Gitmo is open for business

TarHeelEer

Freshman
Dec 15, 2002
89,304
53
48
Link

But that one doesn't stand alone...

Executive order from December 21, 2017
Link

"I therefore determine that serious human rights abuse and corruption around the world constitute an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security, foreign policy, and economy of the United States, and I hereby declare a national emergency to deal with that threat."
 

Keyser76

Freshman
Apr 7, 2010
11,912
58
0
Nothing says American values like locking people up forever without a trial, no wonder the right admires Russia and Putin so much, MAGA.
 

Boomboom521

Redshirt
Mar 14, 2014
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I don’t know why anyone would be excited about just the announcement that Gitmo is going to be operational again. Jobs?
 

Popeer

Freshman
Sep 8, 2003
21,466
81
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Who is suggesting that strawman?
What straw man? We've had many of those people locked up in Guantanamo for more than 16 years with no trial or hope of one, for no other offense than fighting for a government we didn't like. Must make people really proud to know we've turned into the kind of country we claim to oppose.
 

dave

Senior
May 29, 2001
60,598
814
113
What straw man? We've had many of those people locked up in Guantanamo for more than 16 years with no trial or hope of one, for no other offense than fighting for a government we didn't like. Must make people really proud to know we've turned into the kind of country we claim to oppose.
Oh. My bad. I didnt realize you were talking about pampering enemy combatants. I am proud of how we treat them. We should treat them as bad as they treat ours.
 

Brushy Bill

Hall of Famer
Mar 31, 2009
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boomboom's version of gitmo...

 

bornaneer

All-Conference
Jan 23, 2014
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I don’t know why anyone would be excited about just the announcement that Gitmo is going to be operational again. Jobs?
What do you mean "operational again"? I don't believe it was ever closed. BTW....just another fib..... January 22, 2009: Freshly inaugurated President Obama signs an executive order to close the Guantánamo Bay Detention Facility within one year.
 

bornaneer

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Jan 23, 2014
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What straw man? We've had many of those people locked up in Guantanamo for more than 16 years with no trial or hope of one, for no other offense than fighting for a government we didn't like. Must make people really proud to know we've turned into the kind of country we claim to oppose.
WOW
 

DvlDog4WVU

All-Conference
Feb 2, 2008
47,206
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What straw man? We've had many of those people locked up in Guantanamo for more than 16 years with no trial or hope of one, for no other offense than fighting for a government we didn't like. Must make people really proud to know we've turned into the kind of country we claim to oppose.
I believe we call those POWs and we’re within our rights to hold them prisoner so long as we’re at war. It’s not a crime, ergo, no trial.
 

WVU82_rivals

Senior
May 29, 2001
199,091
686
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We've had many of those people locked up in Guantanamo for more than 16 years with no trial or hope of one, for no other offense than fighting for a government we didn't like. Must make people really proud to know we've turned into the kind of country we claim to oppose.



owebama Releases More Gitmo Detainees Despite an Estimated 30 ...
https://www.dailywire.com/.../obama-releases-more-gitmo-detainees-despite-frank-ca...
Dec 27, 2016 - According to the office of the director of National Intelligence, nearly one-third of the detainees freed from Gitmo—208 of the 693 detainees who were released under Presidents Bush or owebama—are confirmed or suspected of returning to terrorism." The president has been releasing men from Guantanamo ...


just another owebamatraitor moment...
 

Boomboom521

Redshirt
Mar 14, 2014
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I believe we call those POWs and we’re within our rights to hold them prisoner so long as we’re at war. It’s not a crime, ergo, no trial.
I’m not arguing against your knowledge of this type of thing — but isn’t the lines between non-combatants and combatants blurred substantially in the war on terror. I know we’ve made mistakes in our incarceration of men not involved in terrorist activities at Gitmo. When it’s a terrorist cell, and not a nation fighting in clear position, doesn’t this create a very serious question in regards to the POW approach to incarceration and interrogation?

We still want to be a little better in our way of doing things, don’t we? Not that I want our feelings to dominate the military theatre, but we want to handle things with a sense of integrity still, right?
 

