Croom's record vs. Johnson's record...

[RonnyAtmosphere]

Johnson's record @ Vanderbilt:

<table class="wikitable" style="FONT-SIZE: 95%"> <tbody> <tr> <td>2002</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>2-10</td> <td>0-8</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2003</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>2-10</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>5th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2004</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>2-9</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2005</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>5-6</td> <td>3-5</td> <td>5th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2006</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>4-8</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2007</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>5-7</td> <td>2-6</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2008</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>5-0</td> <td>3-0</td> <td></td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right">19 (as of 9-28-08)</td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right">19 (as of 9-28-08)</td> </tr> <tr style="BORDER-TOP: #aaaaaa 2px solid; BACKGROUND: #fafafa"> <td align="middle" colspan="2">Vanderbilt:</td> <td>20-50</td> <td>10-40</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
Croom's record @ State:

<table class="wikitable" style="FONT-SIZE: 95%"> <tbody> <tr> <th>Year</th> <th>Team</th> <th>Overall</th> <th>Conference</th> <th>Standing</th> <th>Bowl</th> <th>Coaches#</th> <th>AP°</th> </tr> <tr> <td style="BACKGROUND: #dddddd; BORDER-BOTTOM: #aaaaaa 2px solid" align="middle" colspan="9">Mississippi State Bulldogs (SEC) (2004-present)</td> </tr> <tr> <td>2004</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>3-8</td> <td>2-6</td> <td>6th (West)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2005</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>3-8</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>T-5th (West)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2006</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>3-9</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>6th (West)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2007</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>8-5</td> <td>4-4</td> <td>T-3rd (West)</td> <td>W Liberty</td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2008</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>1-4</td> <td>0-2</td> <td></td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr style="BORDER-TOP: #aaaaaa 2px solid; BACKGROUND: #fafafa"> <td align="middle" colspan="2">Mississippi State:</td> <td>18-34</td> <td>8-26</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
It appears Croom has 2 less wins (both overall & in-conference) than Johnson, even though Johnson has been @ Vandy 2 seasons longer than Croom has been @ State.

Johnson's record @ Vandy has been pathetic.

Croom's record @ State has been equally pathetic.

Notice how "patient" Vandy has been with Johnson. He followed up three 2 win seasons
in a row with a 5 win season, & still was not fired.

Will Vandy finally, this season, get to 8 wins during Johnson's tenure?

My point is, quit kissing Johnson's ***.

He has been a pathetic coach @ Vandy.

Actually, on a year-to-year average, Johnson's record is worse than Croom's.

Yes, Johnson doesn't get paid as much as Croom, but there was not exactly rioting in the streets by the MSU faithful after Croom was rewarded his Freddie Mac-esque "raise."

Johnson & Croom are both sub-par coaches.

One had a decent (but not great) season last year & one (having 2 seasons more to work on it than the other) is having a decent (potentially great) season this year.

So please stop using the newly discovered greatness of Johnson as a method to bash Croom.

Next Sat.'s game will be between the 2 worse coaches in the SEC (not counting whoever is coaching UPig now).

Keep that in mind before you turn Johnson into the new Spurrier.

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

Johnson's record @ Vanderbilt:

<table class="wikitable" style="FONT-SIZE: 95%"> <tbody> <tr> <td>2002</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>2-10</td> <td>0-8</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2003</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>2-10</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>5th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2004</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>2-9</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2005</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>5-6</td> <td>3-5</td> <td>5th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2006</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>4-8</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2007</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>5-7</td> <td>2-6</td> <td>6th (East)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2008</td> <td>Vanderbilt</td> <td>5-0</td> <td>3-0</td> <td></td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right">19 (as of 9-28-08)</td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right">19 (as of 9-28-08)</td> </tr> <tr style="BORDER-TOP: #aaaaaa 2px solid; BACKGROUND: #fafafa"> <td align="middle" colspan="2">Vanderbilt:</td> <td>20-50</td> <td>10-40</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
Croom's record @ State:

<table class="wikitable" style="FONT-SIZE: 95%"> <tbody> <tr> <th>Year</th> <th>Team</th> <th>Overall</th> <th>Conference</th> <th>Standing</th> <th>Bowl</th> <th>Coaches#</th> <th>AP°</th> </tr> <tr> <td style="BACKGROUND: #dddddd; BORDER-BOTTOM: #aaaaaa 2px solid" align="middle" colspan="9">Mississippi State Bulldogs (SEC) (2004-present)</td> </tr> <tr> <td>2004</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>3-8</td> <td>2-6</td> <td>6th (West)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2005</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>3-8</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>T-5th (West)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2006</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>3-9</td> <td>1-7</td> <td>6th (West)</td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2007</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>8-5</td> <td>4-4</td> <td>T-3rd (West)</td> <td>W Liberty</td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr> <td>2008</td> <td>Mississippi State</td> <td>1-4</td> <td>0-2</td> <td></td> <td></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> <td style="TEXT-ALIGN: right"></td> </tr> <tr style="BORDER-TOP: #aaaaaa 2px solid; BACKGROUND: #fafafa"> <td align="middle" colspan="2">Mississippi State:</td> <td>18-34</td> <td>8-26</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
It appears Croom has 2 less wins (both overall & in-conference) than Johnson, even though Johnson has been @ Vandy 2 seasons longer than Croom has been @ State.

