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cowbell rule - unenforceable

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ImHurtinLinda

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Dec 2, 2008
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short of FAA type screening at the gates, you are not going to keep cowbells or any other artificial noisemakers out of stadiums - period - if the SEC made us do FAA type screening, they would have to make every SEC school do FAA type screening - UT would have to start the process on Wednesday morning to get everyone in the stadium - don't see that happening.

now....

if there are cowbells ringing in Scott Field, prove that they aren't opposing fans attempting to get us fined.

if we get fined, and I'm Stricklin, I am sending 5 complaint letters every week stating that I watched game film and that I heard "artificial" noise at UGA, UT, LSU, USC, and UK (or whoever the home teams are for that week) - assuming artificial noise would be the sole of a shoe hitting a bleacher, a stick of a pom, pom hitting something, the pom pom "hair" making that woosh, woosh sound as it is waived, etc.

It simply can't be enforced unless done so subjectively. Uh-oh.......I guess that is that plan......hasn't stopped them before (see public apologies on blown calls, public stumping for certain teams by the commissioner, inexplicable blown calls by replay booth, support for UK player eligibilities, etc.) - recourse? there is none - to paraphrase Stans.....we are Miss. State-we are just supposed to shut up and take it.
 
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ImHurtinLinda

Redshirt
Dec 2, 2008
332
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short of FAA type screening at the gates, you are not going to keep cowbells or any other artificial noisemakers out of stadiums - period - if the SEC made us do FAA type screening, they would have to make every SEC school do FAA type screening - UT would have to start the process on Wednesday morning to get everyone in the stadium - don't see that happening.

now....

if there are cowbells ringing in Scott Field, prove that they aren't opposing fans attempting to get us fined.

if we get fined, and I'm Stricklin, I am sending 5 complaint letters every week stating that I watched game film and that I heard "artificial" noise at UGA, UT, LSU, USC, and UK (or whoever the home teams are for that week) - assuming artificial noise would be the sole of a shoe hitting a bleacher, a stick of a pom, pom hitting something, the pom pom "hair" making that woosh, woosh sound as it is waived, etc.

It simply can't be enforced unless done so subjectively. Uh-oh.......I guess that is that plan......hasn't stopped them before (see public apologies on blown calls, public stumping for certain teams by the commissioner, inexplicable blown calls by replay booth, support for UK player eligibilities, etc.) - recourse? there is none - to paraphrase Stans.....we are Miss. State-we are just supposed to shut up and take it.
 
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RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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You can't confiscate them all on the way into the game, but if security wants to confiscate them, it's easy to find them when they are being rung. It's hard to hide one and ring it at the same time.

That's why there aren't many cowbells heard at all in opposing stadiums when you play if the security wants to get rid of them. I've seen cowbells snuck into VHS plenty of times, but they usually don't last more than a few rings before they are found and taken away, so it's possible to enforce it. At MSU, your security obviously doesn't enforce it once you get through the gate, which I completely understand. If they wanted to though, it could be done, though it would be more difficult since it would be on a larger scale than just a few sections of the stadium.

As an aside, I don't think enough people would be able to conspire to ring bells to get you fined. Nor would they waste the effort.
 
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HuskyDawg

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Apr 29, 2010
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I assert that the only rigorously definable criterion that can distinguish appropriate noise from inappropriate noise is total sound output. It would be silly to suppose that stomping on metal bleachers is any less artificial than banging a piece of rubber on a piece of metal (or, in the case of the cowbell, a piece of metal on a piece of metal), but this does not mean stomping should be banned. It would also be silly to suppose that jingling keys are nearly so disruptive as a cowbell, so I don't see how artificiality can be a basis for determining appropriateness. Rather, it is the volume of these instruments which is the issue at hand - not their artificiality.
 
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Agentdog

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Aug 16, 2006
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......compared to other SEC games. I think there is a noticable increase.

Keep bitching Rebs. I might bring two next time.
 
