Maybe we leave Lamont in place

Skuddy

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It would be fun and NEEDED for us to be good at anything in men's sports.

Do we have ANY men's sports that are any good?

Edit: I did a quick look and Tennis seems to be the only one.
 
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Harvard Gamecock

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Kill off interest in MBB entirely so that all funds can be shifted to making football more relevant.

It would be fun if we were good in basketball. We NEED to be good in football.
 

18IsTheMan

Heisman
Oct 1, 2014
18,663
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Why?

MBB does not really benefit the AD. Minimally.

If you kill it off in the short term, commit all available resources to football to make that relevant and if that works, then you can actually have resources to put towards making basketball relevant.
 

Go Gamecocks

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Jan 19, 2021
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MBB does not really benefit the AD.
Turn our liabilities into assets.
Go full Globetrotter mode.
Offer free food, free tickets, lots of gimmicks, chicken dance, etc.
Create epic half-time shows with things like monkeys riding bikes, etc.
Recruit the tallest players anywhere and put all of them on the court at one time.
Zany new unis/warmups.
;)
 

18IsTheMan

Heisman
Oct 1, 2014
18,663
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Turn our liabilities into assets.
Go full Globetrotter mode.
Offer free food, free tickets, lots of gimmicks, chicken dance, etc.
Create epic half-time shows with things like monkeys riding bikes, etc.
Recruit the tallest players anywhere and put all of them on the court at one time.
Zany new unis/warmups.
;)
It's just crazy enough to work.
 
Feb 11, 2006
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Kill off interest in MBB entirely so that all funds can be shifted to making football more relevant.

It would be fun if we were good in basketball. We NEED to be good in football.
Several players red shirted, which was strange when this team is so bad, why not follow your suggestion, lets save some $ for football and see what he is building :)
 
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18IsTheMan

Heisman
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Several players red shirte, which was strange when this team is so bad, why not follow yoru suggestion, lets save some $ for football and see what he is building :)
Yeah. If we had unlimited resources, it would be a different discussion. We don't.

I just wonder if we don't worry too much about basketball for the time being and put all of our effort and energy (and resources) into football maybe we can finally accomplish something there. A good football program is good for the entire athletics department.
 

Harvard Gamecock

All-Conference
May 5, 2014
2,835
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Why?

MBB does not really benefit the AD. Minimally.

If you kill it off in the short term, commit all available resources to football to make that relevant and if that works, then you can actually have resources to put towards making basketball relevant.
 

18IsTheMan

Heisman
Oct 1, 2014
18,663
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Yep! Perfect gif! It's time for a new kind of thinking. The old school model simply doesn't work in this environment.

I know it's a tough adjustment for some to make, but resources have to be allocated to those endeavors that matter most.
 

Bubba Fett

Joined Oct 6, 2000
Feb 1, 2022
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Turn our liabilities into assets.
Go full Globetrotter mode.
Offer free food, free tickets, lots of gimmicks, chicken dance, etc.
Create epic half-time shows with things like monkeys riding bikes, etc.
Recruit the tallest players anywhere and put all of them on the court at one time.
Zany new unis/warmups.
;)
I'd watch. Be fun.

Cockyball

Better than whatever the hell that thing is they're doing now.
 

SouthernBelly

Senior
Sep 16, 2024
754
580
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Turn our liabilities into assets.
Go full Globetrotter mode.
Offer free food, free tickets, lots of gimmicks, chicken dance, etc.
Create epic half-time shows with things like monkeys riding bikes, etc.
Recruit the tallest players anywhere and put all of them on the court at one time.
Zany new unis/warmups.
;)
All of that sounds great but Paris doesn’t use the height as is. But I’m definitely there for monkeys on bikes
 

adcoop

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Jan 10, 2004
1,485
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We are never going to spend our way to greatness in football. There are just bigger states in our conference with more resources that have people care about football just as much as we do. Using MLB as an analogy, we are never going to be the Dodgers or Yankees. Just not going to happen. However, we can be the Tampa Bay Rays. A program that uses its resources wisely and is a consistent contender.
 
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3USC1801

Joined Dec 10, 2020
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Not only be the worst team in the SEC, let’s be the hands-down
#1 laughing stock, too. /s

And, before you say, “We already are the laughing stock in MBB,“ I’d remind you that there’s a difference between irrelevance and absolute foolishness. Prancing around with gimmicks is Barnum and Bailey level. No, thank you.

