Saw the same thing. I watched it a handful of times. It comes down to their kid making a play, which is what we forced him to do. Again, to his credit, he did.
That's lacrosse folks.
Lax vs PSU Game Thread
- Thread starter AreYouNUTS
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Saw the same thing. I watched it a handful of times. It comes down to their kid making a play, which is what we forced him to do. Again, to his credit, he did.
That's lacrosse folks.
I have NEVER said NOR implicated that the “coaching staff sucks” so we will not be going any “deeper.” I’m not a coach and you know it lol.,, I have actually backed this staff from Day 1. ALL I’ve said - and many agree with me BOTH on and off these boards (including a friend of ours who was a 3-Time AA) - is that some of the same things seem to happen over and over again who IS A SHAME because, had they not, we’d be sitting in the Top 10 and headed to the NCAA’s and it’s incredibly frustrating because these are mainly mental issues that can/could be corrected. That’s all brotha’. If you don’t agree, fine, BUT why have these discussions continually come up throughout the season (and NOT just begin by me...)?
I support this coach, this team, and this program, but there’s a long way to go and it’s NOT just a talent thing. We’ve GOT top 10 talent.
you are correct sir, it was as simple as that but, some people like more of an explanation and I hope I was able to provide some clarity. But in the end their kid made a play
Army beat us last year, too, so what’s the reasoning there? They just recruit better?
NEVERA SAID “the staff sucks” and regardless of what anyone says you’re just going to spin it in the staffs favor, WHICH I GET, but that doesn’t mean there haven’t been issues out there this year WHICH you don’t need to have expertise in the game to notice as they okay out in front if you.
I said elsewhere, maybe it’s just a combination of a new coordinator on each side of the ball, working with the new head coach, and the loss of six or seven very important seniors from last year, and that during this off-season the necessary growth both from the coaches and the team is made and it pays off in 2020. I hope so!
** And hey who knows maybe the staff does noticed some of these things, and has tried to drill some things into these kids heads, but it’s just not catching it. Who knows but I would LIKE to think so! [cheers]
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You are speaking in generalities again. You listed the play we are discussing as a sign of poor coaching. What would you have done differently? Strategy/personnel.
If you don't want to answer specifics, I'll stop asking.
I think that’s the part that is so frustrating for Rutgers fans in general.
Sooner or later we need to see our guys and gals across the board in Athletics start “making a play” on the field of play with the desired results (the W) at the end.
That ain’t coachin’
On paper, probably yes. We haven't had a top 20 ranked recruiting class. Yet we compete with top 5 teams. Clearly the staff is really good at finding under the radar talent and coaching them up. I can't think of more than a few kids that haven't made significant strides since being in the program.
Yes, most of the things I’m discussing are very general topics, specifically coming out of the gate and coming out of the halves slowly. The only thing that would be game specific are giving up the goals at the end of periods and end of games. I don’t know, but one would think there must be a way to make adjustments there, right? Kind of sucks to give up goals at the end of the half with no time left on the clock And, while we seem to never do that, it seems as though it happens to us quite a bit as it did yesterday again.
Ok, so you prefer Max knows the angle of approach from a closer proximity than potentially not from further out.
I appreciate that insight and can see the logic.
I know you are talking in general terms and not about that specific play but I would put my money on Sprock, Rose or Coyne to score had the roles been reversed.
I hear that, but you also have to be realistic. We are competing with teams who have had huge advantages. We just got the full amount of scholarships with out of state money two years ago. We don’t even have a full roster yet with full classes recruited under these economics. Our facilities compared to our peers are far below par with max money.
Combine those two things and it’s a minor miracle we go into number 1 ranked teams and expect to win.
The good news is it’s all changing. Our facility will be incredible. The equal or better than anyone’s. The scholarship money is now on par.
We’ve gotten here with one hand tied behind our back. Let’s see what they can do on a level or better playing field, which we will have.
I know people don’t want to hear this, but winning big at this level is all in the minutia. Truly the little things.
And sometimes the little thIng(s) is what the player needs to do when the lights are on.
Look, I’m totally on board. I just hope we see some of the good stuff across the board in Athletics in the not too distant future.
But I also do feel and see the trend of getting better and think it won’t be much longer before we see something similar like in Wrestling in our other sports.
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THIS! If you have ever coached players, you understand this. The athletes don’t CHOOSE to ignore a good strategy or deviate from the game plan. Rather, in the moment they either forget, or get distracted or frustrated or tired or overconfident or their instincts tell them to deviate from the plan to try to make a play. In the competitive moment there are lots of reasons.
And a team is made up of a bunch of players with their own instincts and discipline. It only takes one or a couple with the wrong ideas in a team sport.
