FC: An update on factors informing the Commonwealth Campuses recommendation

[StamfordBridgeVikingatLeftOffensiveTackle]

An update on factors informing the Commonwealth Campuses recommendation | Penn State University

As promised in the recent message from President Neeli Bendapudi about next steps for Penn State’s Commonwealth Campuses, University leaders Margo DelliCarpini, Tracy Langkilde and Michael Wade Smith are sharing more about the guiding principles of their committee and key factors helping to...

www.psu.edu

 

[NittPicker]

Maybe that'll satisfy those who seem to think the university won't be doing much more than flipping a coin to determine which campuses will be closed. I hope Rep. Krupa read it.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Maybe that'll satisfy those who seem to think the university won't be doing much more than flipping a coin to determine which campuses will be closed. I hope Rep. Krupa read it.

Not sure Rep. Krupa can read

 

[psuro]

I don't think any of this should come as a surprise to anyone. In addition to the information presented, I believe PA's median population, has gotten older over the last couple of decades.

 

[BobPSU92]

An update on factors informing the Commonwealth Campuses recommendation | Penn State University

As promised in the recent message from President Neeli Bendapudi about next steps for Penn State’s Commonwealth Campuses, University leaders Margo DelliCarpini, Tracy Langkilde and Michael Wade Smith are sharing more about the guiding principles of their committee and key factors helping to...

www.psu.edu

“Across the 12 campuses under consideration — Beaver, DuBois, Fayette, Greater Allegheny, Hazleton, Mont Alto, New Kensington, Schuylkill, Scranton, Shenango, Wilkes-Barre and York — enrollment declined by 39% over the past decade (2014-24), a decrease of 3,222 students. Penn State’s overall enrollment decreased by 4% during this same period, while University Park enrollment increased by 5%.”

 

[HarrisburgDave]

I see in the past few years there was a five percent drop in enrollment at University Park. Not surprising. I would expect that to continue with population trends and the rise of on line attendance.

They still have plans for more physical plant improvements, though I think they should seriously be looking at shrinking the size of a campus and facilities built for another era.

My daughter is taking graduate business classes on line. She “attends” Univ of N Carolina and finds it convenient and affordable. Fortunately her employer kicks in. She lives in Brooklyn, works in Manhattan, and telecommutes to Chapel Hill.

I suspect this on line trend will only accelerate. IMO State College had best plan to see a rapid drop in attendance in the coming decade. Branch campuses will likely see their attraction (affordability and proximity) eliminated.

My son wanted to get on with working and living his life at 18. I seriously doubt he would have attended Temple and St Joe’s if he could have earned his degrees on line while working.

 

[NittPicker]

I see there was a five percent drop in enrollment at University Park. Not surprising. I would expect that to continue with population trends and the rise of on line attendance.

It actually says the opposite. Most students want to go to main campus. It's one of the few where the admin can control the number attending.

 

[HarrisburgDave]

It actually says the opposite. Most students want to go to main campus. It's one of the few where the admin can control the number attending.

Oops. Senior moment.

I think that trend will slow and reverse.

Do you think that they are canabalizing the branch campuses in expectation of closings?

We have seen the closure of some schools recently. I wonder if places like York College, Susquehanna, and Lebanon Valley will be around by 2050?

 

[ValleyForgeLion]

“Across the 12 campuses under consideration — Beaver, DuBois, Fayette, Greater Allegheny, Hazleton, Mont Alto, New Kensington, Schuylkill, Scranton, Shenango, Wilkes-Barre and York — enrollment declined by 39% over the past decade (2014-24), a decrease of 3,222 students. Penn State’s overall enrollment decreased by 4% during this same period, while University Park enrollment increased by 5%.”

I think it's been pointed out over the last few years that University Park has been making offers to Commonwealth Campus students who, historically, would not have had the grades/SAT's to qualify for main campus and who *really* needed the high-quality, small-campus two year programs that would help them be successful when they transferred to main campus (the 2+2 program).

But UP needed to juice the numbers to keep building and expanding, and never mind that at the same time they were robbing the Commonwealth Campuses these kids were dropping out with huge debt because, well, UP is expensive and challenging. That off-campus housing was not going to fill itself, people.

In many of the areas with campuses scheduled to be shuttered, the Penn State branch campus was one of the jewels of the economy. Neeli and company would like you to forget, but there is no such thing as a B.A. from Penn State Mont Alto - it only says Penn State. It's all the same accreditation, and supposed to be the same education.

I am putting a big heaping dose of blame on the legislators from these districts for keeping their heads in the sand and letting Penn State do whatever the hell they want to.

 

[psuro]

I think it's been pointed out over the last few years that University Park has been making offers to Commonwealth Campus students who, historically, would not have had the grades/SAT's to qualify for main campus and who *really* needed the high-quality, small-campus two year programs that would help them be successful when they transferred to main campus (the 2+2 program).

