I had to bring this back up

diehard4dawgs

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May 23, 2006
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><span style="COLOR: black">I was reading through the pages a minute ago and found this buried in a thread from a couple of days ago. <span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>I think it warrants further discussion after Croom's comments last night.
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><span class="post-title1"><span class="post-title1"><span style="COLOR: black">I have read Guns, Germs, and Steel</span></span> <span style="COLOR: black">and I agree that MSU has inherant disadvantages. I will say however, that one thing about Croom...the one thing that should give him a longer leash than he deserves...is that he is special. Based on factors outside of our control, MSU is down in a hole that is almost impossible to climb out of. Every once in awhile, we can get a good running start and peak over the top, but we'll eventually have to face the reality that we will always fall right back in the hole.

HOWEVER, Croom gave/gives us something that gives us an unmatchable advantage over our peers. He will always, always, always be the only man who broke the color barrier in SEC football. No one can take that away from him or from MSU. IF Croom could be successful, he could propel us to the top. With some success, he would become a nationally known figurehead. 90% of the college football players in our region are black, and they (and their mommas) inherently identify and trust Croom more than his peers. He had/has the potential, with some success, to go head to head against LSU or Florida for players. He has/had the potential, with some success, to go head to head against LSU or Florida for media coverage. I don't see any other plausible scenario where that could happen at MSU.

All that said, our program is in a state of disarray. We are at a crossroads. I personally think we should consider holding onto Croom for as long as we can bear it. We will never have another opportunity like he presents. We took the same type of gamble that McCain took by choosing Palin, one that had to be taken to overcome seemingly insurmountable odds. Palin could turn out to be a giant mistake for McCain, but it sure doesn't look that way. Without her though, McCain had no chance. He threw the long ball, and right now the ball is on its way down and it looks like his receiver has the defense beat. But there's always a chance the defender could recover or his receiver could drop it.

We were in the same place when we hired Croom. We could have made the best 'traditional' hire possible and gone to two or three mediocre bowl games with more on the way. But we'd never get over that hump. He would have been Tim Pawlenty, a white, male Governor. We'd never climb out of that hole. He would just be a good coach competing against other good coaches with better fanbases, better facilities, more tradition, and more money. As soon as he had some success, he would leave to join their ranks.</span></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><span style="COLOR: black">
Anyway, enough with that analogy. I think everyone agrees that Croom being successful would be the absolute best thing for MSU, but I don't mean that in the same way Ole Miss fans may have meant it toward the end of Orgeron's tenure. I mean it such that this remains a once-in-a-generation type of opportunity for MSU football and that we should do everything we can possibly do to make it a success. Part of that will be at the end of this season. Byrne will have to convince Croom that he needs to continue to be CEO, but let other, new faces come in and innovate. While doing this, Byrne will be faced with the perhaps insurmountable task of managing Croom's pride.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><span style="COLOR: black">While I agree that Croom could be VERY successful at MSU, it is him and him alone that will not allow that to happen.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span> I am pulling for him to come around and make changes, but he is just too damn stubborn to do it.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span> He could go down in history as a great coach if he would just use his strengths and the advantages that his situation gives him.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span> Unfortunately, he has yet to realize that one of those strengths IS NOT offensive game planning.</span></p>
 

BlindDawg

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Jan 23, 2007
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I am so sick of hearing people say its in our best interest for Croom to succeed. Yes, obviously it is, but IT WILL NOT HAPPEN. We can't just sit around saying that its in our best interest while he continues to run our program into the ground. The people who continue thinking like this are as bad as Croom sticking to his offense. Oh, and the thought of Croom staying around and being a good CEO type head coach if he would just get rid of Woody and turn over control to the new OC is just as stupid. Croom makes terrible game management decisions - 4th and 15, punting from the 30, etc. There is no way in hell I want this guy being a "CEO" of our football team. He needs to go, period. Short of pulling 5 more wins out his ***, there is absolutely no concievable way I'll be happy with him having an office in the Bryan Building next year.
 

