In retrospect, too bad he didn’t have PSU cheating at the same level as Michigan.
Does anyone WANT the job?
- Thread starter Arivacalion
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Well, I don’t think most fans judge teams/coaches on 4-year spans. They judge them on peak seasons. Franklin was one of the top coaches in CFB if you look at his record over the last 4 years, but the majority of us agree it was time to move on because it was increasingly clear he had reached his ceiling.
When Rhule took over at Temple, they had just gone 4-7. After a crap season and a mediocre season, he had them at their best record since ‘79.
Whoever we hire, let’s suppose year 1 is a losing season but year 3 is our best since 82/86/94 (i.e., a natl title). Do you think any of us are going to say, yeah, but Franklin would have had a better 4-year record?
I think pointing out that Addazio and Golden were also able to win there is fair, but the 4-year record thing seems like an incomplete picture to me.
Not a vote at all for Rhule, but sometimes you have to take into account how well a coach is doing compared to recent history for that particular school.
Nebraska had not won a bowl game since the 2015 season before Rhule. Nebraska has not been to a "major" bowl since the 2012 season if you consider Citrus as "major". Traditional major bowl, their last trip would have been the Cotton at the end of the 2005 season. That's twenty years since Nebraska has been relevant.
Nebraska is not what it was in the 90s and even if Tom Osborne walked the sidelines, I don't think they'd resurrect that. Schools have ceilings as well as coaches.
No, I do not want Rhule.
Nebraska had not won a bowl game since the 2015 season before Rhule. Nebraska has not been to a "major" bowl since the 2012 season if you consider Citrus as "major". Traditional major bowl, their last trip would have been the Cotton at the end of the 2005 season. That's twenty years since Nebraska has been relevant.
Nebraska is not what it was in the 90s and even if Tom Osborne walked the sidelines, I don't think they'd resurrect that. Schools have ceilings as well as coaches.
No, I do not want Rhule.
Why would anyone want to coach at Penn State, a school that fired 2 of its last 3 head coaches mid-season and who's fanbase drove away the third.
True. And good point.
That said, PSU has clearly thrown any concern vav any sort of academics in the burn barrel. Not even an item on the list - not even the bottom of the list.
No idea where any such "narrative" would come from (some "talking head"?) - but certainly not the case
Northwest New Jersey and the Jersey Shore far outshine anywhere in Texas. I live on the edge of the prettiest part of Texas (Hill Country) and it’s only nice because it is compared to the vast expanses of butt ugly it borders
If you hire a coach that can't start until February you are losing in September. Ohio University 24, Penn State 14. 2012.
Agreed, and I think that would have allowed him to keep his job if it had continued. But once he couldn’t break through on occasion and beat those teams, and his recruiting regressed, it was over for him.
I think you are right about the mega donors but Kraft didn't need much persuading. Franklin was done after UCLA unless he ran the table and picked up a couple playoff wins. Kraft probably held them off after UCLA then after the NW debacle it was obvious to everyone that a change needed to he made immediately. I say everyone except Franklin... LOL.
I think Kraft and the mega donors have been disappointed with James for two maybe three years. His players first over everything, I always want more more more but can't deliver in big games gets old. I think these donors could have been holding back some with NIL donations for the last couple of years due to a lack of belief in Franklin.
With the new coach it is a fresh start so I do see the money flowing. We will see, the true test will be if we can land elite linemen, LBs, QB and WRs. All recruiting weaknesses for Franklin.
They would support Rhule Golden Diaz. A lot of people at PS would be comfortable with Diaz. Not saying it's going to be any of those and I hope not. Certainly not Rhule or Golden.
In answer to your actual original question asking if anyone wants the job. I know it was TIC, but:
Certainly, yes.
Matt Rhule - almost for sure yes. He may be the only current head coach of a Big Boy program who would be though ("Big Boy" program = program that presents an opportunity, through resources/budget etc, to win titles, and that pays among the top 25 or so programs). That - and the BFF relationship w Kraft - is likely a key to him being on top of Kraft's "wish list"
And PSU (Kraft) certainly will be interested in him.
Any AC/Coordinator coach aspiring to be a HC, who doesn't have any other P4 offers? Certainly, most of them (damn near all, unless they have some unusual strong tie to a program or region).
