Lets talk school... Come on you

[ScoobaDawg]

Academicians

Dr. Keenum wants Tier 1 Status...
What does it take and can we get there?

Why are we the only member of the SEC to not have a Phi Beta Kappa, and have we heard anything about our latest application.
Can we become the first MS school to be ARL certified ?
<span style="text-decoration: line-through;">What will it take to be AAU Certified?</span> Nevermind on that..If only UF and Vandy are on that list from the SEC It aint happening ever.
How many Doctorate degrees did we award this year?

Evidently we are a Tier 3 right now..same a UM..same as USM

 

[TheStateUofMS]

I made a 3.2 last semester in Finance. Working on two A's in summer school currently in Philosophy and Business Ethics and I have a feeling Michael Clifford for ethics is going to be a dick and make it hard.

 

[FlabLoser]

In the early 90s PBK rejected us because of our puny library. Since that time we made massive expansions to the library.

Now? Beats me.

 

[TheStateUofMS]

In the early 90s PBK rejected us because of our puny library. Since that time we made massive expansions to the library.

Now? Beats me.

Largest Lieberry in the state of MS I was told.

 

[ScoobaDawg]

According to this reflector article

We got a visit in 1990, after the failure..we did not even APPLY the next 3 times (91,94,97)
During which time UM got theirs (Millsaps also has a VERY Highly ranked chapter) and Auburn received theirs leaving us as the only SEC school with out one.
Evidently we finally started applying again in 2000,03,06, and 09 (under Dr. Keenum) but have not received another visit as of yet.
Dr. Keenum knows getting a chapter is a must and wants to also be the first in Mississippi to get ARL status.
He talks about both in his First 100 update last year

I just wondered if there have been any other updates on either issues.
I've been reading up too much on my Gf's school (texas) and reading about the things that make them such a highly respected university..and Dr.Keenum as set Tier 1 as our goal..so how do we get there.

and seems Both MSU and UM are doing what people in Mississippi best...be the last..as every other SEC school is a Tier 1 university...BUT the Mississippi schools.
LSU left us behind in 2008 jumping from Tier 3 to 1

 

[memphisbulldog]

Academicians

Dr. Keenum wants Tier 1 Status...
What does it take and can we get there?

Why are we the only member of the SEC to not have a Phi Beta Kappa, and have we heard anything about our latest application.
Can we become the first MS school to be ARL certified ?
<span style="text-decoration: line-through;">What will it take to be AAU Certified?</span> Nevermind on that..If only UF and Vandy are on that list from the SEC It aint happening ever.
How many Doctorate degrees did we award this year?

Evidently we are a Tier 3 right now..same a UM..same as USM

1. I would love for us to be ranked higher.

The US News rankings are not fair to schools like MSU. They are far from objective. About half (!) the rankings are perceptions of other universities. We get penalized for the poor national perceptions (unfair) of the state of MS. Have been told this by deans at MSU.

No way some of the SEC schools are that much better than MSU. I got an engineering degree from MSU and then went into a six month training with top grads from MIT, GA Tech, Purdue, etc. I beat them all.

2. I would love for us to have a Phi Beta Kappa chapter. Dr Keenum says we are two years out. This is actally overated, however since is a liberal arts honorary and we are an engineering (and other) school. We have Phi Kappa Phi which is the overall honorary. Since so many think so highly of Phi Beta Kappa, though, we need it.

 

[sardis]

Both are kaput at MSU from what I hear. Don't know about the rest. The roots of MSU are agriculture and mechanics (engineering), we seem to be moving away from one. The chicken indutry can be faulted for not supporting poultry science and I assume the same may be true for forrestry.

 

[drail14me]

I've been reading on the rankings and standards involved in deciding the Tier structure. So far, I've found a WIDE range of explanations. The one that really stuck out for me was this one. "Rankings can be based on subjectively perceived "quality," on some
combination of empirical statistics, or on surveys of educators,
scholars, students, prospective students or others." So, according to that, it's all about the perception. If so, we have a LONG way to go in a LOT of peoples eyes. Unfortunately, a lot of this perception simply comes from the state we're located in. So, Mississippi as a whole has a lot of work to do.

Here is a list of factors that another source claims is how they rank:

Total research expenditures,
Federal research expenditures,
Endowment
assets,
National Academy members,
Faculty
awards,
Doctorates awarded,
Post-doctoral appointees,
Median
students' SAT and ACT test scores
Peer assessments,
Retention (graduation rate and freshman retention
rate),
Faculty resources,
Student Selectivity,
Financial
resources,
Graduation rate performances (predicted versus actual
graduation rate), and
Alumni giving rate


Looks like there's a lot of work to do but there's no reason we can't achieve it. I'm proud that Dr. Keenum has set a goal like that.

