Here is What Should Happen

[crusader_of_90]

Two tiers of Catholics with SHG being the cut off. Teams like Mater Dei, Bmac, Althoff and Ic can battle it out and then the Big Boys up here.

For the public schools, let's have four divisions. It seems that 7/8a flip flop with talent levels - combine them. Same with 6-5 and so on down the line.

And if the seasons end a different times, so be it, but coordination of seasons would be required.

 

[CoachHansen05]

Two tiers of Catholics with SHG being the cut off. Teams like Mater Dei, Bmac, Althoff and Ic can battle it out and then the Big Boys up here.

For the public schools, let's have four divisions. It seems that 7/8a flip flop with talent levels - combine them. Same with 6-5 and so on down the line.

And if the seasons end a different times, so be it, but coordination of seasons would be required.

I think you're on to something. I wonder what the brackets would've looked like...

 

[Chicago312]

Two tiers of Catholics with SHG being the cut off. Teams like Mater Dei, Bmac, Althoff and Ic can battle it out and then the Big Boys up here.

For the public schools, let's have four divisions. It seems that 7/8a flip flop with talent levels - combine them. Same with 6-5 and so on down the line.

And if the seasons end a different times, so be it, but coordination of seasons would be required.

So what about the small private schools, who may or may not be a Catholic school (Ottawa Marquette, Hope Academy, Sterling Catholic)? No way they would be able to compete w/ SHG, Althoff, or BMac!

 

[Snetsrak61]

So what about the small private schools, who may or may not be a Catholic school (Ottawa Marquette, Hope Academy, Sterling Catholic)? No way they would be able to compete w/ SHG, Althoff, or BMac!

I'd assume any reference to "catholics" means all private schools. With all privates, and two classes, I think you can cut it down to 16 teams per class instead of 32. If you include the non-boundary publics you may still have enough for 32 in each class.

 

[Chicago312]

According to IHSA site there are 67 private & 47 Non Bounadry schools that play football (may be off by a few given small font) Seperation could be possible with 3 classes each! 32 teams make the field in each class public/private class. To avoid some conference reshuffling how about top 28 teams get in playoffs plus 4 at large entries who rank in top 15 (or 20) of playoff points with at least 3 wins. Seed 1-32 in all classes, neutral site (college stadium preferred) semifinals, ALL state finals in DeKalb on same two day weekend! Thoughts????

 

[jwarigaku]

Chicago773,

Can't work that would mean 50% of the state titles would be represented by only 20% of the teams. If there are 2 private divisions there must still be 8 public divisions to represent the correct percentages. After that then you need geographic representation as well.

According to IHSA site there are 67 private & 47 Non Bounadry schools that play football (may be off by a few given small font) Seperation could be possible with 3 classes each! 32 teams make the field in each class public/private class. To avoid some conference reshuffling how about top 28 teams get in playoffs plus 4 at large entries who rank in top 15 (or 20) of playoff points with at least 3 wins. Seed 1-32 in all classes, neutral site (college stadium preferred) semifinals, ALL state finals in DeKalb on same two day weekend! Thoughts????

 

[crusader_of_90]

Sure, we could do three private school classes.

Finals held at ISU - smack dab in the middle of the state.

 

[HHSTigerFan]

Sure, we could do three private school classes.

Finals held at ISU - smack dab in the middle of the state.

Illinois St won't let that happen as long as they are FCS..

 

[Anon1754760634]

Yeah I've heard that whole ISU and FCS deal before. I know a few people there and everything they tell me is that they will bid on the next go around contract wise. They also admit that letting the games go was a huge mistake they won't make again.

 

[HHSTigerFan]

Seems crazy to give up a possible home game... is it a money maker for them?

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

Can't work that would mean 50% of the state titles would be represented by only 20% of the teams. If there are 2 private divisions there must still be 8 public divisions to represent the correct percentages.

...unless those private divisions weren't within the confines of the IHSA. Give me the NIPL!

 

[MC63]

...unless those private divisions weren't within the confines of the IHSA. Give me the NIPL!

I think you're just looking for an excuse to say NIPL.