As to outspending other universities in football, SC doesnt have to be the top dog. Indiana is an example. I don’t believe they‘ve outspent or out-recruited the Texas or Ohio State programs, to use two prominent schools with prolific spenders.

Indiana was primarily built with 2-star and 3-star players. That’s been proven. And, you don’t spend big money on those players. You don’t have to. What you do is coach them up and out scheme your opponents on a consistent basis. Why not us?
 
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18IsTheMan

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We are never going to spend our way to greatness in football. There are just bigger states in our conference with more resources that have people care about football just as much as we do. Using MLB as an analogy, we are never going to be the Dodgers or Yankees. Just not going to happen. However, we can be the Tampa Bay Rays. A program that uses its resources wisely and is a consistent contender.

But can we do it while also spending on basketball? If we're already dealing with comparatively limited resources, as you point out, does it not make sense to concentrate those resources on the most fiscally important sport?
 

Piscis

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Nov 30, 2001
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Not only be the worst team in the SEC, let’s be the hands-down
#1 laughing stock, too. /s

And, before you say, “We already are the laughing stock in MBB,“ I’d remind you that there’s a difference between irrelevance and absolute foolishness. Prancing around with gimmicks is Barnum and Bailey level. No, thank you.

As to outspending other universities in football, SC doesnt have to be the top dog. Indiana is an example. I don’t believe they‘ve outspent or out-recruited the Texas or Ohio State programs, to use two prominent schools with prolific spenders.

Indiana was primarily built with 2-star and 3-star players. That’s been proven. And, you don’t spend big money on those players. You don’t have to. What you do is coach them up and out scheme your opponents on a consistent basis. Why not us?
Ah, the good old "coach them up and out scheme" plan. I guess that makes firing Beamer a given since he has been here for 5 seasons and hasn't coached the team up or out schemed anyone enough to amount to anything of consequence. I'll add that he hasn't done anything of consequence with much better talent than IU has, at least according to you.

Why didn't Holtz or Spurrier, two hall of fame coaches "coach them up or out scheme opponents" enough to win a championship of any kind?
 

adcoop

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Jan 10, 2004
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But can we do it while also spending on basketball? If we're already dealing with comparatively limited resources, as you point out, does it not make sense to concentrate those resources on the most fiscally important sport?
May as well spend on basketball. May need to do like Kentucky and spend more on basketball because we are never going to outspend Texas, A&M, Georgia, or Florida. Probably won't outspend LSU, Tennessee, or Oklahoma either. We saw the formula to win here back in 2011-2013. Right coach. Focus on the times when there is a strong in-state recruiting class. That's when we win. All the worrying about money is just spinning around trying to chase your tail. We can be competitive in the area of money. However, there are going to several programs with more resources. It's like our recruiting. We are usually around a Top 20 program in National Recruiting, but there are 10 SEC teams in front of us.
 

adcoop

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Ah, the good old "coach them up and out scheme" plan. I guess that makes firing Beamer a given since he has been here for 5 seasons and hasn't coached the team up or out schemed anyone enough to amount to anything of consequence. I'll add that he hasn't done anything of consequence with much better talent than IU has, at least according to you.

Why didn't Holtz or Spurrier, two hall of fame coaches "coach them up or out scheme opponents" enough to win a championship of any kind?
With Spurrier, we actually should have been in the SEC Championship game three years in a row. We got upset by an inferior SEC opponent in 2 of those years. So, it can be done. Just have to make it happen when it is in front of us. Heck, the National Media thinks we are good right now. We have just proven to have underachieved.
 
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3USC1801

Joined Dec 10, 2020
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Ah, the good old "coach them up and out scheme" plan. I guess that makes firing Beamer a given since he has been here for 5 seasons and hasn't coached the team up or out schemed anyone enough to amount to anything of consequence. I'll add that he hasn't done anything of consequence with much better talent than IU has, at least according to you.

Why didn't Holtz or Spurrier, two hall of fame coaches "coach them up or out scheme opponents" enough to win a championship of any kind?
And what is your proposal for success? You’ve already eliminated hiring someone with a plan to “coach them up and out scheme the opponent” (see Cignetti). I suppose you think Saban just magically produced a winner due to his personality or that Kiffin used his social charm to squeeze out wins during his time with Ole Miss? What’s your secret?
 

