Illinois Central Eight thoughts

[Wilmatucky]

What are your thoughts on the ICE this year? It looks like it should be pretty tough. I'm hearing that CC is the team to beat. Lisle, Herscher, and Wilmington should all be in the hunt for a conference title as well. Should be 4 playoff teams coming out of this conference and I think all 4 would have a shot to make some noise (barring a early round matchup between the 3A teams).

Also loving CC and Wilmo's OOC games. CC will be battle tested with two teams they could see in the playoffs. Should give them an idea of where they stand. Wilmo has interesting games the first two weeks and I honestly have no idea what to expect.

I see it like this...

CC .....clear favorite.....kind of in a bad spot because north or south in playoffs they are more than likely seeing Mac/IC

Wilmo, Herscher, Lisle...... Playoff contenders.....could all beat each other any given day

Peotone, Streator, Reed Custer.........just a step below the group ahead of them

Manteno

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

ICE, ICE Baby...the opening year.

Coal City should be the favorite...they struggled last year without Skubic, but Pullera (sp?) should be ready to step into the key back shoes. Hutchings is headed for his third year as QB before he heads off to pitch at Illinois...vicious non-con schedule at Morris and Bishop Mac at home.

Wilmo has to replace Dempsay, but the Cats don't rebuild, they reload....

I have to wonder if Lisle can replace McGrath?

Can Reed Custer continue to develop on offense, and can they find a defense?

Peotone's program seems to be going in the right direction, but they sure lost a lot of talent...

Streator makes no sense. 900+ kid school in a conference where two schools are in the mid-600's and the rest of the conference is under 550 kids, yet they have shown no consistency. I used to think Hassett jumped from Prairie Central to improve his resume in hopes to return to his alma mater McNamara, where he was a state champion QB, when Zinanni retires - but at this point he's probably ruined that chance.

Herscher? Great team two years ago too small for 4A. Barely makes playoffs last year, goes to semis. Heaven only knows where they might be headed...but starting with Momence and Clifton Central means they should at least start 2-0.

Manteno will finally play a non-I8 school in the opener at Canton...and then returns to the I-8 schedule with Morris...lol. But the Panthers are likely the "surprise" of the conference this year. QB breaking his ankle week 2 doomed the season last year, and six sophs were playing key varsity roles before the soph QB had to take over - so looking at last years sophs record is very deceiving. Replacing Lopez at WR is nearly impossible, but the #2 WR was a soph. Left side of line returns (28 starts), and 90% of non-jet sweep/scramble runs were behind them - and a 240 pound soph is likely to step in on the right side (after starting both ways on the sophs as a frosh). Now if they can only find a way to stop the smashmouth run offenses like Wilmo...

 

[Coalertown44]

Interesting new conference. I still wish Plano and Sandwich were there but it is what it is.
I will give a little insight on this years Coal City Coalers. Not being biased here but they are the top of the Conference this year. Return Hutchings (QB) and Pullara (TE/LB) who have been starters since they were Sophomores. Jezik who was the premiere back when Skubic went down. They pretty much split carries after that. Returning wing back Cooper who started as a Soph last year and three returning starters on the O line. Defensively this might be the best front seven CC has had in a long time. Returning both defensive ends Jasznoz and Crawford (who has some D2 offers and is getting some FCS looks).They get Connor Best back at D line who would of started last year but broke his foot right before the first game and Junior Kyle Burch who got some reps at D End late in the season and in the playoffs last year. Jezik, Bunton and Pullara are all returning starters at LB. Where the Coalers are the least experienced is DB. Only one starter back from a very good defensive backfield last year. They will definitely be tested the first two weeks of the season but having that front 7 will help them a great deal.
If CC can win the first two then I believe they will go undefeated in the regular season. Mac is the big test since Morris looks like they have lost quite a bit from last year.
I think Wilmington will be better than last year, Herscher will be in the mix after their great playoff run. Manteno will be a playoff contender, they played a lot of underclassmen last year and will hang around. Coach Tolly has created a really good program over there and continues to be consistent in winning. RC took a step last year in the right direction but not sure what kind of athletes they have. And Streator and Lisle just wont compete much this year.