 

[RetiredReferee]

Let the coaches seed, take away a home game or bump down their seeding if they don't participate. As a public school guy, I don't want to see the two separate. As a guy that goes where he is told in late October/November I don't care about the difference between the two teams. As a guy who enjoys reading this board, nothing will ever satisfy the masses here.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

I think you're just looking for an excuse to say NIPL.

OH MY! You mean you pronounce the acronym like the body part? I've always spelled it out like N-I-P-L.

 

[Snetsrak61]

I'd take a more long term view on the league and call it just the Northern Illinois League, or even drop the northern part. Once the next batch of schools to get multiplied or success factored or whatever in the name of fairness from the IHSA, teams will be petitioning to join the new IL league

 

[crusader_of_90]

Here's what's funny about that - CPS will blow up the public school model.

Just like almost all municipal legislation has the exemption qualifier for cities with "with a population of more than 500,000," CPS will never play by IHSA rules, thus creating a new "class."

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

I'd take a more long term view on the league and call it just the Northern Illinois League, or even drop the northern part.

Killjoy.

 

[Gaelman]

Killjoy.

Strikes me as much ado about nothing.
If all the private schools lost would there be any issue?
Really takes up a lot of energy and time doesn't it?

Although I guess from looking at the landscape of this world we live in , apparently it's more popular to be against something than for something.

I'm just for better more competitive games.
In almost all classes there were better games along the way than in the finals.

 

[illini14]

You do realize how bad CPS schools are at football? Besides Phillips, I'm not sure how good anyone was. Sure, Simeon was OK, but I can't name a team besides them that was any good. What are there 50-60 other CPS schools that play football? No offense to the other CPS schools, but their level of play is no where close to the DVC, ESCC, CCL, or the West Suburban. I know enrollment is smaller at many of those schools, but those schools aren't mopping up 3A-6A in football...

Sure, Phillips is having some success and there have been some noticeable transfers there. But one school?

Here's what's funny about that - CPS will blow up the public school model.

Just like almost all municipal legislation has the exemption qualifier for cities with "with a population of more than 500,000," CPS will never play by IHSA rules, thus creating a new "class."

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

You do realize how bad CPS schools are at football? Besides Phillips, I'm not sure how good anyone was. Sure, Simeon was OK, but I can't name a team besides them that was any good. What are there 50-60 other CPS schools that play football? No offense to the other CPS schools, but their level of play is no where close to the DVC, ESCC, CCL, or the West Suburban. I know enrollment is smaller at many of those schools, but those schools aren't mopping up 3A-6A in football...

You do realize that if the private schools left the IHSA, it is highly unlikely that the IHSA would allow one of its members to play a non member in the post season and so the Prep Bowl would be discontinued. In that case, the CPS would enter ALL of its schools into the IHSA playoffs, instead of just the relative handful of current qualifiers coming out of its more competitive CPL divisions. I'm not sure if Crusader meant that when he said that the CPS would blow up the IHSA, but that's how I took it.

 

[illini14]

That is a good point, you just took if from a different point than me. I do agree with what you are saying though.

You do realize that if the private schools left the IHSA, it is highly unlikely that the IHSA would allow one of its members to play a non member in the post season and so the Prep Bowl would be discontinued. In that case, the CPS would enter ALL of its schools into the IHSA playoffs, instead of just the relative handful of current qualifiers coming out of its more competitive CPL divisions. I'm not sure if Crusader meant that when he said that the CPS would blow up the IHSA, but that's how I took it.

 

[crusader_of_90]

What I intended to convey is lefts say private schools have their own thing. It's been foreshadowed that if success can happen at Phillips, that it can be duplicated elsewhere. Certainly, the talent is in the CPS. It becomes an issue of gathering that talent - from several hundred thousand kids - under one roof. No cost, just benefits ... If the public schools bemoan "recruiting" now- see how the CPS does it but yet blessed by the IHSA currently.

They could picks schools in each class, assemble talent and take over the title games.

 

[greatgig13]

Something needs to be done but I don't know what. I'm sure the Catholic school backers will call me a whiner and beating a dead horse but the field is not level. I live in Cary and I get fliers to get for my kid, who doesn't play football, to attend Marian Central in Woodstock which is 13 miles away. Cary is a pissant town of 17,000 people and it's zoned for kids to go to Cary Grove, Prairie Ridge and Jacobs. How does a kid that lives 2 miles from CG end up going to Jacobs in Algonquin, 5 miles away when Marian has a reach of at least 13 miles. Hell, I know a family that sold their house in Cary just get into the CG zone. It sucks that some schools just deal with the hand they were given while others can bring in kids from miles away as long as they foot the bill. The system will never change though.