Popeer

Freshman
Sep 8, 2003
21,466
81
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I believe we call those POWs and we’re within our rights to hold them prisoner so long as we’re at war. It’s not a crime, ergo, no trial.
We don't call them POWs, we call them unlawful combatants, and that's the whole basis for keeping them locked up.
 

DvlDog4WVU

All-Conference
Feb 2, 2008
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I’m not arguing against your knowledge of this type of thing — but isn’t the lines between non-combatants and combatants blurred substantially in the war on terror. I know we’ve made mistakes in our incarceration of men not involved in terrorist activities at Gitmo. When it’s a terrorist cell, and not a nation fighting in clear position, doesn’t this create a very serious question in regards to the POW approach to incarceration and interrogation?

We still want to be a little better in our way of doing things, don’t we? Not that I want our feelings to dominate the military theatre, but we want to handle things with a sense of integrity still, right?
It’s extremely blurred. We don’t have precedence in our history to deal with this. There are 3 schools of thought. 1. Is to treat them as traditional enemy combatants. 2. To treat them as criminals. 3. Take advantage of the blurred lines.

My general feelings are that there is a fourth school of thought. There is no question that they are enemy combatants as we have each formally declared war. The problem is that they aren’t a formal Govt or abide by the Geneva Convention. That presents a problem.

I don’t believe they are criminals as Popeer put it, “they are fighting for their cause” and back to the point about formal declarations of war. They may break international laws, but it’s blurred, again.

My thoughts on GITMO, leave it open and house them. Try to interrogate and generate intel as able. I don’t abide enhanced interrogation. That violates my moral code, but that’s me personally.
 

Boomboom521

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Mar 14, 2014
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It’s extremely blurred. We don’t have precedence in our history to deal with this. There are 3 schools of thought. 1. Is to treat them as traditional enemy combatants. 2. To treat them as criminals. 3. Take advantage of the blurred lines.

My general feelings are that there is a fourth school of thought. There is no question that they are enemy combatants as we have each formally declared war. The problem is that they aren’t a formal Govt or abide by the Geneva Convention. That presents a problem.

I don’t believe they are criminals as Popeer put it, “they are fighting for their cause” and back to the point about formal declarations of war. They may break international laws, but it’s blurred, again.

My thoughts on GITMO, leave it open and house them. Try to interrogate and generate intel as able. I don’t abide enhanced interrogation. That violates my moral code, but that’s me personally.
I understand the desire to take advantage of the blurred lines, and I understand the threat (at least a little). But I’m concerned about what our flag (and nation) stands for abroad. I’m not thinking Europe here, but in the ME does it still embody liberty and a beacon of freedom and integrity, or just another imperialist force trying to subjugate the world less advanced?

Even if it’s exploited by our enemy, I’d like for us to operate differently than our enemies.
 

DvlDog4WVU

All-Conference
Feb 2, 2008
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I understand the desire to take advantage of the blurred lines, and I understand the threat (at least a little). But I’m concerned about what our flag (and nation) stands for abroad. I’m not thinking Europe here, but in the ME does it still embody liberty and a beacon of freedom and integrity, or just another imperialist force trying to subjugate the world less advanced?

Even if it’s exploited by our enemy, I’d like for us to operate differently than our enemies.
So, military tribunals? What does what you’re saying translate to in practical terms?
 

Boomboom521

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Mar 14, 2014
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So, military tribunals? What does what you’re saying translate to in practical terms?
I think short term should be handled by the military — both due to logistics and intelligence classification. But anything long term (holding someone more than, say 6 mo - 1 yr?) a noncombatant should be given legal representation and receive trial. Military tribunal I guess (I know very little about them), and I imagine the detainment would violate laws and nullify any possible verdict and sentencing in civilian court.
 

Brushy Bill

Hall of Famer
Mar 31, 2009
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I think short term should be handled by the military — both due to logistics and intelligence classification. But anything long term (holding someone more than, say 6 mo - 1 yr?) a noncombatant should be given legal representation and receive trial. Military tribunal I guess (I know very little about them), and I imagine the detainment would violate laws and nullify any possible verdict and sentencing in civilian court.

See post 22