How many of those will PSU return interest in? Who knows?
Any current HC being paid less than, lets say $6 million per year at a program that can't reasonably be expected to compete for titles - who aspires to a "big boy" job? Certainly many of them (and there won't be many other openings, aside from PSU, that would satisfy those desires - as of now, probably only Florida, and probably 3 or 4 others will open up later this year). How many of those will PSU return interest in? Who knows?
Gotcha, just keep in mind the original context of my post. It wasn’t “Rhule is terrible”. It was in response to:
Huge amount of success at Temple based on their historical norm. Enough success at Baylor to land an NFL head coaching job. Jury is still out at Nebraska, but certainly has raised their level of play from the prior regime. Don't think it's wrong to say he's now found success to this point at all 3 college stops.
Well, he didn’t have more success than the guys before or after him, which should be as much of the measuring stick as anything: about the same administrative support, about the same facilities, about the same level of competition. Fewer variables between 2010-2020 than going back to 1979 if we’re running the “did Rhule make so much an impact that he should be the head coach at a top 10-12 program?” thought experiment? Should I use the same line of thought here, compare to the 70s/80s/90s, to assess his success at Nebraska? Of course not.
Then the same thing happened at Baylor, and the sanctions didn’t come down for the Briles stuff until the very end of Rhule’s time.
Then he fell flat on his face in the NFL.
Now we’re sitting at year 3 at Nebraska, he’s got them moving it seems. But he’s in Year 3, and the hope at this point I is imagine is 8-4, 9-3? With one, possibly two, ranked teams on the schedule? They missed Oregon, Ohio State, and Indiana this year. In Year 3, where they’re at, that’s a coach that gets us to the next step? Better than the last 2 guys there (marginally better than Mike Riley), give him that. Not nearly what Pelini did, and Pelini inherited seemingly worse conditions. I just don’t see where he’s a great coach or even better than about 8 good coaches in the league. Looking up and down the standings I’m not sure I’d take him over anyone except Locksley and Ferentz, and Ferentz still beats him every year.
I just don’t see where he’s made this much impact. Maybe a little at Nebraska, none in Carolina, maybe a little at Temple, none at Baylor. I think he’s super good at selling himself and he’s really likable.
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One thing to keep in mind regarding his tenure at Temple. For 3 of the 4 previous seasons temple was competing in the MAC.
During Rhule years they were alll competed in the American. Which IMO is a much better conference than the MAC.
The last season of Addazio was in the Big East which not surprisingly was his worst season.
and no I absolutely do not want Rhule as the next head coach. But I would still haven taken him Over Franklin moving forward
Your pov is similar to mine. To me, they’re about the same coach, it’s like hiring James Franklin without the summer drama that seemed to unravel everything. But it’s not an upgrade in any way at all.
Why would they support the worst candidates? I supported the termination of Franklin, but why the hell would anybody replace him with somebody that has a much lower ceiling?
There are people in power at PSU who don't just want to win, they want to win with a Penn State Guy. That is important to them.
It's not the only school with this attitude. Earle Bruce came after Woody, and Michigan basically limited all coaching to Michigan Men until Moore.
This is the first real Penn State coaching search since 1950 that wasn't under the shadow of sanctions. I expect that the "Penn State Guy" appeal will wear off eventually. But it matters to a lot of people in power right now. When the hire is announced, we'll see how important it is to the AD.
The only PSU candidate I will support is Terry Smith if somehow he wins out the rest of his games this year or just loses one more. Otherwise, I am a Campbell fan at this point.
Franklin had reached his ceiling? We were a player's epic brainfart away from competing in the Natty game. I'll take that ceiling.
When Rhule took over at Temple, they had had one bad season ... he came in and made it worse before getting back (3 seasons later) to slightly above where they were prior, under the helm of uninspiring coaches.
When Rhule took over at Baylor, they had had one bad season ... he came in and made it worse before getting back to where they were prior.
When Rhule took over at Nebraska, they had had a ton of consecutive bad seasons under one awful coach ... he came in and made them mediocre (going from 4-8 to 5-7 in his first year ... woohoo!).
The point being, there's no indication from his decade+ long head coaching experience that he's going to do any better than Franklin ... likely, he'll do worse.