Todd4State

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Mar 3, 2008
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I think a lot of that could have happened had we hired the RIGHT AA coach, but that's just not Croom.

I still think that Croom can be a very good HC, but HE has to stop meddling with the offense and let someone else run it- just like he has done with the defense.

He seems to be hung up on trying to be an "offensive genious" but it's just not working out.
 

rebelrouseri

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Jan 24, 2007
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90% of the college football players in our region are black, and they (and their mommas) inherently identify and trust Croom more than his peers.
he never signed a top rated class or clearly defeated the big O in recruiting. Going up against LSU and UF....riiiiight.
 

RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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rebelrouseri said:
90% of the college football players in our region are black, and they (and their mommas) inherently identify and trust Croom more than his peers.
he never signed a top rated class or clearly defeated the big O in recruiting. Going up against LSU and UF....riiiiight.

By that same logic, Rod Barnes would've been a great recruiter. I know it's a different sport, but if race is that important to players, you'd think that it would show up more in recruiting than it does. If you were to make a list of things that recruits like the most about schools winning would be No. 1, and race of the head coach or the coaches on the coaching staff would be near the bottom of the list.
 

NutherT

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Oct 14, 2007
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And Rod Barnes was not making national headlines nor was he featured crying on Say it Loud.

I don't care what you say, Croom's race matters to recruits...as long as he shows that he can win. If you say otherwise, you are being a delusional homer.
 

patdog

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May 28, 2007
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He went to 3 NCAA tournaments and 1 NIT in his first 4 years at UM. There was no excuse at all that his only real recruiting success in his career was giving Wayne Brent a job so he could bring the Provine Posse to Oxford. If Croom had that kind of success in his first 4 years, we'd be pulling in top-20 classes every year.
 

was21

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May 29, 2007
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across the board with black kids. It could possibly work just the opposite. They didn't grow up seeing many black coaches win, so they may actually believe that their best bet is to sign with a proven guy, regardless of his race, but truth told, he will usually be white if he's had success. That's just the way it is, and I'm not being delusional, either.
 

rebelrouseri

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Jan 24, 2007
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which gets you to about midway up the sec recruiting totem pole and below meyer and miles. They would never have feared croom. </p>
 

BuyGuyatooth

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Mar 3, 2008
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While I think race is a factor, you're still in a small state with many of the best players unable to qualify. Winning will be a bigger factor, but all things equal between Ole Miss/State, then I think Croom would be at an advantge - moreso than Barnes was (though Stansbury still buried him in recruiting). We had about 7-10 years of Alabama not cherry-picking some of our recruits, but with the Ole Miss/State swoon Saban has been able to get his share. Race won't change that, only winning will. Even with UAB and Troy going 1A (or whatever it's called now) and South Alabama about to - the state has over 4 million people to support two SEC teams. Look at the major football programs around the state versus their respective state populations. It's a long road and a tall mountain for us (in Mississippi).

Can Ole Miss or State afford the lost revenue (from lack of ticket sales) to stick with a coach? The answer for Orgeron was easy. It was painfully obvious. But fans are short-sighted and fickle.

The older I get - the less I want to make a quick change. Many of our fans hated Cutcliffe from early on. It was a Manning-thing, in that they expected top 10 rankings, a Sugar Bowl, etc. I only wanted some changes after the Arkansas debacle in 2004, and strangley enough, Cutcliffe expressed the same resolve that Croom seems to be expressing now. If Cut would've replaced coordinators at the end of 2004, I honestly believe he'd be coaching at Ole Miss today, and I think we'd managed a winning season since then as well. Sherrill was the most successful coach at State in my lifetime, and love him or hate him (as many State fans won't agree), he took you to Atlanta (and bowl gameS) and he'd replace assistants in a heartbeat. Tubberville will do the same at Auburn. Sure, State or Ole Miss could luck out with a hire (we did with Tubberville), but frankly these jobs aren't as appealing as most of the others in the SEC. The pay is good, but less, the expectations are nearly as lofty, but without the built-in advantages in Revenue, Recruiting, and Exposure.