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Hector.sixpack

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May 1, 2006
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sounds reasonable and very easy. Shouldn't take...what.... 15 minutes tops. And where to put all these cowbells- well, their pockets of course.
 
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RobbieRandolph

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Apr 17, 2008
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Since then, I have never had a problem bringing in alcohol to VHS.

I will admit my sample size is only 3 (non egg bowl) games. But I had a blasty blast.
 
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RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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Hector said:
sounds reasonable and very easy.? Shouldn't take...what.... 15 minutes tops.? And where to put all these cowbells-? well, their pockets of course.?
Click to expand...

All I'm saying is it's enforced at other stadiums successfully. It would be on a larger scale at your stadium, which would make it more difficult, but if the effort was put into it, it could be done, mainly because people would stop bringing them knowing that they couldn't ring them without risk of losing them.

I'm not even saying you should do that, because it's your tradition, but your argument is that it's logistically not possible. That's wrong. It is possible to do more than just sit idly by and watch if you wanted to, but I understand why you don't have security do it.

I still say that we should adopt a tradition of blowing those vuvuzelas that the South Africans blew during every match of the Confederations Cup last year. If people think a cowbell is annoying. Wait until you hear 10,000 of those in a stadium?

ETA: For those unfamiliar, here is a clip of the vuvuzela:
<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/wCbP-iZb0D8&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowScriptAccess="never" width="480" height="385" ></embed>

See if you can make it through all 2 minutes and then imagine that at a football game. If our fans really wanted to get noisemakers eliminated, just to tick your fans off, that would get it done by the first week in October.
 
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dawgoneyall

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Nov 11, 2007
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Artificial? Would that not encompass most UofM fans?

Hell! Lets strictly enforce that artificial noise maker ban when we play UofM.
 
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RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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go ahead and do a box showing which noises are created while a team is at the line of scrimmage too, which I think is the ultimate gripe with the cowbells. If cannons, loudspeakers, fireworks, or the band were noises used during the pre-snap time, there would be complaints about that. The argument against them is not the noise, but when they are used.

I wouldn't include pom-poms in your sound diagram either, unless you're going to include the sound of feet shuffling on the pavement, birds chirping, and other things that make a negligible amount of noise.

Cowbells fall in the same category with yelling, clapping, and stomping in terms of when they are used. The question is, is it unfair to use other sounds like airhorns, thundersticks, cowbells, or my favorite, the vuvuzela along with the natural yelling, clapping, and stomping that everyone does? Theoretically, everyone in the crowd could bring a trumpet and play a really loud note right before every snap if they wanted to, and it would fall in the same category with airhorns, cowbells, or whatever.
 
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Optimus Prime 4

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May 1, 2006
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and maybe your ticket, not sure. For a while they took your ticket when they caught you. Tub asked they quit checking period to get fans to go. Then once you were in you could sit a handle on the bleacher and no one cared. Now they look for it, and will confiscate it if seen. Obviously the solution to that is don't let them see it.
 
Bulldog from Birth

Bulldog from Birth

All-Conference
Jan 23, 2007
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When the noise is made is not a category, it's an application. Any of those noises could theoretically be generated while the team is at the line of scrimmage. He addresses this issue by showing which noises are under institutional control, which completely addresses your point as to which noises can be prevented while play is on-going, and which ones cannot be prevented.

BFB
 
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HuskyDawg

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Apr 29, 2010
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is to do it with zero fan noise and zero weather. We allow these to be part of the game for two reasons:
1) They add to the experience.
2) Assuming teams are subject to these unfair conditions on a roughly even basis, some degree of fairness is maintained. For example, the Dolphins may have to play the Jets in the snow, but the Jets may have to play the Dolphins in the humid heat. Alternatively, the Vols may have to play the Gators with eighty thousand people doing the gator chomp, but the next year the Gators have to play the Vols with a hundred thousand people screaming rocky top.

Regarding (2), I don't think any MSU fans have a problem if you want to ring a cowbell at us while we're on offense during the next Egg Bowl. As for (1), cowbells sure as hell add to the experience for MSU fans, and it's our damned stadium.
 
