purely speculative.

An unalterable ledger of transactions spread across a network has far more relevant and world changing applications than a goddamn token.

Exactly. It’s a permanent, decentralized and cryptographically secure audit trail.
 

Deeeefense

Heisman
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Aug 22, 2001
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There’s a fundamental error in your analogy that a lot of people are also making.

Throughout these stages you’ve laid out, people weren’t technically investing in a technology. They were investing in a company that was developing a technology which it used to sell either a service or good and generate revenue. The investment was in a security (i.e., equity) that the investor believed would grow in value based upon the decisions management would make.

That is not the case with cryptocurrencies. If you buy Bitcoin, you are not buying a share of Bitcoin company, you’re buying the Bitcoin itself.

Bitcoin is not a security. It’s closer to buying gold on a commodities market than it is to buying a share of Apple.

Good point, I agree at this stage Bitcoin's attraction is more for it's stored-value, not it's utility. I'm not a chart guy but I have read a couple of Bill O'Neill's books on technical analysis, and my take is the chart of Bitcoin will likely behavior along the same technical principals as stocks or precious metals. People buy stocks for two reason, to share in the profits of the company (dividends) and for appreciation in value. IMO most movement on a stock chart is dictated by people's perception of the stocks price going up or down, which is the same thing they are doing with any cryptocurrency.
 
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Again, it has nothing to do with a cryptocurrency or with IBM facilitating non-regulated funding for startups.

Then we aren't in disagreement, except for the fact that if you want to invest in Stellar and some other blockchain ICO's that IBM has partnered, currently you can do so by buying bitcoin and then buying Stellar lumens et al with bitcoin.

Which was clearly my point.


You still don't understand what I meant if you think I don't know the difference between blockchain currency and blockchain tech in general. I didn't mean that they are endorsing it as you said, but that they are currently inextricably linked, which doesn't necessitate that they always will be or have to be.
 
A

anon_l8pbkn96tg3j6

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trading the bank oligopoly as a payment processor for a globally decentralized super computer with thousands of independent nodes who's interests are at least partially aligned with yours is a pretty big ******* deal . . . and that's just one use case. the "if it works" vision of the crypto world is obviously worth a bet if you have the spare change.
 

jameslee32

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What's occurring to bitcoin and other CCs right now is what's called "consolidation". That normally occurs after a big run up. A lot of profit taking occurs and sends the price down, and people that got in late start panic selling. Others with a longer term view see a buying opportunity and start buying, but then comes a new round of sellers wanting to "get out while the can". All that back and forth can go on for a few months until the price forms what technical charters call a "bottom". Then it can move up again.
In what range do you see this consolidation? Usually you won't see stocks do that with this much volatility. Not when it's breaking the 50-day moving average. In these moments techs look to see if the floor becomes a ceiling. In this case, buyers should be ready to buy again above 13106. If it can't make it back above there, it could be a consolidating a while.
 
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UKnCincy_rivals

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Then we aren't in disagreement, except for the fact that if you want to invest in Stellar and some other blockchain ICO's that IBM has partnered, currently you can do so by buying bitcoin and then buying Stellar lumens et al with bitcoin.

Which was clearly my point.


You still don't understand what I meant if you think I don't know the difference between blockchain currency and blockchain tech in general. I didn't mean that they are endorsing it as you said, but that they are currently inextricably linked, which doesn't necessitate that they always will be or have to be.

Actually, we’re not in agreement and you’ve now transitioned to arguing a totally different point. The argument was never around how to invest in an ICO. The argument was around you positioning IBM advertisements featuring Blockchain as an endorsement of cryptocurrency. That is simply not true. IBM is squarely focused on Blockchain platforms they can sell to large corporate customers and not on cryptocurrency itself.

Not only do IBM’s product offerings reinforce this, their executives have also explicitly stated this. Below is an excerpt from an article that included an interview with one of the partners from IBM’s VC fund.

“In short, a cash investment in a blockchain company is square in IBM Venture's sights, but there are several conditions that now need to be met. For starters, IBM's investments are expected to occur within 18 months to five years of the company's maturity – the widespread adoption of its product – and further, investments are limited to purveyors of business-to-business products.

This last criteria is one of the reasons IBM has eschewed cryptocurrency applications, said Auer-Welsbach. He told CoinDesk:

Most companies in the space are in the cryptocurrency field, which we don’t see from a B2B perspective as the ultimate angle for us to add value.’”
https://www.coindesk.com/blockchain...lose-to-making-its-first-industry-investment/
 
May 6, 2004
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I understand what you mean, but you clearly don’t get the point I am trying to get across. I even said I agree with most of your posts, which would be decidedly self contradictory if I were making the point you think I am trying to make.

Perhaps it is my inability to effectively articulate it, or maybe you simply can't or otherwise refuse to comprehend it, or perhaps it’s just a limitation of this medium of discussion. Either way, I think enough has been said on this.
 

Deeeefense

Heisman
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In what range do you see this consolidation? .

that's above my pay grade but normally with stocks I look for the "cup and handle" pattern which you don't see right now so my best guess is it will likely move lower before we see a floor develop, but since it's bitcoin aka the wildwest, who really knows? i.e. the rumored Amazon announcement in February could cause a nice spike depending on how the media reacts to it.
 

dgtatu01

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That's the way all stocks work, yo.

But with this the main question is do you believe in the tech or not? Because at some point you are still going to need an injection of buying volume to raise price. IBM showing blockchain commercials during the playoff game yesterday was shocking to me, and I believe in the tech (know it's real).

If IBM believes in the tech and you don't, well then it's maybe time to reevaluate.
Believing that blockchain technology is extremely interesting and useful can be mutually exclusive of thinking bitcoin is a good thing to own. I think blockchain tech has a ton of applications, but I think only a fool would have their money stored in bitcoin.
 
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Believing that blockchain technology is extremely interesting and useful can be mutually exclusive of thinking bitcoin is a good thing to own. I think blockchain tech has a ton of applications, but I think only a fool would have their money stored in bitcoin.

I never said otherwise and I stated earlier in the thread that serious investing in bitcoin was probably not a good idea.
 

jameslee32

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In other words, you don’t know ****.
 

jameslee32

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Lol this **** happens like all the time, right?
Hacks do. Equifax, Yahoo, Uber, Target, JP Morgan Chase, DNC, The Pentagon. Some of this stuff is hard to measure in today's dollars because with personal data, the ramifications can last years.