Nance

[clarificationcat]

I think Nance is the focus of way too much criticism on this board. He's a sophomore who is still figuring out how to use his length at the collegiate level. By the time he's a senior, he will be a very good B1G player. He had 9 rebounds, 2 blocks and 4 assists yesterday. He helped us win the game even though his shot was not falling. He was the best player on the court against Purdue and had 14 points against Michigan State.

I wish he were more aggressive offensively but I don't think he's lazy or has a bad attitude. He brought the ball up in high school and doesn't have a post-game yet. He's not as quick or explosive as his dad or his brother so he's not able to overwhelm defenders driving to the basket. He is still figuring out how to score at this level. If we are going to be a good team, he will be an important part of it. He looks to be a couple of inches taller than Young and Beran (so either they are shorter than listed or he is closer to 7 feet). He's a good passer and has a decent handle for a guy his size. His shot is erratic but from 15 feet in he is pretty effective. There are a lot of players who made huge strides after their sophomore year. He needs to play this year and he will get better. He will likely never be a big-time scorer but he will be able to affect games in a lot of different ways like Law.

 

[Medill90]

I'll take Nance's 9 rebounds, 4 assists and 3 blocks against Nebby pretty much any Big Ten game

 

[GatoLouco]

There’s been enough games where his length bothered opponents. Where, without it, we would have allowed more points.

 

[PurpleFaze]

He’s got the tools. As he matures hopefully his decision making improves (shot selection/dumb fouls) and that will make him a better player. He may not end up being a star, but he’s still a valuable player and a big part of our rotation.

 

[go cats go_rivals310290]

Nance is one of our best defenders, especially with Gaines out.

Jones is also a very good defender.

 

[hdhntr1]

I think Nance is the focus of way too much criticism on this board. He's a sophomore who is still figuring out how to use his length at the collegiate level. By the time he's a senior, he will be a very good B1G player. He had 9 rebounds, 2 blocks and 4 assists yesterday. He helped us win the game even though his shot was not falling. He was the best player on the court against Purdue and had 14 points against Michigan State.

I wish he were more aggressive offensively but I don't think he's lazy or has a bad attitude. He brought the ball up in high school and doesn't have a post-game yet. He's not as quick or explosive as his dad or his brother so he's not able to overwhelm defenders driving to the basket. He is still figuring out how to score at this level. If we are going to be a good team, he will be an important part of it. He looks to be a couple of inches taller than Young and Beran (so either they are shorter than listed or he is closer to 7 feet). He's a good passer and has a decent handle for a guy his size. His shot is erratic but from 15 feet in he is pretty effective. There are a lot of players who made huge strides after their sophomore year. He needs to play this year and he will get better. He will likely never be a big-time scorer but he will be able to affect games in a lot of different ways like Law.

I don't think anyone said those things about him. And on D he seems fine. Just saying on O while he is 6'10", he seems to play more like he is 6'2". My better half asks why he is on the floor and I sure will not go that far. But when he attacks like he is 6'10" (he did a couple times yesterday and results positive) you can see what he can do and can be. Just want to see more of that and less of the 6'2" Nance on O

 

[rwhitney014]

Nance is one of our best defenders, especially with Gaines out.

Jones is also a very good defender.

For Jones, the transition from foul-prone post defender to staying straight up so quickly has been miraculous, though he did catch a good break on one no-call yesterday. He couldn’t make it through a half in November, and now he’s giving us great minutes. I’m excited about him.

Also, Brian James is an NBA-caliber big man coach. What he’s done with Pardon and now Young, Jones, and even Beran is strong work. Gives me all the confidence that Nance will come along too.

 

[Alan Smithee_rivals156293]

There’s been enough games where his length bothered opponents. Where, without it, we would have allowed more points.

Last night was definitely such a game.

 

[clarificationcat]

I don't think anyone said those things about him. And on D he seems fine. Just saying on O while he is 6'10", he seems to play more like he is 6'2". My better half asks why he is on the floor and I sure will not go that far. But when he attacks like he is 6'10" (he did a couple times yesterday and results positive) you can see what he can do and can be. Just want to see more of that and less of the 6'2" Nance on O

I don't think anyone said those things about him. And on D he seems fine. Just saying on O while he is 6'10", he seems to play more like he is 6'2". My better half asks why he is on the floor and I sure will not go that far. But when he attacks like he is 6'10" (he did a couple times yesterday and results positive) you can see what he can do and can be. Just want to see more of that and less of the 6'2" Nance on O

He has been criticized for his effort in warmups and for pouting after fouls. And he absolutely takes the brunt of criticism after losses. He's not the only inconsistent player on the team but he definitely gets called out more when he plays poorly. Young had 2 points yesterday and 3 points against Purdue. Like I said, Nance definitely needs be more aggressive in taking advantage of mismatches, but I think a little patience is warranted this year.

