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Just to add to the Freshman numbers talk...

A

Anon1754760634

All-American
May 29, 2001
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Was able to talk with over 20 HC's last night at Maine West and I mentioned overall freshman numbers to all of them.

Coaches overwhelmingly said overall numbers will be way down....and more and more4 serious talk about just three levels of football in varsity JV and freshman level.

Not good.
 
S

septon34

Junior
Jul 12, 2012
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EdgyTim said:
Was able to talk with over 20 HC's last night at Maine West and I mentioned overall freshman numbers to all of them.

Coaches overwhelmingly said overall numbers will be way down....and more and more4 serious talk about just three levels of football in varsity JV and freshman level.

Not good.
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Do you mean there will only be two levels of football -- varsity and JV? As opposed to the current set-up where there are 3 levels of Varsity, Sophs, and Frosh.
 
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JCHillmen

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septon34 said:
Do you mean there will only be two levels of football -- varsity and JV? As opposed to the current set-up where there are 3 levels of Varsity, Sophs, and Frosh.
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Well right now some big schools have 4....frosh, soph, varsity, and then JV for some of the varsity guys who didn't get time on Friday night and some sophs. I believe the suggestion many of the coaches have is to eliminate the soph game and make it a JV game. So you would have a frosh game, varsity game, and a JV game for the sophomores and upperclassmen that did not play in the varsity game. Essentially it is making the "sophomore" game a "JV" game and opening it up to all sophomores and the juniors/seniors who didn't play a whole lot.
 
A

Anon1754760634

All-American
May 29, 2001
76,845
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Also yes most have four levels freshmen sophs JV and Varsity....several school looking to eliminate soph level football so you are left with Varsity JV and freshmen
 
S

septon34

Junior
Jul 12, 2012
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JCHillmen said:
Well right now some big schools have 4....frosh, soph, varsity, and then JV for some of the varsity guys who didn't get time on Friday night and some sophs. I believe the suggestion many of the coaches have is to eliminate the soph game and make it a JV game. So you would have a frosh game, varsity game, and a JV game for the sophomores and upperclassmen that did not play in the varsity game. Essentially it is making the "sophomore" game a "JV" game and opening it up to all sophomores and the juniors/seniors who didn't play a whole lot.
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Thank you for the clarification. I wonder if they will soon have only 2 levels -- JV (comprised of frosh and sophs only) and Varsity. Very depressing but I totally understand why parents don't want their boys playing football.
 
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jwarigaku

All-Conference
Jan 30, 2006
4,199
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I've said it before, outside of Illinois, Sophomore football is a foreign concept. Welcome to the rest of the country guys.

septon34 said:
Thank you for the clarification. I wonder if they will soon have only 2 levels -- JV (comprised of frosh and sophs only) and Varsity. Very depressing but I totally understand why parents don't want their boys playing football.
Click to expand...
 
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Wild_Mustang

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Jul 30, 2010
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USD24

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May 29, 2001
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jwarigaku said:
PJJP,

So were you exaggerating about the 50 freshmen at camp or did 20 figure out the pending extinction?
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For the record, the "schematically extinct" offense you like to criticize so often has put up an average of 30.5 pts per game against Naz over their last four meetings.
 
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I

illini14

Sophomore
Jun 12, 2014
468
117
0
USD24 said:
For the record, the "schematically extinct" offence you like to criticize so often has put up an average of 30.5 pts per game against Naz over their last four meetings.
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Some would argue the offense is extinct. I would argue its the defense. The refusal to move guys out of the box on defense has really hurt them against spread teams.
 
J

jwarigaku

All-Conference
Jan 30, 2006
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USD24,

I want to say to start this I have respect for JCA and most of their fans including you. The last four games ended as follows.

Naz 35 JCA 21
JCA 38 Naz 35 both games in 2015
Naz 24 JCA 21
JCA 42 Naz 0

Aside from the John Ivlow freight train season these teams have been competitive but one has to admit that JCA's refusal to change has put them in a tougher slot than they should be with the storied history they own. Kids and even fans want to stay with the times and adapt and in this world if you don't adapt you go extinct. A great JCA is great for Illinois football a declining JCA hurts everyone!

USD24 said:
For the record, the "schematically extinct" offense you like to criticize so often has put up an average of 30.5 pts per game against Naz over their last four meetings.
Click to expand...
 
J

JCHillmen

All-Conference
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USD24 said:
For the record, the "schematically extinct" offense you like to criticize so often has put up an average of 30.5 pts per game against Naz over their last four meetings.
Click to expand...

This is what is just not gotten by those who don't see the ridiculousness in the post. This comment came......

a) From a coach....on a message board

b) Literally 5 weeks after that "schematically extinct" team put up 38 points in a victory against his own team.

The source of a statement like that must be either very unaware in general or just trolling. I prefer to think it's the latter.
 
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B

BretEpic

Heisman
Jan 27, 2005
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Who cares? In the world of football it IS going extinct. I like the scheme, but it's being passed by.

How many teams run that offense at the collegiate level? Why don't they?
 
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Goomlah

Goomlah

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Jul 29, 2011
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jwarigaku said:
I've said it before, outside of Illinois, Sophomore football is a foreign concept. Welcome to the rest of the country guys.
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We could (and should) abolish sophomore football and put the JV game as the Friday Night opener. Makes sense,...
 
C

Cross Bones

All-Conference
Aug 19, 2001
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Well, a some teams use the JV game for players who didnt play or play much in the Varsity game and sophomores who will likely be seeing time on Varsity the following year. If the JV game precedes the varsity game then that changes who gets JV time.
 
