Emanuel and Obama stirring race fires once again

[Walter Brennaneer]

They knew releasing that shooting video would cause problems....another stupid, but calculated move.

Come home Jackson and Sharpton..your services are required once again.

"Stoke the hatred!"

 

[easy91_rivals]

Rahm Emanuel, the police union and the city of Chicago fought to have the video suppressed; a local Chicago judge ordered it released. This was in response to a FOIA request from a reporter. Obama had nothing to do with this; Emanuel wanted to keep it suppressed. This seems like a "shift of blame" from the fact an officer is being charged with murder because he shot a teenager 16 times that was causing no immediate threat. Instead of focusing on the act, you angrily focus on folks that politically differ and look different from you. Disappointing we can't focus on issues without reverting to vitriolic, divisive comments that pander to people's fear and anger.

 

[easy91_rivals]

Who here is stirring race fires?

 

[robEERt]

Rahm Emanuel, the police union and the city of Chicago fought to have the video suppressed; a local Chicago judge ordered it released. This was in response to a FOIA request from a reporter. Obama had nothing to do with this; Emanuel wanted to keep it suppressed. This seems like a "shift of blame" from the fact an officer is being charged with murder because he shot a teenager 16 times that was causing no immediate threat. Instead of focusing on the act, you angrily focus on folks that politically differ and look different from you. Disappointing we can't focus on issues without reverting to vitriolic, divisive comments that pander to people's fear and anger.

Now it's Jackson and Sharpton. Must be another dollar in it for these expensive big shot race batters to show up.

 

[bornaneer]

Where are Al and Jesse???????
Chicago Murder Update

November to Date
Shot & Killed: 23
Shot & Wounded: 140
Total Shot: 163
Total Homicides: 25

Year To Date
Shot & Killed: 402
Shot & Wounded: 2312
Total Shot: 2714
Total Homicides: 454

 

[easy91_rivals]

Even if some heartless folks don't care about the folks they shoot and abuse, those folks still face this indisputable argument for lawful retraints on the police use of force--being a police officer is no doubt stressful and their job is dangerous. The thing is, the police make their job VASTLY MORE DANGEROUS when they abuse their power.

When the police abuse their power, they erode and lose public confidence and faith that the police will act in accordance with the law. That public confidence and faith is indispensably necessary to the police doing their job. There are not enough police anywhere to enforce the laws in a society where a majority of folks (or even a substantial minority) view the police as untrustworthy, lawless, etc.

It seems to me that this type of atrocity surely must affect even the dangerousness of some of the folks being apprehended. If a suspect the police are approaching thinks that he might get gunned down in cold blood by the police, it seems to me that might well make it more likely the suspect might himself use deadly force against the police.

 

[bornaneer]

There are not enough police anywhere to enforce the laws in a society where a majority of folks (or even a substantial minority) view the police as untrustworthy, lawless, etc.

Do you have any data to back up this claim?

 

[easy91_rivals]

Opinion; that's who I included majority and minority

 

[bornaneer]

Opinion; that's who I included majority and minority

Just as I thought. Your totally baseless accusation is the an example of what is a big problem in this country.

 

[easy91_rivals]

For having an opinion? Ok, pal.

 

[easy91_rivals]

Majority or minority view--in dumb dumb words, that means either a lot or a little. Let me know if you need anymore help.

 

[bornaneer]

Majority or minority view--in dumb dumb words, that means either a lot or a little. Let me know if you need anymore help.

Thanks, but I don't need any help. I appreciate that you at least admitted it was only an opinion. I deal in facts,not opinion, like the fact 402 people have been gunned down and 2,312 shot and wounded in Chicago this year and have yet to hear a word from the mouths of Jesse and Al. Any "opinion" from you on that? Maybe you think those 402 don't matter. In my "opinion" they DO matter.

 

[MountaineerWV]

Thanks, but I don't need any help. I appreciate that you at least admitted it was only an opinion. I deal in facts,not opinion, like the fact 402 people have been gunned down and 2,312 shot and wounded in Chicago this year and have yet to hear a word from the mouths of Jesse and Al. Any "opinion" from you on that? Maybe you think those 402 don't matter. In my "opinion" they DO matter.