Johnson's record @ Vandy has been pathetic.

Croom's record @ State has been equally pathetic.

Notice how "patient" Vandy has been with Johnson. He followed up three 2 win seasons
in a row with a 5 win season, & still was not fired.

Will Vandy finally, this season, get to 8 wins during Johnson's tenure?

My point is, quit kissing Johnson's ***.

He has been a pathetic coach @ Vandy.

Actually, on a year-to-year average, Johnson's record is worse than Croom's.

Yes, Johnson doesn't get paid as much as Croom, but there was not exactly rioting in the streets by the MSU faithful after Croom was rewarded his Freddie Mac-esque "raise."

Johnson & Croom are both sub-par coaches.

One had a decent (but not great) season last year & one (having 2 seasons more to work on it than the other) is having a decent (potentially great) season this year.

So please stop using the newly discovered greatness of Johnson as a method to bash Croom.

Next Sat.'s game will be between the 2 worse coaches in the SEC (not counting whoever is coaching UPig now).

Keep that in mind before you turn Johnson into the new Spurrier.

 

[MSUCostanza]

you leave out the majority of the difference between the two situations. You're too stupid to understand why there is no comparison between Johnson and Croom, so I'm not even going to bother to try to explain it to you. Suffice to say, Vanderbilt and State are playing from two different decks.

 

[615dawg]

but much much much easier to recruit players at the public university that is tied for the easiest entrance requirements in the SEC (tied with Ole Miss) than a private university with entrance requirements that rival Ivy League standards.

My wife works in admissions at Vandy - the requirements for athletes allow just a little wiggle room, but they aren't letting in 3.0 GPAs with 22 ACTs, muchless the Jerrell Powes of the world.

 

[Barkman Turner Overdrive]

[No message]

 

[Garciacamebackadawg]

He does a lot with very limited resources, and much higher entrance standards. I do think he would be an excellent fit at MSU. He can already do some things that CC has proven that he can't do, like manage a football game and show some imagination in his offensive scheme to get his best athletes the ball.

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

you leave out the majority of the difference between the two situations. You're too stupid to understand why there is no comparison between Johnson and Croom, so I'm not even going to bother to try to explain it to you. Suffice to say, Vanderbilt and State are playing from two different decks.

Go back & read the top post. I was not writing a post about "differences."

I wrote a post about similarities.

I thought your sabbatical away from this board would help rid you of your red herring syndrome.

Clearly it didn't.

The similarites being as such:

1. Both Croom & Johnson coach in the SEC.

2. Both Croom & Johnson have crappy records in the SEC.

3. Based on pure data instead of your emotional admiration for the "victim" Johnson, Croom actually has a better overall record than Johnson (based on percentages).

4. Johnson never whines about being disadvantaged in the SEC due to higher standards; he was hired to win games regardless of the fact he is forced to recruit players who are not mentally retarded.

Best to my knowledge, Vanderbilt has not (at least not recently) made a request they should be allowed to leave the SEC because they are forced to recruit authentic student-athletes.

Until that request is formally filed, Vandy should not be framed as a SEC affirmative action case.

I realize the new craze here is to use Johnson to bash Croom; if you think that's a clever path to take, I'm sure this time last year Vandy fans were using Croom to bash Johnson.

The one caveat I will submit is that Johnson's university has not tossed him 5 truck loads of free money like Croom's university has done for him.

Regardless, even with Johnson's low salary (by SEC standards), this is the first year he (Johnson) is actually earning his money.

 

[MSUCostanza]

Your argument was that Johnson and Croom both suck, or that somehow Croom is better based SOLELY on one statistic - overall record. How is it a red herring to suggest that Johnson and Croom are in two completely different situations, thereby invalidating using only their records to compare them? Which they are, by the way. TOTALLY different situations. I have never used Johnson to bash Croom, nor do I need to. Croom does a fine job of eliciting ridicule on his own. I was making the point that Johnson has done more at Vanderbilt than has been done since WWII, and despite his record, he is a very good coach. Croom has proven that he is a horrible in-game coach who makes mind-boggling decisions with strategy and personnel. Johnson has recruited a caliber of athlete at Vandy that they aren't used to seeing there, despite incredibly stringent academic requirements, the complete lack of an athletic department and a football budget that is small even by our standards.

You want to compare records? Let's do it.

2008: Vandy 5-0, despite having no bowl appearances since 1982. MSU 1-4, coming off a bowl victory the prior year and returning a ton of significant starters.

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

I was making the point that Johnson has done more at Vanderbilt than has been done since WWII, and despite his record, he is a very good coach...

