CI Wrestling Thread #56

[krazykats]

How in the world is Lawler a play in? Jericho, Funk, Guerrero............but you choose Lawler?

If I'm going heart/kayfabe inclusive:

Hogan, Flair, Stone Cold, Sting and Sting wins.

If I'm going just ability and straight up wrestling:

Angle, Rock, Macho, Sting and Sting wins

It's like in the movie big daddy only instead of I win its called Sting wins

 

[KingOfBBN]

How in the world is Lawler a play in? Jericho, Funk, Guerrero............but you choose Lawler?

If I'm going heart/kayfabe inclusive:

Hogan, Flair, Stone Cold, Sting and Sting wins.

If I'm going just ability and straight up wrestling:

Angle, Rock, Macho, Sting and Sting wins

It's like in the movie big daddy only instead of I win its called Sting wins

Mainly he's a play-in because I completely forgot about him. His character was great but he wasn't some amazing in-ring talent. That's the only reason why Eddie is in there and Jericho. Remember some of these are just thrown together because I'd be intrigued by it.

 

[KingOfBBN]

If I was picking, I'd have Hogan getting knocked out in the 2nd round.

Out of those first round match-ups I'd love to see Brock vs Andre. That whole region 3 would be fantastic. HBK vs Brock/Andre winner? Taker vs Sting?

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

Where is the Flair/Lawler being held at?

Could be a huge upset in the right venue.

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

Region 3 is stacked.

Region one could open up and you get a surprise. Flair has won the title so many times because he's willing to lose it. He could be like Kansas and get out early, as in Lawler in a Southern venue.

Brett could be screwed and an outlier (like the Jericho/Angle match) make a final four run.

 

[KingOfBBN]

Region 3 is stacked.

Region one could open up and you get a surprise. Flair has won the title so many times because he's willing to lose it. He could be like Kansas and get out early, as in Lawler in a Southern venue.

Brett could be screwed and an outlier (like the Jericho/Angle match) make a final four run.

With Flair/Lawler, let's say it's in Atlanta. Kind of a compromise. Don't want it in North Carolina or Tennessee because of the home field advantage. A Kurt Angle/Bret Hart match is a dream match for me. Would love to see how that turns out.

How would that Region 3 bracket play out?

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

Atlanta?

I see Lawler beating Flair and its downhill from there with the bracket.

Edge beats Steamboat and sets up an ugly 2nd round matchup that Lawer then takes and has a Cinderella story.

Angle beats Canadian one (Jericho), Canadian two (Hart) beats Rogers with a hostile crowd against him. Angle then Merica's up and beats Hart. It's Georgia, and they do Georgia things.

Angle then ends up ending Lawlers run and becomes the sacrificial lamb in the final four.

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

Two match-ups the committee should have tried to make happen.

Flair/Rogers. Nature Boy square off.

Race/Lawler. Battle for the crown.

Race and Rogers are the real Nature Boy and King. Though the moniker is more recognized through Flair/Lawler. Would be good stuff, and I'm sure bad blood.

 

[TransyCat09]

Race just starts shooting on everyone (with a gun?) and wins the whole thing

 

[krazykats]

Only matchup a I'd really want to see is Sting/Brock and Macho/Stone Cold.

Younger Macho had this schtick where he would intentionally have people play into a trap running around while being chased and eventually when positioned right use it to his advantage and capatilize on the stupid face.

I envision this with Stone Cold standing in the ring throwing beers at Macho as he runs instead of how it really went.

Sting/Brock gives me the same "can he really get over" feel I got when sting overcame Flair, Vader, and Sid. I really thought at one time Sid just might kill Sting at a Halloween Havoc match. Sid was unreal as a kid!

 

[Lexie's Dad]

Obviously BCF doesn't understand bake my cakes.

Stupid toucher doesn't think Ric Flair is top 5 all time, you know he's trying to use an Easy Bake Oven with one of the new-fangled environmentally friendly light bulbs.

 

[Lexie's Dad]

If I was picking Hogan wins and then has sex with everyone on camera while calling em ni**ers.

 

[School boy]

Well Orton over Stone Cold because well... I mean this and got heat for it with people but Randy Orton is the greatest wrestler ever.

Sorry beer gut 3:16 but Orton will have to move on.

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

Well Orton over Stone Cold because well... I mean this and got heat for it with people but Randy Orton is the greatest wrestler ever.

Sorry beer gut 3:16 but Orton will have to move on.

As a poster you really need some face run. Your heel game is very stale. You've kind of gotten to that place where your intro isn't shown on TV and you don't elicit cheers or boo's.

Maybe job out a few times and agree with a good posters take and unexpectedly defend positions that surprise the regulars.