 

[GatoLouco]

It seems you are being selective on just looking at the critical comments. For the most part people here have criticized his offensive choices while recognizing he brings a lot of other things to the table.

Ultimately it seems pretty much your opinion of his play.

 

[go cats go_rivals310290]

He has been criticized for his effort in warmups and for pouting after fouls. And he absolutely takes the brunt of criticism after losses. He's not the only inconsistent player on the team but he definitely gets called out more when he plays poorly. Young had 2 points yesterday and 3 points against Purdue. Like I said, Nance definitely needs be more aggressive in taking advantage of mismatches, but I think a little patience is warranted this year.

I called him out for pouting after foul calls...but that is different from saying that he is lazy or has a bad attitude.

 

[hdhntr1]

He has been criticized for his effort in warmups and for pouting after fouls. And he absolutely takes the brunt of criticism after losses. He's not the only inconsistent player on the team but he definitely gets called out more when he plays poorly. Young had 2 points yesterday and 3 points against Purdue. Like I said, Nance definitely needs be more aggressive in taking advantage of mismatches, but I think a little patience is warranted this year.

To those that much is given, much is expected.

Young took all of 4 shots. They really were not getting him the ball Certain games that seems to be the approach. We really were not working to get much inside. He had one blocked, the one he made was on a rebound and he missed a bunny. But all were contested. And Young is a First Year playing in his first games

 

[clarificationcat]

It seems you are being selective on just looking at the critical comments. For the most part people here have criticized his offensive choices while recognizing he brings a lot of other things to the table.

Ultimately it seems pretty much your opinion of his play.

If you go back through the threads, I am pretty sure you will find a disproportionate amount of Nance c

I called him out for pouting after foul calls...but that is different from saying that he is lazy or has a bad attitude.

To those that much is given, much is expected.

Young took all of 4 shots. They really were not getting him the ball Certain games that seems to be the approach. We really were not working to get much inside. He had one blocked, the one he made was on a rebound and he missed a bunny. But all were contested. And Young is a First Year playing in his first games

Young is in his second year in the program and has played a ton this year. He played poorly yesterday. No big deal. That was my point. As our center, he can still get points on put backs, block shots, etc.

 

[go cats go_rivals310290]

If you go back through the threads, I am pretty sure you will find a disproportionate amount of Nance c


Young is in his second year in the program and has played a ton this year. He played poorly yesterday. No big deal. That was my point. As our center, he can still get points on put backs, block shots, etc.

If you believe in advanced stats, Young is our best player.

There is an interesting advanced stat called Box Plus/Minus (BPM) that quantifies "a box score estimate of the points per 100 possessions a player contributed above a league-average player, translated to an average team."

Here are NU's individual BPM numbers on the season (best to worst):
Young 6.2
Gaines 4.0
Buie 2.7
Kopp 2.4
Nance 2.3
Spencer 2.0
Beran 0.9
Turner -1.0
Jones -1.5
Greer -3.4

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/northwestern/2020.html

 

[clarificationcat]

If you believe in advanced stats, Young is our best player.

There is an interesting advanced stat called Box Plus/Minus (BPM) that quantifies "a box score estimate of the points per 100 possessions a player contributed above a league-average player, translated to an average team."

Here are NU's individual BPM numbers on the season (best to worst):
Young 6.2
Gaines 4.0
Buie 2.7
Kopp 2.4
Nance 2.3
Spencer 2.0
Beran 0.9
Turner -1.0
Jones -1.5
Greer -3.4

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/northwestern/2020.html

He has been a huge surprise and has played well in a bunch of games. I didn't think he played well yesterday or in a few other conference games. That happens with most college players, particularly young players. He has a lower ceiling than some of our players but he can certainly continue to get better.

 

[go cats go_rivals310290]

He has been a huge surprise and has played well in a bunch of games. I didn't think he played well yesterday or in a few other conference games. That happens with most college players, particularly young players. He has a lower ceiling than some of our players but he can certainly continue to get better.

It seems like when they get him involved early on in the offense, he plays well. It could also be that these happen to also be the game when he factored heavily in the offensive plans going in. But he's doing great for a freshman big man.

This season has been such a surprise with Young, Spencer and (to a certain extent) Buie.

 

[GOUNUII]

It seems like when they get him involved early on in the offense, he plays well. It could also be that these happen to also be the game when he factored heavily in the offensive plans going in. But he's doing great for a freshman big man.

This season has been such a surprise with Young, Spencer and (to a certain extent) Buie.

I think Buie has been a huge surprise. After a very brief adjustment period he had all the look of a legit 4 star freshman before he went down.

