I think MCHS is too high! (I just want to read about something besides what I just read above).
DARKSIDE Rankings, 2015, Vol. 1
- Thread starter JCHILLTOPPERS
- Start date
I didn't have MCHS in my 10 yet. I would have if MS showed up against LA, but that whipping made me gun shy.
Despite Naz opening with an easy slate, they handily took care of business. MCHS narrow win over MS knocked them out for me.
Argue
I may note be a Montini fan, but you got a freaking squad there. Lil (big) guy is impressive, and one of many excellent skills, with a plus line. As important as the line may be, in an open offense you can win games with athletes and playmakers at the QB, RB and WR positions. Broncs have that. They also again have a line that can compete.
On defense the secondary is going to dominate as they get going, and I'm always hard pressed to question the Montini front seven.
You guys also still have a big leg at kicker, right?
I may note be a Montini fan, but you got a freaking squad there. Lil (big) guy is impressive, and one of many excellent skills, with a plus line. As important as the line may be, in an open offense you can win games with athletes and playmakers at the QB, RB and WR positions. Broncs have that. They also again have a line that can compete.
On defense the secondary is going to dominate as they get going, and I'm always hard pressed to question the Montini front seven.
You guys also still have a big leg at kicker, right?
My original argument was that two Naz fans ranked Naz higher than everybody else. You correctly pointed out that USD had the same Naz ranking as you did. I acknowledged that mistake and pointed out that you are still in the minority of DSR voters with respect to ranking Naz and that you still have the second highest Naz ranking of all the voters. But, hey, if that is what you want to rest your argument on, then have at it, dude.
I did look up homerism. Here are three definitions that I found:
"In sportscasting, having a bias toward your hometown team or toward the team for which you play/used to play."
"Being blindly devoted to your favorite sports team whether they are good or not."
"The activity of miming of scenes from one of Homer's epics."
Had to throw that last one in there because of the epic reference. Get it? Epic?
I slay me.
Anyway, I looked it up and couldn't find anything about placing characteristics that are unreasonable on one's team. Where did you find that gem? Or did you just make it up?
Regardless, you are taking the pure coincidence route. Good choice. I have already spoken to the coincidence argument.
See you next week.
Take it up with JCHILL. He appointed me the official DSR devil's advocate.
If you really want me to talk about Naz relative to DSR rankings, then I would say that I don't care how many D1 players they have or that they are defending state champs or that they have a very successful head coach. What I would say is that Naz hasn't played anybody of note THIS YEAR that would justify a DSR ranking. Period, end of story. EVERY TEAM in the current top 10 DSR has played AT LEAST one above average or top tier program in the first two weeks of this season. Naz cannot say the same.
If the DSR were about POTENTIAL and TALENT and PROMISE, then why wait until after week 2 to publish the first edition? More than anything, the DSR is about answering the question what have you done for me lately, and lately does not include last year. The DSR is the DSR. It's not Beth Long's Super 25. It's the DARK SIDE, and it is held to a very different standard.
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What about the Week 2 win against ESL? Didn't ESL come up to Chicago in Week 1 and beat a highly touted Simeon team, who just handily beat a team from MS in Week 2?
everything in this post is correct...I actually enjoy and get something out of the epic/rambler debate...and it's exactly why I have asked ramblr to be the official justice brandenburg. I actually think you can be a homer and be objective.
In my DSR i wrote that i would have liked to rank naz in the top ten. I did not simply because i felt the other teams on the list had proven their skills to me by their sos, while naz had not yet. that being said, i cannot fault epic for ranking naz if he has watched them more closely than i have and feels that based on what he has seen from naz on the field, he thinks they are top ten.
The dsr IS a what have you done for me lately poll, as well as a poll that ranks you based on how you did against competition, regardless of the result...but there is room for wiggle. If HF were in Naz's position, i'd still have HF 1....
You can leave it anywhere you want. I obviously agree that strength of schedule is important. I also agree that it is not the be all and end all.
When ALL DSR ranked teams have faced at least one decent program and yours hasn't, then your team is an outlier. Given the STATED PREFERENCE for SOS as a criterion to be used in the DSR, I don't think that the Roadrunners deserve to be ranked at this point of the season, given the lack of strength of their schedule relative to the strength of schedules of those schools currently ranked.
