Kellenberger writes....

[HD6]

Who thinks that? Nobody is saying not to expect that, at least I'm not. I'm saying that when it happens, you can't just put all your focus on that. MSU is one game behind my prediction for this year. If they go 7-5, should we fire Mullen because we lost to South Alabama?

 

[HD6]

Is it possible for all seven SEC West teams to be at the top of their games at the same time? Somebody has to lose when they play each other you know, you're never going to have 1-7 going undefeated.

 

[MaroonNation]

El-Oh-El. We are going 0-3 against those teams my friend.

 

[HD6]

You think Auburn might score more than two touchdowns in a game against us? Since that's what they are averaging against Power 5 opponents.

 

[campshelbydog842003]

Who thinks that? Nobody is saying not to expect that, at least I'm not. I'm saying that when it happens, you can't just put all your focus on that. MSU is one game behind my prediction for this year. If they go 7-5, should we fire Mullen because we lost to South Alabama?

Absolutely not. Like I said in my first post in this thread, the season needs to play out and then make some sort of decision. To say Mullen needs to go or not at this point is premature on both ends. If he completely loses the team (and after seeing some of the things our players get upset about on social media that is a distinct possibility if they lose a few more games because some of them don't seem to be very head strong) then we need to go in another direction. Like Jackie said, once that train starts going in the wrong direction it's almost impossible to stop it. We aren't nearly there yet, but it doesn't take very long to get there and we need to be prepared if it does.

After saying all of that, I think that we have the talent on this team to still win 7 games like you said and I will be hoping and cheering that we do just that or even more. I would much rather be wrong and us win than be right and us lose.

 

[Confucius Say]

El-Oh-El. We are going 0-3 against those teams my friend.

Beating auburn would not surprise me. Beating ark or Aggie would.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Of course you are not sure**

We were a Dak shitburger game away from winning the SEC west outright in Tuscaloosa 6 games in and being a playoff lock regardless of the Egg Bowl. Multiple red zone/end zone INTs in a game we lost by less than a touchdown. But it was just luck that year -- you say.

Quick question. Who'd we beat to get to 5-0 in conference? Was it the exact set of teams I just mentioned who were down?

Losing to Bama & Ole Miss in 2014 doesn't disprove what I said. No matter how we lost to them.

The "beyond a shadow of doubt" proof Mullen could take us to the next level would have been a victory in either of those games (where the next level was right there to be grabbed). We all know what happened.

 

[Junction John]

Don't worry about it, it's not that fun once the novelty wears off**

 

[JungRebel]

That's not a result of their philosophy professors' ability to communicate the subtleties of Hegel and Kant.

Oh yeah well how do you KNOW?


**

 

[InTheIttaBenaHotSun]

So in your opinion, how many games should State fans expect to win in a rebuilding year?

In a rebuilding/transition year, I think we should win 6 games and not lose to teams like South Alabama and struggle with teams like UMASS.

 

[fishwater99]

Did we really win 9???
I think you and others fail to fully understand that with the SEC contract money we are on a completely different playing field than in the past. It's different now. Do u expect to win a Natty? No, but I do expect to beat USA and to get a real upset win every now and then. Also to be able to recruit much better than in the past. A down year should be 6 or 7 wins, not 3 or 4.

 

[InTheIttaBenaHotSun]

My God I get so damn tired of hearing this ignorant tripe. So, according to these geniuses, at some arbitrary point in an SEC coaches career (3 years? 5 years? 8 years? who the hell knows) you should never have a losing record again. Rebuilding years should be lower tier bowls EVERY YEAR WITHOUT EXCEPTION, average years are New Year's Day bowls and really good years and undefeated seasons and national championships.

Woohoo! Look e'rybody! I'm better than you because I don't accept med'ocrity!!!

I'm saying in year 8, we should be a 7 to 8 win team. A team that shouldn't lose to South Alabama and struggle MIGHTILY against a team like UMASS. I''m saying in year 8, we should have consistent Oline play. In year 8, we should be able to run the ball up the middle on most D's with our 220 lb. rb's (not our 165lb. one - we all know that's impossible in the SEC). I think, by year 8, we should be a consistent 7 to 8 win team that has a legit shot at winning the west every 4 to 5 years. Not saying we win it every 4 to 5 years but that we're in the hunt to win it every 4 to 5 years. Yes, in a rebuilding year (6 wins), we should go to a lower tier bowl and with us going to middle tier bowls for an 8 win season and if we are lucky enough to get to Atlanta then a top tier bowl.

