winning percentage means more
Joe's was outstanding, but not as good as the Bear's or Saban's
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- Thread starter ConcealedCarry
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Joe's was outstanding, but not as good as the Bear's or Saban's
No excuse for 2000, 2001, 2003, and 2004. Joe stayed too long.
But his last 7 years...
2 BiG titles
3 top 10 finishes (probably would have been 4 if not for the scandal)
#3 in the country in 2005
76% win percentage
I'd hardly call that middle of the road.
I loved Paterno….i grew up on him because my father was a PSU grad and a huge JoePa fan. I just don’t think he was the greatest ever. He stayed too long and ultimately hurt the program because of it (and I’m not talking about the Sandusky mess). Those last 16 years made us less of a desirable location for top talent.
Funky Fudd tells it like it is...
Tell us some more Fudd.
Fails as troll...
Succeeds as gnome.
If you and others stop making Joe out to be better than he was there wouldn't be any fighting. Look at winning percentage and titles. 409 only speaks to longevity and reminds us he stayed over a decade longer than he should have.
Crapped your pants again jumbo. Go back to your racist friends.
opinions vary
we all (well most of us anyway) loved Joe but it's long past time to support the coach we have and look forward this debate does nothing to benefit anybody
No one won it, they were mythical until the last 12 years
Still mythical really. No such thing as an official Division 1-A championship.
What does treating Joe w/ respect have to do with supporting the current team? Nothing.
= useless.
For the record, national championships were awarded, not necessarily won.
Yeah 68 69 73 and 94 should have had 6 Titles
Saban inherited a team with a great national tradition at Alabama. Joe inherited a team that was hardly known nationally.
That's not a dig at Saban. I'm just saying that Saban started near the top which is a totally different thing.
And Joe inherited a 40,000-seat stadium. Look at it now. It's the house that Joe built.
Is there any doubt the '94 team would have stomped the guts out of both Indiana and tOSU?
I think most of us agree that Joe stayed too long and that there was no excuse for the 4 dark years. The fact that his inability to travel to recruit had to hurt. That said he somehow overcame that during his final 7 years when he won 2 BiG titles and had 3 top 10 finishes. He even had a top 5 recruiting class until it fell apart because of the scandal. I guess he was doing that with the help of assistants and the reputation he built over time.
But let's put that all aside. There are 2 reasons I consider JoePa to be great. One is that he started with a program that hadn't accomplished much on the national stage. Rip Engle was 6-4 in 1964 and 5-5 in 1965. His teams never played in a major bowl game. So if you look at where Joe started and where he finished. Beaver Stadium sat 40k in 1965 and 106k when Joe left.
I think an argument could be made that Bear Bryant was greater than Saban. Bryant took over from Jennings Wentworth in 1958 after Wentworth teams went a combined 4-24-2 during the previous 3 years. Bryant took Alabama from nothing to a National powerhouse. Saban took over from Shula who struggled but Alabama was already a powerhouse program.
The second and more important reason I think Joe was a great coach is because of his emphasis on academics and doing things the right way. IIRC PSU was one of only 2 college football teams without a major recruiting violation. PSU fans who suffered through a subpar season could hang their hats on the fact that their team didn't cheat. I think that counts for a lot and to be honest I miss those days.
If you go by national championships Saban would be the best but he started from a better spot and I count more than just the wins and losses. JMO.
And Knute Rockne’s Fighting Irish teams would have beaten them all. If we’re going to go back and make up hypotheticals, let’s go way back.
FWIW, talked to a letterman today and a close friend of Hack's. The letterman (not a distinguished one) said Campbell was the plan all along but he wouldn't agree or announce or sign until the season was over. The past 50 days have been backup plans, reach outs, etc..
Hack's friend sort of said the same thing but that during the search Kraft did begin to warm to guys (BYU), but MC was always the choice.
Hack's friend sort of said the same thing but that during the search Kraft did begin to warm to guys (BYU), but MC was always the choice.
I think it could be said that there was also a decline in talent within PA.
And we know whether this is really true or just another of the many rumors that were circulating during the search? It sounds preposterous to me, but if someone has documented evidence...
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I choose to believe this.
Yea, ok. When I met the women of my dreams I also made the mistake of proposing to another girl first. Glad it worked out for me too.
I agree with most of what you said and I loved Joepa. But staying too long cannot be minimized. As you stated, he was slipping and was being propped up by the good will inherent in the program that he had built and his assistants. Everyone knew he had to go but he stayed because he was too big to be told otherwise. IMO, it was selfish to stay. When the Sandusky scandal hit, he became the story and he was unable to handle it the way a younger coach may have. As a result, the program that he built and his legacy were irreparably damaged. Personally, I have great appreciation for everything he did, but his legacy includes the building of the program AND the epic collapse resulting from the Sandusky scandal. The end result is a legacy that the university cannot fully embrace with the pride it initially deserved.
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I think it’s BS, but to be fair, the majority of people here were ready to jump off a cliff by the middle of November and wanted Kraft to sign anybody at that point. So from their perspective, Kraft did the right thing and tried to settle for someone (Sitake) instead of waiting for the right guy (Campbell).