I got my BS from MSU back in '96. Three weeks ago, I set foot on campus as a student again working on a Masters. It feels good to be a student again. I'd be nice to see that Tier ranking move up within the next two years.

 

[RaiderDawg24]

<div style="text-align: left;">the tier system used by some government funding agencies? Those are two different things, but we aren't high on either list.

When it comes down to it, tier status comes down to research money. The more extramural funding (NIH, NSF, USDA, etc.) and a large private endowment means better facilities, which means more postdocs and grad students, which means more paper and patents, which justifies the funding sources giving you more money. Its a cycle of success breeds success.

The major problem is getting MSU to the point where we can get into the cycle and that's going to take some Boone Pickens-like donations for academia and a shift in teaching focus (meaning lightening the teaching load of faculty so they can focus on research and not be in the classroom as much).

We need enough funding to support more full time technicians to work in labs, enough money to hire more postdoctoral fellows, and enough money to put more graduate students on RAs instead of TAs. We also need more money to give new faculty better start-up packages when they come to MSU so that they have a better chance of getting a good project going and being competitive for larger grants. Truth is, we also need enough money to hire instructors so that research faculty aren't in the undergraduate classroom as much. Those kinds of changes would draw stronger research faculty and that gets MSU in the cycle. At least that's what we need for departments with faculty that can tap into NIH funding (NIH is our government's largest funding source).

Problem is, in most cases, MSU can't offer a competitive hiring package to quality new faculty. I love MSU, but it would be a very hard sell to get me back there on faculty because I know how much less I would make and the research funding problems that would come with being on campus.

</div>

 

[ColMuldrow]

It was my understanding that the settlement reached in theAyerscase made it virtually impossible for State (and Ole Miss) to raise their admissions standards. This would seem to directly or indirectly have an effect on several of the factors you have cited and, logically, make it much more difficult to increase the academic quality and integrity of the institution.

 

[jakldawg]

Because in terms of attainability, it's the only one that (I think) MSU would have a shot at. The USN&WR rankings are more of a dog-and-pony show for the most elite universities, whereas these rankings (along with AAU membership) are more useful for showing how well universities can get funding for research, which is more important for bringing in respected faculty, and overall university... prestige (probably not the right word). Keep in mind that most of the top research universities have med schools associated with them, because that's where all the research $ is. With the way the MS legislature is cutting higher ed. funding (which hurts competitiveness in terms of new faculty hiring), Keenum will have his work cut out for him.
Oh, and it is possible to be Tier 3 in USN&WR, but be considered a "Tier 1" research university (I think Pitt and Cincy are both examples of this, but they both have med schools).

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

Both departments had cuts made in them just like all the other departments. MSU is NOT getting away from agriculture.

 

[38843dawg]

and next year there will be even more cuts.

 

[UpTheMiddlex3Punt]

It's that as far as the liberal arts go, we're pretty weak. Auburn is primarily an Ag and Engineering school and managed to get one. Our Ag and Engineering programs are outstanding and highly regarded.

Granted, the liberal arts programs have come a long way in the last couple decades. The Honors program was a joke when I was there less than 10 years ago and now it looks pretty legitimate. If they can make some double major crossover programs (e.g. Math and Electrical Engineering or Mechanical Engineering and Physics) it will go a long way to getting top students in the A&S college and getting MSU a PBK chapter.

 

[The Big Slick]

Some older hippie lady with big tits from USM taught a summer ethics class just for the hell of it. If you came to class and half way participated in discussions, you got an A. Several class sessions were held at what was then The Bistro, over beer.

 

[ScoobaDawg]

[No message]

 

[beyourowndawg]

I did a little research on this a month or so ago in order to respond to a Tiger who was boasting about this on VZ's blog.

The US News & World Report did away with Tier 2 a few years ago. Now there's only Tier 1, Tier 3, & Tier 4. Tier 1 consists of the universities in the top 50% according to thier evaluation system. These schools get ranked. They don't rank Tier 3& Tier 4, each of which represents the next 25% in their evals.

If memory serves, there's like 260 or so "national universities" that USN&WR includesin their 4 tiers. So, if Tier 2 still existed, the dividing line between Tiers 2 & 3 would be somewhere around the 130th ranked school. LSU's ranking is 128. Point being, they aren't that far from being Tier 3, like us.

Not that any of this really helps us much. Just knowledge to have in case you find yourself arounda corndog-smelling coonarse wants to brag about LSU's Tier 1 status.</p>

 

[Fresno Bob]

God be with you.

 

[dawgstudent]

I would consider reading them.

 

[beyourowndawg]

nm

 

[beyourowndawg]

nm