Harvard Gamecock

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May 5, 2014
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But can we do it while also spending on basketball? If we're already dealing with comparatively limited resources, as you point out, does it not make sense to concentrate those resources on the most fiscally important sport?
Do you really seriously believe this would make a sound argument in the AD's office ? If anything a turnaround in the MBB program could happen more quickly that the FB program.
This proposal would give the national perception that we are just not committed to, or worse yet incapable of providing more than 1 successful sports program for the university.
The major flaw with you theory, is that you are assuming if resources are cut from one program, that would automatically translate to success in another.

I hope to never see the day we abandon our sports programs for such a whimsical proposition.
 
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HWGcock

Joined Nov 2, 1998 • Garnet Trust Supporter
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If we retain Paris, need to charge $5 per ticket with free hot dogs, popcorn and cokes. Hell, I still wouldn’t go and live 4 miles from CLA.
 

atl-cock

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Jan 18, 2022
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Kill off interest in MBB entirely so that all funds can be shifted to making football more relevant.

It would be fun if we were good in basketball. We NEED to be good in football.
We need to be good in all sports.
 

atl-cock

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Jan 18, 2022
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Yep! Perfect gif! It's time for a new kind of thinking. The old school model simply doesn't work in this environment.

I know it's a tough adjustment for some to make, but resources have to be allocated to those endeavors that matter most.
If you are referencing football, then it matters to you,
 

muscleknight

Senior
Mar 25, 2001
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Kill off interest in MBB entirely so that all funds can be shifted to making football more relevant.

It would be fun if we were good in basketball. We NEED to be good in football.
Make up the lost revenue through tractor pulls, monster trucks and concerts?
 

atl-cock

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Football matters most to EVERYONE. No football = no sports teams at all.

Football makes everything else possible.
Then how do schools which do not sponsor football have a viable athletics program?
 

ThinnyJ

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Sep 16, 2023
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Not only be the worst team in the SEC, let’s be the hands-down
#1 laughing stock, too. /s

And, before you say, “We already are the laughing stock in MBB,“ I’d remind you that there’s a difference between irrelevance and absolute foolishness. Prancing around with gimmicks is Barnum and Bailey level. No, thank you.

As to outspending other universities in football, SC doesnt have to be the top dog. Indiana is an example. I don’t believe they‘ve outspent or out-recruited the Texas or Ohio State programs, to use two prominent schools with prolific spenders.

Indiana was primarily built with 2-star and 3-star players. That’s been proven. And, you don’t spend big money on those players. You don’t have to. What you do is coach them up and out scheme your opponents on a consistent basis. Why not us?
2 and 3 Star players that are older, more physically developed, and more seasoned than everyone they're playing against. - an investment in proven decent play rather than in potential - this doesn't really work as much with basketball.
 
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Piscis

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And what is your proposal for success? You’ve already eliminated hiring someone with a plan to “coach them up and out scheme the opponent” (see Cignetti). I suppose you think Saban just magically produced a winner due to his personality or that Kiffin used his social charm to squeeze out wins during his time with Ole Miss? What’s your secret?
Hire a proven head coach with a record of winning. Saban already had won a NC at LSU and 2 SEC championships in 5 seasons. Kiffin gamed the system and is also a very good offensive coach (he still hasn't won a championship of any kind, or even played for one, as head coach). Urban Meyer (a detestable human being) won at Utah before UF hired him. Cignetti won at 3 different schools as head coach before IU hired him. Being a successful head coach is very much like being a top tier CEO. A head coach has to have a vision, a plan and the ability to find and hire a staff that will execute that vision and plan.

Spurrier and Holtz were good coaches. The problem was, they came to SC at the end of their careers when their best days were behind them. Spurrier caught recruiting lightning in a bottle with Lattimore, Clowney, Shaw and a generally talented roster, but he couldn't keep the momentum going because he was old and tired and ready to retire.

Hiring a hyperactive, emotional basket case position coach because of who his father was and because ex players liked him is not the recipe for real success.
 

Piscis

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Then how do schools which do not sponsor football have a viable athletics program?
Define "viable". Schools without football programs generally have MUCH smaller athletic departments with smaller budgets, smaller facilities, etc..

USC Aiken is a pretty good example. They are very competitive in all sports they play. Their teams travel in vans, their recruiting budgets are in the tens of thousands of dollars and their facilities are small and much more basic than larger schools. They are very viable and student fees, donations, advertising at venues and gate receipts fund their athletics.
 