But UP needed to juice the numbers to keep building and expanding, and never mind that at the same time they were robbing the Commonwealth Campuses these kids were dropping out with huge debt because, well, UP is expensive and challenging. That off-campus housing was not going to fill itself, people.

In many of the areas with campuses scheduled to be shuttered, the Penn State branch campus was one of the jewels of the economy. Neeli and company would like you to forget, but there is no such thing as a B.A. from Penn State Mont Alto - it only says Penn State. It's all the same accreditation, and supposed to be the same education.

I am putting a big heaping dose of blame on the legislators from these districts for keeping their heads in the sand and letting Penn State do whatever the hell they want to.

I don't necessary agree with your last statement. The legislators are reacting to what their constituents want - and looking at the map that was included, I think the population in that area is simply not interested in supporting higher education. It's just not that important to them. (perhaps some think of it as a luxury).

 

[StamfordBridgeVikingatLeftOffensiveTackle]

I think it's been pointed out over the last few years that University Park has been making offers to Commonwealth Campus students who, historically, would not have had the grades/SAT's to qualify for main campus and who *really* needed the high-quality, small-campus two year programs that would help them be successful when they transferred to main campus (the 2+2 program).

But UP needed to juice the numbers to keep building and expanding, and never mind that at the same time they were robbing the Commonwealth Campuses these kids were dropping out with huge debt because, well, UP is expensive and challenging. That off-campus housing was not going to fill itself, people.

In many of the areas with campuses scheduled to be shuttered, the Penn State branch campus was one of the jewels of the economy. Neeli and company would like you to forget, but there is no such thing as a B.A. from Penn State Mont Alto - it only says Penn State. It's all the same accreditation, and supposed to be the same education.

I am putting a big heaping dose of blame on the legislators from these districts for keeping their heads in the sand and letting Penn State do whatever the hell they want to.

There is such thing as a B.A. from Mont Alto. Mont Alto offers eight B.A. degrees.

Bachelor's Degrees at Penn State Mont Alto

Bachelor's Degrees at Penn State Mont Alto

montalto.psu.edu

 

[manatree]

I suspect this on line trend will only accelerate. IMO State College had best plan to see a rapid drop in attendance in the coming decade. Branch campuses will likely see their attraction (affordability and proximity) eliminated.

For years I've been hoping that the new, high end student apartment complexes would cause the older, basic apartment complexes to lower their rates in order to fill their buildings. Hasn't happened yet. I'm hoping to hold on to my small, below market 1br apartment until I die.

 

[HarrisburgDave]

BTW, why do we appoint a committee of people with career and personal interests that may conflict with critical thinking about University investment decisions?

Didnt we hire a President who should do that job?

Perhaps someone like John Fry at Temple would have handled things differently? He certainly did at Drexel. Then again, he has a track record of raising money, building programs, and developing facilities. Wish we had him.

 

[Midnighter]

I don't think any of this should come as a surprise to anyone. In addition to the information presented, I believe PA's median population, has gotten older over the last couple of decades.

Per Wiki PA is 10th in the US (and territories) in median age - 40.9. Texas is the lowest (state) at 35.2 (DC is 34.4). At some point, the weather will force people north (not in our lifetimes but not too far away....).

 

[psuro]

Per Wiki PA is 10th in the US (and territories) in median age - 40.9. Texas is the lowest (state) at 35.2 (DC is 34.4). At some point, the weather will force people north (not in our lifetimes but not too far away....).

Yeah, I saw that. We will see about the weather, but I can guess that the median age won't be getting better in PA for a while. At least, not for a good portion of the commonwealth. I would imagine should people move back to Pa, they woul be attracted to places in or near developed areas, and not the rural areas that are the basis for this article. The dichotomy between the two areas could be even more stark than it is now.

 

[NittPicker]

Oops. Senior moment.

I think that trend will slow and reverse.

Do you think that they are canabalizing the branch campuses in expectation of closings?

We have seen the closure of some schools recently. I wonder if places like York College, Susquehanna, and Lebanon Valley will be around by 2050?

I'm not a data analyst. I'm just a guy with a computer. But enrollment at UP won't decrease unless Old Main wants it to. The vast, vast majority of applicants to Penn State want to go to main campus. OTOH, declining enrollment is happening organically at the branch campuses because if demographics changes. The writing on the wall is saying many campuses in a given area will be consolidated.

 

[BobPSU92]

Buc-ee’s coming to PA would shift the demographics in Penn State’s favor. Penn State needs to make that happen.

 

[ValleyForgeLion]

I don't necessary agree with your last statement. The legislators are reacting to what their constituents want - and looking at the map that was included, I think the population in that area is simply not interested in supporting higher education. It's just not that important to them. (perhaps some think of it as a luxury).

