Cohens first 2 years at Kentucky compared to his first 2 at State.

[mstatefan88]

-In his 1st year atKentuckyhe won 7 SEC games, and only won 2 series. Kentucky went 24 and 30 that year.
-In his 2nd year at Kentucky he again only won 7 SEC games, and only won 1 series. Kentucky went 29 and 27 overall, with a terrible nonconference schedule that included 3 game series with Buffalo and Toledo, along with games against Cumberland, George Mason, Georgetown (KY), Appalachian State,and Tusculum just to name a few. Needless to say their nonconference schedule is no where close to comparable with the one we have this year.

-In his 1st year at State, he won 9 SEC games, and only won 2 series. We went 25 and 29 last year.
-In his 2nd year up to this point, we have won 5 SEC games with 2 series wins. We are 20 and 20 at this point, with 16 games left to go.

Cohen is in the exact same place he was in with Kentucky. In his 3rd year at Kentucky he won the SEC. We have got to get off Cohen and let him coach. Not saying we are gonna win the SEC next year, but the man hasn't even had 2 full years to turn the program around, and some of you are calling for his head already. He's recruited his *** off, and we have a ton of freshman who are forced to have to play even though they may not have been ready. Give the man some time to build a nucleus of his own players. Once that happens, and we still aren't playing well, then we can go after him. Buthe needsmore than2 seasons to get the job done.

 

[mstatefan88]

-In his 1st year atKentuckyhe won 7 SEC games, and only won 2 series. Kentucky went 24 and 30 that year.
-In his 2nd year at Kentucky he again only won 7 SEC games, and only won 1 series. Kentucky went 29 and 27 overall, with a terrible nonconference schedule that included 3 game series with Buffalo and Toledo, along with games against Cumberland, George Mason, Georgetown (KY), Appalachian State,and Tusculum just to name a few. Needless to say their nonconference schedule is no where close to comparable with the one we have this year.

-In his 1st year at State, he won 9 SEC games, and only won 2 series. We went 25 and 29 last year.
-In his 2nd year up to this point, we have won 5 SEC games with 2 series wins. We are 20 and 20 at this point, with 16 games left to go.

Cohen is in the exact same place he was in with Kentucky. In his 3rd year at Kentucky he won the SEC. We have got to get off Cohen and let him coach. Not saying we are gonna win the SEC next year, but the man hasn't even had 2 full years to turn the program around, and some of you are calling for his head already. He's recruited his *** off, and we have a ton of freshman who are forced to have to play even though they may not have been ready. Give the man some time to build a nucleus of his own players. Once that happens, and we still aren't playing well, then we can go after him. Buthe needsmore than2 seasons to get the job done.

 

[Goatdawg]

<div class="scrolling"><div>

*(deleted my other post and added it with this topic)*

2010: 20-20 through 40 games, 5-13 SEC, Team BA = .299, Team ERA = 5.85, Team FP = .959

2009: 19-21 through 40 games, 6-12 SEC, ended 25-29 (9-20), Team BA = .298, Team ERA = 6.57, Team FP = .968

2008: 16-24 through 40 games, 4-14 SEC, ended 23-33 (9-21), Team BA = .289, Team ERA = 6.82, Team FP = .965

So, it appears that our records are improving (outside the SEC difference from this year to last - one game) in spite of a more challenging non-conference AND conference schedule to date. All stats have gone up since Cohen arrived, while the FP did decrease from last year to this one.

So this is indeed NOT rock bottom, and we ARE improving, and we ARE recruiting lights out. 2008 pretty much covered everything that could be considered rock bottom. So Brianthedawg, rugbdawg, etc....stop posting on a subject you know nothing about.

ETA: Not to mention the numerous injuries, Polk's complete lack of recrootin', and the older guy's general terrible attitude.</p></div>
</div>

 

[Sutterkane]

Nothing ever happens the same way twice though. Just because his records are similar to what he did at UK doesn't mean we'll have a breakout year next year. At the same time, it sure could happen too.

Right now though...it looks like we'll have more of the same. Other than what he did at UK, point to me signs that say we'll be in a regional next year.