 

[PRokie]

You

Something needs to be done but I don't know what. I'm sure the Catholic school backers will call me a whiner and beating a dead horse but the field is not level. I live in Cary and I get fliers to get for my kid, who doesn't play football, to attend Marian Central in Woodstock which is 13 miles away. Cary is a pissant town of 17,000 people and it's zoned for kids to go to Cary Grove, Prairie Ridge and Jacobs. How does a kid that lives 2 miles from CG end up going to Jacobs in Algonquin, 5 miles away when Marian has a reach of at least 13 miles. Hell, I know a family that sold their house in Cary just get into the CG zone. It sucks that some schools just deal with the hand they were given while others can bring in kids from miles away as long as they foot the bill. The system will never change though.

unfortunately they don't always have to foot the bill either!!!!!

GASP!

But that never really happens..


Every state champion this year can say their ENTIRE starting lineup actually played for the same team last year AND each of those kids families were ENTIRELY responsible for all expenses incurred in their attending that school, including all travel costs.

 

[greatgig13]

Hell, it could be Jackie Robinson West all over again if the IHSA really wanted to look into it. But they won't.

 

[PRokie]

Hell, it could be Jackie Robinson West all over again if the IHSA really wanted to look into it.

How DARE you suggest such a thing!!

 

[UlbKA91]

What I intended to convey is lefts say private schools have their own thing. It's been foreshadowed that if success can happen at Phillips, that it can be duplicated elsewhere. Certainly, the talent is in the CPS. It becomes an issue of gathering that talent - from several hundred thousand kids - under one roof. No cost, just benefits ... If the public schools bemoan "recruiting" now- see how the CPS does it but yet blessed by the IHSA currently.

They could picks schools in each class, assemble talent and take over the title games.

Through agressive fiscal-"crisis" based consolidation (co-op ing) of football programs, perhaps guided by a systemwide management of all football by a AUSL or other consultant. Football would be another vocational program (in that sense, they should be subject to smaller multipliers to account for gender imbalance like Lane, CVS and early Simeon). Or CPS could sacrifice any number of its larger boundary selective enrollment schools into the "private" pool as a quid pro for IHSA to look the other way on AUSL, Urban Prep, Noble Network.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

Something needs to be done but I don't know what. I'm sure the Catholic school backers will call me a whiner and beating a dead horse but the field is not level. I live in Cary and I get fliers to get for my kid, who doesn't play football, to attend Marian Central in Woodstock which is 13 miles away. Cary is a pissant town of 17,000 people and it's zoned for kids to go to Cary Grove, Prairie Ridge and Jacobs. How does a kid that lives 2 miles from CG end up going to Jacobs in Algonquin, 5 miles away when Marian has a reach of at least 13 miles. Hell, I know a family that sold their house in Cary just get into the CG zone. It sucks that some schools just deal with the hand they were given while others can bring in kids from miles away as long as they foot the bill. The system will never change though.

Whiner.

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

Separating Public & Private schools in the playoffs is a stupid and boring idea.

All the games would be too predictable on the outcomes. I only support a separate playoffs for the private schools if they combine it with surrounding states and come up with a Midwest HS Playoff bracket.

Just go to 6 classes with 1-32 seeding and everything is great.

Wassup

 

[chief1968]

Hell, it could be Jackie Robinson West all over again if the IHSA really wanted to look into it. But they won't.

I would back an investigation, as long as they look at the publics that recruit as well.... It's a shame that no one ever mentions that problem and everyone in the media turns a blind eye to kids that have ghost addresses in certain well known public school districts just for sports sake.

 

[WestSuburbanCatholicConference]

I think if you are public/private supporter its easy to hate the other side and cry about all the advantage the other has.

But what it comes down to is coaching and reputation.

