When the press now says there is a divided fanbase, what are they referring to? My understanding is that everyone thought it was time for Franklin to go. I was a holdout until after the UCLA game but I think the final holdouts were all converted after Northwestern. Is the press still referring to old JoePa stuff, are they misreading the room or am I missing something?
"Divided" Fanbase?
- Thread starter Srg111
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See Marshall's post--there's a lot of people that still want it to be 1984 and hate the fact that Franklin was fired because "he was a good man" and "that's not how Penn State does things".
I was a holdout until Northwestern--after UCLA he had to fire AK (I know the defense lost that game but the offense was a mess) so his decision to keep him meant they had to win out--they didn't. Time to go.
I was a holdout until Northwestern--after UCLA he had to fire AK (I know the defense lost that game but the offense was a mess) so his decision to keep him meant they had to win out--they didn't. Time to go.
I heard that question too and was puzzled by it.
I agree with Lando's assessment. I fell into the camp where I was seriously disappointed with Coach Franklin on many levels, but didn't want him fired until after the NW debacle.
I agree with Lando's assessment. I fell into the camp where I was seriously disappointed with Coach Franklin on many levels, but didn't want him fired until after the NW debacle.
I hate the fact that he was fired midseason but Franklin was broken. I appreciate what he has done for Penn State but Franklin himself seemed like he was done. I think Kraft did the right thing by Franklin and the university to make the decision. Would Franklin want to be humiliated week after week on the field? I doubt it.
If 50% of the fanbase wanted him gone after Oregon, 22.5% wanted him gone after UCLA and another 22.5% wanted him gone after Northwestern, I do not see how this is a divided fanbase. If anything, the fanbase now seems united.
If 50% of the fanbase wanted him gone after Oregon, 22.5% wanted him gone after UCLA and another 22.5% wanted him gone after Northwestern, I do not see how this is a divided fanbase. If anything, the fanbase now seems united.
It's probably just some envious Syracuse grads working at ESPN tying to create controversy.
We should be united but...see the thread started by Marshall. His opening post is why we're not.
Now it's not a 50/50 split but there's a segment of the fan base that is upset.
I'm not a Marshal fan in the least. I reread his post and tried to find something that might offend you.
Could you expand on what you read / interpreted?
I wasn't offended. His take is the divided part. His blind loyalty to a coach because he "did things the right way". He's entitled to that. There's people that can't accept its ultimately about winning...and winning titles.
Misery? The program has a higher ceiling now than it did Saturday when you woke up. Cloud 9 more like it.
Agreed. I think I figured his ceiling had been hit in 2016 by the time 2018 or 2019 rolled around. Of course, then I was in the minority. Last year was a great year, but this year just never got out of first gear.
Given everything, I think that, over the years, the fanbase has been very patient and the school very accommodating. This ain't your father's college football anymore, though.
If it was 1984 there wouldn’t have been a 10 year contract signed. Pretty sure in 1984 the idea was to win national championships and if you heard Kraft it is the same today. Franklin set the table himself at media days: this is the year. It had become untenable. There was nothing left to do.
The 84 comment is about not accepting the changes that have occurred. This is a business now. It doesn't matter if the coach is a good guy or not. Winning matters. Only winning.
I was a holdout for a long time as well. I have no inside knowledge, but believe something else was going on behind the scenes that took away any benefit of the doubt that might have been given that would have enabled the decision to be made after the regular season. This wasn't a knee-jerk, nor do I believe it was a Sunday afternoon decision. As I said before, when this kind of move is made, with the reasons given for the move, it makes me hopeful (I think) that the next coach is a done deal and is just waiting until mid to late November to be announced.
I think it bothered me, maybe more than it should have, when he tried going after the fan in 2018.
I get it, people can be rude and cross a line. But that fan’s entire interaction was filmed and he just told him it was a bad call. Didn’t cuss, didn’t insult him personally. Said bad call, have to pass. Thin skinned James wanted to fight the kid. Then kind of did the same last year with Ohio State (but that kid was a little more aggressive).
I didn't think it would be possible to get rid of him from a financial standpoint at this time (especially with the optics that it gives), but I was obviously very wrong. I'm still not the biggest fan of the in-season timing, but time to turn the page and give coach Smith my full support.
I definitely think any characterization of things being "divided" at this point is BS. Pretty much everyone that I've talked to over the past 24+ hours is excited about turning the page and seeing what's up next.
My only issue at this point is with anyone that's still kicking Coach Franklin (and Drew) while they are down...they did their best, and I'm thankful for everything they gave to my alma mater.
