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Does it always hurt kids when teachers strike?

C

capnbillhitters

Senior
May 18, 2015
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Ok guys, here ya go.

From the teacher's perspective, going on strike is sometimes necessary to secure fair and equitable salary and benefits for the admittedly hard work of being a teacher. The job of teaching is often entered into for the right reasons, but when faced with unreasonable demands from parents, administrators, school boards, State folks etc., it is every union's right to fight hard for their constituents desire to fix said situation. After much debate and argument, sometimes sides need to move on to the difficult decision to strike. Such a decision has many negative ramifications, but it is hoped that those negatively impacted will learn something about standing up for your rights, and at the end of the day, a settlement will occur that benefits the parties such that the related work conditions become, at a minimum, more livable.

From the sports fans perspective (admittedly simplistic) is that it always sucks when kids have to miss games, dances or other right of passage because adults can't agree to anything these days without a knock down drag out fight.

While I realize that today's political climate may be considered poisonous with entrenchment and divisiveness, it is true that our history has significant patches of bad behavior around union activity. So we can't really fall back on the thought of "everything in government/politics/unions sucks."

Please, if you are a Union person currently supporting a strike, I would love to hear what situation you are facing specifically related to your strike that is a show stopper that made you leave your job and jeopardize the activities of the kids.
 
J

jwarigaku

All-Conference
Jan 30, 2006
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I fully endorse the right of teachers to organize and strike as a last resort, in some cases it may be about greed while in others it's about fairness. With that in mind some states have adopted a middle of the road approach to allow teachers to strike but maximizes the period they can strike for, before going to the non-binding arbitration phase, of 5-10 days. This minimizes the impact on the Kids(regardless of relation to sports, graduation dates, school work etc...). If no agreement is reached during non-binding arbitration the teachers may strike again for a limited period and if an agreement is not reached both parties are required to go to Binding arbitration. I believe that this is a best solution for both sides because it places equal responsibility on both sides to reach an equitable agreement. I don't know enough to comment on the current strikes, but I do know that the pending strike in IPSD 204 is certainly justified in a district that has never experienced a strike.
 
C

capnbillhitters

Senior
May 18, 2015
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So what about a time of year slotted for Strikes? Say strikes could only occur between Thanksgiving and Dec 31st?

Maybe having both sides have to sacrifice family time to bear down and get a deal done would do the trick. It may provide incentive for both sides to get the job done

Who knows, maybe the holiday spirit works it's magic and folks arrive at agreeable positions before the December break, but in the worst case, disputing parties lose their two week break to get the deal done.
 
S

SweetWalter34

Redshirt
Apr 16, 2013
131
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capnbillhitters said:
Ok guys, here ya go.

From the teacher's perspective, going on strike is sometimes necessary to secure fair and equitable salary and benefits for the admittedly hard work of being a teacher. The job of teaching is often entered into for the right reasons, but when faced with unreasonable demands from parents, administrators, school boards, State folks etc., it is every union's right to fight hard for their constituents desire to fix said situation. After much debate and argument, sometimes sides need to move on to the difficult decision to strike. Such a decision has many negative ramifications, but it is hoped that those negatively impacted will learn something about standing up for your rights, and at the end of the day, a settlement will occur that benefits the parties such that the related work conditions become, at a minimum, more livable.

From the sports fans perspective (admittedly simplistic) is that it always sucks when kids have to miss games, dances or other right of passage because adults can't agree to anything these days without a knock down drag out fight.

While I realize that today's political climate may be considered poisonous with entrenchment and divisiveness, it is true that our history has significant patches of bad behavior around union activity. So we can't really fall back on the thought of "everything in government/politics/unions sucks."

Please, if you are a Union person currently supporting a strike, I would love to hear what situation you are facing specifically related to your strike that is a show stopper that made you leave your job and jeopardize the activities of the kids.
Click to expand...
I wonder what the kids' perspective is?
 
C

capnbillhitters

Senior
May 18, 2015
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SweetWalter34 said:
I wonder what the kids' perspective is?
Click to expand...