Nowhere near the hype and recruiting interest of Beran. But has proven to be one heckuva baller.

GOUNUII

 

[go cats go_rivals310290]

I think Buie has been a huge surprise. After a very brief adjustment period he had all the look of a legit 4 star freshman before he went down.

Nowhere near the hype and recruiting interest of Beran. But has proven to be one heckuva baller.

GOUNUII

No doubt Buie has been surprisingly good. But I just meant that I didn't even expect Young and Spencer to be starters, much less average double figure points. I thought that there was a good chance that Buie might be a starter (as he only recently has). Maybe that's just where my expectations were when looking forward to this season.

 

[torque-cat]

I think Buie has been a huge surprise. After a very brief adjustment period he had all the look of a legit 4 star freshman before he went down.

Nowhere near the hype and recruiting interest of Beran. But has proven to be one heckuva baller.

GOUNUII

the few games that Buie went off were the best shot creation offense I have ever seen from an NU player. I pray he can get and stay healthy because to me a guard like that is exactly the type of player that can lead you deep into the tourney.

 

[NJCat]

I pray he can get and stay healthy because to me a guard like that is exactly the type of player that can lead you deep into the tourney.

I pray that he can get NU out of last place. One step at a time.......

 

[GOUNUII]

the few games that Buie went off were the best shot creation offense I have ever seen from an NU player. I pray he can get and stay healthy because to me a guard like that is exactly the type of player that can lead you deep into the tourney.

I want 3 of those kind of guards/wings. Guys that can beat you deep or take you to the hoop and finish ... smartly or with authority.

GOUNUII

 

[NJCat]

Like I said, Nance definitely needs be more aggressive in taking advantage of mismatches, but I think a little patience is warranted this year.

It's hard to believe, but Pete hasn't shot a FT in 10 consecutive games. He's 15 of 17 on the season but his last throw was against Norfolk. He needs to get to the line.

 

[torque-cat]

I pray that he can get NU out of last place. One step at a time.......

Nah, I don't care nearly as much about this season as him showing those kinds of chops when this roster peaks in 2 years. If he stays healthy and can improve on what we've already seen, he'd be incredible.

 

[docrugby1]

NU started 4 players 6'7" or taller but I did not see anyone try to post up a smaller defender. Nance or Beran has to be mismatch for most defenders but not 25' feet from the basket.
The first play NU ran got Kopp a nice 15' jumper but after that all perimeter play except for Spencer ,with the shots fortunately falling for a change

NU is "long" but plays short. I just would love to see some type of passing into and out of the post. If the post is doubled, pass out to the open man. Young, Nance and Beran could all contribute here

 

[torque-cat]

NU started 4 players 6'7" or taller but I did not see anyone try to post up a smaller defender. Nance or Beran has to be mismatch for most defenders but not 25' feet from the basket.
The first play NU ran got Kopp a nice 15' jumper but after that all perimeter play except for Spencer ,with the shots fortunately falling for a change

NU is "long" but plays short. I just would love to see some type of passing into and out of the post. If the post is doubled, pass out to the open man. Young, Nance and Beran could all contribute here

posting up only helps if you have post moves. These guys have grown up in a generation where post offense is considered inefficient.

 

[GatoLouco]

did not see anyone try to post up a smaller defender. Nance or Beran has to be mismatch for most defenders but not 25' feet from the basket.

posting up only helps if you have post moves. These guys have grown up in a generation where post offense is considered inefficient.

We never post up anyone. Not literally never, ever. But I'm guessing we do it like once a game.

It's not just us. Minny has a stud in Oturu and rarely posts him up (amazingly, when they do, he is often double teamed!). It's the "modern" basketball of motion offense. Have your big men set up screens over and over to try to open up lanes for the guards to penetrate. Just don't understand how that's more efficient than being double teamed and getting the other team out of balance that way.

Not sure there's analytics behind all this. No idea. But to me, it seems when we post we get the big guys involved and good things happen.

For mismatches to be taken advantage you need at least one of:
1) The player wanting to exploit it
2) A point guard that leads the offense to doing it (with a coach that gives him the freedom to do so)
3) A coach who wants to make it happen

We don't seem to have much of any of the above mentioned

 

[hdhntr1]

If you go back through the threads, I am pretty sure you will find a disproportionate amount of Nance c


Young is in his second year in the program and has played a ton this year. He played poorly yesterday. No big deal. That was my point. As our center, he can still get points on put backs, block shots, etc.

He is in his first year playing. And Bigs are notoriously slow in developing. Sorry but I don't know that you can say that he played all that poorly. We were not attempting to get the ball into him. Also job as a center is often to block out his man from getting rebound so others can get them. He did not get many shots as a result. He missed a couple including a FT. As far as put backs, etc, originally we were not missing much. Not saying he was playing fantastic but he was doing his job and I don't think you can say he was playing all that poorly.

