Everyone See The Game?

[GMAN81]

I am wondering if anyone lost power and didn't see the game yesterday. I lost power four times, but each time it was out for only about 10 seconds. The last one came at about 2:30. I had my fingers crossed and we lucked out. Once it got to be around 7:30 - 8:00 I figured the worst was over.

Also, I am wondering what those of you who saw the game thought of the play call by Seattle to lose the game. OK the call was bad, but we complain about the Bears and the play calling. I think this kind of stuff is all over the league.

As I stated a few weeks ago, Detroit scored two consecutive TDs against Dallas early in the game in the playoffs by mainly running the ball and then on their next drive they pretty much went away from the run and didn't score another TD the rest of the game. I couldn't understand that. Why do coaches do this?

Why in the world did Seattle choose to throw the ball in that situation? Lynch took the 1st down hand off from the five yard line and almost scored. For a brief second it looked like he was going to. You would think with the defense Seattle has they would score by running and trust the defense. Why wait to score?

It seems easy for me to second guess now, but I will be willing to bet pretty much everyone here was wondering what Seattle was doing when Wilson went back to throw.

The other thing I was wondering was why Belichick didn't stop the clock when Seattle ran the ball down to the one? A lot of time went off that clock and New England had two timeouts left I think. They lost at least a half minute there.

I didn't watch any post game stuff and nothing today, so I have no idea what was said about either situation. At least it was a good close game.

Wondering what some of you think?

 

[Brin22]

If you heard Pete Carroll's response to why he ran the rub play and what their plan was for the rest of the downs it makes sense...they score he's a genius. Also, consider this, there have been 110 1 yard line pass plays this year and none have been picked off and 5 times Lynch has ran the ball form the one yard like and only scored once.

Fact is Butler make a ridiculously good play and the Pats won.

I love how people sit back like they have all the answers and the one person who doesn't is the one calling the plays.

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

I hate to be a Monday morning QB but I was shocked Lynch was not given the ball. The pass play right into the middle of the line resulting in a "Cutler" (which is my new term for a "pick") shocked me and made me cringe. Would Phil Jackson not have given the ball to Mickael Jordan?

I think the reason I did not like the play call was because I saw something similar to this play on the one yard line when Montini played SHG in the state championship game in November and the outcome was the same.

Also I think NE not calling the timeout was brilliant. I think if the timeout was called, Seattle thinks again about the play call and changes the play and gives the ball to Lynch.

Remember when Walter Payton was ticked off when Ditka let the Refrigerator carry the ball into the end zone and therefore Payton never scored a TD in the Super Bowl? Well I bet Lynch is a bit ticked also.

Wassup

This post was edited on 2/2 2:57 PM by Wassup13

 

[Oddy]

I'm no fan of Carroll, but all this hand wringing over this play is total hindsight IMO. Did you notice New England did not call time out, and the game clock was ticking away? I think Seattle thought NE would call time out, and when they didn't they got confused and ,well you saw the rest.

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

I know everyone is going to talk about Brady as being the best NFL QB ever the next month or so. But I would pick at least 3 all-time QB's if I were starting a team over Brady. What about everyone else?

Wassup

 

[DeanOfSelection]

I would put Brady #2

 

[GMAN81]

Brin:

I have to disagree with you. I did see what Carroll said and sometimes you have to play as the game dictates and not "by the book."

I'll tell you exactly why that was the wrong call and why he isn't a genius even if they do score. Let's say for a minute the pass is completed and they do score. You would still have people questioning the riskiness of a pass play in that situation. On the other hand, if they give the ball to Lynch and he fumbles, no one is questioning the play call because they gave the ball to their best player with the game on the line.

Not only did they not give the ball to Lynch, the pass wasn't intended to Jermaine Kearse, who had the best game on the Seattle side.

Finally, as far as stats go. Yes there were 110 1 yard line pass plays with no picks...but you forgot to include number 111, which WAS picked. It only takes one. Lynch may have been 1 for 5 from the 1 yard line but do you honestly believe he was going to be 1 for 6? Neither do I. No way in hell NE keeps him out of the end zone with the Super Bowl on the line.

It's fun to talk about. But I really dislike Pete Carroll and it was especially pleasing to see him get it stuck in his face in the end. Did you see him on the sidline in the 3rd quarter? He thought he had that game won...WRONG. He forgot who he was playing against. Reminded me of the loss to Texas.

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

Dr.

Did you like Pete Carroll's call right before the half to go for the TD instead of the FG from the 10-yard line on the last play of the half? I hated the call but it worked.

How do you think Green Bay would have done vs NE?

Wassup
This post was edited on 2/2 3:03 PM by Wassup13

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

"I would put Brady #2"

====

Montana the #1 QB during our time I assume?

 

[DeanOfSelection]

yes I go Montana, Brady , Elway 1-3
This post was edited on 2/2 3:13 PM by DeanOfSelection

 

[LakeCtyNewt]

I think too often coaches try and outthink it or out smart themselves or the other team.