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3USC1801

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Hire a proven head coach with a record of winning. Saban already had won a NC at LSU and 2 SEC championships in 5 seasons. Kiffin gamed the system and is also a very good offensive coach (he still hasn't won a championship of any kind, or even played for one, as head coach). Urban Meyer (a detestable human being) won at Utah before UF hired him. Cignetti won at 3 different schools as head coach before IU hired him. Being a successful head coach is very much like being a top tier CEO. A head coach has to have a vision, a plan and the ability to find and hire a staff that will execute that vision and plan.

Spurrier and Holtz were good coaches. The problem was, they came to SC at the end of their careers when their best days were behind them. Spurrier caught recruiting lightning in a bottle with Lattimore, Clowney, Shaw and a generally talented roster, but he couldn't keep the momentum going because he was old and tired and ready to retire.

Hiring a hyperactive, emotional basket case position coach because of who his father was and because ex players liked him is not the recipe for real success.
So, we are saying the same thing. Hire a coach who can coach players up and out maneuver the opponent (in your case, you’ve added the caveat “a proven coach” to the equation).

I’m not familiar with the inner workings of USC’s hiring decisions so I can’t comment on it but Beamer is who we have as a coach. I think we all know he’s not necessarily an “X and O” type coach. However, as our diminutive upstate rival has proven, you don’t have to be the wizard of coaching to succeed. You just have to get out of the way of those who are gifted in that area. Maybe with Briles and Co. we will see success.
 

atl-cock

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Hire a proven head coach with a record of winning. Saban already had won a NC at LSU and 2 SEC championships in 5 seasons. Kiffin gamed the system and is also a very good offensive coach (he still hasn't won a championship of any kind, or even played for one, as head coach). Urban Meyer (a detestable human being) won at Utah before UF hired him. Cignetti won at 3 different schools as head coach before IU hired him. Being a successful head coach is very much like being a top tier CEO. A head coach has to have a vision, a plan and the ability to find and hire a staff that will execute that vision and plan.

Spurrier and Holtz were good coaches. The problem was, they came to SC at the end of their careers when their best days were behind them. Spurrier caught recruiting lightning in a bottle with Lattimore, Clowney, Shaw and a generally talented roster, but he couldn't keep the momentum going because he was old and tired and ready to retire.

Hiring a hyperactive, emotional basket case position coach because of who his father was and because ex players liked him is not the recipe for real success.
That is an excellent summation of Spurrier's time at USC.
 

Lurker123

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A true Gamecock fan wants all sports the school sponsors to compete well and represent USC well, whether or not they follow or don't follow a sport. And I don't want any one sport to excel at the expense of any other.

That is certainly one opinion of a "true" gamecock fan. I do not share it though.
 

atl-cock

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Define "viable". Schools without football programs generally have MUCH smaller athletic departments with smaller budgets, smaller facilities, etc..

USC Aiken is a pretty good example. They are very competitive in all sports they play. Their teams travel in vans, their recruiting budgets are in the tens of thousands of dollars and their facilities are small and much more basic than larger schools. They are very viable and student fees, donations, advertising at venues and gate receipts fund their athletics.
Sounds viable to me. Not big time, but much more conducive to true intercollegiate competition.
 

Piscis

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So, we are saying the same thing. Hire a coach who can coach players up and out maneuver the opponent (in your case, you’ve added the caveat “a proven coach” to the equation).

I’m not familiar with the inner workings of USC’s hiring decisions so I can’t comment on it but Beamer is who we have as a coach. I think we all know he’s not necessarily an “X and O” type coach. However, as our diminutive upstate rival has proven, you don’t have to be the wizard of coaching to succeed. You just have to get out of the way of those who are gifted in that area. Maybe with Briles and Co. we will see success.
A big difference with Saban, Kiffin, Meyer and Dabo is; they start with players who are already at the maximum level of talent and ability that most other programs hope to coach their players up to. Saban, et al then develop those top talented players even further and end up with elite talent.

I always find it amusing that some fans (of all teams, not just ours) assume that their coaches are going to "coach up" and "out scheme" opponents but the highly successful coaches who recruit better talent are going to sit still and not develop their players at all and aren't going to watch tape and scheme to win games. Having an elite football program requires laser focus and demand for excellence from everyone involved, from the head coach down to the trainers.
 

Piscis

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Sounds viable to me. Not big time, but much more conducive to true intercollegiate competition.
I think smaller school college athletics is much more like "real college sports". I went to a Georgia Southern game a few years ago. The stadium holds about 30,000 and the game day feel was very much like a South Carolina game in the 1970s. It was fun.
 
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