 

[Columbus Dawg]

.

 

[8dog]

what makes anyone think we are a regional team next year?

 

[Goatdawg]

Columbusdawg's statement is exactly the type of off base opinion that the first two posts of this thread showed to likely be wrong. Winning the SEC is a stretch, but being much improved is not.

Look at our team. Get our injured players back. Add talented freshmen. Add sophomore pitchers who will likely improve. I look for some of the JUCOs to be better with a year of experience, namely Shepherd and Vickerson, hopefully Ogden and Thigpen. And we're losing some cancers off the team as well.

Why is that such a stretch?</p>

 

[GloryDawg]

I bet the same people calling for Cohen's head after 1 and 1/2 years will be the same ones who will call for Mullen's head if he only wins five games next year. That's how message boards work. It's a place to *****! So let the weak at heart *****. Right now I am on Cohen's team. He needs more the two years. Now if there is no improvement next year, we need to be looking for a coach. I will give Mullen more time, football take longer to rebuild. Baseball and Basketball should be no more then a two year rebuilding period.

 

[BriantheDawg]

I think I've been more vocal than most on here, but I'm not calling for his head....and neither is anyone else that I've seen. I do think he needs to change some things though. The stubbornness is eerily similar to that of a certain football coach who could never get his offense into the Top 100 of the country because he wasn't willing to change. We aren't the most talented team right now and yes, we've had a lot of injuries too, but I believe we are better than Bama, UK, UGA & UT this year and that's enough to secure the last spot in Hoover. That ain't happening now and we're duking it out with UGA for the overall worst team in the league. I'm pulling for him to get it turned around, but at this point, I certainly have my concerns that he won't.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

Alabama's RPI is 20. Provide me one shred of evidence that we "should" be better than them, other than you (and all of us) just wish we were.

 

[Goatdawg]

but the problem is, you look much more stupid because Coach at least has like a decade or so to base his arguments on. Cohen's path to success has been similar everywhere he's been.

So, long story short, you look like a retard. Shut up.

 

[KennyPowers2]

What makes you think we won't be???? You should know that baseball is very streaky and as these young players mature they may get hot and have a god run next year!!!!! Don't be so negative polk left cohen a slight mess!!!

 

[Columbus Dawg]

we are losing 5 of our top 6 hitters and almost all of our run production. But Goathead made a good point, we are returning Thigpen and Ogden who are hitting .241 and .200 respectively.

I love how everyone keeps talking about these freshmen pitchers maturing like they are HS offensive linemen. How many upper class pitchers on our roster are significantly better now than when they were freshmen.

Guys like Dubose, Maholm, Ginter, Wallace were dominate for all 3 years. CC Watson might improve but he's not going to become an SEC ace just because he is one year older.

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

Seriously, I dont think anyone is calling for Cohen to be fired (yet), but this team has shown no improvement whatsoever, I think it is fair for constructive criticism of Cohen at this point, a lot of the moves he has made are just mind boggling, and its fair to question. The fact that people are still blaming us sucking entirely on Polk is laughable, sure its somewhat his fault but no where near all his fault still.

Also I just dont see where the improvement is going to come next year, yeah Stratton is good but until he adds a third pitch he is not going to be able to be that lights out guy on Friday night, also where do the other do weekend starters come from. Not to mention we lose our entire lineup, except Ogden (.200), and Thigpen, who has been below .200 all year until this weekend, and Captain Error himself Vickerson who is a capable hitter.

Duffy, Adkins, Sneed everyone gone. And if Powers had left in the draft this team would have at least 5 more losses IMO.

 

[Irondawg]

Which seem to be more often than you'd think for a baseball manager. Nobody will argue about our talent level or the injuries, but there have been very few brilliant managerial decisions that have resulted in wins that I can recall while there have been numerous decisions over the past few years that have made you scratch your head.

 

[muddawgs33]

I love how everyone keeps talking about these freshmen pitchers maturing
like they are HS offensive linemen. How many upper class pitchers on
our roster are significantly better now than when they were freshmen.