When you look at the "Haves" when it comes to any school private or public they all have excellent coaches with a proven track record. They have instilled a culture of what is expected, so the player knows what is expected of him entering that program. It isnt that hard, it happens at college, players don't choose schools because of the school, they choose because of the coach and program.

GW just won state and Montini is in their backyard. A MAJORITY of players will stay with their public schools if they are a winning program. Same with CG, I dont see MCC soaking up all their talent. Then if you are in the Kennedy public school district, its no brainier why you want to play football at a private. Then look at LVIlle runner up to a great GW team and they have Caramel a stones throw away. Is Caramel taking all of LVille's talent? You can argue the opposite because LVille has system favorable to players, proven coach, and a program that is on the rise.

When publics complain about privates "cherry picking" players, the players that get cherry picked are programs that are usually average or below average, and no player wants to play for a bad program. Proviso West/East, LT, Kennedy, and Morton are the ones suffering the most. Maybe I missed it but I dont see that many fans/poster of Proviso, LT, and Morton on this board. In all honesty these programs need to step it up, like GW, CG, and Lville have done. If these public schools had a great coach and program on the rise would a player still choose a private school, if they knew they could just go to the public school for free and have the same success?

What the IHSA should do if they really want to limit private school success is implement more of an Unsuccessful Rule, instead of coming of with new crazy ways to limit private school success,(which doesnt work) the IHSA should increase the chances of existing average schools to win.

Has the multiplier, SF, and etc,really worked on MC, LA, BR, Montini, and Naz? No, so instead of trying to make these teams worse, try and make mediocre public schools like LT have a chance. Put LT or Proviso East in 6A, they aren't going to win 7/8A but they have a much better chance in 6A.

Schools like GW, CG, LVille, all have privates in their backyard, with Montini being one of them. Players choose programs based on past success and the coach.

-no rule whatever it is, is going slow down the "haves" of the privates
-best thing the ihsa would want to do is raise the level play at mediocre/ below average public schools.

 

[UlbKA91]

I think if you are public/private supporter its easy to hate the other side and cry about all the advantage the other has.

But what it comes down to is coaching and reputation.

When you look at the "Haves" when it comes to any school private or public they all have excellent coaches with a proven track record. They have instilled a culture of what is expected, so the players knows what is expected of him entering that program. It isnt that hard, it happens at college, players don't choose schools because of the school, they choose because of the coach and program.

GW just won state and Montini is in their backyard. A MAJORITY of players will stay with their public schools if they are a winning program. Same with CG, I dont see MCC soaking up all their talent. Then if you are in the Kennedy public school district, its no brainier why you want to play football at a private. Then look at LVIlle runner up to a great GW team and they have Caramel a stones throw away. Is Caramel taking all of LVille's talent? You can argue the opposite because LVille has system favorable to players, proven coach, and a program that is on the rise.

When publics complain about privates "cherry picking" players, the players that get cherry picked are programs are usually average or below average, and no player wants to play for a bad program. Proviso West/East, LT, Kennedy, and Morton are the ones suffering the most. Maybe I missed it but I dont see that many fans/poster of Proviso, LT, and Morton on this board. In all honesty these programs need to step it up, like GW, CG, and Lville have done. If these public schools had a great coach and program on the rise would a player still choose a private school, if they knew they could just go to the public school for free and have the same success?

What the IHSA should do if they really want to limit private school success is implement more of an Unsuccessful Rule, instead of coming of with new crazy ways to limit private school success,(which doesnt work) the IHSA should increase the chances of existing average schools to win.

Has the multiplier, SF, and etc,really worked on MC, LA, BR, Montini, and Naz? No, so instead of trying to make these teams worse, try and make mediocre public schools like LT have a chance. Put LT or Proviso East in 6A, they aren't going to win 7/8A but they have a much better chance in 6A.

Schools like GW, CG, LVille, all have privates in their backyard, with Montini being one of them. Players choose programs based on past success and the coach.

-no rule whatever it is, is going slow down the "haves" of the privates
-best thing the ihsa would want to do is raise the level play at mediocre/ below average public schools.

LT=Leyden Township (LT may mean Lyons to some, and Lane Tech to others)?

 

[greatgig13]

I just think it needs to go both ways. I get it that kids want to play for reputable programs but for private schools, it's a choice and money talks.

