Here's a basketball tidbit for the board...

[DowntownDawg]

...in our run from 2002-2005, we lost a total of 4 preconference games to Cincinatti, La. Lafayette, Syracuse, and Arizona. Only Lafayette was at home. The rest were in tournament settings close to the opponent's fanbase if I am remembering correctly. In 2002, Cincinatti was a 1 seed in the tournament. Syracuse in 2005 was a 4 seed. Arizona was a 3. The only non NCAA tournament team that we lost to in that time frame was La. Lafayette. 1 hiccup in four years.

In the four years following, we lost 17 preconference games to Northwestern State, SELA, Akron, Winthrop, Clemson (twice), George Mason, Missouri, Southern Illinois, Miami (OH), Miami (FL), South Alabama, Washington State, Texas Tech, Charlotte, Cincinatti, and San Diego. Home games were NWSU, SELA, Winthrop, Clemson (once), Miami (FL), Charlotte, and San Diego. In 2006 Northwestern State was a 14 (winning the Southland with a 25-7 record). SELA and Akron didn't make it. Winthrop was an 11 seed in 2007 and only lost 4 games. Clemson, George Mason, and Missouri didn't make it. In 2008, Miami (FL) was a 7 seed and South Alabama was a 10. Clemson was a 5. Southern Illinois and Miami (OH) didn't make it. None of the 5 teams that beat us last year were tournament teams.

Add three more this season in Rider, WKU, and Richmond. Lunardi has Richmond in as a 7 with no sign of Rider or WKU.

If that holds true to form, then out of 20 preconference losses, 5 would be tournament teams. That's compared to only 1 non-tournament team in the stretch before that, out of 4 losses (and that's because Bradley Boyd was bombing us from 35 ft. all night). Think about that. From '02 - '05, we lost 4 preconfence games, and 25% of those losses were to non-tourney teams. From '06-'09, we lost 17 preconference games and 76% were to nontourney teams. WTF has happened?

What conclusions do we draw from this? I think...

1) There are definitely two distinct "eras" of State basketball in the 21st century.
2) Rick is not getting us prepared like he used to for the start of the season. Is this laziness?
3) Our talent level is comparatively down.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...in our run from 2002-2005, we lost a total of 4 preconference games to Cincinatti, La. Lafayette, Syracuse, and Arizona. Only Lafayette was at home. The rest were in tournament settings close to the opponent's fanbase if I am remembering correctly. In 2002, Cincinatti was a 1 seed in the tournament. Syracuse in 2005 was a 4 seed. Arizona was a 3. The only non NCAA tournament team that we lost to in that time frame was La. Lafayette. 1 hiccup in four years.

In the four years following, we lost 17 preconference games to Northwestern State, SELA, Akron, Winthrop, Clemson (twice), George Mason, Missouri, Southern Illinois, Miami (OH), Miami (FL), South Alabama, Washington State, Texas Tech, Charlotte, Cincinatti, and San Diego. Home games were NWSU, SELA, Winthrop, Clemson (once), Miami (FL), Charlotte, and San Diego. In 2006 Northwestern State was a 14 (winning the Southland with a 25-7 record). SELA and Akron didn't make it. Winthrop was an 11 seed in 2007 and only lost 4 games. Clemson, George Mason, and Missouri didn't make it. In 2008, Miami (FL) was a 7 seed and South Alabama was a 10. Clemson was a 5. Southern Illinois and Miami (OH) didn't make it. None of the 5 teams that beat us last year were tournament teams.

Add three more this season in Rider, WKU, and Richmond. Lunardi has Richmond in as a 7 with no sign of Rider or WKU.

If that holds true to form, then out of 20 preconference losses, 5 would be tournament teams. That's compared to only 1 non-tournament team in the stretch before that, out of 4 losses (and that's because Bradley Boyd was bombing us from 35 ft. all night). Think about that. From '02 - '05, we lost 4 preconfence games, and 25% of those losses were to non-tourney teams. From '06-'09, we lost 17 preconference games and 76% were to nontourney teams. WTF has happened?

What conclusions do we draw from this? I think...

1) There are definitely two distinct "eras" of State basketball in the 21st century.
2) Rick is not getting us prepared like he used to for the start of the season. Is this laziness?
3) Our talent level is comparatively down.