So you don't think a freshman pitcher gets physically and mentally better after their freshman year? The reason the upper class pitchers aren't better than when they were freshman is because they 17ing suck and had no potential but to suck... The freshman pitcher's we have now actually have potential to get better. How many of the upper class pitchers were we scared of losing to the Mlb draft? I'm gonna bet none...

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

No upperclassmen pitchers, because they are all injured or have been run off with the exception of Houston, who Cohen continually refuses to use even though he has the best ERA on the team and has been through the battles.

Look back at the upper classmen that would be here otherwise. Lefty Holloway would be a Junior or senior this year, drafted out of high school, cut. Moore drafted out of high school, injured and gone. Busby, injured and gone, actually signed with UAB. Pace, hurt. There are many others that have been run off. I am sure Reed would have been cut too, had he not agreed to drop down.

ETA: Whitney is still here and Cohen refuses to start him also.

 

[57stratdawg]

but I think the argument that we're gonna suck again holds much more water than the argument that we're going to be good.

Reasons why we might be improved next year:
[list type=decimal][*]"He did it at UK in his 3rd year"[*]We have some promising young pitchers[/list]Reasons why we might suck again:
[list type=decimal][*]We're losing the vast majority of our offense[*]The players that are going to win for us next year ARE NOT on campus right now
[*]There hasn't been any noticeable progress (anywhere in our baseball program)[*]Our pitchers don't seem to progressively get better
[/list]I'm not calling for Cohen to be fired, but he is under REAL pressure next year to win. There aren't very many bright spots associated with our baseball program. I hope he wins, but we don't see any closer now that we were in Polk's last year.

 

[Todd4State]

I had to laugh at Ginter being dominate all three years that he was here. I think his junior year he was like 7-5 or something like that. He was definately drafted on potential, but he is not in the class of the other pitchers that you mentioned.

And as far as CC Watson, I don't know if he'll be a SEC ace, but I bet getting his labrum fixed will help him out.

I guess you've missed Luke Bole's last two outings to. I won't even go into Stratton.

I don't have any stats with me at work, but all of those pitchers that you mentioned while they were very good as freshmen, and all improved as they continued to play here at MSU. The thing is people tend to forget how someone was as a freshman and they tend to remember what they were at the end of their career. It's the same for pretty much all sports. Raise your hand if you thought that Greg Houston would be a decent relief pitcher in the SEC by the time he was a senior.

 

[Todd4State]

Houston pitched yesterday and has pitched pretty regularly throughout the season?


Otherwise, you make a good point. We've lost a lot of pitchers lately and it has killed us.

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

The freshman will get better, thats just the way it goes. Cohen has not done them any favors this year, he could have by giving some vital roles to older guys but he chose not to. I dont think any of these kids will be that dominant, with the possible exception of Stratton if he can add a changeup. That is the problem I just dont see the team being that good next year with the kind of pitching depth that is needed to compete week in and week outin the SECand the lack of any hitters coming back.

 

[DAWG101]

nm

 

[Columbus Dawg]

Devin Jones was going to be Curt Shilling this year the way Cohen talked.

Of course these guys will get moderately better, but none except for Stratton, has the potential to be the dominating pitcher that we will need to get in a regional next year. They certainly haven't shown the talent on the field to legitimize our class ranking. I tend to agree with rebel law that our class should have been ranked in the 30's not the teens.

 

[Todd4State]

Statistically, we have improved. If you watch the team in person and remember what the 2008 team was like, you can tell that there is improvement. We have freshman pitchers with actual potential. We are just now starting to play hard and look like a respectable team- going by what I saw against Tennessee. Heck, Cohen said in his comments on Sunday that we are playing hard and doing what we need to do in the field and at the plate to win, but the pitching has to execute better and he said that they would get better with time. He also said- and I find this very telling- that he gets upset when we don't play as hard as we possibly can.