 

[School boy]

Stupid toucher doesn't think Ric Flair is top 5 all time, you know he's trying to use an Easy Bake Oven with one of the new-fangled environmentally friendly light bulbs.

I'm having problems trying to figure out how to even use this easy bake oven thing. Like the cake should have already been made by now.

Kyboy I can not get good with the crew. I can agree with every thing they say and I bet I'll take more heat. But really I do think Orton is the greatest ever. I get it I'm the only one on here that thinks that.

But stand by it

 

[krazykats]

Well Orton>Nash so I'll leave you alone about it.

 

[Lexie's Dad]

Gee, another injury...

Bray Wyatt sustained a calf injury in Italy during a match against the guy.

Truthfully, if he has to miss time it will give "creative" time to figure out a way to use him. Depending on how long it takes for him to return, could bring him and Harper back together.

This does hurt Rowan and Strowman - will be interesting to see what happens with them. Maybe they become guy disciples.

 

[allabouttheUK]

Well Orton over Stone Cold because well... I mean this and got heat for it with people but Randy Orton is the greatest wrestler ever.

Sorry beer gut 3:16 but Orton will have to move on.

I'm a huge Orton mark, but greatest ever?? Do you mean actual skills or WWE "wrestling". In his prime he was pretty damn good, but so was Edge, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Benoit. As far as wrestling ability (no promo), Deal Malinko and Kurt Angle have to be ahead of Orton.

 

[CrimeDawg18]

My picks first round anyway..

Flair
Edge
Angle
Bret

Hogan
Bruno
HHH
Rock

Austin
Dusty
Cena
Macho

HBK
Andre
Taker
Sting

If you like podcasts, Cornette is on with JR and Hayes and Garvin are on with Jericho this week.

Watched the Edge and Christian show last night for the first time, had a SuperFAN dude from Williamsburg, Ky on there. Won't spoil it but it was pretty funny

 

[allabouttheUK]

I think there needs to be some clarification on GOAT wrestler. Are we talking performer? Over with the crowd? Merch sales? Actual ability? Promos?

I mean as good as Hogan, Cena, and the Rock were...there matches (wins) all were so predictable.

 

[MoreheadEagle]

GOAT

 

[allabouttheUK]

Is that from the Power Rangers movie?

 

[cricket3]

If you don't recognize Max Moon GTFO.

 

[stereonut]

If you don't recognize Max Moon GTFO.

Paul Diamond?

 

[krazykats]

If your goat isn't Stone Cold, Rock, Flai, Hogan or Cena you are not aware of what THE top guy is supposed to do for the business.

 

[MegaBlue05]

As a poster you really need some face run. Your heel game is very stale. You've kind of gotten to that place where your intro isn't shown on TV and you don't elicit cheers or boo's.

Maybe job out a few times and agree with a good posters take and unexpectedly defend positions that surprise the regulars.

Ring announcer: And his opponent, already in the ring, from Kentucky, Big Cat Fan.

CROWD: MVP as a face pop (aka nothing)


-------------------------------------------------------------------


My GOAT is Austin. Co-GOAT is The Rock.

Brought me back into the mix. Got me beyond interested in the product. Made me WANT to tune in each week. Hogan was too saccharin for me even as a kid, IMO.

As to Orton, I'm probably in the minority but I think he's bland as bland can be. Good wrestler though.

 

[allabouttheUK]

My point is that the case could be made for many different wrestlers as GOAT, like the poster above who said Orton. Each one of the top 10 could be number 1 in any given category so if you list a top 5 or 10 based on categories that makes it a bit easier...that's all I was saying.

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

I agree with krazykats regarding greatest ever. It just is what it is. None of those are my favorite, or most influential, but that's a good short list and understanding what it means to be the GOAT.

 

[krazykats]

I get what your trying to say, but what I'm saying is the top guy or goat is simply more than a wrestler he is the seller of the product, the draw that keeps fans coming back and his coworkers paid, he has to reach the crowd somehow, he has to by default have to be able to hold his own in the ring no matter his style, and he has to balance/politic the locker room in order for them to care enough not to hurt the guy.

All of that is why it comes down to only a handful. Those other guys you may consider was weak at some of that somehow and couldn't be goat. They can be your favorite or they can be really damn good but it just isn't meant for all.

 

[TransyCat09]

I highly recommend this week's Cornette podcast. Ricky Morton tells some awesome stories and his co-host rips Lance Storm to shreds

 

[Lexie's Dad]

If your goat isn't Stone Cold, Rock, Flai, Hogan or Cena you are not aware of what THE top guy is supposed to do for the business.

You can also make a case for Sting, HHH, HBK, & Bret from the modern era.