So, do you believe this officer was justified in his actions? Sixteen shots? Little much, for a kid walking away and only having a knife. But, the police have a difficult job. Their lives are literally at risk every second. But, in this situation, it isn't like the Cleveland situation where the teen pointed a gun (toy gun; but you can't tell anymore the difference) and the officer fired at him.

 

[easy91_rivals]

I agree; they do matter. Mattered to those fellows too; not hard to find comments they've said regarding Chicago crime.

 

[Mntneer]

So, do you believe this officer was justified in his actions? Sixteen shots? Little much, for a kid walking away and only having a knife. But, the police have a difficult job. Their lives are literally at risk every second. But, in this situation, it isn't like the Cleveland situation where the teen pointed a gun (toy gun; but you can't tell anymore the difference) and the officer fired at him.

Was it true that the kid was on PCP? If so, then that knife could pose a lot of harm.

 

[bornaneer]

So, do you believe this officer was justified in his actions? Sixteen shots? Little much, for a kid walking away and only having a knife. But, the police have a difficult job. Their lives are literally at risk every second. But, in this situation, it isn't like the Cleveland situation where the teen pointed a gun (toy gun; but you can't tell anymore the difference) and the officer fired at him.

No.... I don't think the cops actions were justified. I believe he has been charged with murder. And for the record I felt the cop in NYC who choked the guy to death should have been charged with murder,maybe you missed the comments I posted on this board when that happened. No question there are BAD cops, just like there are BAD priests,BAD teachers,BAD leaders of countries and a lot of other BAD humans. My problem is with people who make absurd comments with ZERO facts to back up their absurd comments.

 

[bornaneer]

I agree; they do matter. Mattered to those fellows too; not hard to find comments they've said regarding Chicago crime.

I have not seen any protests led by Jesse or Al regarding the slaughter taking place in Chicago or other cities. When did you see them leading demonstrations about the urban slaughter? Do you always paint with a broad brush or do you always pick and choose?

 

[dave]

For having an opinion? Ok, pal.

You stated opinion as fact. A lot of people do it.

 

[easy91_rivals]

My opinion is

When the police abuse their power, they erode and lose public confidence and faith that the police will act in accordance with the law. That public confidence and faith is indispensably necessary to the police doing their job.

 

[easy91_rivals]

You may choose to agree or disagree with such.

 

[easy91_rivals]

You probably would feel differently if I had said,
"When BIG GOVERNMENT abuses its power, they erode and lose public confidence and faith that the government will act in accordance with the law. That public confidence and faith is indispensably necessary to Government doing its job."
Fact is you don't like who I'm questioning.

 

[dave]

You probably would feel differently if I had said,
"When BIG GOVERNMENT abuses its power, they erode and lose public confidence and faith that the government will act in accordance with the law. That public confidence and faith is indispensably necessary to Government doing its job."
Fact is you don't like who I'm questioning.

Police do a great job 99% of the time and their failures get trumpetted by folks who wish to undermine their work. Government fails much more often.

Police study their mistakes to improve. The police investigate their own and when they break the law they are punished. Government repeats the same mistakes as often as they change leadership.

 

[easy91_rivals]

I appreciate police and what they do for the community. I have no desire to undermine what they do positively for the community. However, if you did what I do for a living, you may be a little less likely to praise them all with such glowing support.

 

[easy91_rivals]

↑
For having an opinion? Ok, pal.

You stated opinion as fact. A lot of people do it.

18 Today at 1:23 PM

Your assertion that police do a great job 99% of the time is also "an opinion". A lot of people, including yourself, do it.

 

[RichardPeterJohnson]

↑
For having an opinion? Ok, pal.

You stated opinion as fact. A lot of people do it.

18 Today at 1:23 PM

Your assertion that police do a great job 99% of the time is also "an opinion". A lot of people, including yourself, do it.