One huge criticism of Franklin has been his performance in "big games" and top ranked teams. Rhule has had equal futility, not just against TOP ranked teams, but ANY ranked teams. I think I read he was something like 2-22 against ranked squads all time. And I'm not sure if that was updated for this year, when he again hasn't been able to beat any ranked squads. They've never done anything in the postseason either - the one time in his career Rhule had a nationally relevant squad, not only did they go the whole season without beating a ranked opponent, they lost the conference championship game and the Sugar Bowl ... going 0-3 against ranked squads that year.
THAT appears to be HIS ceiling.
Except he takes a bit to get there, and it's likely his actual ceiling, going forward, is lower than that. His current Nebraska squad is underwhelming. There's no big breakthrough (season 3 or otherwise) likely on the horizon.
PSU had zero relevancy until Franklin, and were actually a **** stain in CFB with all of the Sandusky and Paterno stuff. You fired the coach who gave you any ounce of respectability. You are no where near OSU and are going to be the laughing stock when you end up hiring a coach that probably gets to to 7-5. Great job.
Maybe. Only time will tell. I think though with the right hire we will be better than 7-5. Program is too big to fail!
Nebraska vs. Minny:
29 rushes for 36 yards
213 total yards
Gave up 9 sacks
6 penalties for 70 yards
3/12 on third/fourth downs
I mean, I know we've been joking about Rhule being the white James Franklin. But he's worse. His offenses have been abysmal for the entirety of his career and he no notable QBs to his name. HE HASNT BEATEN A RANKED TEAM SINCE 2016. Please god no, do not make this guy PSU's next coach.
In good news, sounds like Kingsbury has been added to the list of candidates. I think he provides a shot in the arm, if anything. And his QB development list might be second to none.
29 rushes for 36 yards
213 total yards
Gave up 9 sacks
6 penalties for 70 yards
3/12 on third/fourth downs
I mean, I know we've been joking about Rhule being the white James Franklin. But he's worse. His offenses have been abysmal for the entirety of his career and he no notable QBs to his name. HE HASNT BEATEN A RANKED TEAM SINCE 2016. Please god no, do not make this guy PSU's next coach.
In good news, sounds like Kingsbury has been added to the list of candidates. I think he provides a shot in the arm, if anything. And his QB development list might be second to none.
Is it that they simply don't care about the success of the program, or do they genuinely believe—despite not having won a championship in 40 years—that it can now be achieved entirely on their own terms, without any rationale or logic behind how it will actually work?
Additionally, what makes Schiano a Penn State man? Because he was a position assistant for a few years?
He's 64-58 coaching college football. At some point, you are what you are. He's going to lose at least 2, likely 3/4/5 games in a year he will miss the 3 best teams in the league.
With Kingsbury, a coach with poor college results, at least there's some hope that taking time off and serving as an assistant changed and matured him. It did with Pete Carroll, it did with Lane Kiffin.
Undoubtedly. There is a contingent that cannot get past the Paterno legacy and will do whatever they can to build a bridge to it whatever the fallout. I am not sure this squares with the other contingent that believes they are due a championship even though the blue-chip ratio in the programs that they measure the program against dwarfs PSU. For instance, Ohio State's blue-chip ratio in 2025 is 89% (tied for first with Alabama); in contrast, Penn State's is 68%. In short, the talent disparity is enormous. Yet, the expectation is that they are able to beat OSU (even on occasion) with MUCH less talent. Franklin did what he could to develop a competitive roster and hire successful coordinators to bridge the gap. His last two hires were catastrophic. Andy's system was not a fit for the B10 and Knowles' needed a couple of cycles to get the pieces he needed to make it work. He will not have the chance, but Jim will be successful at his next stop. This last iteration of staff cost Franklin his job. Personally, I think it was a hasty decision when viewed in the context of wins and losses over 12 years, but necessary given Franklin's demand for a new contract in the middle of his current one, how he chose to circumvent Kraft, the collapse of this year's team, and the animus of the fan base.