As for the better part, I'm not saying I'm better than you because I don't accept med'ocrity.....I'm saying I'm better than you because.....I just am.

edit: And no, that wasn't me that down voted your post.

 

[InTheIttaBenaHotSun]

You might not be cut out for M-State fandom.

In case you missed it, Dak threw 3 god-awful passes last night.

Yeah, it seems like I read where he ALMOST threw an interception.**

 

[olblue.sixpack]

Just like Florida replaced Tim Tebow, and Ole Miss replaced Eli Manning, and Auburn replaced Cam Newton? Just like that huh? No problem finding those guys if you recruit all proper like.

If you read enough threads here you would think coaching football in the SEC is the easiest job in America.

Its almost as if these kids think there is a money tree on one end of campus and a Quarterback tree on the other with some linebacker, linemen and athlete trees scattered throughout.

 

[engie]

So, in your mind, the "next level" for MSU football -- is being locked into playing for a national title?

In that case -- you aren't intelligent enough for me to waste energy arguing with.

 

[engie]

I just wonder how these Gary Patterson teams ever have down years? After all -- it's well past year 10*** Should compete for titles every single year***

 

[engie]

Did we really win 9???
I think you and others fail to fully understand that with the SEC contract money we are on a completely different playing field than in the past. It's different now. Do u expect to win a Natty? No, but I do expect to beat USA and to get a real upset win every now and then. Also to be able to recruit much better than in the past. A down year should be 6 or 7 wins, not 3 or 4.

When did Mullen win "3-4"?

Also -- if you expect "upset wins" -- without getting "upset losses" -- you don't understand the mentality of playing sports and what it takes to win as an underdog. Those two things go together 99% of the time.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

So, in your mind, the "next level" for MSU football -- is being locked into playing for a national title?

In that case -- you aren't intelligent enough for me to waste energy arguing with.

You are as bad at arguing as you are at insults. I'm not smart enough? Got it.

What's the next level if it's not winning our division just once or beating Bama just once? Quit equaing us winning a national title with beating them once. Sumlin ('12), Freeze ('14 & '15), Malzahn ('13) & Miles ('11) all managed to beat Bama without winning the national title. A quick check of the records shows that in 2014 exactly 0 SEC teams were in the national title game.

By the way, that 2014 Bama squad we choked against was probably the worst Saban team in the last 5-6 years.

 

[Strike.sixpack]

I'm saying in year 8, we should be a 7 to 8 win team. A team that shouldn't lose to South Alabama and struggle MIGHTILY against a team like UMASS. I''m saying in year 8, we should have consistent Oline play. In year 8, we should be able to run the ball up the middle on most D's with our 220 lb. rb's (not our 165lb. one - we all know that's impossible in the SEC). I think, by year 8, we should be a consistent 7 to 8 win team that has a legit shot at winning the west every 4 to 5 years. Not saying we win it every 4 to 5 years but that we're in the hunt to win it every 4 to 5 years. Yes, in a rebuilding year (6 wins), we should go to a lower tier bowl and with us going to middle tier bowls for an 8 win season and if we are lucky enough to get to Atlanta then a top tier bowl.

As for the better part, I'm not saying I'm better than you because I don't accept med'ocrity.....I'm saying I'm better than you because.....I just am.

edit: And no, that wasn't me that down voted your post.