 

[sweetpapajones]

that for Stansbury to have great teams he has to have at least onesmartplayer that is a vocal leader and will jump on a teammates *** if they are slacking. I never thought about it before until he mentioned it, but the last couple of years we have been absent the on/off court leaders we used to have likeZimmerman andBowers.

With as little contact as the staff can have with them during the off-season and as busy as the staff is recruiting the off-season workouts are mainly driven by the players. They may all show up but I don't think that we have anyone on our team that will jump on somebody because the aren't blocking out in off-season scrimmages. I imagine that this has had something to do with our pre-conference problems.

I do think that Deehas the potential to be this guy

 

[Coach34]

but this difference is due to one thing- the Baylor kid shooting his teammate- therefore LR being able to transfer out and be eligible to play somewhere else- IMMEDIATELY. That situation had not happened before in college basketball history. Let's look at it:

Stansbury has 2 great seasons with Austin and crew. Austin leaves early and we are left with Big Feces as our post player with no bench. Without LR, that team is most likely not a Tourney team either season. Hello NIT. LR transferring in to be the perfect fit for those 2 teams have given some people a much higher opinion of Stansbury than what reality is.

3 seasons of no NCAA's, followed by 2 with Austin and crew, and then a couple of NIT's with Big Feces in the post in 2004 and 2005- followed by what has transpired since 2005 is definitely more on par with Stansbury's coaching ability. Getting LR in has been best thing to ever happen to Stansbury- no doubt

Yes Sheep, Stansbury gets credit for getting LR here. And it turned out to be the best recruit of his 12 year tenure. Maybe another school will have some players shoot each other so we can get another AA on our team.

 

[dawgstudent]

<p class="MsoNormal"></p>

<p class="MsoNormal">1. The troll</p><p class="MsoNormal">Need I say more? This is the only guy on the list
who goes out of his way to annoy people. Think about that, this guy is
so damn bored that he has to shake things up and piss people off to get
his jollies.</p><p class="MsoNormal">Because the troll does everything he can to be
intentionally annoying while the other four do it unintentionally, this
is the worst fan of all andgets the top spot.</p>

<p class="MsoNormal"></p>

 

[DowntownDawg]

...with or without Roberts. We would've been a much worse seed, but Bowers, Frazier, Power, et al. were good players. Plus you have Vincent in 2004. I agree that 2005 would be very iffy without LR. We were an 8 seed anyway.

No doubt that Roberts was a big part of it.

Still, why the hell do we go from basically not losing to bad teams to losing to em in droves?

 

[Coach34]

take the whole LR situation out and let Marcus Campbell be our post presence in 2004 and 2005- do you think Stansbury is looked upon in anywhere close to the same light?

 

[dawgstudent]

he has zero national championships and never looked at as a high caliber coach that can win the big one.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...and Rhodes would've been as a redshirt freshman in 2005. That's assuming he doesn't go and sign some other player. Worst case scenario, we have one less tourney appearance.

Nice try, though.

 

[Johnson85]

Still, why the hell do we go from basically not losing to bad teams to losing to em in droves?

No clue if that's related orif the timing even matches up.

 

[DowntownDawg]

However, other teams have the same situation. I think he needs a leader more than just during the off season.

 

[Coach34]

inside scoring from Campbell and Vincent would have been tough to come by. LR opened things up for Vincent, Big Feces wouldnt have opened up ****. Plus, instead of Campbell coming in for LR, you would have who, Morgan coming in for Campbell? Could you imagine Campbell playing 28-30 minutes a game?

 

[Coach34]

but as someone that has been to 13 Sweet 16's, it just capped off a great career.

LR made Stansbury's career, without him- Stansbury's career is very pedestrian

 

[dawgstudent]

but we would have been to the tourney 5 out of 8 years (I agree with Downtown that we would have made it in either 04 or 05 without LR) and won 2 SEC tourney championships. Considering our basketball history, it is far from pedestrian.

 

[BriantheDawg]

If Monta Ellis... If Jonathan Bender... If Travis Outlaw... If, if, if..... **** works both ways.

 

[Coach34]

do we get some of those recruits in 2005, 2006, 2007??

LR didnt just make Stansbury's career for those 2 years, but in the years following because of the success we had and the awards he won.

I just don't think a frontline of Campbell and Vincent with no back-ups makes an NCAA Tourney

 

[dawgstudent]

[No message]

 

[seshomoru]

If your Dad hadn't 17ed your mom, this board would be a hell of a lot better. The fact is, they knocked boots, and now we have to put up with your **** everyday.

