Isn't a motion offense supposed to have, you know, motion?

[Columbus Dawg]

From Locke's blog:

Q: What is the problem with the <span class="caps">MSU</span> basketball team's offense? People just stand around, is that by design?</p>

A: As I wrote in today's Journal, there has been a lack of energy among the Bulldogs. But they <span style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"><font color="#000000">found something</font></span> against Old Dominion last Saturday. It was interesting what Dee Bost told me last night about his offensive output (12.8 ppg, 48.5% from 3-point range): "It seems like our offense is kind of stagnant; we're just standing around. I just try to, when the shot clock gets low, go make plays." I'll have a feature on Bost in tomorrow's Journal.</p>

 

[Columbus Dawg]

From Locke's blog:

Q: What is the problem with the <span class="caps">MSU</span> basketball team's offense? People just stand around, is that by design?</p>

A: As I wrote in today's Journal, there has been a lack of energy among the Bulldogs. But they <span style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"><font color="#000000">found something</font></span> against Old Dominion last Saturday. It was interesting what Dee Bost told me last night about his offensive output (12.8 ppg, 48.5% from 3-point range): "It seems like our offense is kind of stagnant; we're just standing around. I just try to, when the shot clock gets low, go make plays." I'll have a feature on Bost in tomorrow's Journal.</p>

 

[Coach34]

I seriously hope the sheep on here realize that in a "motion" offense there should be constant movement and each player always has somewhere to go at all times...

Yet we just stand around alot- now you tell me:

How well-coached is a team that stands around in a motion offense?</p>

 

[GoToHellOleMiss.sixpack]

that Stans felt the day after the Egg Bowl when he realized that he is now the "weakest link". Just a couple of years ago folks were saying, "well, at least we have Stans".....now the magnification is turning up on the microscope.

It's a shame too.....all he had to do was beat Rider and Richmond. Seems easy enough. If our first loss had been Missouri people would be understanding. And I can't believe he's still singing the "team chemistry" song. How many returning players do you have to have before you can't use the "chemistry" excuse?

Peaches may be douche......but I think he's right about Stans.

 

[ckDOG]

Our guards generally suck at penetration. Largely because they all weigh about a buck-fiddy.

Here's the logic of our genius offense:

- Pass around perimeter for at least 10 seconds.
- Stop passing.
- Are you Phil Turner? Yes - turn ball over. No - look for Varnado.
- Is Varnado open? Yes - lob, pray. No - shoot 3.

 

[SallyStansbury]

It is sad to me that we lack set plays to get the ball in to Jarvis or plays to free up Kodi.

Or even set screens to free up Ravern or whomever.

I have seen a single timing play where we rush down the court and fire it in to Jarvis quickly. That play worked pretty well. Other than that, not much happening.

So now Dee gets to "Create" with time running out....nice. He can't do any worse than Barry or Ravern.

If Coach Stans won only 16 games this season and was required to replace both Cunningham and Kirby, (assuming with someone who was a bench coach) would this be like Coach Sherrill's last hoo-rah when he brought in has-beens for his last year??....or might that work?

 

[maroonmania]

we are pacing ourselves and conserving energy so that we will be fresh at the end of games and be able to pull them out as demonstrated in the Richmond game. Oh wait a minute, never mind.

 

[markymark.sixpack]

or a good one even. as a matter of fact, i've always said the opposite in my circles. my question is this: who do we get that's better? who will be better and actually stay? if we get a good floor coach that can't recruit MS like Stans (and even nationally, but you KNOW he is going to get the majority of the best MS has to offer on a yearly basis), then what is the net result? there's a good chance if we get rid of him that we will go in the crapper for awhile, or even worse start a cycle of being in the crapper most years but good every once in awhile. there is a slim chance that we will find somebody who will keep us at least as competitive as we are and take us past the 2'nd round every once in awhile. it's a huge gamble, and is it worth it just to go to the sweet 16 or elite 8 once every 5 or 10 years? Stans may have a low ceiling, but, damn, he has a high "floor" too.