OK I'll take your word for it.
But he is going to the # 1 ranked team in the country
Who are the others and where are they headed ?
Ranked number 1 for now.
I don't know where he ranks in NJ, but Stephenson is a 2020 from Seton Hall Prep, headed to RU. That kid is a baller.
I don't know where he ranks in NJ, but Stephenson is a 2020 from Seton Hall Prep, headed to RU. That kid is a baller.
Ok, McLane from Westfield is going to Brown
Griffin from Ramapo is going to Loyola
Glavin from Lakes is going to Brown also
Long from Delbarton is going to Cornell
I have coached against all five kids and I would say that these kids are all better but do not have the benefit of playing against shore conference teams. That being said Birch is a very good player I am just interested in how he fits into PSU’s offense.
QUESTIONS- for the connected guys here. What will it take for us to get to the tournament? What is missing? We've been bouncing around between #1-#20 for the past few years. We're had some great wins and some frustrating loses. Why haven't our classes been ranked in the top 20? We are literally surrounded by the best and deepest HS lax in the nation.
To Nut's point-why do we commit 25 turnovers against UM when Cali says our talent is so amazing? the past two years you guys say our schedule was too easy. Now some of you have said our schedule is one of the hardest in the nation and a reason for these loses...which do we want?
Why do we keep losing to Princeton-Army-Lehigh etc, the teams we think we're supposed to be better than? Either our talent is better...like many of you say....or it isn't. Our fogo is hurt-the D middle is out-we're young-we had to replace some guys-next year it will be, max isn't here. Many excuses, when do we stop making them?
Westfield/Delbarton/Lakes.....I get the Ivy thing from those type towns. How about Griffin or Birch....what's it take for RU to get those kids to get our classes in the top 10. Like many of you had said above...it's about the Jimmys and Joes. If our classes are ranked outside of the top 20, why do we expect top 10/15 results? Should our recruiting be better...or ranked higher?
Not a criticism, just trying to understand the nuances...Brecht has done a great job and I've only heard positive things from families, coaches etc.
PS-My son has been playing for 10 years now and hopes to play club at RU next year. I will say Family ( summer team ) was the best coach he had in all that time!
Look at it in the micro not macro. The stench of the football team is not to be confused with the accomplishments the lacrosse team has had.
You've asked a lot of questions, some have already been answered.
1) UM has turned every single team they play over. They use a 10 man ride that is not easy to break. We didn't play our best game and we turned the ball over ourselves, but many of them were simply their ride. It's unique, and it works. If we get a more mobile goalie, I wouldn't be shocked if start to employ it. We had 25 turnovers that game. We also turned them over 22 times. But that was not our best game. I was on the field for that game. It had a weird flow. I think the kids were a bit over amped. But, we won. Which is all that matters. Did you see the PSU game? We turned the ball over roughly half the amount while playing much faster. Much better game for us. Did you know Michigan turned over Penn St. 24 times? Would you say they have good talent?
2) Our schedule is one of the harder in the nation. But that's a good thing. We typically had these schedules in the past and expect them in the future. Brecht has done yeoman's work in the regard. You'd be shocked at how hard scheduling is, especially for a team like us where we were 4 years ago. Teams didn't want to play us, and schools like Uva dropped us because of it. Now that we are consistently ranked, it's been made easier.
3) We should expect those results because we have been getting those results. Recruiting is getting better and better, but it's been a very heavy lift. We lost essentially one class with the b.s. that Brecht went through with the parent complaining about helmets the kids wore for practice. Our former low life AD suspended while he was investigated. Of course, it came up with nothing. By that time, the damage was done.
4) We have split games with Princeton and with Lehigh. Army got us two in a row. When making statements, it would help if you were correct.
5) Have you seen our facilities? I know high school's with better locker rooms. Did you see my statements about scholarships? Up until two years ago we were losing approximately 3-4 kids, per class, because we had 12.6 scholarships, but with in state money. Now we have out of state money, which put us on par with our peers.
6) Reality isn't excuse making. We played two games without Max. We played 3 without our best short stick. We played 4 without our best fogo. We played 2 without our best attackman. We've had a number of other injuries along the way. It's sports, things happen. Any team that loses that much production is going to be affected negatively. To think otherwise is naive.
7) Our facilities are being built which will be great. When a recruit steps on campus, they aren't going to be taken to a dingy room with no windows that was old when I was there 20 years ago. Big time recruits need to see those investments or it's going to be tough to get them. Good news, we broke ground on them.
8) We have a great staff, very well respected. Let's hope we can keep them and build continuity both on the field in the recruiting circles.