Bottom line is this, second and goal, two yard line, one time out left, 20 seconds to go and you have the best running back in football behind you. Stats or no stats, if I'm going down, I am doing so with the ball in the hands of my best player.

As far as the GOAT, I would take Brady every day and twice on Sunday's. Besides Rob Gronkowski and Randy Moss, can you name ANY NE Patriot wide receiver or running back?

You, me and everyone else would look pretty damn good throwing to Jerry Rice for most of our careers.

 

[DeanOfSelection]

I heard that on the radio this morning this morning also concerning Montana. Montana won SB 16 and 19 before Rice started his career though.

 

[LakeCtyNewt]

Still take Brady. He has 6 Super Bowl appearances and hardly had the pedigree that Montana had. If not for a heroic catch from Tyree and a drop from Welker, he would be a no doubter.

 

[GMAN81]

Originally posted by LakeCtyNewt:


Still take Brady. He has 6 Super Bowl appearances and hardly had the pedigree that Montana had. If not for a heroic catch from Tyree and a drop from Welker, he would be a no doubter.

I agree 100% with you Newt. You are saying exactly what I said a few weeks ago when we were talking about the best QBs ever. Brady has done it with a host of average players. Montana also had John Taylor who was a good receiver. Let's not forget about Dwight Clark who was an excellent TE and Roger Craig. These guys were two of the best players in the league for a time. Craig was in four pro bowls and Clark was in a couple himself as was Taylor.

I am not taking anything away from Montana, he is a close second and to me and was number one till Brady surpassed him. I'd certainly take either guy. But if they faced each other at the height of their careers and the talent was the same on both sides I'd take Brady any day.

I felt Brady was the best before the Super Bowl was played yesterday.

 

[DeanOfSelection]

They both had all-time seasons (Montana in '89, Brady in '07) and Montana had the third best season (1984). The top five seasons for each compare favorably statistically. It's after that where Montana separates a bit. His worst two seasons (his first and last as a starter) rank ahead of five Brady seasons.

BUT TEAMMATES

Joe Montana got to play with Rob Gronkowski were the next two best offensive players to play with either of these guys. (with an in-his-prime Roger Craig from 1985-1989 being fourth).

In those 13 seasons, Montana had 23 other offensive pro bowlers and 8 teammates with all-pro seasons. Brady is at 20 and 7 in those two categories.



In their best five statistical seasons, Brady played with 15 pro bowlers on offense (3 per year) and 6 all pros, including Randy Moss in his best year. Montana played with 12 pro bowlers (2.4 per year) and 3 all pros (two being Rice in 1987 and 1989). For what it's worth, Montana only played with Rice in two of his top five statistical seasons, Rice was a rookie in #6, and Montana was in KC for #7.

It's an interesting phenomenon. Three of Joe Montana's Super Bowl titles came in his five best passing seasons. None of Brady's have. It's almost like the Patriots have been better in other areas in years they have won the title, to compensate for a little less offensive firepower.

THE SUPER BOWL PERFORMANCES

If we look at just the wins (and exclude the rest of the playoffs and the Super Bowl losses by Brady) it's not particularly close in terms of just performance in the Big Game.

Montana in four Super Bowl wins: 83 of 122 (68.0%), 1142 yards (9.4 yards per attempt), 11 TD, 0 INT

Brady in four Super Bowl wins: 108 of 158 (68.4%), 1054 yards (6.7 yards per attempt), 10 TD, 3 INT

 

[BretEpic]

When your running back is the most valuable running back (statistically) in the NFL, the most successful inside the five, scores 13 touchdowns, and goes by Beast Mode, you don't get pretty.

It's not hyperbole to say that was the worst call in Super Bowl history.

 

[GMAN81]

Originally posted by Wassup13:

Dr.

Did you like Pete Carroll's call right before the half to go for the TD instead of the FG from the 10-yard line on the last play of the half? I hated the call but it worked.

How do you think Green Bay would have done vs NE?

Wassup

This post was edited on 2/2 3:03 PM by Wassup13

I didn't care for the call either but as you say it worked out. But if it didn't, there was still an entire half to play and Seattle was getting the second half kickoff.

As for GB against NE that is an excellent question. That was the game I wanted to see like a lot of other people. The game couldn't have been much closer but I think I still would have gone with NE.

I certainly wasn't 100% sure of my pick. No one could have been. I will admit part of my pick came from the heart. I really wanted to see Pete Carroll lose the Super Bowl because I detest the man. I have no problem with any of the Seattle players. But as far as NFL coaches I dislike intensely, Pete Carroll and Rex Ryan are at the head of that list.

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

Just wanted to add as you always hear me say this -- I do not like lining up in the spread offense inside the 5-yard line. I think it only helps the defense.

Also, For QB's I believe its about how many Super Bowl wins you get, not appearances (unless your from Buffalo). Montana never threw an interception in a Super Bowl. I go with Montana.

