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Major problem for the future of High school football, bigger than Private vs Publics

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SweetWalter34

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Apr 16, 2013
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For those of you who are withholding your sons from football, I am sincerely curious:
- Do you believe football is substantially less dangerous than a generation ago?
- What concussion treatment protocols did you follow when you played? Any mandatory resting to heal?
- How low a rate of concussion incidence would you need to see before you allowed your son to play football? The same rate as soccer, hockey, basketball, or 0.00%?
 
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septon34

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Jul 12, 2012
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mchsalumni said:
Flag football can get pretty aggressive and would look more like rugby over time. My boys play, if they get head injuries they will be yanked, but I'm not holding them out.
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If I had sons, I would hope they choose NOT to play football. And I'm not sure how I would react if they insisted on playing. It is a very difficult position for parents, and I don't pass judgment on any parent for their decision.

That being said, lets not try to pretend that flag football is physical or some sort of adequate substitute for real football. I played fairly competitive flag football at U of I, with almost everyone in the league having played varsity high school football. There is zero comparision to flag football and rugby.
 
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mchsalumni

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Sep 24, 2008
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septon34 said:
I played fairly competitive flag football at U of I, with almost everyone in the league having played varsity high school football. There is zero comparision to flag football and rugby.
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I didn't say it would be like rugby, I said it would turn into something like rugby. People always push envelopes.
 
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Snetsrak61

Snetsrak61

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Aug 16, 2008
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SweetWalter34 said:
For those of you who are withholding your sons from football, I am sincerely curious:
- Do you believe football is substantially less dangerous than a generation ago?
- What concussion treatment protocols did you follow when you played? Any mandatory resting to heal?
- How low a rate of concussion incidence would you need to see before you allowed your son to play? The same rate as soccer, hockey, basketball, or 0.00%?
Click to expand...
I don't have kids yet, but if I do have sons I certainly wont steer them that way, but I probably would let them play if they sought it out.

1. No, probably safer now actually.
2. I feel like it was someone lax. No one was pushed to ignore concussions, but if a player said he was fine I feel like it wasn't really investigated except in extreme situations like when they were walking to the wrong huddle. Seems like today it's more assumed something is wrong if you're at all slow to get up and more subtle signs are looked at instead of just knowing your own name. Never was concussed in padded football, but still took a lot of violent hits to the head. I know a few specific examples of guys having a long healing time or stopping football altogether but we never had an official mandatory healing as far as I know.
3. I'm not sure, but even with those sports you're gonna be more diligent in those hard hits to the head.
 
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BoilerRC90

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Oct 2, 2014
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I would honestly steer my kids towards rugby. I have played rugby for longer than I have football and have seen less concussions in that time span for that sport. They teach tackling differently and it is safer for your head for both the offensive and defensive players. With the Olympics picking rugby back up, colleges now offering rugby scholarships and a professional rugby league kicking off in April, I could see a shift over the next 5-10 years of players opting to move into that sport. Especially if the trend in numbers for head injuries keeps rising.

It is also way more fun to play/watch than flag football.
 
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SweetWalter34

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septon34 said:
I think football, as we know it, will be extinct. I could see flag football becoming a varsity sport in most schools. But I highly doubt flag football will ever be a popular spectator sport. An intricate part of the allure of football is the physicality and toughness.
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I think that football ever becoming "extinct" is an extreme possibility.
What I feel is much, much more likely is that the rules will be tweaked, including something like:
1. Face masks and hard helmets will be replaced by soft helmets without face masks (like rugby)
2. Hard shoulder pads will be replaced by soft shoulder pads
3. The head will be off-limits when tackling or blocking.
The above three changes would result in most collisions becoming much less concussive. Why? Head-in-front tackling, and below-the-waist tackling are virtually eliminated as head-to-head and head-to-knee collisions - the two most common causes of concussions - are avoided at all costs (players will very quickly come to learn this the easy way or the hard way.)
This approach also preserves the two most entertaining elements of the game of football:
- the forward pass
- the kickoff
Combine these three rules changes with continuous improvements in equipment and injury protocols and you have a very entertaining, fun to play, relatively safe game.
And, ironically, it might be professional rugby's future that we should worry about as football becomes more familiar and attractive to rugby fans.
 