Lastly, many people here question a lot. I have a question for all of you. What exactly are you doing to make the program better? Are you donating or expecting everyone else to do that while you just question and complain?
First, Thanks for saying that SF88
UM ran a ten man ride that has been very effective in force teams to turn the ball over. SF88 we run a ten man ride and even when you are ready for it we turn you over because your second team can not replicate the speed and aggressiveness I. Which we play it. Most teams also very little time working on their clear and we have 5 variations of the ride.
Cali does an excellent job explaining but, I will add my two cents and it is pretty simple as it starts and ends with recruiting but the deeper dive means that it is money. When BB got here his 12.6 scholarships were not fully funded they had all 12.6 but only 4 of them were fully funded at the out of state limit, which means he was underfunded by about 120,000 dollars. We are fully funded now and it makes a big difference in there ability to attract players. Second, as Cali said our facilities have not improved much, same locker room as when I played, Yurchak was built in 1994. I am not sure how many of you have seen other schools Lacrosse facilities but I have seen some of them and frankly until the Rodkin center and new practice facility is built we are far behind. I have been to Michigan, Duke, UNC ND OSU, UMD. Their facilities for lacrosse are crazy nice. Hopkins just built a new facility as did PSU.
I kind of feel like we need to reduce our recruiting footprint not expand it. Hit NY hard and be more selective with who you take in NJ
This is something a lot of us (myself included) tend to forget about. The economics of everything. It’s a lot harder for us to fundraise and get they players the money as opposed to the Umich’s and Psu’s or the world
To answer Cali's question, I give to the program every year.
I have also reached out to the athletic director(Pernetti, no reason to reach Hobbs) and coaches(about recruiting direction and suggestions) and to the man they have all responded.
I have also reached out to the athletic director(Pernetti, no reason to reach Hobbs) and coaches(about recruiting direction and suggestions) and to the man they have all responded.
To follow up, I am sure any of my suggestions were ignored post haste, but using that as an example to illustrate that at least some of us are engaged with the program on a level greater than being keyboard warriors.
I think we all come from the same place which is the fervent hope that Rutgers can turn the corner and be a consistent NCAA team.
The one place that I think that BB excel's that has been a little overlooked is player development. You guys see AC and see a great lacrosse player I see AC and I remember the scrawny kid who could not catch with his right hand and could not beat anybody off a dodge. I would say that the Rutgers staff is as good as it gets in the Big Ten in developing players. I watch it over and over kids that look overwhelmed as freshman come in ready to contribute as Sophomore's, these kids who are exposed to big-time lacrosse for the first time become players. Just look at our top 6 offensive kids only 1 from LI. one each from Texas, Utah, Ohio and Georgia. great athletes but maybe not seeing the highest level of play every day. BB and his staff have done amazing this with some of these kids.
Not from me (because as I said earlier I do get it and am fully onboard) but how do you answer this question (I get asked a lot) posed by someone who doesn’t know what’s really going on:
What success? Under Brian...Did we win the B1G yet? Have we been in the tournament yet.
Getting better? Will give you that.
Good and hopeful future? That too.
I will say if AC was healthy the whole time we’re probably not having this type of discussion but the upward climb has to have a landing spot at some point but...still not there yet.
And again I know this is the Other Sports Board but I (like you and the B1G do too) look at the whole picture and trends. Yes, MLAX IMO is trending upward but sooner or later we have to get somewhere with this positive trend. Maybe this weekend?
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I’ll name a few ED, but remember where this program was when Brecht started. It was in complete shambles in every way. The last coach completely decimated the program at every level.
What success have we had?
We made it to the finals of the B1G tournament
We have been ranked number 1
We are producing All Americans and B1G players of the year
We won 30! games the last 3 years taking down big programs in the process
Brian has been named B1G coach of the year
We’ve done these things with one hand behind our back, which won’t be the problem moving forward after the facility gets built.
And we’ve done this with great kids who do very well in the classroom and stay out of trouble. You may not care about those things but I do.
I’ll ask you directly, are to donating to the program? If not, what are you doing to help make it better?
What success have we had?
We made it to the finals of the B1G tournament
We have been ranked number 1
We are producing All Americans and B1G players of the year
We won 30! games the last 3 years taking down big programs in the process
Brian has been named B1G coach of the year
We’ve done these things with one hand behind our back, which won’t be the problem moving forward after the facility gets built.
And we’ve done this with great kids who do very well in the classroom and stay out of trouble. You may not care about those things but I do.
I’ll ask you directly, are to donating to the program? If not, what are you doing to help make it better?