Let's expect that kids have one of two or three general reactions:
  1. This sucks, I want to play my games/go to homecoming/ other
  2. I have learned so much from my teacher/parent that I fully understand why you sometimes have to strike
  3. I hate all unions and my parents say unions are the scourge of America
I feel compassion for # 1, I understand # 2, and feel sorry for # 3
 
S

SweetWalter34

Redshirt
Apr 16, 2013
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capnbillhitters said:
Let's expect that kids have one of two or three general reactions:
  1. This sucks, I want to play my games/go to homecoming/ other
  2. I have learned so much from my teacher/parent that I fully understand why you sometimes have to strike
  3. I hate all unions and my parents say unions are the scourge of America
I feel compassion for # 1, I understand # 2, and feel sorry for # 3
Click to expand...
Or, instead of we adults projecting our expectations and our personal feelings (see underlined)...
We actually ask the kids how they feel about teachers strikes?

Any ideas on how we might get some high school kids' perspectives added to our thread? Edgy?
 
C

chuck998

Junior
Aug 11, 2014
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I would just guess that with 2 forfiets, the ESL kids are feeling left out of the adults decision making process. Or perhaps they feel like one of the tools the adults are using to make political points.
 
J

jwarigaku

All-Conference
Jan 30, 2006
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To the teachers that are reading this would you be amenable to the arrangement I listed above? It gives you the right to strike and be heard but also minimizes the impact on all parties involved and eventually forces compromise.
 
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eireog

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Oct 6, 2007
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Bruce Rauner demonizes teachers and other union workers. The term greed is often tossed around about what teachers and other organized labor workers make. What they make is usually an above average compensation with health and welfare benefits. No one working these jobs is getting rich.

In the meantime Bruce Rauner made 53 million dollars in 2012. He says that highway workers making 50k are making too much money. Teachers making 60k are making too much money. Policemen, Fireman, tradesman making good money are making too much money. Collective bargaining is a bad thing and these are the reasons we as a state are in trouble.
Seriously ? A guy makes 53 million in one year and all these other people are making too much money ? I don't get it .
 
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capnbillhitters

Senior
May 18, 2015
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Not a Rauner defender by any means but the comparison is not a good one. By collective bargaining you are ensuring a wage and benefits for hundreds often thousands. Rauner is a business owner that took risk that paid off through sheer force of will (and possibly luck, deception, the list could go on but honestly I don't care about him enough to research).

Demonizing unions is a popular mantra for those not relying on the benefits derived from said union. Not sure why public sentiment has swayed that direction but my guess is we live in an anti-Obama world where everything he supports must be demonized. Unions historically have supported Dems so to score points with the Anti-O crowd, unions are an easy target.
 
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LHSTigers94

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Oct 25, 2004
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I disagree with strikes only because one side is using force. I feel as long as the two sides are sitting at the table, striking should not be allowed. I feel negotiations should be limited to a certain time frame between two parties. If an agreement can't be made, a legal mediator should decide on a middle of the road agreement for a one or two year term with the understanding that talks for a long term agreement should continue.
 
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jdhitters

Freshman
Aug 31, 2013
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I am not a union supporter, but if they could not walk out at all, even for a limited time, what leverage does labor have?
 
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sac'em

Junior
Jul 16, 2012
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The process in which it takes to get to the point of a strike is on par with a federal indictment. It doesn't happen overnight and requires a butt load of due process before it can even be voted on.
 
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LHSTigers94

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Oct 25, 2004
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jdhitters said:
I am not a union supporter, but if they could not walk out at all, even for a limited time, what leverage does labor have?
Click to expand...

on the other side, what leverage do the non union side have in this. Who determines what's fair or not. What if the offer is actually the best offer. The main party that is affected has absolutely no say.
 
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jdhitters

Freshman
Aug 31, 2013
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That's true for most of the things that affect kids. Non unions can always unionize. There are good arguments on every side. If there were not, there would be no dispute. So every comment on here has merit.
 
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WestSuburbanCatholicConference

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Jun 17, 2015
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eireog said:
Bruce Rauner demonizes teachers and other union workers. The term greed is often tossed around about what teachers and other organized labor workers make. What they make is usually an above average compensation with health and welfare benefits. No one working these jobs is getting rich.