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BoilerRC90

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So I know more about rugby than HS Football, but what you wrote is literally having football return to it's original form - Rugby.

1. They have soft head gear in rugby-optional (Worn for both concussion prevention and to avoid cauliflower ear).
2. They have shoulder pads-optional
3. Tackling high is a professional penalty and they can send you off
4. Tackling players in the air (defenseless) is a professional penalty
I agree with your points about the collisions becoming a lot less concussive, which is why I would steer my kids towards rugby. We always teach head behind because shoulders and knees tend to win the match up against a head.

Football came from rugby, Americans introduced the forward pass (rugby you have to kick forward) because it was exciting. You can pass forward in rugby by kicking, but that resembles soccer too much and we all know how people feel about that sport. As for the kickoffs, rugby pretty much always onside kicks, so to me that is way more exciting. Also, winner takes it type possession with the kickoffs.

I wouldn't worry about American (Internationals are not going to watch a startup rugby league) Rugby fans learning morea bout football, most of us have played it. The NFL owns a day of the week, so a lot of other countries are pretty aware of it as well. Jared Hayne just made the transition to NFL (Cut now, but with 49ers). The fact that you can play a sport professionally will always attract people to a sport growing up. Not everyone can go to the NFL or be a NCAA athlete, this is simply another route kids can take.
 
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BoilerRC90

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Oct 2, 2014
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Two more key things is we can't dump (lift a players legs above the parallel with the ground - avoids bad shoulder/spine/head injuries) and we must wrap when tackling (forces a more controlled collision). Still plenty of collisions and excitement in a game and teaches all the values you would want from a sport to your kid. Montini and Brother Rice have some good rugby programs, and I think it does have a positive effect on their football teams.

As a side note - I wear head gear, because my wife would leave me if I didn't (I used to just tape the ears).
 
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SweetWalter34

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Apr 16, 2013
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BoilerRC90 said:
So I know more about rugby than HS Football, but what you wrote is literally having football return to it's original form - Rugby.

1. They have soft head gear in rugby-optional (Worn for both concussion prevention and to avoid cauliflower ear).
2. They have shoulder pads-optional
3. Tackling high is a professional penalty and they can send you off
4. Tackling players in the air (defenseless) is a professional penalty
I agree with your points about the collisions becoming a lot less concussive, which is why I would steer my kids towards rugby. We always teach head behind because shoulders and knees tend to win the match up against a head.

Football came from rugby, Americans introduced the forward pass (rugby you have to kick forward) because it was exciting. You can pass forward in rugby by kicking, but that resembles soccer too much and we all know how people feel about that sport. As for the kickoffs, rugby pretty much always onside kicks, so to me that is way more exciting. Also, winner takes it type possession with the kickoffs.

I wouldn't worry about American (Internationals are not going to watch a startup rugby league) Rugby fans learning morea bout football, most of us have played it. The NFL owns a day of the week, so a lot of other countries are pretty aware of it as well. Jared Hayne just made the transition to NFL (Cut now, but with 49ers). The fact that you can play a sport professionally will always attract people to a sport growing up. Not everyone can go to the NFL or be a NCAA athlete, this is simply another route kids can take.
Click to expand...
I agree with every point you make.
However, I would emphasize that the forward pass (thrown not kicked) in football - which rugby does not allow - is a key differentiator between the two great games; and it is a HUGE differentiator.
 
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Wild_Mustang

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Jul 30, 2010
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I'll have my kids play football, not a doubt in my mind, I'm going to push him towards it as well. The game is so much safer now...the equipment and the rules. I'm not saying they won't get dinged up or maybe even get a concussion, but unless my kid goes to the NFL (which won't happen), the chances of him having brain damage is pretty minimal. You can throw any stat at me you want, but playing football in high school won't make my kid a wet brain. College, maybe but doubtful. NFL...50/50 chance.

This is my opinion, I'm sure some of you will disagree. But my kid will 100% play football. What the sport of football teaches a young man is so valuable. I know we all agree on that. I think it's worth a headache or two along the way.
 
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