J

jwarigaku

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Bones,

I can see both sides here for sure, sophomore kids and parents want to play and watch, but is a second year of freshman football beneficial? With the 6 quarter limit of play those unlikely to see varsity time would have a full 4 quarters of JV to play, plus if the opportunity arose, to play 2 quarters of the Varsity game. The role players could play 2 quarters of JV and 4 quarters of Varsity and the starters have no business playing JV. Everyone also gets developed at a varsity level and the school gets to eliminate the cost of one staff or if they chose pay more of their freshmen and varsity staff. I personally think the advantages outweigh the disadvantages.

Cross Bones said:
Well, a some teams use the JV game for players who didnt play or play much in the Varsity game and sophomores who will likely be seeing time on Varsity the following year. If the JV game precedes the varsity game then that changes who gets JV time.
Click to expand...
 
I

i011763

Freshman
Nov 12, 2001
755
80
28
Cross Bones said:
Well, a some teams use the JV game for players who didnt play or play much in the Varsity game and sophomores who will likely be seeing time on Varsity the following year. If the JV game precedes the varsity game then that changes who gets JV time.
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Many states don't have "prelim games", soph or jv, prior to the varsity contest The varsity game is it. I believe that one of the ESCC teams, Naz maybe, had their frosh team play the prelim game last year and then the JV game was Saturday
 
M

mchsalumni

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Cross Bones said:
Well, a some teams use the JV game for players who didnt play or play much in the Varsity game and sophomores who will likely be seeing time on Varsity the following year. If the JV game precedes the varsity game then that changes who gets JV time.
Click to expand...

^^This^^

What happens if you use a backup QB in the JV game and the varsity starter goes down? The QB in the JV game could be only available for 2 quarters, and this would be immediately following the JV game.

Won't work.
 
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LHSTigers94

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mchsalumni said:
^^This^^

What happens if you use a backup QB in the JV game and the varsity starter goes down? The QB in the JV game could be only available for 2 quarters, and this would be immediately following the JV game.

Won't work.
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I would assume that IHSA would look at the circumstances and grant a waiver given the above situation. The rule is in place to protect kids from coaches who would play kids for numerous quarters to win lower level games. In the case of an injury, I don't see IHSA punishing anyone for lack of numbers in the program. I could be wrong.
 
C

Cross Bones

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My comment was basically in response to putting the JV game before the V game. If its after that could work.
 
K

kpjasion

Senior
Oct 12, 2014
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Cross Bones said:
Well, a some teams use the JV game for players who didnt play or play much in the Varsity game and sophomores who will likely be seeing time on Varsity the following year. If the JV game precedes the varsity game then that changes who gets JV time.
Click to expand...

Not sure if this happened elsewhere or if it really means anything, but in the MSL the sophomore squads were renamed "JV" last year and what was traditionally JV (Sat game after Friday night varsity contest with non-starters) was renamed "Varsity B". Not quite sure why. New "JV" was still just sophs plus a couple of good freshman brought up at Palatine.
 
M

mchsalumni

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LHSTigers94 said:
I would assume that IHSA would look at the circumstances and grant a waiver given the above situation. The rule is in place to protect kids from coaches who would play kids for numerous quarters to win lower level games. In the case of an injury, I don't see IHSA punishing anyone for lack of numbers in the program. I could be wrong.
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What, like an in-game waiver? Slippery slope there, doubt the IHSA would allow it, and I don't think they should.
 
M

mc140

All-Conference
May 29, 2001
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You can play 8 quarters in a noncoference game. There is no ihsa rule on quarters played. Some conferences use 6 quarters and some don't allow a student to play tw levels on same day at all.
 
W

Wild_Mustang

Sophomore
Jul 30, 2010
828
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Is it just Football or are all/most sports numbers down? Whether it be Baseball, Basketball, Soccer, Track, Cross Country, Golf. Is there a sport where you hear "numbers are up"?
 
U

USD24

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May 29, 2001
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Wild_Mustang said:
Is it just Football or are all/most sports numbers down? Whether it be Baseball, Basketball, Soccer, Track, Cross Country, Golf. Is there a sport where you hear "numbers are up"?
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The specialization of athletes has led to numbers decreasing in all the sports. Very few multi-sport athletes means less athletes for each sport.
 
L

LHSTigers94

All-Conference
Oct 25, 2004
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mchsalumni said:
What, like an in-game waiver? Slippery slope there, doubt the IHSA would allow it, and I don't think they should.
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I also doubt they would make you forfeit because of injury. Most schools that fall under the 6A class system only have on 40 players in the program. Not often will this situation occur however, when or if it happen, I am sure adults will act like adults.

Also I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't allow it. Please elaborate on why you feel they shouldn't.
 
M

mc140

All-Conference
May 29, 2001
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If they ever get rid of Sophomore football they will be no JV game the same day as Varsity. It will be the Saturday Morning after or the Monday after.

No Junior/Senior is ever going to want to play in a JV game before the varsity game on Friday night. Actually in most states JV football is basically Sophomore football with a handful of Juniors sprinkled in.
 
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GMAN81

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Just curious to know if enrollment numbers are down across the board. I do know the public school my kids went to has seen a decrease in enrollment. But not really enough to have a big enough impact on any sport.

We all know there are a few factors causing this and for years a lot of people have been saying it was coming.
 
M

mchsalumni

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LHSTigers94 said:
Also I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't allow it. Please elaborate on why you feel they shouldn't.
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Because if you give coaches an inch, they will take a mile. The seedy underbelly many talk of on here about high school football should be hint enough. Starting varsity QB not playing well in the first quarter? No problem, take him out for injury and put in the backup who just played 4 quarters in the JV game.
 
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