 

[Wilmatucky]

Good discussion so far........Outside of CC/Wilmo/RC I don't have a ton of knowledge on the other teams so I was just making educated guesses.

Lisle- Giving a little bit of their toughness due to their home field advantage. I do know that Wilmo does not like playing at Benedictine when they go to Lisle and I'm sure the other teams feel the same. It's a hard place to play. I remember when we played Lisle it was at like a city park or something? They didn't have lights I know that.

Herscher- Have been tough lately but I truly feel that their playoff run was a lucky draw.

Not sure about Manteno....they should improve but are the other teams still just too good

I actually think if RC gets the athletes out and they stay out of trouble that they will be a semi-tough team. Same as Manteno though.....are the other teams still too good?

I wouldn't mind Plano or Sandwich still being in, but I do like the ability to play OOC games. I was never a fan of the small/large split with crossovers.

The teams that make playoffs should be in a good spot, but like I said previously CC will have a tough road. I think 3A has the most parity of the lowest four classes. Wilmo/Lisle/Herscher all had potential for a long run.....I'm not complaining though.....it makes it more fun!

 

[Coalertown44]

I'm, still a little stunned that CC and Mac have never played before. You would of thought that they would of hooked up at some point in the past.

 

[Coalertown44]

Prediction
1-CC
2- Wilmington
3- Peotone
4- Manteno
5- Herscher
6- Lisle
7- RC
8- Streator

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

To chase another thread, what are the freshman levels looking like for the fall? Had a conversation with Manteno's stud 6'3", 220 frosh's dad over the weekend. His son is worried about whether or not there will be enough freshmen to field a frosh team, as the daily frosh core is only 10 kids...The numbers should pick up...A couple sophs are already moved up to Varsity, and his son very well might go up (wrestler, 3x middle school state shot qualifier who anchored 4 x 200 relay- reminds me of a young Nick Nasti...). His son has regularly been kicking off into the end zone for a couple years as well (and having to run directly off the field as a striper in youth league)- so I don't see him playing down because of that kicking talent.

 

[Coalertown44]

To chase another thread, what are the freshman levels looking like for the fall? Had a conversation with Manteno's stud 6'3", 220 frosh's dad over the weekend. His son is worried about whether or not there will be enough freshmen to field a frosh team, as the daily frosh core is only 10 kids...The numbers should pick up...A couple sophs are already moved up to Varsity, and his son very well might go up (wrestler, 3x middle school state shot qualifier who anchored 4 x 200 relay- reminds me of a young Nick Nasti...). His son has regularly been kicking off into the end zone for a couple years as well (and having to run directly off the field as a striper in youth league)- so I don't see him playing down because of that kicking talent.

Coal City has around 25 Freshman I believe. Pretty much been our typical Freshman numbers the last few years, we have been fortunate. If he needs a Freshman team to play on, I know of some houses for sale in Coal City

 

[Coalertown44]

But I have been told that a few teams have indicated that they don't have enough Fresh to field a team. Lisle and Herscher if I remember correctly

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

But I have been told that a few teams have indicated that they don't have enough Fresh to field a team. Lisle and Herscher if I remember correctly

I figure that part of the new conference was driven by programs, highlighted by Westmont, who were not being overly honest about their numbers and whether they were going to have every level...I know Wilmo was not happy when Westmont either cancelled the day of or just didn't bother to show...If they don't have enough kids, let the opponent know so they can schedule somebody else in the same position - Wilmo played Bradley's freshmen one year, and watching 80 Boilers stream onto the field was intimidating...the tables were turned, as Wilmo had 35ish frosh that year and conference opponents were averaging upper teens...

 

[Wilmatucky]

What are the Wilmo freshman numbers like this year? I haven't talked to any of the coaches yet this year

 

[DHS2018]

Was told Herscher has 15 freshmen out...

As for varsity, I think the Tigers are going to be down for a few years in all programs.. they have had a great 12-13 year run from before the Ruckmans until that great class two years ago, but the talent pool is really thin right now.. 2018-19 was a weird year, talent was down but still had semi-final football run and made it to the sectional title game in baseball despite being 5-4 and well below .500 in baseball..

 

[Wilmatucky]

Was told Herscher has 15 freshmen out...