 

[hdhntr1]

He has been a huge surprise and has played well in a bunch of games. I didn't think he played well yesterday or in a few other conference games. That happens with most college players, particularly young players. He has a lower ceiling than some of our players but he can certainly continue to get better.

He is a first year.

 

[hdhntr1]

No doubt Buie has been surprisingly good. But I just meant that I didn't even expect Young and Spencer to be starters, much less average double figure points. I thought that there was a good chance that Buie might be a starter (as he only recently has). Maybe that's just where my expectations were when looking forward to this season.

Who else was going to start before Young? As far as Spencer starting, had to figure he had a shot as we did not really have a lot at guard coming in. Buie is a true Frosh and no one else was likely to be in front of him

 

[docrugby1]

posting up only helps if you have post moves. These guys have grown up in a generation where post offense is considered inefficient.

That's why you have coaches. Beran and Nance are athletic enough to be real threats closer to the rim. There is no movement/cutting to force defenses to react. The Nance fact about lack of free throws is enough for CC to at least look at different offensive patterns. Duke perimeter exchanges doesn't work at NU

 

[hdhntr1]

NU started 4 players 6'7" or taller but I did not see anyone try to post up a smaller defender. Nance or Beran has to be mismatch for most defenders but not 25' feet from the basket.
The first play NU ran got Kopp a nice 15' jumper but after that all perimeter play except for Spencer ,with the shots fortunately falling for a change

NU is "long" but plays short. I just would love to see some type of passing into and out of the post. If the post is doubled, pass out to the open man. Young, Nance and Beran could all contribute here

Could not say it better. Other than Young, we tend to play small.

 

[hdhntr1]

posting up only helps if you have post moves. These guys have grown up in a generation where post offense is considered inefficient.

So is shooting only about 25% or less from three

 

[clarificationcat]

He is a first year.

We just view this differently. Young's in his second year in the program. He got to practice against Pardon and Benson for a full season. Nance played 10 minutes a game last year (and looked lost) and missed a bunch of time with mono. I don't view one as a seasoned veteran and the other as a freshman. Nance is actually taller than Young so the it takes time thing for big men would seem to apply to him as well. Even more so, since he is still trying to figure out how to use his length and what his role should be. If you see a big difference in their experience levels, I respect your opinion.

 

[hdhntr1]

We just view this differently. Young's in his second year in the program. He got to practice against Pardon and Benson for a full season. Nance played 10 minutes a game last year (and looked lost) and missed a bunch of time with mono. I don't view one as a seasoned veteran and the other as a freshman. Nance is actually taller than Young so the it takes time thing for big men would seem to apply to him as well. Even more so, since he is still trying to figure out how to use his length and what his role should be. If you see a big difference in their experience levels, I respect your opinion.

Sorry but players, especially bigs, need playing time to get the game to slow down for them. Young did not have that last year. Practicing against our Bigs last year helped more than playing against HS competition, but it is not at the same speed and it takes actual game time to take them to the next step. So his situation is better than a true Frosh but way behind a true Soph that played a lot as a Frosh. Did not say that Nance was as seasoned as Kopp for example but a lot more seasoned than Beran.

 

[NJCat]

Pete should watch tapes of Garza or Wieskamp shooting 3's. Both put beautiful arc on their 3's. Pete's line drive shot just won't cut it.

 

[willycat]

I think Buie has been a huge surprise. After a very brief adjustment period he had all the look of a legit 4 star freshman before he went down.

Nowhere near the hype and recruiting interest of Beran. But has proven to be one heckuva baller.

GOUNUII

Agree that Buie has been a pleasant surprise but still feel that the best in that class will be Beran.

 

[willycat]

Who else was going to start before Young? As far as Spencer starting, had to figure he had a shot as we did not really have a lot at guard coming in. Buie is a true Frosh and no one else was likely to be in front of him

Yes, Young has to be the starter, for now but thinking and hoping that Jones will be starter by the time next season rolls around.

 

[willycat]

It's hard to believe, but Pete hasn't shot a FT in 10 consecutive games. He's 15 of 17 on the season but his last throw was against Norfolk. He needs to get to the line.

That's exactly why he needs to take it to the hoop a hell of a lot more.

 

[willycat]

Pete should watch tapes of Garza or Wieskamp shooting 3's. Both put beautiful arc on their 3's. Pete's line drive shot just won't cut it.

Yep, Garza's down low play is defiantly one thing to copy but not his smirking antics. He can kiss my a--!

 

[NJCat]

Yep, Garza's down low play is defiantly one thing to copy but not his smirking antics. He can kiss my a--!

Agree on the smirking. But watch Garza shoot from 3. A thing of beauty.