As of right now, the teams you face before you meet JCA have a combined record of 7-1. Beat all those teams, combined with what will likely be some losses among top ten teams before then, and I would be more agreeable with a Naz DSR ranking (but probably not one as high as you will want to go). So, no, you don't have to wait until your JCA game in week 7.
This is shaping up just like it did last year. Besides Nazareth's relatively weak early season schedule, the problem is that you don't fully appreciate how much weight SOS has in the DSR. It's far more about who you have played and how you have done than it is about things like reputation, how many D1 prospects you have or how you did last year.
Ramblin' and JC,
Please allow me to be the devils advocate of the devils advocate, why should JCA be ranked, both of their opponents are 0-2. WN failed to qualify for the playoffs last season with a record of 4-5 and PC while being last year's defending 7A title holder is struggling. Leo was also 4-5 last season and Bloomington is coming off of a 27 year playoff qualifying run. Does JCA belong in the top 10? Hell yes, can Naz be justified to be there as well...sure. Hell even the Montini fan, who I think it's safe to say loathes Naz, has them in his top 10!
Please allow me to be the devils advocate of the devils advocate, why should JCA be ranked, both of their opponents are 0-2. WN failed to qualify for the playoffs last season with a record of 4-5 and PC while being last year's defending 7A title holder is struggling. Leo was also 4-5 last season and Bloomington is coming off of a 27 year playoff qualifying run. Does JCA belong in the top 10? Hell yes, can Naz be justified to be there as well...sure. Hell even the Montini fan, who I think it's safe to say loathes Naz, has them in his top 10!
That's a good point. After watching JC in Week 1, I expected to have them higher than I did (at #10). They didn't do anything in Week 2 to make me think any less of them. However, both teams they beat are currently 0-2, as you point out. I do think both Oswego (who beat Provi in Week 2) and WWS (who beat WN in Week #1) are pretty good teams. Also, both of the non-JCA losses by Provi and and WN were close games, while JC beat both handily. Weighing all those realities, I couldn't justify a JCA ranking higher than #10. But, I am surprised that Jwar was the first poster to question JC's ranking.
Hell even the Montini fan, who I think it's safe to say loathes Naz, has them in his top 10!
Not the school or team, just the coach who helped in allowing the inmates to run the asylum at Driscoll.
It's a ninth place ranking, not a top 7 even. They haven't played the SOS, hence why I think they aren't an elite team now. However for every other solid reason I've mentioned, and when considering THERE ARE OTHER FACTORS IN RANKING, I think Nazareth makes up for the iffy SOS, and thus SQUEEKS into the top ten.
I think you are no asset to the DSR. You have your way, and refuse to consider others. I've laid out explanation after explanation, and you've slowly back pedaled to SOS being the STATED PREFERENCE. You are digging in, and now despite others chiming in to the contrary of your thought, you dig deeper.
Congrats on being the DSR contrarian ***, closed off to well thought and defended opinions, and refuting math in statistical rankings. Bravo, you've shown yourself as usual.
And you cannot come close to looking past SOS, to evaluating an actual roster. We are not CalPreps. You sound like CalPreps...
When you talk of current season records after week 2, every school ranked in the top ten has beaten schools with current records of 1-1 or 0-2. PC lost a one pointer on the road to a quality opponent in Oswego and WN lost in OT in their road opener at WWS. I think that WN and PC at 0-2 isn't all that meaningful at this point if you are trying to play devil's advocate with JCA's ranking. Furthermore, in terms of overall strength of program, I don't think it makes sense to compare a 4-5 Leo with a 4-5 WN.
Nevertheless, it's not a completely unreasonable question that you pose and one that should be kept in mind as the weeks progress. Why don't you pose your question to DOS, since he gave JCA the highest ranking of all DSR voters at #4.
Good Lord, You two sound like two bickering old ladies at the hair salon. Accept that you have a difference in opinion and move on. Let the rest of us enjoy the anticipation of this week's games in peace.
This is not Beth Long's Super 25. It's the DSfreakingR.
Here's the problem: You can't fathom your talent rich Roadrunners not being ranked. In your mind, they clearly DESERVE to be ranked based on roster alone. It has to be on roster alone, because they certainly haven't proven anything so far this season other than they know how to beat up on much weaker teams.
You are trying to fit a square peg in a round hole and it's driving you bananas. Take a chill pill. Relax and go with the flow. If Naz is as strong as you say they are, it will all play out in the end -- just like it did last year. But, right now, it's not playing out the way you think it should.