It's an absurd arbitrary stance. Coaches and teams have down years and it can happen at any time. Throughout history of even the best that have ever been have had years at or even BELOW that schools historic norm. Besides Tom Osborn, who hasn't? I can't hardly think of other coaches NOT to have those years at some arbitrary time in their career. Crap, some have it happen in years 10 or greater. It's an asinine stance to demand never ending perfection and upward trajectory. Especially in light of history that shows even some of the greatest have had those type of years. That's not excepting mediocrity, that's understanding humanity and history. And when your history is still less than .500 demanding to never drop to that level in X number year is absurd in the extreme

 

[Strike.sixpack]

Again, for the 3rd time, no one is asking us to win with the upper tier of the SEC. We have 4 nonconference teams this year that we have distinct money and every other type of advantage over that we should never ever lose to. We also get to play the worst 2 teams in a bad SEC East division. One just hired a horrible coach and the other doesn't give a 17 about football. In a down year with that particular schedule, it should be unacceptable to people that matter for us to win less than 6 games. If we scheduled FSU and played Tennessee and Florida in the East, then a 4-8 / 5-7 year is more understandable, but we don't. We have an extremely favorable schedule and there is no excuse to not go to a bowl game this year. Also, if Mullen not getting a contract extension last year doesn't concern you then you aren't paying attention.

One more thing. Once you get a budget up to where we are now, how much more does more money really help you? We have new facilities, have enough money to have good coaches in all sports, made tons of stadium upgrades. If we had another 100 million dollars, what would we spend it on? Recruits? I know that money is something that you can never have too much of, but at some point you have diminishing returns in this league don't you?....unless you put it in a recruiting slush fund.

Just want to address the money thing. I have seen the idea that once a team gets to $100 MIL how much more does making $150 MIL help them. In a one year glance, I agree. But when a team has been at $100 MIL for 5-6 years longer than you and the difference in budgets averages at least $50 MIL throughout that time, $300 MIL more over just those 6 years is an enormous difference. We are catching up and doing a great job at that, no small part to the work Stricklin did. But until we sustained $100 MIL + (which we are still not there yet) they gap will still be felt. I wonder if we drop back to closer to $80 MIL this year or next. The big push for the baseball stadium has inflated our budget some I believe.

 

[olblue.sixpack]

And 8 years in we still don't have a memorable upset.
QUOTE]

I have no idea who the favorites were in the LSU/A&M/Auburn streak of 2014. But I do know I will never forget that run.

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

As for the better part, I'm not saying I'm better than you because I don't accept med'ocrity.....I'm saying I'm better than you because.....I just am.

edit: And no, that wasn't me that down voted your post.

If you have to tell people you are better than them, you probably aren't. That's usually a trait we see from ole miss pricks.

 

[UpTheMiddlex3Punt]

I believe we are in the ballpark of top programs for HC pay, but way behind in assistant pay. Kinda like putting cheap tires on a corvette, you're not gonna get the results you want.

We could double Hevesy's salary but our O-Line is still going to suck.

 

[HD6]

So our down year should be about one win behind what LSU would be willing to say is a down year. Yeah, that seems right.

 

[HD6]

So we've made up ground on Alabama and LSU with this SEC money? They didn't get any?

I expected to beat South Alabama as well, and its disappointing, but you guys want to chop off an arm over a hangnail.

 

[HD6]

If we were 4-0, nobody would give a **** about recruiting.

 

[HD6]

Considering that 3 of the last 5 Saban teams won a national title, I'm not sure "worst Saban team" means anything.

Who was the last SEC West Champion to not have a shot at the national title? Alabama 2008.

09-Bama-NC
10-Auburn-NC
11-LSU-NC Runner Up
12-Bama-NC
13-Auburn-NC Runner
14-Bama-Playoffs
15-Bama-NC

So you see, winning the SEC West means you are a national championship team. Period. The days of MSU 1998 or Arkansas 1995 are dead and buried.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Okay. I disagree. Like I listed above beating them doesn't mean a national title otherwise Freeze would have two trophies. What is the next level then? If it's not winning the West what is it? What is the sign the program is moving in a good direction and not a bad one? Since we lost to Bama in 2014 I haven't seen one sign we are going the right way. But hey, maybe I'm not looking in the right place...

 

[HD6]

The fact that we won 9 games the next year wasn't a good sign?

The next level for MSU is being a consistent 8-9 win team, that can occasionally jump up to 10 if the cards fall in the right places. Contending for the West is going to take more than us being good, we have to get Alabama down somehow, and that's beyond our control.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

gonna be tough to win 8 consistently when we win 5 or less this year.

