It shows the point that enrollment difference isn't the dangerous part like you claim, it's the program itself..
CCL Division Imbalance and Player Safety Concern
- Thread starter Cat Box
- Start date
It shows the point that enrollment difference isn't the dangerous part like you claim, it's the program itself..
@Cat Box, I like your posts most of the time, but this is getting shoveled into the ballot box for dumbest post of the year.
Epic & mchsalumni - I respect you guys as a posters on this board. If you think this is much to do about nothing, then I'll put the topic to rest. Clearly there are few who agree with me. For the record, this was never a complaint about fairness/unfairness. I just feel strongly there is a better way to schedule which would allow for more competitive games and perhaps fewer player injuries.
Several posters in the past have complained about the 3A vs. 8A mismatches that are regularly scheduled into the CCL. My position simply takes the conversation to the next, most logical level. My hypothesis is that uncompetitive mismatches put the athletes at a higher risk of injury.
Thanks for entertaining the topic, everyone. I'm out.
The better way to schedule would be to find a conference that fits your enrollment better...
I guess when I see 3A Mac taking it to 7A Plainfield N last year, I don't see your point..
Move Laurence to the Green to create a 6-team division. Move the 3 Red teams to the White to create another 6-team division. It would look as follows:
CCL Blue
Loyola (3486)
Brother Rice (2637)
Mt. Carmel (2161)
St. Rita (1993)
Providence (1709)
CCL Green
Fenwick (1944)
Marmion (1742)
De LaSalle (1533)
St. Francis (1290)
Montini (1086)
St. Laurence (1597)
CCL White
St. Ignatius (1387)
Bishop McNamara (520)
Aurora Christian (420)
DePaul Prep (509)
St. Joseph (382)
Leo (380)
No Blue teams will have any crossover games against White teams. The Green will play both the Blue and White in crossovers. Based on the strength of the individual Green teams, their crossovers will slant towards the Blue or White. For instance, Montini will play the Blue twice, while weaker Green teams will play the White. If the Blue is short of crossovers, work out a deal with the DVC. They have open dates throughout the season and are currently forced to look for games out of state. The Southwest Suburban also has an odd number of teams and has some open dates. They would also be potential games for Blue teams.
While Ignatius is still an outlier, in terms of enrollment, they are currently not a mismatch for most of the "new" White on the field.
CCL Blue
Loyola (3486)
Brother Rice (2637)
Mt. Carmel (2161)
St. Rita (1993)
Providence (1709)
CCL Green
Fenwick (1944)
Marmion (1742)
De LaSalle (1533)
St. Francis (1290)
Montini (1086)
St. Laurence (1597)
CCL White
St. Ignatius (1387)
Bishop McNamara (520)
Aurora Christian (420)
DePaul Prep (509)
St. Joseph (382)
Leo (380)
No Blue teams will have any crossover games against White teams. The Green will play both the Blue and White in crossovers. Based on the strength of the individual Green teams, their crossovers will slant towards the Blue or White. For instance, Montini will play the Blue twice, while weaker Green teams will play the White. If the Blue is short of crossovers, work out a deal with the DVC. They have open dates throughout the season and are currently forced to look for games out of state. The Southwest Suburban also has an odd number of teams and has some open dates. They would also be potential games for Blue teams.
While Ignatius is still an outlier, in terms of enrollment, they are currently not a mismatch for most of the "new" White on the field.
There is a better way to align the CCL, which includes five 3A teams. See post from pjjp. He lays out a very good approach which would reduce obvious mis-matches and make for more competitive games.
3A Mac taking it to 7A Plainfield N last year is an isolated game. Of course you would cherry pick one atypical example to argue the point. Hat's off to Mac for having one of the best 3A programs in the state year in and year out. Since you don't see my point, here is reality for 3A vs. 7/8A illustrating the CCL Red vs. CCL Blue (plus Fenwick) since 2012...
3A - St. Joe
2015 vs. Rita = 56-0 loss
2014 vs. Rita = 55-14 loss
2013 vs. Fenwick = 63-0 loss and BR = 63-14 loss
2012 vs. Mt. Carmel = 54-0 loss
3A - DePaul Prep
2015 vs. Loyola = 42-0 loss
2014 vs. Loyola = 42-6 and Fenwick 38-0 loss
2013 vs. Providence = 42-0 and Fenwick 40-7 loss
2012 vs. Loyola = 42-0 and Fenwick 42-0 loss
3A - Leo
2015 vs. MC = 38-12 loss
2014 vs. MC = 63-20 loss
2013 vs. MC = 59-13 loss
2012 vs. BR = 44-12 and Rita 31-6 loss
This is not good football by anyone's standards. This is 0-17 and a 41.7 point margin average.
But wait! Mac beat Plainfield North last year so none of this matters.
Again, cuddos to pjjp for his excellent conference realignment suggestion.
I'm not sure where I stand but there will always be blowouts. Was there an injury risk when West Chicago was getting smoked in the DVC? I dont know, they were close in class assignment.
I do agree the CCL could adjust and make things different that might be better. It seems everyone is trying to possition themselves for 6 wins and that will never work.
A school stepping up to the blue would make a huge difference but we all know the history behind that. But on the flip side SFHS did step up in baseball and they had a real good squad in '16 and they took their lumps but also a different sport. I'm looking a little east down Roosevelt Rd.
I do agree the CCL could adjust and make things different that might be better. It seems everyone is trying to possition themselves for 6 wins and that will never work.
A school stepping up to the blue would make a huge difference but we all know the history behind that. But on the flip side SFHS did step up in baseball and they had a real good squad in '16 and they took their lumps but also a different sport. I'm looking a little east down Roosevelt Rd.
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I think the reluctance of other schools to join the Blue discredits the notion that it's about coaching and working hard.
Why are you using St Joes and DePaul Prep as your comparison for AC and Mac??? AC played Rita very well in 2014
There are going to be blowouts in every conference, we have running clock games in the I-8 and its all 3A/4A schools..
You gripe about AC having to play St Rita, but yet they have no problem scheduling Senn and Marshall... So basically you feel that you shouldn't have to play a game you lost by 21, but have no problem scheduling a game you win by 49... I think we all see what's going on here..
I may forever regret this, but I find myself agreeing with almost everything @HHSTigerFan has said in this thread
I don't want the conversation to be all about AC or Mac. Sure Mac and AC compete well (at times) vs. the CCL Blue. But there are five 3A schools in the CCL affected by the current structure which has obvious room for improvement. Again, I really like the suggestion pjjp laid out.
As for AC scheduling Senn and Marshall, as SiuCubFan8 said, "everyone is positioning themselves for 6 wins". Everyone does it in effort to be playoff eligible. AC managed to schedule ACC this season, so only one CPL school on the schedule.
Are there many 3A conferences St Joes could compete in??
If AC is playing Brother Rice and a CPL school this year, they really don't have much to gripe about as they are a wash
I dont know why SJ hasnt gone to the Metro Suburban yet - could be that basketball drives that bus and it prefers that bball compete in a more reputable conference. Since there is no chance of a West Suburban Bronze forming up, thats probably the way to go. Leo and DPP if they ever did a blended conference would probably go to smaller Illini CPS divisions. But I think DPP might get up to Iggy levels of football competence if it avoids the temptation to jack tuition up to Latin/Parker levels.