Flair is the "best" of all time - matches, promos, heat, etc.
Hogan is the most important due to his ability to draw money and his mainstream appeal.
Just beneath that you have Austin in the "Flair spot" and Dwayne Johnson in the "Hogan spot".

 

[KingOfBBN]

You can also make a case for Sting, HHH, HBK, & Bret from the modern era.

Flair is the "best" of all time - matches, promos, heat, etc.
Hogan is the most important due to his ability to draw money and his mainstream appeal.
Just beneath that you have Austin in the "Flair spot" and Dwayne Johnson in the "Hogan spot".

I think The Rock has probably had just as many good and memorable matches as Austin. Personally, I think Hogan is pure **** and is one of the worst in-ring stars of all-time. Rock is well above Hogan in athleticism and having good matches.

 

[krazykats]

You can also make a case for Sting, HHH, HBK, & Bret from the modern era.

Flair is the "best" of all time - matches, promos, heat, etc.
Hogan is the most important due to his ability to draw money and his mainstream appeal.
Just beneath that you have Austin in the "Flair spot" and Dwayne Johnson in the "Hogan spot".

Agree to disagree. The time between Flair leaving and Hogan being there WCW wasn't on fire and Sting was the leader facing Sid/Vader/Luger and it just wasn't the same as a legit goat type at the top of the card.

HBK/Bret are the exact same. They are great individuals but they need roster power to also help carry the card. You didn't by Bret you bought Bret and Shawn or Bret and Yokozuna or.......

HHH I may concede on but I disagree for now because I can.

 

[Laparkafan]

I think Krazy and I are twins

 

[Laparkafan]

But to say wcw stunk once flair left and hogan jumped ship revived them does kind of show the impact they had - I always thought Austin was held down in wcw until he jumped to wwf.

My top 5 has to be...
1 Hogan - he carried wwf from 80s until he made wcw the top dog for a while
2 Flair - he's gotta be top 2 no doubt
3 Austin - he still had some good ring work before wwf but helped them in attitude era end wcw Monday night wars
4 Lawler - his staying power has been unbelievable not to mention his impact in territory days can't be ignored. His work rate was off the charts.
5 HBK - dispute this if you want but he was the icon and the main event - he helped carry wwe from mid 90s into attitude era and despite a couple injuries could tear the roof off an arena

 

[KingOfBBN]

So you interviewing him soon?

No chance for that. You drop the n word and you're invovled in a messy civil trial, PR folks don't usually offer you to the media for interviews.

I am going to begin working with another wrestling promotion media wise but I'm not allowed to announce it yet, which is stupid.

 

[KingOfBBN]

Agree to disagree. The time between Flair leaving and Hogan being there WCW wasn't on fire and Sting was the leader facing Sid/Vader/Luger and it just wasn't the same as a legit goat type at the top of the card.

HBK/Bret are the exact same. They are great individuals but they need roster power to also help carry the card. You didn't by Bret you bought Bret and Shawn or Bret and Yokozuna or.......

HHH I may concede on but I disagree for now because I can.

A lot of people call HBK the GOAT. He may have given the best matches but he was never a "ratings guy." He never had the Hogan, Flair, Austin, Rock type stardom.

 

[kyboy1998_rivals34276]

 

[Bigtyrone]

I thought it was time to start a new thread since that one had been going on for almost a year now.

I was at Wrestle mania when the Iron Sheik kicked *** and showed off that beautiful Muslim moustache. This new WWE is just weak sauce.

 

[Lexie's Dad]

Agree to disagree. The time between Flair leaving and Hogan being there WCW wasn't on fire and Sting was the leader facing Sid/Vader/Luger and it just wasn't the same as a legit goat type at the top of the card.

HBK/Bret are the exact same. They are great individuals but they need roster power to also help carry the card. You didn't by Bret you bought Bret and Shawn or Bret and Yokozuna or.......

HHH I may concede on but I disagree for now because I can.

I try really, really hard not to put too much emphasis on business when discussing greatness in wrestling because it's beyond the performer's control. You have to consider

• The economy and the impact it had on ticket/merchandise sales,
  
• The impact that popular culture had on attendance and ratings,
  
• The surrounding roster - not only who they had to work with, but who they had working the undercard
  
• The booking/creative team

Because of all those factors I try to focus on "Did I like their promos?" "Did I like their matches?" If I had stock or some other financial interest, I'd give a **** about their impact on ticket sales or merchandise sales.

**Disclaimer from above - I am not a Dwayne fan. He's probably better than I give him credit for being. I consider him to be charismatic, but always felt he had his best matches with better workers, that he wasn't a guy who was going to be the lead dog in a great match with an inferior worker.