I definitely think any characterization of things being "divided" at this point is BS. Pretty much everyone that I've talked to over the past 24+ hours is excited about turning the page and seeing what's up next.
My only issue at this point is with anyone that's still kicking Coach Franklin (and Drew) while they are down...they did their best, and I'm thankful for everything they gave to my alma mater.
"Having is not so pleasing a thing as wanting; it is not logical, but it is often true." -Spock
Buyer's remorse is a common phenomenon. People were comfortable calling for Franklin's head when he was still here, and they didn't have any power over the matter. But now the guillotine has fallen, and it's understandable that remorse is something some people are feeling. You think you want nothing more than to see someone banished until it happens and now suddenly, you realize you're twisting in the void of uncertainty, and the guy you just axed maybe doesn't seem as objectionable as he did last Saturday at 4pm.
For the people feeling sudden remorse, you need to remember that we lost to an 0-4 UCLA team that was averaging 14 points/game, and had no actual coaching staff, and 2 days to prepare to play us. You have to remember that we dumped to Northwestern at our Homecoming game. You have to remember that we were 20+ point favorites in both of those games.
You need to remember that a running back that was averaging 3.8 ypc was getting equal playing time to a RB that was averaging 7.1 ypc.
There is no cause for celebration here. But this did have to be done because we are not Northwestern, or UCLA, or Rutgers, or Maryland, or MSU.
We are Penn State.
Of course the fanbase is divided. Just read this forum any day of the year!
But, on the issue of Franklin’s dismissal, there is no division. Everyone has come to realization that the relationship between coach and program has run its course. I say that as someone who very much did not come to that conclusion until the UCLA loss. He did amazing things here and I hope he is fondly remembered for that in the future.
But, on the issue of Franklin’s dismissal, there is no division. Everyone has come to realization that the relationship between coach and program has run its course. I say that as someone who very much did not come to that conclusion until the UCLA loss. He did amazing things here and I hope he is fondly remembered for that in the future.
Yep, because that "ceiling" is now a LOT further away. What we just did was bat **** crazy.
You just fired a guy that had ONE losing season in his first 11 years (the COVID season), and would have qualified for the CFPs in 7 out of his first 11 years under the current CFP format. Not only that, you are spending probably up to $100 million dollars to make the change to a coach that has to qualify in 8 of 11 years instead of 7 to show any improvement over what we already have.. That's more money than our current annual media rights payout from FOX/NBC/CBS.
For every Cignetti, there's probably 10 or 20 busts. For that kind of money, I can put up with one sh!tty year. An extra $100,000,000 dollars put towards players has a FAR higher probability of getting us to the Promsed Land than a Hail Mary trying to find the next Vince Lombardi.
The only thing Kraft did right in this entire fiasco was appointing Terry Smith as interim Head Coach instead of Kotelnicki or Knowles. That MIGHT keep some of these guys from bailing ship.
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I was surprised by when I heard Sunday. we could have gone 9-3 and made the playoffs possibly but most likely 5–6. Think franklin lost the team. It’s to bad because franklin made his bed and didn’t deliver. I was hoping this was the year and was ready to be at every game until the end.
right decision in the end.
Time to move on. Next man up!!
Our "Homecoming Game " was a freakin disgrace wrt the crowd. Northwestern might as well have been playing in Evanston.
Every time we booed another Allar incompletion, it just motivated their players more. To the point to where the first place the whole Northwestern team ran to after the game was to our student section to thank them.
That bull **** crowd with all their boos and "FIRE FRANKLIN" chants probably cost us at least those two extra points we needed to beat Northwestern. Anyone that thinks that crap motivated OUR players to play harder is nuts.
I can't believe there are so called fans of our program that feel Franklin was mistreated or deserved better or whatever horse crap that Marshall guy was whining about.
This was a very simple decision and it was made decisively. Absolutely the right move, 100%! The guy lost the team and had the two worst losses in CFB history considering we were 20 plus point favorites. On top of that the program was a laughing stock because we could not win a game vs top 5 or top 10 teams if their lives depended on it. This firing was a long time coming and is completely justified. As for the booing, fans have every right to boo him off the field. He deserved it. This is a results business and Franklin did not deliver so don't let the door hit you on the way out.
These are professionals getting paid 5 to 10 times what our average fan makes in a year. These are NOT student athletes. It comes with the territory. This is a business not a high school homecoming game. Strap it up and play. Deliver results or face the consequences.