You're new around here. dave is always right so his opinions are facts (as far as he's concerned). He always has to have the last word too. [laughing]

 

[easy91_rivals]

I've had a subscription for about 10 years; I used to mainly read and rarely post. For a couple reasons, I've wanted to post more as of late. It's interesting to see patterns now that I pay more attention. Typically, I enjoy the commentary and opinions here--even when I don't necessarily agree with them.
That being said, I have wondered more lately why people post here--Trying to make a change? Trying to learn? Just complain? Mad? Want others to see a different perspective? Like to argue? Want to push an agenda?
I ask myself these questions too--I've enjoyed this forum quite a bit though and appreciate the comments.

 

[easy91_rivals]

I wonder what the other posters here do for a living? I've read dentist and optometrist, but that's all I know. I think it's interesting comparing how one's vocation may or may not have a role in political ideation.

 

[bornaneer]

I've had a subscription for about 10 years; I used to mainly read and rarely post. For a couple reasons, I've wanted to post more as of late. It's interesting to see patterns now that I pay more attention. Typically, I enjoy the commentary and opinions here--even when I don't necessarily agree with them.
That being said, I have wondered more lately why people post here--Trying to make a change? Trying to learn? Just complain? Mad? Want others to see a different perspective? Like to argue? Want to push an agenda?
I ask myself these questions too--I've enjoyed this forum quite a bit though and appreciate the comments.

I did see that you have been a member for the past 10 years. Some of us are aware of things like that especially when the proof is right in front of us. Some others find it hard to see the facts or more importantly, accept the facts. I like to stir things up and I like to argue even though it is useless since none of us are going to change. I point out the hypocrisy of a lot that is posted by many of us like I did with the selective outcry of a cop murdering someone vs. the daily slaughter taking place in our cities.

 

[dave]

↑
For having an opinion? Ok, pal.

You stated opinion as fact. A lot of people do it.

18 Today at 1:23 PM

Your assertion that police do a great job 99% of the time is also "an opinion". A lot of people, including yourself, do it.

I am not the one in the thread whining about having an opinion.

 

[dave]

You're new around here. dave is always right so his opinions are facts (as far as he's concerned). He always has to have the last word too. [laughing]

Doc must be getting lonely if he has started campaigning for board buddies.

 

[dave]

I appreciate police and what they do for the community. I have no desire to undermine what they do positively for the community. However, if you did what I do for a living, you may be a little less likely to praise them all with such glowing support.

Cops dont exactly love lawyers either but i was not suggesting you want to undermine police but you have to recognize that there are plenty of groups out there that do. For every shooting like in chicago or south carolina there are hundreds of heroic acts by police that dont necessarily go unnoticed but people have come to expect it so it is not national discussion.

 

[easy91_rivals]

Cops dont exactly love lawyers either but i was not suggesting you want to undermine police but you have to recognize that there are plenty of groups out there that do. For every shooting like in chicago or south carolina there are hundreds of heroic acts by police that dont necessarily go unnoticed but people have come to expect it so it is not national discussion.

You're probably right about that brother.

 

[mneilmont]

You're probably right about that brother.

The kind of law you practice would probably make a difference. Do you prosecute or defend? One group is on the same side as cop while the other, the defense lawyer, feels they have to make law enforcement as the culprit in defense of client. Some lawyers feel there are no boundaries in the vernacular they use to present their case. They even go to extent of outright lying to cast a shadow. Then, where does the officer go to recover his good name?

"Fact" on this board is what perception, preconceived, supports the theory or the individual. They read an editorial that is without fact, then relay it as "fact". Some are so weak minded that any fiction that is repeated a few times becomes their "fact". Of course some on here know they are lying when they are attempting to win an argument. Their supporters pick up on the lie and repeat it as "fact". The offered 99% is incorrect in my opinion. It is more like 99.99%, or greater, of positive total contact in doing the job. The "fact" is that so few people have any conception about the positive contacts policemen have in a days work. It is impossible to report all contacts made. On the other hand, most any bad contact is is reported and media picks it up and reports it. It really gets blown out of proportion when the story gets legs and finally makes national news. Returning a lost child to parent is not newsworthy. Parents and family are overly appreciative, but seldom is it reported.