 

[patdog]

Lawrence Roberts is no longer just responsible for any success we had the two years he was here. He's now responsible for any success we have after he's gone. Next thing you know, he'll be claiming Stans shot the Baylor guy and framed the teammate.

ETA: Damn! Now that I've given him the idea, he'll probably actually post it. We should get a pool going to see who can guess the date the closest.

 

[futaba.79]

so you'll know how ridculous this whole discussion is.

 

[Coach34]

Outlaw and Ellis were never going to attend college

 

[DowntownDawg]

nm

 

[DowntownDawg]

Gordon is the only one that amounted to anything and I think UT spurned him. I'm pretty sure we get the following without LR: the Delks, Hans, Turner, Jarvis, Benock, Bailey, Augustus, Ravern.

I really don't think any of them would tell you that Roberts was the reason they attended MSU.

 

[Coach34]

your point about the decline in our program is not missed by most people

 

[DowntownDawg]

...that said, you had a bunch of guards and it might've looked more like this year. Timmy, Winsome, Power, Harper, and a young Ervin to back up the point. We would not have been SEC champs, but we'd have squeaked in on the backs of Bowers and Frazier.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...have maintained some consistency. 10-6, 9-7, 14-2, 9-7, 5-11, 8-8, 12-4, 9-7. The preconference has killed us. We've apparently just gotten weaker along with the conference.

 

[JxnDawg39211]

whether it be Andy Kennedy, SEC basketball, the weather,restaurants,etcalways ends up in a conversation about Rick Stansbury and how he has underperformed

 

[seshomoru]

That's what I blame it on. Assistants are supposed to want to be head coaches, and I get the feeling ours have become complacent. They like where they are, and there is no threat to their job security. The entire staff has lost the edge we had back in the early 2000s. That "we're gonna prove a team from Starkville can kick your ***" attitude.

 

[seshomoru]

[No message]

 

[AdamDawgDude]

I don't know if Stans is really to blame for the Delks and Hansbro being A-holes. They would have been valuable players on this year's team. I can imagine that it is difficult to take a handful of basketball recruits and find the ones that actually want to work hard and pay their dues.

 

[Coach34]

Lawrence Roberts is no longer just responsible for any success we had the two years he was here. He's now responsible for any success we have after he's gone. Next thing you know, he'll be claiming Stans shot the Baylor guy and framed the teammate.

ETA: Damn! Now that I've given him the idea, he'll probably actually post it. We should get a pool going to see who can guess the date the closest.

has no effect on who wants to be a part of the program later on?

 

[PBRME]

I think it has to do more with Rick's recruiting strategy. We're recruiting smaller and have been since 2005. Maybe a betterway to put it wouldbe we're signing smaller players. Compare this years starting lineup to any lineup pre-2006.

One thing to note, according to the roster, JV is the same height and weight as LRoberts his JR year. Come on, really?

 

[Irondawg]

Seriously - who on our team has that "we will not lose" look in their eye? Varnado and Bost are the only ones I've seen even flash it but not consistently.

 

[AdamDawgDude]

Seriously - who on our team has that "we will not lose" look in their eye? Varnado and Bost are the only ones I've seen even flash it but not consistently.

I expect Bost to be 'that player' next year. We may actually be pretty good next year with the return of Elgin and TB.

 

[Johnson85]

He two the team two inbound plays that were passed down from player to player. Ontario Harper was the last one who knew how to run it. The additional 6 points a game we got from in bounds plays were enough to avoid the terrible upsets and by and large beat teams in the SEC. As the knowledge granted by the Greg Byrne of basketball coaches dissapated, Stansbury's teams became less and less successful.

 

[maroonmania]

Timmy Bowers, Shane Power, Lawrence Roberts, etc. versus Dee Bost, Ravern Johnson, Kodi Augustus, etc. that we have now. Hey, I'm not trying to rag on the guys currently playing but its pretty obvious to see that we have a lot of "me-first" emotionally fragile type players right now that don't have the basketball maturity of a team such as the 04 team had. Plus the guys that we have now that ARE "yes sir" kind of guys (Stewart, Varnado) are NOT the vocal leader types and so are unable to reign in some of the disgruntled types on the team. Its pretty obvious that Stans does MUCH better when he has some players that are basically coaches on the floor with team-first attitudes. But then again, I guess, what coach doesn't.

 

[Chesusdog]

I'm going to run out of pics if you keep beating this dead horse.