 

[Hanmudog]

Our defense has sucked monkey balls. I have no idea what happened to our half court trap that we used to employ. It generated turnovers which led to easy baskets.

 

[Coach34]

Our defense has sucked monkey balls. I have no idea what happened to our half court trap that we used to employ. It generated turnovers which led to easy baskets.

the head coach is in charge of that. He knows what happened to it

 

[Coach34]

Florida hired Billy Donovan, Georgia hired Tubby Smith, Mississippi hired Andy Kennedy (and before you give me any crap. let me remind you Stansbury didnt make it to the NCAA's his 1st 3 years...not to mention Kennedy is on pace to become their all-time winningest coach in 5 years), Vandy hired Stallings, Duke hired Sha-chef-sky, Indiana hired Bobby Knight, and so on and so on...

 

[Columbus Dawg]

I think Anthony Grant is going to make them the team to beat in the West sooner rather than later.

 

[Johnson85]

Florida hired Billy Donovan, Georgia hired Tubby Smith, Mississippi hired Andy Kennedy (and before you give me any crap. let me remind you Stansbury didnt make it to the NCAA's his 1st 3 years...not to mention Kennedy is on pace to become their all-time winningest coach in 5 years), Vandy hired Stallings, Duke hired Sha-chef-sky, Indiana hired Bobby Knight, and so on and so on...

Fair enough. So who should we go get? We definitely shouldn't get rid of Stansbury without a good idea of who we are going to get to replace him. I don't keep up with college basketball enough to know, but what close to sure thing coach is out there that we should be able to get. To be an upgrade, it needs to be somebody with X's and O's and also needs to have an experienced bag man. Also, preferably it would not be somebody with a clear tie to a school that would grab him if he did well. So who would that be this year?

 

[Hanmudog]

The same way Arkansas hired Pelphrey, Kentucky hired Gillespie, Arkansas hired Stan Heath, etc. Also becoming the all time winningest coach is not exactly a huge accomplishment.

On another note Coach, did you or did you not praise Les Miles for being LSU's winningest coach, recruiting well, and winning at a place where others have failed? Does that sound familiar to you at all?

For the record, I do not think Stansbury is a great coach. In fact he has done a poor job so far this season. He needs to pick it up. However, the level of success that he has been able to have at MSU is unequaled and I am just not willing to get rid of a successful coach on a gamble that maybe we could get an even more successful coach. For every good hire there is a bad hire and I do not want to go back to the basketball hell we endured for 25 years prior to 1990.

 

[markymark.sixpack]

there are waaaay more examples of terrible hires by schools of our stature than good ones. Donovan is the huge exception, not the rule. face it, MSU isn't a huge draw. before rich williams, we had one good era. We are in our 2'nd, and it has been long and consistent and it's thanks to RW and Stans BOTH...like it or not, it's true.

Oh yeah, kennedy is very unproven so far, so you really need to quit using him as an example. tubby didn't STAY at UGA, one of my main points. So you have stallings (who is decent, but by no means great) and Donovan. So we're basically looking for the next Donovan. Good luck to us.

Here's how great of a draw we are (all time SEC records):

• University of Kentucky 823-217 (.791)
• University of Alabama 674-495 (.577)
• University of Arkansas 123-97 (.559)
• University of Tennessee 598-480 (.555)
• Vanderbilt University 574-530 (.520)
• <font style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: #980202! important; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color="#980202"><span class="kLink" style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: #980202! important; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">LSU</span></font> 572-550 (.510)
• Auburn University 521-593 (.468)
• University of Florida 486-569 (.461)
• Mississippi State University 491-645 (.432)
• University of Georgia 450-650 (.409)
• University of South Carolina 91-133 (.406)
• University of Mississippi 405-710 (.363)

 

[8dog]

has to be about hiring/firing or finding a feasible alternative.