As for varsity, I think the Tigers are going to be down for a few years in all programs.. they have had a great 12-13 year run from before the Ruckmans until that great class two years ago, but the talent pool is really thin right now.. 2018-19 was a weird year, talent was down but still had semi-final football run and made it to the sectional title game in baseball despite being 5-4 and well below .500 in baseball..

IMO 3A as a whole was pretty weak. Herscher also had a great draw. If you don't want to call it weak lets call it parity. That being said, it may be what's best for keeping it interesting. Without IC there was no clear favorite.

 

[DHS2018]

IMO 3A as a whole was pretty weak. Herscher also had a great draw. If you don't want to call it weak lets call it parity. That being said, it may be what's best for keeping it interesting. Without IC there was no clear favorite.

I thought the teams we beat in 2016, 2017 and 2018 were all pretty even, difference was that 4A had a team that recruits the entire city of Chicago and the other was a school of 900, while 3A was schools of around 400 so the top tier wasn't at good..

 

[jwarigaku]

Come on DHS last 5 years were good 2 were really good, however from 2001-2013 the team was 48-74 with 4 qualifying years and all but one of those ending in a first round loss and the other in round two.

Was told Herscher has 15 freshmen out...

As for varsity, I think the Tigers are going to be down for a few years in all programs.. they have had a great 12-13 year run from before the Ruckmans until that great class two years ago, but the talent pool is really thin right now.. 2018-19 was a weird year, talent was down but still had semi-final football run and made it to the sectional title game in baseball despite being 5-4 and well below .500 in baseball..

 

[DHS2018]

Come on DHS last 5 years were good 2 were really good, however from 2001-2013 the team was 48-74 with 4 qualifying years and all but one of those ending in a first round loss and the other in round two.

Key words there "in all programs", I feel pretty confident saying Herscher has had the best overall athletic program in the conference since they joined.. Right now, doesn't seem like the athletic talent is there..

 

[jwarigaku]

Okay DHS, it’s a football board so I’m football focused as you know. I can’t and won’t argue over other sports but the football program to me always will speak loudest.

Key words there "in all programs", I feel pretty confident saying Herscher has had the best overall athletic program in the conference since they joined.. Right now, doesn't seem like the athletic talent is there..

 

[Wilmatucky]

Okay DHS, it’s a football board so I’m football focused as you know. I can’t and won’t argue over other sports but the football program to me always will speak loudest.

110%.....football moves the needle the most. Same with any D1 college. It’s what matters most.

 

[Wilmatucky]

And I don’t mean that as a slam. I honestly couldn’t tell you aside from CC being good at wrestling and baseball how good any other school is at a given sport.

 

[Wilmatucky]

I thought the teams we beat in 2016, 2017 and 2018 were all pretty even, difference was that 4A had a team that recruits the entire city of Chicago and the other was a school of 900, while 3A was schools of around 400 so the top tier wasn't at good..

Herscher was a semi final team and Wilmo darn near clocked them. Herscher beat Monmouth-Roseville in quarters and Wilmo lost to them in a pretty evenly matched game.

Some call it parity. Some call it weak.

 

[mc140]

Key words there "in all programs", I feel pretty confident saying Herscher has had the best overall athletic program in the conference since they joined.. Right now, doesn't seem like the athletic talent is there..

Yeah Basketball wise the only team I personally saw that was worse than Herscher last year was Wilmington.

 

[DHS2018]

Herscher was a semi final team and Wilmo darn near clocked them. Herscher beat Monmouth-Roseville in quarters and Wilmo lost to them in a pretty evenly matched game.

Some call it parity. Some call it weak.

Herscher was missing their 3 best linemen and two other starters when they played Wilmington..

 

[DHS2018]

110%.....football moves the needle the most. Same with any D1 college. It’s what matters most.

Is that really true in 2019? We are losing programs, to either coops or 8 man football, I think within 10 years very few schools with fewer than 300 kids have regular 11 man football teams..

 

[Wilmatucky]

Yeah Basketball wise the only team I personally saw that was worse than Herscher last year was Wilmington.

It’s funny to me how bad we are at basketball. I feel like I hear we have a new coach every theee years or so.

 

[Coalertown44]

It’s funny to me how bad we are at basketball. I feel like I hear we have a new coach every theee years or so.