Sadly, I agree. But it's been proven that, along with walk-able communities, having great libraries and a notable institution of higher education are the easiest ways to increase an area's value and attraction to better paying employers.

There is such thing as a B.A. from Mont Alto. Mont Alto offers eight B.A. degrees.

Bachelor's Degrees at Penn State Mont Alto

Bachelor's Degrees at Penn State Mont Alto

montalto.psu.edu

That was my point. Even though Mont Alto offers 8 BA's (and I think DuBois, Schuykill, Scranton, and Shenango also offer B's) the degrees don't mention the campus a student earned the degree at. It just says Penn State. In theory a much, much better bang for the buck and speaking from experience, a much better education for students that need smaller class sizes and individual attention.

 

[CFLion]

Gotta think one of the campuses in the Pittsburgh region will be saved. My guess would be New Kensington. It's the most central and appears to have a lot of land around it in the event expansion would be necessary.

 

[Keyser Soze 16802]

This is key: "No other land-grant university maintains a statewide footprint as extensive as Penn State’s 19 undergraduate-serving campuses. Instead, many peer institutions focus on fewer, larger regional campuses, robust extension programs, and strategic partnerships to provide education and service at scale."

 

[HarrisburgDave]

Why are there so few industries in Centre and adjacent counties If employers are so attracted to pools of students?

 

[PSU Mike]

There is such thing as a B.A. from Mont Alto. Mont Alto offers eight B.A. degrees.

Bachelor's Degrees at Penn State Mont Alto

Bachelor's Degrees at Penn State Mont Alto

montalto.psu.edu

I dunno. A quick online search returned a response that the diploma does not say Mont Alto, which was the gist of the other poster’s comment, albeit about the 2+2 version.

 

[LB99]

I see in the past few years there was a five percent drop in enrollment at University Park. Not surprising. I would expect that to continue with population trends and the rise of on line attendance.

They still have plans for more physical plant improvements, though I think they should seriously be looking at shrinking the size of a campus and facilities built for another era.

My daughter is taking graduate business classes on line. She “attends” Univ of N Carolina and finds it convenient and affordable. Fortunately her employer kicks in. She lives in Brooklyn, works in Manhattan, and telecommutes to Chapel Hill.

I suspect this on line trend will only accelerate. IMO State College had best plan to see a rapid drop in attendance in the coming decade. Branch campuses will likely see their attraction (affordability and proximity) eliminated.

My son wanted to get on with working and living his life at 18. I seriously doubt he would have attended Temple and St Joe’s if he could have earned his degrees on line while working.

There was so much of a demand for University Park enrollment two years ago that they offered kids a nice financial savings to attend a branch campus instead. There were 9,000+ in that freshman class, which I believe is the norm with plans to increase it to 10,000.

 

[saturdaysarebetter]

Gotta think one of the campuses in the Pittsburgh region will be saved. My guess would be New Kensington. It's the most central and appears to have a lot of land around it in the event expansion would be necessary.

You can blame me if New Kensington closes. The curse of marriage. Where we held our rehearsal dinner - the Brown Derby in the Monroeville Mall adjacent to the ice skating ring - long gone. Where we had our wedding reception - the Holiday House in Monroeville - torn down to become a Pharmor Store - both are long gone. I met and proposed to my future ex-wife at PSNK, so I've always feared for PSNK and the church we got married in.

 

[LB99]

You can blame me if New Kensington closes. The curse of marriage. Where we held our rehearsal dinner - the Brown Derby in the Monroeville Mall adjacent to the ice skating ring - long gone. Where we had our wedding reception - the Holiday House in Monroeville - torn down to become a Pharmor Store - both are long gone. I met and proposed to my future ex-wife at PSNK, so I've always feared for PSNK and the church we got married in.

Our rehearsal dinner venue burned down. The church we got married in has been vacant for many years now and our reception venue went out of business temporarily. Fortunately, our marriage is pretty strong.

 

[kgilbert78]

The restaurant we got engaged in became a Jiffy Lube. Which is also gone now.

 

[retsio]

For this current academic year - BOT reports 110,000 applications received for 10,000 Freshman class at UP. While Commonwealth Campus enrollment declined by 3%.

 

[Lion84]

They have plans to build a new Dorm complex off University Drive I think - mot sure what they can call it all directional names are taken.

 

[kgilbert78]

They have plans to build a new Dorm complex off University Drive I think - mot sure what they can call it all directional names are taken.

"Central Halls".

Here in my town. one of the suburbs had a North and a South high school. Then they built a third one, well north of North. It was named Central.

 

[BobPSU92]

They have plans to build a new Dorm complex off University Drive I think - mot sure what they can call it all directional names are taken.

Too Country Halls

 

[saturdaysarebetter]

"Central Halls".

Here in my town. one of the suburbs had a North and a South high school. Then they built a third one, well north of North. It was named Central.