As to the original topic, its nothing new that we stand around on offense. Watch many of the teams that come on tv--their motion is far better than ours. It doesn't take NBA talent to keep people moving, set screens, balance the floor, run an occastional set, etc.

 

[Coach34]

Les Miles is one win away from having his 4th 10 win season in 5 years...that's more than State has in it's entire history...and he is doing it in the basketball equivalent of the Big East...I'd have to say New Years Day Bowl = Sweet 16 at least... We have had a good basketball program fir the last 20 years...what we did in the 70's and 80's no longer matter- ask Fla St football right now if the past matters... Based on our last 20 years and 9 NCAA appearances, we should be able to expect to have a great season every few years... If I named another school that stood around in their motion offense and didn't practice Zone offense before their first game, you would call for that coach to be fired and you know it

 

[Rezpup]

Do we gamble away that high floor? That crystallizes the whole Stansbury debate. I change my mind every other day during basketball season.

 

[bulldawg225]

We all have watched Stans teams over the years. His X's & O's are horrible and he shuffles players in & out like a deck of cards. Codi complained earlier this year about not getting enough playing time to find a rhythm. As an ex-player (hs & college), I know what Augustus is saying about enough time to get into a rhythm or groove. Especially in basketball, team chemistry is very important. I've seen Turner or Stewart go 4-4 and Stans subs for them. IF they are out of shape, then that's on the coach. If not, then leave them in. How can you have team chemistry when you might be playing with 4 different guys every 5 minutes?
Stans substitutes players in a game like playing musical chairs. That's one of the reasons they will fill the nets up and 10 minutes later can't hit their butt with a handful of rice. I love Stans as a recruiter, but if ur a recruit, you better know that your playing time will be limited during each game. Stans is the "Orgeron" of college basketvball....A hell of a recruiter, but a crappy coach.

 

[SallyStansbury]

From the Ninja's perspective:

Not to argue the get rid of vs keep Coach Stans thing to death, but isn't the Hump sold out, aren't we currently building a really nice practice facility? Fans around here seem to be, for the most part, quite pleased with where we are as a program.

If Stans somehow made it to the Final 4 or we got a new coach who could then what, raise ticket prices, build sky box suites?? We seem to have a pretty decent revenue stream rolling in...would Greg be an idiot to mess with it if it isn't broken?

To repeat myself: Barry and Ravern are pussies. Benock and Jarvis trend that way, especially when they are all on the court together. Phil, Dee, and Kodi need to be on the floor at the same time. The person in charge of weight training for our basketball team should be fired.

 

[maroonmania]

is that normally with our staff they are always preset. In other words, it doesn't matter if someone is blistering the nets or if they are stinking up the joint, either way, they will still come out at the preset time. Stans very seldom uses the "feel" or flow of the game to dictate who stays in and who comes out. This philosophy is a killer to game management. If a guy is on a hot streak DON'T sit him down right then just because it was preplanned.

 

[Johnson85]

From the Ninja's perspective:

Not to argue the get rid of vs keep Coach Stans thing to death, but isn't the Hump sold out, aren't we currently building a really nice practice facility? Fans around here seem to be, for the most part, quite pleased with where we are as a program.

If Stans somehow made it to the Final 4 or we got a new coach who could then what, raise ticket prices, build sky box suites?? We seem to have a pretty decent revenue stream rolling in...would Greg be an idiot to mess with it if it isn't broken?

To repeat myself: Barry and Ravern are pussies. Benock and Jarvis trend that way, especially when they are all on the court together. Phil, Dee, and Kodi need to be on the floor at the same time. The person in charge of weight training for our basketball team should be fired.

Isn't the Ninja keeping Stansbury's contract at the max number of years? Unless the buyout is tiny, I'd guess that means the Ninja is content with where the basketball program is as of right now.

 

[AROB44]

Strongly second that motion !!!</p>

 

[gravedigger]

wanting stans to be fired.

Do you think that is the route or not?