We know that feeling

 

[Wilmatucky]

Is that really true in 2019? We are losing programs, to either coops or 8 man football, I think within 10 years very few schools with fewer than 300 kids have regular 11 man football teams..

Not talking about losing programs. I’m Talking about what do people show up to watch, talk about at the water cooler, pay money to support, watch on tv, etc. Football isn’t going anywhere in terms of popularity.

 

[DHS2018]

Not talking about losing programs. I’m Talking about what do people show up to watch, talk about at the water cooler, pay money to support, watch on tv, etc. Football isn’t going anywhere in terms of popularity.

Sure about that? If I think about playoff attendance in football in the Kankakee area, crowds are a lot smaller now than they were 20 years ago..

 

[Wilmatucky]

Sure about that? If I think about playoff attendance in football in the Kankakee area, crowds are a lot smaller now than they were 20 years ago..

Is basketball attendance up then? Kids might go to less school activities across the board, but if football was on top, then it still should be now.

I’m not making an arguement about then vs. now for football. I’m saying football is the most popular sport to watch. High school, college, and pro. The numbers are there to support it.

 

[jwarigaku]

DHS,

The state of Illinois has documented population losses of about 700,000 inhabitants in that same time frame, and they’re not just leaving Chicagoland.

Sure about that? If I think about playoff attendance in football in the Kankakee area, crowds are a lot smaller now than they were 20 years ago..

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

Sure about that? If I think about playoff attendance in football in the Kankakee area, crowds are a lot smaller now than they were 20 years ago..

Manteno's football attendance is infinitely better than it was 20 years ago...

Key words there "in all programs", I feel pretty confident saying Herscher has had the best overall athletic program in the conference since they joined.. Right now, doesn't seem like the athletic talent is there..

Herscher built an athletic program that demanded success for years as the biggest school in the KVC & RVC...they were the near 700 student school, flirting with going AA, in a conference where nobody else was over 500 students. They have two middle schools still, so their freshman teams have example 10 kids who started in junior high hoops - a huge advantage (and in my day they had three middle schools).

Football brought them to the I-8 after years of being a football nomad, like Peotone. They were the second biggest school when they joined, after Sandwich. But the field caught up to them. They no longer have 200+ more kids than everyone else, so the playing field leveled some. And now their enrollment has dropped 150+ kids. At some point the great depth that measured Tiger teams for years will be gone...and you are starting to see it now. It will be harder for them to have football and soccer teams that will be capable of deep playoff runs every year, much less state championship quality cross country teams..

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

Is that really true in 2019? We are losing programs, to either coops or 8 man football, I think within 10 years very few schools with fewer than 300 kids have regular 11 man football teams..

In an interesting twist, athough not directly football related, Kankakee Grace Christian announced that it is leaving the Christian school arena and headed for the IESA this fall and the IHSA for 20-21. Manteno used to play Grace in basketball & baseball every year before joining the I-8. I suspect Grace will seek to join the RVC, since it plays most of those schools already...and Crete Illinois Lutheran is already a member.

Sports isn't driving this move according to the Daily Journal. The opportunity for music contests, speech, chess, academic bowl etc. is a bigger factor. And apparently it will be a bigger change at the junior high level, as their junior high kids were playing on the high school jv squads...

I have to wonder if Kankakee Trinity is going to follow.

I think this shows that the small schools are not going to completely go away. I believe that you will see some more schools go 8 man and perhaps some co-ops, but I also think the districts issues needs to settle first. Realistically, I look at the swath south of Kankakee to Champaign/Danville and think that most of the consolidation of districts is over except for a couple near Danville. I don't see putting kids on a school bus for an hour and a half in the morning going to school and another 1 1/2 hours going home, and the next round of consolidation would probably require that...

 

[Wilmatucky]

In an interesting twist, athough not directly football related, Kankakee Grace Christian announced that it is leaving the Christian school arena and headed for the IESA this fall and the IHSA for 20-21. Manteno used to play Grace in basketball & baseball every year before joining the I-8. I suspect Grace will seek to join the RVC, since it plays most of those schools already...and Crete Illinois Lutheran is already a member.