I prefer Well North of North. Truly unique and directionally descriptive.

 

[Bison13]

"Central Halls".

Here in my town. one of the suburbs had a North and a South high school. Then they built a third one, well north of North. It was named Central.

We don’t understand geography HS?

 

[kgilbert78]

We don’t understand geography HS?

There have been a couple of PSU players who came from their south campus.

 

[Catch1lion]

Budget cuts include engineering and Schreyer . Like WTF . Biggest boost is nursing funding . While we need more nurses , nursing enrollment had a big drop off . Bendi’s got this . We are so screwed . Paywall but easy option for 48 hr sign in .

https://www.centredaily.com/news/local/education/penn-state/article302276739.html?utm_campaign=trueanthem&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwY2xjawJGdBxleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHaxjivYz66SvhHsOmmhCl7APaG675953anX9dq3La31KVVLI1g_fg7HfJw_aem_gZoGScLNQ4zJP6CqVO3IcA

 

[Keyser Soze 16802]

No paywall here

https://www.spotlightpa.org/stateco...on-spending-engineering-stem-graduate-school/

 

[Keyser Soze 16802]

These moves seem insane given how essential these programs are to reputation building:

The graduate school’s budget is down 46.5%, a decrease of $9 million. Graduate enrollment at University Park was 6,281 in fall 2024, compared to 6,330 in fall 2021, according to the university.

On previous Giving Tuesdays, Penn State promoted its Millennium Scholars Program, which provides tuition and housing assistance to students for “an elite opportunity designed to help underrepresented individuals earn a doctorate” in science, technology, engineering, and mathematics, according to Penn State. Since fiscal year 2022, Penn State cut the program’s budget by $3.1 million, a 76.7% decrease.

Over the same period, Penn State cut $3.4 million from Schreyer Honors College, a 54.1% decrease.

 

[Catch1lion]

These moves seem insane given how essential these programs are to reputation building:

The graduate school’s budget is down 46.5%, a decrease of $9 million. Graduate enrollment at University Park was 6,281 in fall 2024, compared to 6,330 in fall 2021, according to the university.

On previous Giving Tuesdays, Penn State promoted its Millennium Scholars Program, which provides tuition and housing assistance to students for “an elite opportunity designed to help underrepresented individuals earn a doctorate” in science, technology, engineering, and mathematics, according to Penn State. Since fiscal year 2022, Penn State cut the program’s budget by $3.1 million, a 76.7% decrease.

Over the same period, Penn State cut $3.4 million from Schreyer Honors College, a 54.1% decrease.

All the new buildings going up for engineering college, and a $20 million cut for the department.

 

[BobPSU92]

I prefer Well North of North. Truly unique and directionally descriptive.

North by North North.

 

[doctornick]

These moves seem insane given how essential these programs are to reputation building:

The graduate school’s budget is down 46.5%, a decrease of $9 million. Graduate enrollment at University Park was 6,281 in fall 2024, compared to 6,330 in fall 2021, according to the university.

On previous Giving Tuesdays, Penn State promoted its Millennium Scholars Program, which provides tuition and housing assistance to students for “an elite opportunity designed to help underrepresented individuals earn a doctorate” in science, technology, engineering, and mathematics, according to Penn State. Since fiscal year 2022, Penn State cut the program’s budget by $3.1 million, a 76.7% decrease.

Over the same period, Penn State cut $3.4 million from Schreyer Honors College, a 54.1% decrease.

Schreyer is one program that gets a lot of positive press for PSU (often regarded as one of the best honors colleges in the nation and “Ivy League caliber” education) so I am shocked they cut it so much especially when it’s not a huge budget to begin with.

I’m not really familiar with Millennium Scholars but have seen people rave about it. I feel like they were very generous to students in the program financially but I’d guess these cuts would mean a lot less financial support.

 

[Anon1686102235]

Do you think that they are canabalizing the branch campuses in expectation of closings?

We have seen the closure of some schools recently. I wonder if places like York College, Susquehanna, and Lebanon Valley will be around by 2050?

Can't speak for York College, but I do know Susquehanna is struggling a bit (and Albright). LVC on the other hand has record enrollment. They are sitting in one of the few areas in PA that's increasing in the desired population.

The branch campuses closing will actually only help those schools, not hurt (in the short term at least). PSU has already funneled some nursing over to LVC so they can staff the Med Center with interns. Schools that have niche/desired programs seems to be positioned better than those that don't. (LVC - Nursing/PT; Del Valley - Vet school, etc.). It may come down to which schools can pivot and meet the demands/create new programs quicker than other schools.

Lack of funding from the state has really affected this. These smaller schools can compete on price (by offering scholarships) to the state schools/branch campuses better than they ever have before. Don't look at just the sticker price, you have to look at the discount rate and factor that in.