 

[HD6]

I would be willing to admit we haven't reached the next level. And I believe that Mississippi State will have rebuilding years.

You know whose fans believe they are championship contender every year and they should always been good no matter the historical results? I'll give you a hint, they are in the same state as us.

 

[engie]

I would be willing to admit we haven't reached the next level. And I believe that Mississippi State will have rebuilding years.

You know whose fans believe they are championship contender every year and they should always been good no matter the historical results? I'll give you a hint, they are in the same state as us.

and we've got a bunch of people that are totally indistinguishable from them -- in this very thread.

Inside the playoff from the first week -- till the last week -- is not "competing for titles" -- according to Cookiereb**

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

and we've got a bunch of people that are totally indistinguishable from them -- in this very thread.

Inside the playoff from the first week -- till the last week -- is not "competing for titles" -- according to Cookiereb**

A. I think HD6 just said we haven't reached the next level. So much for that beyond a shadow of a doubt business.

B. I have two degrees from MSU but if you like calling folks reb, you should head to another board I've heard about. They'll love you over there. Oh wait, you left that board because you got your feelings hurt by that loser who runs it. Prayers sent.

C. I can't recall us even having the ball with a chance to take the lead against Alabama in the 4th quarter. I'd settle for that over beating them at this point. Instead, our average margin of defeat is three touchdowns under Mullen. Man, we sure do have different definitions of competitive. If we can't compete with them, ever, then just give it up. What's the point? If we can, let's start doing it and stop bragging about Belk Bowl trophies and mid-season rankings (which mean nothing).

 

[HD6]

If "not competing with Alabama" is a reason to disband the program, about 110 other programs need to go with us.

Do you compete with Bill Gates salary wise? If not, do you just give up or do you try to find enjoyment with the money you have?

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

If "not competing with Alabama" is a reason to disband the program, about 110 other programs need to go with us.

Every other team in our division has given them a better game than we have (2014) in the last five years. Bert lost by 1 in 2014. Freeze beat them twice and lost a close one this year. Miles beat them in 2011. Sumlin beat them in 2012. Malzahn beat them in 2013. Our best shot has been a garbage time touchdown to cut it to 5.

They are the standard and I don't expect us to win against them while Saban is there. But Mullen is about to be 0-8 without even playing them close.

I'm done talking about this. We agree that 2017 is make or break for Mullen. I think it's going to break. You think it's going to make. We'll see.

 

[Sapsdawg]

I know I've told you before, but it just amuses me to no end the dubmass **** you say about Mullen while having a Jackie sig pic. By your standards Jackie should have been fired in 95. We have indisputably reached another level under Mullen, whether you agree or not is irrelevant. That doesn't mean there aren't other levels. Until we recruit consistently top 15 there will be years like this. I just don't understand why so many of you are so quick to pull the trigger on firing him when you idolize JWS whose record against a MUCH easier SEC does not compare favorably to Mullen. If this were year two of a similar start, I would be on your side. But, after losing our best player in history, our best defensive player leaving a year early, both starting corners going down before the season, I think this is not unexpected.

 

[Joe Schmedlap]

Beating auburn would not surprise me. Beating ark or Aggie would.

Beating AU wouldn't be surprising only because of the fact that AU is a very bad football team right now. No one should be able to honestly dispute that fact. AU blows. Having said that, a team playing as raggedly as State is with so many glaring weaknesses will have a heck of a time with AU. Holy cow, our team lost to a mediocre at best team by Sunbelt standards on our home field and had its hands full with a lowly UMass team. This does not instill confidence that AU will be a bulldog victory. And forget about aTm - the Aggies will name the score. Arkansas looks a hell of a lot better than State does also. I suppose key injuries might play a role in that game in mid November.

 

[tired]

If we were 4-0, nobody would give a **** about recruiting.

Avoid the question...

 

[fishwater99]

People would still ***** about it.

 

[HD6]

No, I don't think recruiting would be that big an issue if we were undefeated, and the people who bitched about would be rightly mocked. Who cares about recruiting rankings when you're winning, I don't remember people saying anything about recruiting before the Alabama game happened 2 years ago.

Also....