Sports isn't driving this move according to the Daily Journal. The opportunity for music contests, speech, chess, academic bowl etc. is a bigger factor. And apparently it will be a bigger change at the junior high level, as their junior high kids were playing on the high school jv squads...

I have to wonder if Kankakee Trinity is going to follow.

I think this shows that the small schools are not going to completely go away. I believe that you will see some more schools go 8 man and perhaps some co-ops, but I also think the districts issues needs to settle first. Realistically, I look at the swath south of Kankakee to Champaign/Danville and think that most of the consolidation of districts is over except for a couple near Danville. I don't see putting kids on a school bus for an hour and a half in the morning going to school and another 1 1/2 hours going home, and the next round of consolidation would probably require that...

Don’t get me started on Junior high conferences......

 

[DHS2018]

Manteno's football attendance is infinitely better than it was 20 years ago...



Herscher built an athletic program that demanded success for years as the biggest school in the KVC & RVC...they were the near 700 student school, flirting with going AA, in a conference where nobody else was over 500 students. They have two middle schools still, so their freshman teams have example 10 kids who started in junior high hoops - a huge advantage (and in my day they had three middle schools).

Football brought them to the I-8 after years of being a football nomad, like Peotone. They were the second biggest school when they joined, after Sandwich. But the field caught up to them. They no longer have 200+ more kids than everyone else, so the playing field leveled some. And now their enrollment has dropped 150+ kids. At some point the great depth that measured Tiger teams for years will be gone...and you are starting to see it now. It will be harder for them to have football and soccer teams that will be capable of deep playoff runs every year, much less state championship quality cross country teams..

Not that its a big deal, but Herscher has only one middle school...

And not sure of your other points, they were amongst the larger 2A schools for many years just like they currently are.. we are just in a dry spell for a few years.. the one that really surprises me is basketball, we had what seemed like a 30 year run of success, but since that group about 6 years ago we are a .500 program..

 

[DHS2018]

In an interesting twist, athough not directly football related, Kankakee Grace Christian announced that it is leaving the Christian school arena and headed for the IESA this fall and the IHSA for 20-21. Manteno used to play Grace in basketball & baseball every year before joining the I-8. I suspect Grace will seek to join the RVC, since it plays most of those schools already...and Crete Illinois Lutheran is already a member.

Sports isn't driving this move according to the Daily Journal. The opportunity for music contests, speech, chess, academic bowl etc. is a bigger factor. And apparently it will be a bigger change at the junior high level, as their junior high kids were playing on the high school jv squads...

I have to wonder if Kankakee Trinity is going to follow.

I think this shows that the small schools are not going to completely go away. I believe that you will see some more schools go 8 man and perhaps some co-ops, but I also think the districts issues needs to settle first. Realistically, I look at the swath south of Kankakee to Champaign/Danville and think that most of the consolidation of districts is over except for a couple near Danville. I don't see putting kids on a school bus for an hour and a half in the morning going to school and another 1 1/2 hours going home, and the next round of consolidation would probably require that...

But I can see districts like Donovan and Tri-Point being split up like RUCE was back in the 80's..

 

[PanthersWildcats86]

Not that its a big deal, but Herscher has only one middle school....

The Daily Journal's abandonment of the smaller town news is rendering it more and more useless...Reviewing the IESA site indicates my stepson played Herscher Limestone in 3A hoops regionals in 12 & 13, while Herscher JHS was 2A...then in 14 Herscher disappears and Herscher Limestone jumped to 4A...Mea culpa, Herscher has been one middle school program since 2014...But the talent drop now matches going to one middle school...

 

[DHS2018]

The Daily Journal's abandonment of the smaller town news is rendering it more and more useless...Reviewing the IESA site indicates my stepson played Herscher Limestone in 3A hoops regionals in 12 & 13, while Herscher JHS was 2A...then in 14 Herscher disappears and Herscher Limestone jumped to 4A...Mea culpa, Herscher has been one middle school program since 2014...But the talent drop now matches going to one middle school...

It was little before 2014.. was when my daughter went into 5th grade, she is going to be a junior this year... I just think we have 3 classes in a row with less talent, back into the freshmen class and junior highs its better.. And part of that is this is a weird senior class, 6 or 7 kids that should be playing football are not, strange considering the success in the program last 4-5 years