As far as the pitchers- Devin Jones, Houston, Caleb Reed all have improved since Cohen has gotten here. Luke Bole is starting to turn the corner, I think. Stratton has improved since he has gotten here. Bracewell has been good for a freshman at closer. CC Watson had a labrum tear that he got even before he came on campus. Now, I do think you can complain about Nick Routt more than anyone else. But at the same time, we were trying to make him more attractive to pro ball by increaing his velocity. I gurantee you we won't make that mistake again. Bowen you can blame on them, but I think he was a head case as much as anything.

Maybe if people would actually go to the games, they would notice progress a little more.

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

Something every pitcher who has ever thrown has done and you point is.

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

Bowen you can blame on Bowen, I am still baffled how he had a good year, was an absolute P***y headcase.

 

[Todd4State]

we could put someone and let them develop, but we don't have that luxury. If your best pitchers are freshmen, you have to play them.

I'd rather not have a rotation of Houston, Reed, and Whitney compared to what we have now.

It's just a ****** situation. Our Regional hopes hinge on how our freshmen come in and perform. I did some kind of a rough projection last night, and I think I had about three freshmen on there, and maybe one JUCO guy. We'll see. I definately think that our power production will go down, but other than Conner and maybe Duffy, we're not replacing anyone that I really think is unreplaceable. We're going to need Cody Freeman, Nick Vickerson, and Jaron to step up offensively. Our defense will be better, and I actually think that we will hit about like we are now- around .300 as a team, the pitching should be better, and we should be a faster team. But again, we'll see.

 

[BriantheDawg]

You sound like the GP Croom followers a couple of years back. Just give him time. He is cut from the mold of Bear Bryant. Wah wah wah. You are probably the biggest douche to ever frequent this board.

Please explain Sam Frost. Please explain Tyler Whitney. Please explain Ryan Duffy. Please explain Jet Butler. Oh, that's right. 1 is a Cohen recruit. The rest aren't. We should definitely be sacrificing the betterment of the team for an agenda by the head coach. Give me a break.

 

[Todd4State]

and all of a sudden he is Roy Halladay to some of our fans.

 

[Todd4State]

Devin Jones was going to be Curt Shilling this year the way Cohen talked.

Of course these guys will get moderately better, but none except for Stratton, has the potential to be the dominating pitcher that we will need to get in a regional next year. They certainly haven't shown the talent on the field to legitimize our class ranking. I tend to agree with rebel law that our class should have been ranked in the 30's not the teens.

of evaluating what we have in the offseason. Made Trey Johnson sound all-world as well. At least he puts out a decent lineup on gameday though. And before I hear about Sam Frost- he hasn't started in at least two weeks.

As far as our class, it may be in the 30's, but we will know for sure in two years.

As far as just getting into a regional- one dominating pitcher is enough to just get in a regional. There are all kinds of mid-majors that get to the postseason because they have one and that's it.

 

[8dog]

Jones...

With the way this staff has thrown this year, just getting better on a normal progression isn't going to do us a ton of good.

 

[Goatdawg]

right here.

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

We have one gave in improvement from terrible to still terrible, our BA went up one point thanks to Jackson State game, our ERA went down but honestly could it be worse than a 6.87.

You are wrong about the improvement being there, I am not saying we will not be much better next year, I just have not seen improvement over the last two years.

 

[Goatdawg]

You're done, pal.

 

[bill brasky.sixpack]

NM</p>

 

[brantleyjones]

BJ Wallace barely pitched his freshman year.

Dubose, Maholm, and Jeff Brantley perhaps.

 

[alabamadog]

if you don't see any errors for him, it was because he completely misses the ball. I still feel like he should start, but his fielding really is that bad. Whitney should be pitching more, but its not like he is that much better than the rest of our pitchers. Butler is only hitting around .280 in the Sec and as gotten to start in 17 of 18 sec games. Frost actually has a higher on base percentage than Butler in sec play, but I would still rather have Butler in there.

 

[8dog]

I think it would have been okay to stick Duffy out there.

But you are right, Stratton got charged with some earned runs against TN he shouldn't have b/c Duffy just whiffed.

 

[Todd4State]

To be fair.

 

[8dog]

he has started 27 games this year and still has more ABs than Duffy.