No one claimed that it motivated our players. But what reason did the fans have to show up for this team that got 42 points hung on them by UCLA? You have to have first have pride in yourself before you demand respect from others.
Here's something to think about:
Should we be playing a tight game against Northwestern in an average year? Should we be playing a tight game against Northwestern in a year where many people in the country picked us a favorite to win the National Championship?
The fight went out of this team after Oregon. And that, too, is something that led to Sunday's news.
I don’t think there are many people “kicking Coach Franklin (and Drew)” while they are down. First, Franklin has $50 million reasons to be up not down. What other job pays a fired employee $50 million to leave? Second, in terms of Drew Allar, most people have wished him a speedy recovery as they would for any injured player in sports. I feel really sorry for Drew because I believe he followed some very bad advice to stay for his senior year. It made no sense to return to a football program with one of the worst reputations for developing QBs. It cost Allar millions in potential NFL earnings and destroyed his draft status.
Except for those fans of the team that most recently won the championship, every CFB fanbase is divided. A big part of the angst we’re seeing is that firing a coach mid season (or at all) is Not Done At PSU. Sort of like what happened at Notre Dame: Rev. Hesbergh would tell his football coaches that as long as they didn’t cheat they could coach until their contract expired. And then some coach got fired for poor coaching, can’t remember who. Talk about a divided fanbase is just talk for the sake of talk, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing. (I left out the idiot part.)
After thinking about this for a day and a half now, i feel this was not only the right decision and timing for Penn State (which I believed from the moment I heard of it) — I feel it was the right decision and timing for CJF himself.
It was honestly a merciful thing to do for Coach given how badly he’d lost the fans and apparently the ability to fire up and drive this team.
I still feel awful for Franklin that it ended up playing out like this. But I’m confident he’ll land on his feet somewhere, will continue to have the opportunity to mold and support young men and be a positive influence in their lives, and oh yeah, win some football games — probably at a place where the expectation and pressure around WHICH games should be winnable will be much lower than they (very justifiably) have become at Penn State.
It was honestly a merciful thing to do for Coach given how badly he’d lost the fans and apparently the ability to fire up and drive this team.
I still feel awful for Franklin that it ended up playing out like this. But I’m confident he’ll land on his feet somewhere, will continue to have the opportunity to mold and support young men and be a positive influence in their lives, and oh yeah, win some football games — probably at a place where the expectation and pressure around WHICH games should be winnable will be much lower than they (very justifiably) have become at Penn State.
Do you think Penn State was going to win a national championship with James Franklin? I don’t.
That’s the only consideration I have. I don’t believe any team ever willl with him because it demands winning, not just one, but multiple games in a short stretch that he just couldn’t win. It’s not personal. Last year was gift wrapped, gift wrapped isn’t strong enough. Got the weakest entrant round 1 at home, then Boise, then the big boys started in Final 4. Guess what, shocker, he lost. Because that’s what he does.
Next guy might go 7-5 for three years. Ok, then move on. The money is there, folks. We spend all this time worrying about money, it’s not ours and the school will spend it somewhere anyways. But we were Iowa with a bigger stadium under James. No thanks. We’re like abused puppies around here and should start demanding Ohio State wins every few years minimum and actually scaring good teams on offense instead of whatever it was we’ve been seeing.
Plus, he would have made 5 playoffs in his tenure, not 7. Only 3 of the last 6.
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I honestly don’t think we ever are going to win another NC in football. Do I hope we do? Absolutely. Hope we win a bunch of them.
CFB is changing rapidly and will continue to do so. Not sure the changing landscape is in our favor.
The way I see it is like it or not college football is a business now. It's not 1982 anymore. When you are being paid like a CEO $8-10 million a year the shareholders expect results. You don't deliver the shareholders or board are going to step in and remove the CEO. They don't wait until Jan 1 to remove the CEO. You remove him when you make the decision. It is what it is now.... a business.
I would think any fan base that has championship expectations and does not have a zero in the win or loss column would be divided. If the team is x-0 everyone is happy and 0-x everyone is pissed. Even at 0-0 fan bases are divided.
The fanbase has been divided since the "Joe must go" years.
Then let’s go all the way. Raise the prices. Find the dumbest best players. Pony up Lions Nation. It’s all about winning. Strippers not cheerleaders. Let’s get that casino going! Cmon now people! It’s all about winning. We are…the Miami of the North!
That's the elephant in the room and Kraft commented on uniting the nation. All PSU has to do is appropriately recognize the Paterno's for their contribution to Penn State and do it while Sue is still around... those other check books will open up. UnCancel JoePa!