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Rebels7

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Mar 3, 2008
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You can craft your argument however you want, but two teams playing on a ****** field (LSU-Penn State last year) isn't even close to the same thing as the purpose of the cowbell rule. Even you have to see that.
 
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RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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I'm not a soccer fan though I did watch a little bit of the Conf. Cup matches during vacation last year or whenver that was, and I remember those horns.

Those things make cowbells sound tame.
 
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RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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Like I said, the argument is whether or not it creates an unfair advantage.

Obviously 90,000+ fans in Knoxville, Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc. give a similar type of advantage as well with the noise they make. The question is whether or not the schools feel it is fair to use noisemakers to make 50,000 sound like 100,000.

It's your tradition, and so I see why you like it and appreciate it, but you have to be able to admit that the cowbells make your crowd sound louder than it would be without them, which I'm sure is a part of the reason why you like it.

The argument to make for it being fair is to say that everyone else can do it if they'd like to as well, and they can. You just happen to be the only SEC school with a tradition related to noisemakers. If we had an airhorn tradition, or Alabama had a thunderstick tradition, or whatever else, would it create an unfair advantage for those schools?
 
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HuskyDawg

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Apr 29, 2010
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I think the Bulldog solution is for everyone to be allowed to have thundersticks, cowbells, or whistles (not airhorns!) and to hope that you guys don't take advantage of it to the extent we do. I am also inclined to believe that the crowd noise will naturally cap itself at a level just below painful, regardless of the stadium, but I'm kind of an optimist.
 
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Agentdog

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Aug 16, 2006
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To be fair, I understand the point of the rule. It is to not create an unfair advantage. I understand and agree it would not be good if 100,000 brought air horns, rocks in cans, and etc. to games.

However, the REALITY of the situation is that is not happening. You have one school with half the crowd (which roughly and generously half of the half crowd has a cowbell) bringing a cowbell to games. One because it is a symbol/tradition our University has adopted and two to make noise. But that is beside the point. The point is. The reality is you have approximately 1/4 of the people you would at Tuscaloosa, Knoxville, BR, and etc. with a cowbell. Three coaches said yesterday, every stadium is loud and Starkville is no louder than anywhere else. I think that says it all. The cowbells don't create an unfair advantage and people in Knoxville, Tuscaloosa, and etc. are not going to start bringing noise makers just because State fans do.

The noise and other fans bringing noise makers is a non-issue. The real issue is a few teams get beat by State on occassion and they need an excuse and something to push back with. AU bitched after getting beat in the 70s. OM and Bama are bitching now because State has landed a few Ws in their column.
 
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dawgoneyall

Junior
Nov 11, 2007
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in the NCAA rule book.

The 11 SEC dumbass AD's can't rewrite the NCAA rules book. You are one for thinking they could or should.
 
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MrHooch

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Feb 25, 2008
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HuskyDawg said:


I assert that the only rigorously definable criterion that can distinguish appropriate noise from inappropriate noise is total sound output. It would be silly to suppose that stomping on metal bleachers is any less artificial than banging a piece of rubber on a piece of metal (or, in the case of the cowbell, a piece of metal on a piece of metal), but this does not mean stomping should be banned. It would also be silly to suppose that jingling keys are nearly so disruptive as a cowbell, so I don't see how artificiality can be a basis for determining appropriateness. Rather, it is the volume of these instruments which is the issue at hand - not their artificiality.
Click to expand...
what if every state fan took the "clacker" ball or whatever the hell it's called out of the cowbell? Then it's not a noisemaker, right? So we should be able to walk right in the gate w/ a cowbell without a ringer, and then we are free to bang them on bleachers, or better yet get two and beat them together (think "metal thunderstick"... that's what I call my junk).
 
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pankReb

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Jun 2, 2010
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States can implement their own laws as long as they don't conflict with Federal laws.

pretty sure that the SEC can create rules as long as they don't override any NCAA rules. Crowd enforcement would likely be one of those rules. The SEC has it's own compliance department just like the NCAA does.
 
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