Wassup
This post was edited on 2/2 5:52 PM by Wassup13

 

[MWittman]

Originally posted by Wassup13:

Just wanted to add as you always hear me say this -- I do not like lining up in the spread offense inside the 5-yard line. I think it only helps the defense.

Wassup:

I concur: Lining up in the spread inside your opponent's five-yard line OR inside your own five-yard line all too often leads to utter calamity.

 

[brownandwhite]

DVRd it

I wanted to be able to avoid the timeouts, cute commercials and hyperbolic halftime show.

Some of the commercials were interesting, and I began to wonder why the ad agencies except for this one event produce such boring, repetitive, and in many case demeaning commercials. Am I the only guy who feels insulted that wives always seem to know more about healthy eating and cleaning products?

And as far as the ending, Bears fans ought to be used to choking as a result of poor coaching and/or
execution.

 

[GMAN81]

Re: DVRd it

Originally posted by brownandwhite:
I wanted to be able to avoid the timeouts, cute commercials and hyperbolic halftime show.

Some of the commercials were interesting, and I began to wonder why the ad agencies except for this one event produce such boring, repetitive, and in many case demeaning commercials. Am I the only guy who feels insulted that wives always seem to know more about healthy eating and cleaning products?

And as far as the ending, Bears fans ought to be used to choking as a result of poor coaching and/or
execution.

Interesting change of gears. I was talking to my son about the commercials and we agreed that this year's game probably had the worst. Too many serious ones and the funny ones just weren't very funny. These are created by some very highly paid people too. Just goes to show what has happened to creativity in this age of gadgets.

Yes, men have become dorks on TV. I don't know whose idea this was but it is annoying... as if women are the only ones in control of everything.

As for the Bears fans...many of my friends and I have said, "and people ***** about the Bears' play calling and Cutler throwing a last minute pick." I said before and I'll say again, bad play calling is all over the league.

 

[JCHILLTOPPERS]

Originally posted by Wassup13:

I hate to be a Monday morning QB but I was shocked Lynch was not given the ball. The pass play right into the middle of the line resulting in a "Cutler" (which is my new term for a "pick") shocked me and made me cringe. Would Phil Jackson not have given the ball to Mickael Jordan?

I think the reason I did not like the play call was because I saw something similar to this play on the one yard line when Montini played SHG in the state championship game in November and the outcome was the same.

Also I think NE not calling the timeout was brilliant. I think if the timeout was called, Seattle thinks again about the play call and changes the play and gives the ball to Lynch.

Remember when Walter Payton was ticked off when Ditka let the Refrigerator carry the ball into the end zone and therefore Payton never scored a TD in the Super Bowl? Well I bet Lynch is a bit ticked also.

Wassup


This post was edited on 2/2 2:57 PM by Wassup13

I was shocked as well, but that does not mean it was wrong...

as far as MJ...there were numerous times, in big games, where pax or kerr got the last shot.

 

[GMAN81]

Originally posted by JCHILLTOPPERS:

as far as MJ...there were numerous times, in big games, where pax or kerr got the last shot.

That's most likely because Jordan probably had three guys on him. When Jordan was open and even when he wasn't, he got the ball. Tell me how many games those two got the last shot and then tell me how many times Jordan got the last shot. I guarantee you if you total up the last shots Pax and Kerr got at the end it comes nowhere near what the man got. Sure he was used as a decoy once in a great while but I don't remember it happening in the finals or even in an Eastern Division championship series.

Sorry, poor call by Seattle and the wrong call as well. Carroll ended up outcoaching himself. He tried to get cute and he got busted. Couldn't have happened to a better guy. He may not have actually called the play but he could have changed it.

I will make the same argument I made as to why it was the wrong call. Even if Seattle scores the TD there would have been plenty of people questioning the call. And I don't mean the Joe Blows on this board or in the public including myself. I mean people around the NFL.

On the other hand if they gave the ball to Lynch and he fumbled it away no one would be questioning the call itself, period. Lynch just made a four yard run to get it down to the one. There was plenty of time to run all four downs and Seattle had a TO left. I think there was some panic on the Seattle side in the closing minute.

We may never agree on this, but if I am on the sideline making the decision I am giving the ball to Lynch and I don't care if New England knows it. They still have to stop it and I don't think they would have.

If I am going to get beat it is going to be with the ball in my best player's hands. I can't blame Wilson for the INT. The pass really wasn't that bad. You have to give a ton of credit to Malcolm Butler for reading and jumping the route. Even if Wilson runs the ball there, it's still a better call than the pass no matter what happens.

 

[Oddy]

Of course nobody would blame Carroll if Lynch fumbled, you would blame Lynch for that. If Butler hadn't made an outstanding play... If the receiver had blocked him out.... Actually if it were me I would have had Wilson to a read option. It's all hinsight, especially the "experts".