As a former cop, cops are normal people who desire to do public service job. They are tested, and investigated, and given barrage of psych tests prior to being given the shield. Normal people who have been screened to be acceptable to do the job. Candidates wash out at any time and even suspended from the job anytime they do not measure up.

And, 91, be careful of first opinion of people on this board. Some of them do not measure up later on and get suspended by Vernon when they get too far out of line. V. may or may not allow them to resume participating on his board that is offered as entertainment.

 

[easy91_rivals]

I have worked with both sides of the fence--prosecution and defense. I appreciate your comments and do not disagree with you entirely. Cops, doctors, lawyers, ditch diggers--we're all normal people doing the best we can to make this world a better place. That being said, I believe all of us have the potential to do both great and terrible things alike. When high profile politicians get caught up in scandals, the public is outraged. When judges and lawyers abuse their position, the public is outraged. When doctors willfully abuse those they are supposed to heal, the public is outraged. When high profile religious leaders get caught in sex scandals, the public is outraged. Likewise, when police officers abuse their authority, people are outraged.
I'm not saying one group is any better or worse than the other. I don't believe that any person is free of sin or blameless, nor do I believe the actions of an individual dictate how every other person in that group or line of work thinks or acts. However, I believe that people in positions of authority (whether it be political, legal, religious, familial, or business) should be and are held to the highest standards of the position they hold. Simply, those who teach and uphold the line should walk the line. When we/they don't, it erodes the public's confidence in our professions and what we try to impart by practicing our professions.
I have no misgivings that some lawyers are at times unethical and the public disdain for them is merited. That holds true for other professions as well. Both actions lead to the same end result, an erosion of the public's confidence in their profession and values that they try to impart.

 

[easy91_rivals]

"The public regards lawyers with great distrust. They think lawyers are smarter than the average guy but use their intelligence deviously. Well, they're wrong; usually, they are not smarter."
F. Lee Bailey

 

[dave]

The law can be ugly at times as well. When yhe correct legal thing isnt popular or fulfilling to the general publics desire for their idea of justice the lawyer is stuck doing the right thing and unpopular thing. The treyvon Martin case is IMO a good example of that.

If course those situations happen in every line of work. Nobody is happy when an engineer tells a clent that what they want to do is impossible or unfeasible because of legal, scientific or regulatory reasons. Nobody is happy if a doc tells them that a procedure they want done isnt practical or necessary. Sometimes doing the right thing hurts and lawyers get their fair share of that aside from the hit to everyones reputation when crooks corrupt the public trust.

 

[mneilmont]

"The public regards lawyers with great distrust. They think lawyers are smarter than the average guy but use their intelligence deviously. Well, they're wrong; usually, they are not smarter."
F. Lee Bailey

You qualify your agreement with me. What do you disagree with that requires a qualifier? Not sure I found such in the body of your offering.

"The public regards lawyers with great distrust. They think lawyers are smarter than the average guy but use their intelligence deviously. Well, they're wrong; usually, they are not smarter."
F. Lee Bailey

 

[easy91_rivals]

Nothing of importantance; in hindsight, I wouldn't have written that qualification if I had written the reply again. I enjoyed reading your and dave's perspective.

 

[mneilmont]

Nothing of importantance; in hindsight, I wouldn't have written that qualification if I had written the reply again. I enjoyed reading your and dave's perspective.[/QUOTE Likewise, I enjoy your contribution and style. it is refreshing to hear thoughts from an individual who doesn't have the need to preface the thought with a derogatory comment about those who may be in opposition. When the remark is challenged, they are quick to point out that it is not necessarily intended in the context it was taken. It is only their style of writing??? In the meantime, you are considered a wimp if you don't challenge. You are in agreement with the derogatory remark if you don't challenge. They simply cannot stand to be challenged.