If yes, considering what another poster just said, what coach can we get at State that will IMPROVE upon the unacceptable success that Stans has had?

I'm with you that he is not coaching the team well at times. But to change, it's only worth it if you think you can better your situation.
Moderate success not being good enough is a fine and worthy thing to preach. But a lack of a better alternative means you hold what you have until there is someone out there willing to take the job that can do it better. A gamble isnt good enough. This one needs to be a ringer or it can throw us back to the early 80's with Jim Hatfield or Bob Boyd.

 

[Hanmudog]

Les Miles is one win away from having his 4th 10 win season in 5 years...that's more than State has in it's entire history...and he is doing it in the basketball equivalent of the Big East...I'd have to say New Years Day Bowl = Sweet 16 at least... We have had a good basketball program fir the last 20 years...what we did in the 70's and 80's no longer matter- ask Fla St football right now if the past matters... Based on our last 20 years and 9 NCAA appearances, we should be able to expect to have a great season every few years... If I named another school that stood around in their motion offense and didn't practice Zone offense before their first game, you would call for that coach to be fired and you know it

Stansbury has a pretty nice little string of 20+ win seasons going himself at a place that has over the last 40-50 years been one of the hardest places to win in the SEC. Miles is doing it at a place where 10 wins should be the norm. And don't give me that **** about basketball having longer seasons now because football does too.
And your example sucks too. I don't give a damn about how someone else runs their offense or defense as long as they win. Is that not the whole point? Coaches that don't win get fired. It is pretty simple. Stansbury wins, he stays. He loses then Byrne will get rid of him. Like I said earlier, Stansbury has done a poor job this year but you ***** even when we have won over the years. Besides maybe winning one game more in the NCAA tournament, exactly WTF do you think another coach would have done better?

 

[gravedigger]

I'm not adverse to the idea that you have higher coaching expectations than Stans, but man up and take it to another level or put a sock in it.

 

[Coach34]

wanting stans to be fired.

Do you think that is the route or not?

If yes, considering what another poster just said, what coach can we get at State that will IMPROVE upon the unacceptable success that Stans has had?

I'm with you that he is not coaching the team well at times. But to change, it's only worth it if you think you can better your situation.
Moderate success not being good enough is a fine and worthy thing to preach. But a lack of a better alternative means you hold what you have until there is someone out there willing to take the job that can do it better. A gamble isnt good enough. This one needs to be a ringer or it can throw us back to the early 80's with Jim Hatfield or Bob Boyd.

I do want him fired. There is no excuse for a college basketball coach- especially in a top conference, to not work on zone offense before the first game. That shows someone that is completely unprepared. Players that stand around in a motion offense- unprepared. Its the same story year after year. There is a reason Stansbury is never mentioned for top jobs when they come open.

We will never get back to the days of Hatfield or Boyd. We put too much money in basketball now. We pay in the top 1/3 of the country. We are building an indoor practice facility. We have been a solid program for the last 20 years. We are a much more attractive job than we were when Richard Williams took over. Not to mention coaches will look at the fact Stansbury was here for at least 12 years and never made a Sweet 16- the job security here is much better than at other schools.

No matter the situation, hiring another coach doesnt guarantee anything- good or bad. I personally, am willing to take that chance. I know others arent- and thats understandable. Some people want the safe play- instead of chancing greatness. Gillespie is the perfect example- could win at A&M, but struggled at Kentucky. And its way harder to win at A&M than it is at Kentucky. But I do trust the Ninja. He is 2 for 2 so far

 

[Boomerdog15]

I don't know if we could get him now, but I would love to get Mike Anderson from Missouri. I love his style of play and I think he's a really good coach, he took UAB to the sweet 16 and already got Missouri to the Elite 8. I was at the game when when we beat UAB at the buzzer in 03. After a couple years of watching stans under achieve in the tournament I told my dad I wish we would go after Anderson while he was still at UAB. Might not be able to pull him from Missouri, but he is from Alabama so if we threw enough money at him we might have a shot.