The next coach will have an uphill battle to equal what Franklin accomplished. He will need to recruit at an elite level to bring blue-chip talent to State College and away from Columbus, Ann Arbor, and Eugene. Nebraska is currently ranked 64th in recruiting, surely not encouraging. I am hoping that Kraft is prudent here. Though Rhule is his friend and supported by a wealthy contingent, its the fan base that will be rabid and make life intolerable for the new coach if there thirst for success is not slaked. Personally, I see very rough seas ahead
Folks are saying that Kraft painted himself in a corner by blathering about NATTYS. 
as THE. STANDARD. . Now, he has his work cut out for him with this hire to back up his words. Screw that. WE ARE! … PENN STATE! Kraft is armed with piles of cash money. The stadium is getting a major facelift complete with better sh|tters. I say Kraft’s job is easy. Sit by the phone. Agents will come to him. Hell, he’s likely beating off candidates with a stick.
Easy, peasy.
as THE. STANDARD. . Now, he has his work cut out for him with this hire to back up his words. Screw that. WE ARE! … PENN STATE! Kraft is armed with piles of cash money. The stadium is getting a major facelift complete with better sh|tters. I say Kraft’s job is easy. Sit by the phone. Agents will come to him. Hell, he’s likely beating off candidates with a stick.Easy, peasy.
Of Franklin's 10 losses to OSU five were by one score. Two were by one point. You can go back and watch those closer games and see a bunch of boneheaded play calling and clock management. Franklin wins a couple of those games and who knows where we are now? The talent disparity isn't (or wasn't) as big of an issue as it is today - no idea how he ran this roster into the ground being so light on LB, DT, WR, and QB.
Anyway - rough seas are at least unpredictable. Better than the SS You Know What You're Getting With Me James Franklin.
If he wins a couple of those games he is still here. Pure and simple. The media would not have been able to bludgeon him with the Big Game James moniker. If he Beats 1 out of the last four marquee games Oregon 2x, Notre Dame or Ohio State he is still here. Football is a game of inches and he came up short and it cost him is job.
I am fully aware. This does not mean that the talent discrepancy was not there; it just meant that Penn State over-performed and OSU under-performed. Hell, the only win against OSU in James' tenure was the result of a blocked FG returned for a touchdown in 16. OSU should have won every game against PSU since the sanctions, given the talent on both rosters. Any of those wins would have been upsets.
True. Rough seas are unpredictable. But there are shipwrecks and if Penn State finds itself in the limbo of the mid-tier B10 team people may look to the Franklin years they turned their noses up at as the golden years of Penn State football (since the 80s)
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Who?
(And if Rhule gets the job - and he is the most likely, though probably not close to an "odds-on" favorite at this point - it will be due to his ties to Kraft, not being a "Penn State Guy")
Donors, the people who write checks for NIL, etc. Could be Pegula, but don't know if he is as involved in it as he is in football.
Moreso, certain members of the Board of Trustees.
Well, we took Cael from Iowa State and we now have a dynasty. Just saying
.As I have said on here before, he survives just about any stretch if he wins 1/3 of the games he's lost against Michigan/Ohio State. He probably wins at least one more conference title and makes at least 2 more playoffs.
Losing "only to the best teams" is a razor thin margin, and likely unsustainable.
On Schiano yes, he comes from Joes coaching tree. He did contact PS on the opening. They care they just think that they can get it done their way and that a PS man would have a better understanding of how things should get done at PS.
Only way PSU starts beating the elite teams is they need to raise the blue-chip ratio from the high 60s to the high 80s AND coordinator are chosen to maximize the skill-sets of the recruits. If your blue-chip ratio is in the 60s I do not care who your coach or coordinators are the probability of you winning against comparable staffs with a higher ratio is much lower (that is why it is an upset).
This line of thinking is so unbelievably narrow minded. That people in power are willing to sabotage the program or at the very least hold it back, just so they have a “PSU guy” in the spot is so frustratingly shortsighted and incestuous that is is mind boggling. Let’s be honest too, they want a Paterno guy. So, rather than hire a great coach who may also be a great individual and mentor of young men, they would rather throw up the middle finger to the outside. There aren’t enough adjectives to describe my frustration with that line of thinking. This is the type of thinking that O’Brien blasted us for on the way out the door and it’s another example of why those outside of Happy Valley call us a cult. Unbelievable. By doing this, they are completely ignoring a lot of great football minds and great people that would provide a fresh start to the program…again. I sincerely hope that isn’t the case.
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