I think I'll wander over to the Florida or LSU or Georgia board & get me some "Croom-will-turn-your-program-around because-he-is-a-good-man" sunshine shot up my rectum.

Granted, Johnson is having an outstanding year this year, but last year patdog, coach34, you & a bunch of other people were crapping asterisks all over every State win.

Glad to see you think Johnson is " a very good coach despite his record."

That at least saves Johnson from your asterisk attacks.

 

[OEMDawg]

You mean like spouting off a bunch of asterisks while a coach takes his team to Omaha? Who'd a thunk it.

 

[HighPointDawg]

Is drastically overrated Do they have trouble recruiting? YES.. is it based only on admissions standards? NO. They myth that they can't get a 5 star below-average student into Vandy is just that... a myth.. they have just as many players that have it so easy that it's not even funny.. there is a track at Vandy for athletes that is really no harder than MSU. Could they get Jerrell Powe in to Vandy? Hell no because of the public perception... but there have been some less notable players of that level that made it through.

It's hard to recruit to Vandy because...well.. they are Vandy.. just like it's hard to recruit to other schools (including MSU) that have historically SUCKED.

I live here and have gone to a number of games with faculty and heard a ton of stories.. if they can get a player they will.

 

[MSUCostanza]

Tool.

You might need to check your archives, Pariah. I was defending Croom while he was winning last year. But, a nice try nonetheless.

 

[patdog]

The football and basketball teams at Vandy, just like at other academic powerhouses like Duke, Stanford, Northwestern, etc., are mostly made up of players who wouldn't have a prayer of ever getting admitted into those schools if they weren't on athletic scholarship.

 

[olemissbydamn]

The football and basketball teams at Vandy, just like at other academic powerhouses like Duke, Stanford, Northwestern, etc., are mostly made up of players who wouldn't have a prayer of ever getting admitted into those schools if they weren't on athletic scholarship.

 

[Indndawg]

****POOF****

You should lose all use of the interwebs for 2 months and then go on probation for another year.

JR.....your reign has just been usurped.

Congrats Ronnie

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

Tool.

You might need to check your archives, Pariah. I was defending Croom while he was winning last year. But, a nice try nonetheless.

No checking of the archives is necessary.

This is an out-&-out lie.

I'm amazed you are going to suddenly try to pretend you were a Croom cheerleader last year after the way you showed your *** after every win (not talking about losses, I'm talking about wins).

 

[MSUCostanza]

I doubted him early in the year, but I really thought we had turned the corner after the UK and Bama wins. But, you're going to believe what you want to believe regardless, so there is no point in continuing this ridiculousness. You are just a lying sack of ****, and stupid to boot.

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

****POOF****

You should lose all use of the interwebs for 2 months and then go on probation for another year.

JR.....your reign has just been usurped.

Congrats Ronnie

...Rule of Thumb #1:

If you can't conceptually grasp the topic being discussed, stay out of the thread.

Rule of Thumb # 2:

If the thread does not fit your Croom-bashing motif (which this one clearly doesn't), stay out of the thread.

Rule of Thumb #3:

If you have nothing of significance to add to the thread topic (which you clearly don't), stay out of the thread.

Rule of Thmb #4:

If you are going to take cowpower's side, then make your case & take his side. Otherwise, stay out of the thread.

Rule of Thumb #5:

When you have over 7,000 comments & have offered nothing of significance in any of those 7,000+ comments, for God's sake, try to save face & stay out of the thread.

 

[MSUCostanza]

Keep it up, douchenozzle.

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

Keep it up, douchenozzle.

I've made my case.

Meanwhile, you've tossed out red herrings & lied.

Even the morons who took your side (I guess they were taking your side), as usual, went down in the flames of their own stupidity.

Anyway, I won.

You are not even a worthy opponent anymore when it comes arguing emotion (you) vs. logic (me).

 

[Indndawg]

We bow and scrape to the superior intellect

 

[Indndawg]

We bow and scrape to the superior intellect

 

[MSUCostanza]

[No message]

 

[BewareOfMSUDawg]

.

 

[GeauxTigahs2005]

you do realize that you went on a 2 page rant for nothing right, and the fact that Vandy is now 5-0 and State is 1-4 can only show what is being done this year. You really can't use the past 5 seasons(fig of speech) records to see who is the better coach this year. If that were so, then Little Napolean(Saben) went from Genius to Croom and now seems to be headed north again. That's why Bowl games are not decided in pre season, b/c some teams surprise you. I would say that both Vandy and State have been a surprise this year, I didn't think VU would be undefeated at this point, nor did I think State would be this bad. I'm a Tiger fan and I thought last week if Croom had sacked up before half time it would be a tighter game that it turned out to be. Here's is the difference I see in the 2 coaches, Johnson coaches 60 min. win or lose, Croom
rolled over and gave his team a real positive image that State couldn't win in TS last week, even if he hadn't scored before that half, his team would still have had a chance to believe the dream was possible.