Cali, I love your perspective. This program has been on an incredible rise and so has the Big Ten. I felt it weird adding JHU just for lacrosse but another great move by conference. Haven't posted much lately. Truthfully dissapointed we did not take down either Maryland or Penn State. I felt pretty confident we would win at least one with a now healthy team. I still feel our starting team has the talent and is as good or better than anyone in country and they proved they can play with the best. Haven't been able to close in big games, and still don't know the answer.
First, I am a Brecht supporter. He's done a great job. He's done more with less, similar to Goodale, who I believe is also fully funded now. In fact I spoke face to face with Brecht just last week at a HS game. Cali, you are the programs biggest cheerleader and that's great. I'm asking a real question and that is how do we get to the next level. That next level is a consistent top 10-12 team that makes the NCAA's in most years.
We now are fully funded. We have broken ground on a new facility, that any HS kid at this point will get to use. We are in a top lax conference. We play a top schedule. Are there any more hurdles or obstacles from keeping us to getting to the next level? As e5fdny just asked again, when do we get over the hump? Is it just a higher level of recruiting? Are we going head to head for kids that select Hopkins or Maryland? Everyone says there's so much untapped lax talent everywhere and only 25 top D1 programs. Do we need the Birch kid, or someone like him, to get over the top at each position group?
I've been to all but one home game this year. I watched us not score a goal against Princeton in the second half. I watched us unable to clear against Army. I'm aware of the W/L record against those teams. Most of those here believe we are better, should be better, or have better talent than Army, Lehigh, Princeton. So my statement was correct. Most on here called those games a WTF loss and we did lose 4 of 6 in the past two years. I'm not asking why we didn't beat Maryland. I'm not questioning your lax knowledge, in fact I'm asking for it. Try not to be so condescending.
For the record, I'm a 30 year season ticket holder, in multiple sports. I have literally bought the mat the wrestling team uses in the RAC for matches. I have bought the mascot costume and yes I've sponsored lacrosse scholarships. Scott Beida, who also coached my son, was the last recipient. You responded directly to me, so get off the high horse, we're all on the same "team"
Yes, I remember the Stags story about his pleading with the guys, “to play better or I’m gonna get fired!”
And I have also used the hand behind the back analogy when discussing the program with others. The point being it starts with getting the right person in charge (Brian and Goodale) for things to change. I can only imagine what can be accomplished as we get more into our tenure in the B1G.
My hope in the near future is when a shot hits the post it goes in instead of out. Meaning the breaks go our way. And not just in lacrosse but for all of Athletics.
I’ll ask again, what are you doing to help the lacrosse team? Hope isn’t a strategy. More money is though.
That’s great. How do we get consistently in the 10-12 range? Well we are getting there. But that won’t guarantee entry into the NCAA tourney. We finished 12 last year and got snubbed.
But to answer your question, donate more money.
We aren’t healthy. We were missing our best short stick, who is an absolute lock down defender, against PSU.
That game looks different with him out there. They feasted on our shorties.
First of all who the heck is Ed? LOL
Second, none of my questions involve funding. A dollar from me doesn’t get a ground ball, the extra move needed to slide to a defender, set a pick, sell out to beat the other player to the end line, etc. As I have said numerous times on this website when discussing all things Rutgers as it pertains to accountability...I don’t put out the fire my men do. The City buying me an extra length of hose or a shiny new fire engine doesn’t do it either. It’s the heart beating inside the bunker gear that does it.
A lot of you in this conversation are much closer to the players than the rest of us. Would love to hear what they think. Not x’s and o’s but what they think is needed for the next rung on the ladder.
This is the kind of info those who don’t know need to know.
This is answer in bold above I can give to those who ask us the question all the time, “When Rutgers, when?”
So you don’t donate. If you want to make a real difference outside of message board warrior’ing, I’d recommend you do. It will help get the program where you want it to be. That extra hose can be a hose another department doesn’t have but needs.
I’m actually going to dial back the info. I probably give too much here as it is. I don’t like arguing about the program just because I’m closer to it.
I’ll leave it at this.
Brian is very open with the program. Anyone who wants to be truly involved will be welcomed. Get involved and donate. It matters more than anything else.
^Honestly, I think we got spoiled the past couple years of being right there that we forgot (myself included) how much talent we lost. Lacrosse is a tough game. You have a lot of close games and sometimes you’re flat out not good enough. Not a knock on the team. It is what it is. Just watch the the Umich game. Some very sloppy play that made too close to call. Then they bounced back and played PSU very well, but we were never able to stretch the lead. I saw some of the younger guys out their who have shown some promise. @Caliknight Any chance AC comes back for another year? I know he’s been here for awhile, but still has eligibility left