It's not your fault that it's not playing out right now. It's the fault of Naz and the DSR. That's because Naz played teams in weeks one and two that are far and away weaker than the level of competition faced so far by the ranked DSR teams. No two ways about that. And it's because the DSR is not about future promise or potential. It's a snapshot...a what have you done for me lately snapshot that purposefully subordinates talent, reputation, coaching, etc. to what a team has done ON THE FIELD AGAINST DECENT COMPETITION. Don't fight the DSR or try to change it so that your favorite square team can fit into the round hole of the DSR.
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Has nothing to do with my team. It has to do with what I know of the roster. If I saw the same proven talent returning on any other team, I'd have them in the same spot. If that's not the spirit of the DSR, I apologize.
Henceforth my top ten will be the top ten from CalPreps, a calculation based on SOS.
I accept the fact we differ, I embrace that. He's the one telling me how I can and cannot vote, or at least the proper way.
As for telling us to stop, this is a thread about the DSR, and we are discussing it. Quick hijacking the thread with your anticipation.
He wants rankings based off SOS, and he'll get that.
Mt. Carmel at 16 makes sense to me.
If Vol. 1 of the DSR is any indication of how the rest of the season is going to go, it's going to be a long strange trip. But, I'm game for it. They key is to be able to agree to disagree and move on. If you can't do that, then you are going to see lots of threads like this one. In his eighth post in the thread, Epic said he was done arguing with me. Nine posts later, and he still can't let it go...
You continued to reply, and I addressed your points. You are the guy that continues to harp points at someone trying to drop the subject. Pulling the "he keeps posting" card is pathetic.
FYI all, I just sent JCHILL an email telling him I'm out.
If ramblin wanted to question my picks, that's one thing. He insists on going after my character as a voter, so he can take all his coincidences, and his standards of the DSR, and have them. Not going to go through this season with him refuting what I say by telling me I am not objective. Question the team, not me as a voter.
If ramblin wanted to question my picks, that's one thing. He insists on going after my character as a voter, so he can take all his coincidences, and his standards of the DSR, and have them. Not going to go through this season with him refuting what I say by telling me I am not objective. Question the team, not me as a voter.
IDGAF what you think of my skin. Congrats on being an intolerable asshat. Seriously, you argue against people's opinions by telling them they cannot form them unless they follow your standards. You are just an outsider to the whole process, yet the end all be all truth holder of the process. That's interesting to say the least, and I just don't want to be part of it.
I'm not going to spend my entire year defending my objectivity from your attacks. Nothing about this was worthwhile or enjoyable.
I've always thought you to be insufferable, and this just confirmed it.
Lastly, here I say I am done, and you go after me one last time. Again, congrats on being someone that ruins a good thing.
Ramblin'
You make my point for me...it's silly to question JCA's ranking(I said as much), but for some reason you feel it's not silly to question Naz's ranking. WN lost to WWS who lost to Lake a Park who got roughed up by WV, yes WV is an acceptable abbreviation for Waubonsie Valley(I know I live in district). Carry on!
You make my point for me...it's silly to question JCA's ranking(I said as much), but for some reason you feel it's not silly to question Naz's ranking. WN lost to WWS who lost to Lake a Park who got roughed up by WV, yes WV is an acceptable abbreviation for Waubonsie Valley(I know I live in district). Carry on!
I wasn't so much questioning Naz's ranking as who it was ranking them. But, if you want to argue the merits of ranking or not ranking Naz in the DSR, I think you have to start with the caliber (or lack thereof) of their competition. Again, SOS is a a major criterion when determining DSR rankings. When you examine the level of competition faced by both schools in weeks one and two, there is no comparison to JCA whatsoever in terms of the quality of JCA's first two opponents relative to those opponents faced by Naz.
Because we are so different, we have that much more to share. That's what the good Jesuits taught me. Have a great season and good luck to those talented Roadrunners.
rankings have nothing to do with making the post season and winning a trophy.....however, they do give bloggers something to do during the day. good luck to all the hard working boys out there who will put their best efforts to the test this weekend, and the follow several weekends. lets all keep it in perspective guys.
You absorbed none of that. I shared an opinion, you disagreed and labeled me. Others proved my opinion to be common and shared. You then stated our opinions are wrong because they are not the opinion you shared, and not formed as you prescribed . This of course is, " players don't matter, coaches don't matter, schedules do. unless you're a homer, irrelevant (Sorry USD and mchsalum), Beth Long or Edgytim."