 

[WestSuburbanCatholicConference]

LT=Leyden Township (LT may mean Lyons to some, and Lane Tech to others)?

Lyons Township, but to my point we don't even know what school we are talking about, due to the lack of these programs success. And Lyons Township has no excuse, they could be just as good any other top public school program.

 

[mchsalumni]

for private schools, it's a choice and money talks.

What does this even mean?

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

I live in Cary and I get fliers to get for my kid, who doesn't play football, to attend Marian Central in Woodstock which is 13 miles away.

What you have said right there is proof that MCC does not recruit boys for football only. It proves that they look far and wide for students to fill their classrooms.

13 miles to go to a private school is NOTHING. When I was a student at Loyola, there were non-athletes commuting there from the south side of Chicago. Their one way trip would be 90 minutes on a couple of CTA trains and a suburban bus. Uphill both ways! (okay, that last part was hyperbole)

Here's the problem: You and your boundaried public school ilk think that the public schools are where all kids in their districts should attend. SHOULD attend. It doesn't matter if your school underperforms academically. It doesn't matter if it has 4500 students and the kids who attend there are just numbers. It doesn't matter if it is ridden with gangs or drugs. It doesn't matter if a particular kid would do better in a single gender or small school environment. It doesn't matter if parents want a religious element present in their children's education. None of that matters to you. You consider your school to be the LOGICAL choice for EVERYONE. One size fits all.

Well, guess what? The world is not one size fits all. And, thank GOD for that.

 

[mchsalumni]

What you have said right there is proof that MCC does not recruit boys for football only. It proves that they look far and wide for students to fill their classrooms.

13 miles to go to a private school is NOTHING. When I was a student at Loyola, there were non-athletes commuting there from the south side of Chicago. Their one way trip would be 90 minutes on a couple of CTA trains and a suburban bus. Uphill both ways! (okay, that last part was hyperbole)

Here's the problem: You and your boundaried public school ilk think that the public schools are where all kids in their districts should attend. SHOULD attend. It doesn't matter if your school underperforms academically. It doesn't matter if it has 4500 students and the kids who attend there are just numbers. It doesn't matter if it is ridden with gangs or drugs. It doesn't matter if a particular kid would do better in a single gender or small school environment. It doesn't matter if parents want a religious element present in their children's education. None of that matters to you. You consider your school to be the LOGICAL choice for EVERYONE. One size fits all.

Well, guess what? The world is not one size fits all. And, thank GOD for that.

Great points @ramblinman. @greatgig13, why would a private school, particularly MCC, recruit a kid who doesn't play football?

 

[PRokie]

What you have said right there is proof that MCC does not recruit boys for football only. It proves that they look far and wide for students to fill their classrooms.

13 miles to go to a private school is NOTHING. When I was a student at Loyola, there were non-athletes commuting there from the south side of Chicago. Their one way trip would be 90 minutes on a couple of CTA trains and a suburban bus. Uphill both ways! (okay, that last part was hyperbole)

Here's the problem: You and your boundaried public school ilk think that the public schools are where all kids in their districts should attend. SHOULD attend. It doesn't matter if your school underperforms academically. It doesn't matter if it has 4500 students and the kids who attend there are just numbers. It doesn't matter if it is ridden with gangs or drugs. It doesn't matter if a particular kid would do better in a single gender or small school environment. It doesn't matter if parents want a religious element present in their children's education. None of that matters to you. You consider your school to be the LOGICAL choice for EVERYONE. One size fits all.

Well, guess what? The world is not one size fits all. And, thank GOD for that.

You are Right Ramblinman!!
It's great to know that none of those things you mention EVER happen at the private schools! I think it's fair to say if the Nuns at Naz ran more of the Catholic programs a lot of these teams rosters might be different...Maybe even yours!

Kids and families should be able to go where they want! Exactly the reason I believe the publics should be able to recruit and fund these kids the same way the privates do. Give us an even playing field!

 

[greatgig13]

I suppose it's an argument I'll never win. But hey, great competitive games this past weekend.

 

[Corey90]

B

How DARE you suggest such a thing!!

Be carful guys your going to get blasted for your recruiting comments. This is a private only site if you suggest such notions it's will fire up the mass.