In the meantime Bruce Rauner made 53 million dollars in 2012. He says that highway workers making 50k are making too much money. Teachers making 60k are making too much money. Policemen, Fireman, tradesman making good money are making too much money. Collective bargaining is a bad thing and these are the reasons we as a state are in trouble.
Seriously ? A guy makes 53 million in one year and all these other people are making too much money ? I don't get it .
Click to expand...

smh at many of these post... many of you need to go back to college and retake a microeconomics course.
 
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eireog

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Oct 6, 2007
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WestSuburbanCatholicConference said:
smh at many of these post... many of you need to go back to college and retake a microeconomics course.
Click to expand...
I certainly don't need a microeconomics course or any other course to let me know that someone making 52 million dollars in a year has no business telling people that make a middle income wage are making too much money.
 
P

privatone

Junior
Jul 31, 2008
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Does it always hurt kids when teachers strike?

I would say no. When I was in school, we were struck by teachers all the time. It didn't really hurt.
 
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Jiggs

Senior
May 18, 2009
891
646
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privatone said:
I would say no. When I was in school, we were struck by teachers all the time. It didn't really hurt.
Click to expand...

One morning in class while I was taking a well deserved nap, a Brother hit me in the back of the head with his fist. He must of caught me with his ring finger because I sprung a leak.
The Brother ignored the blood coming from my head, and continued to
teach the class.
Those were the days.
 
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E

Excalibur1188

Redshirt
Oct 11, 2015
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My question is... What does the head coach do if he thinks the strike is specifically directed at ruining the football season?
 
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Excalibur1188

Redshirt
Oct 11, 2015
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Can he though? If all the other teachers are not working their classes can the kids be eligible to play if they are not in school? Teachers are truly trapped in unions in the current system.
 
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ignazio

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Oct 25, 2007
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It's pretty obvious that the teachers' unions are running head-first into the economic reality that is the pension crisis in this state.
Interesting to point out that part of the strike in McHenry centers on the cola increases in the pensions.
Meanwhile, Social Security recipients will receive no cola increase this year.
 
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eireog

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Oct 6, 2007
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ignazio said:
It's pretty obvious that the teachers' unions are running head-first into the economic reality that is the pension crisis in this state.
Interesting to point out that part of the strike in McHenry centers on the cola increases in the pensions.
Meanwhile, Social Security recipients will receive no cola increase this year.
Click to expand...

Social security recipients were not granted ,by law , cost of living adjustments teachers were. You can like the law . You can hate the law. You can complain about the law . The law is the law. You have one option and that is changing the law.
 
T

Thedoctor50

Freshman
Jun 10, 2013
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eireog said:
Social security recipients were not granted ,by law , cost of living adjustments teachers were. You can like the law . You can hate the law. You can complain about the law . The law is the law. You have one option and that is changing the law.
Click to expand...
No we can't change the law, illinois judges rule it can't be changed.
 
B

brickben

Redshirt
May 29, 2001
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Meanwhile, tens of thousands of IL residents and a lot of businesses, are leaving this state every year to flee the high taxes. The Law is the Law but the only two ways out of this mess is to raise taxes or cut costs. We are seeing the results of the former...
 
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sac'em

Junior
Jul 16, 2012
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The pension system became weak and broke when the state government started to "borrow" from it and never paid it back. Studies have shown that if the government did not touch that money and left it in there to pay what it was intended to pay, the system would be fine.
 
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eireog

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Oct 6, 2007
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JCHILLTOPPERS said:
Eir, I'm guaranteed a cola increase as well by law, but am not getting one.

To me, that seems like a great place to begin a compromise.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure of your situation JC but the courts in Illinos have been steadfast in ruling on the diminished benefits clause. Unions have been open to compromise but even those compromises have been ruled unconstitutional in court. The only way to change it right now seems to be through a constitutional convention.
 
C

capnbillhitters

Senior
May 18, 2015
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so post actual ideas and opinions...they are funner than rhetorical questions that only lead to explanations that reactions are not really answering the original meaning of the rhetorical question and so on and so on and so on
 
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