Spot on analysis. It didn't frustrate some but it sure frustrated the hell out of me.
Next season is going to be brutal...
- Thread starter BlueDevils725
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Some of these assessments about Tatum are simply laughable. He was one of the best players in the country towards the end of the season. He also became one of our best playmakers over the course of the season, rebounded at a high rate, and played solid defense yet some still say that "he played for himself" smh. Dude was big time and we're going to miss the hell out of him.
While I was banned I read a lot of the scout board and yes I know there are many trolls there but the one constant was Tatum was a ball hog and only played for himself and I tend to agree with some of it. Look at the ncst game yes it took a team effort to lose that game, but Tatum tried to play hero and failed miserably
Tatum was bad during the first half of the year and a lot of the things you said were true then. But he turned the corner and started playing much smarter and he was terrific after that.
I know you don't like me since I'm a uk fan and even if we agreed on the same exact thing you would still say my assessments suck. You gotta admit Tatum played for Tatum and you guys will be much better without him next yr. I watched a lot of duke games this yr and as i stand by Tatum being a problem. If kennard would of asserted himself more when you guys needed him to hit a big shot you would of beat the likes of nc state. As I also mentioned we had a guy that played throughout most of the season for his draft status in briscoe, but a son the season wore on he actually played team ball rather than playing for himself
Laughable, but understandable. I think a lot of basketball fans watching one-and-dones will make the mistake of "he played for himself".
These kids come FROM high school as the TOP player on their team and use to putting everything on their shoulders. I think we saw some of that with Tatum and with Jackson. This is the big challenge for Krzyzewski. How do you get 18 year kids who are very, very good who less than a year prior was "THE GUY" on their team to curb his ego enough to function within a team.
Fault Tatum. Hardly. The kid plays to win and did that for Duke quite well. I watched both Grayson and Luke make that transformation. I hope Frank and Marques do the same.
@Showenuff -- "drama mamas"....nailed it.
Brutal next season? -- hell yeah, for the other guys.
Wrong, wrong, wrong. And I don't give a damn that there are some on here even partially agreeing with you. They are probably the ones starting the early-season Tatum thread in which they thoroughly embarrassed themselves, so they've shown how astute their analysis is. Right there with yours it seems.
Jayson was a terrific player for Duke this year. While the team never reached the heights we all hoped, they wouldn't have been anywhere close to where they did get without his production.
I could care less who you cheer for...that's not why I don't like you. I'm not that kind of person. You're just clueless, IMO....and you also find ways to take pot shots at Duke but sugarcoat them. I'll actually be happy when you overstep your bounds again and we can get rid of you....again.
Lastly, I will not admit Tatum played for Tatum. It's not true. At the beginning of the season was he struggling to fit in and find a balance within the team? Yes. He was outstanding the last two months of the season, though. Without him we're less than .500 team in conference play and no way do we win the ACCT. With exception to Luke, he was our best player this past season....and both of them being on the team made the other better.
Do you think there is even a slight possibility that although Tatum is a great player, the way he played just didn't mesh well with everyone else on the team? I don't think it is unheard of to have a talented player that doesn't bring out the talents of his teammates. If you think this is farfetched, what is your explanation of being a play away from beating Kansas without him? Do you think that game was just an aberration? Not trying to be argumentative. Just curious what your thoughts are on that.
My thoughts on this are a few things, one of which DJ pointed on which was, it took Tatum some time to fit in and learn how to play at this level with the caliber of teammates he was playing with. Did we have stumbles with him? Of course. However to your question against KU and being a play away, that game was played in November, it was a horribly officiated game and neither team were anywhere close to what they would be later on. Josh Jackson would improve a great deal over the course of the year. They were a better team later than they were that night and honestly we were a better team later on too, we just ran into a buzz saw on their home court in the tourney. But I digress on that and will ask you a question- do you think we were a better team this year with or without Tatum? Serious question.
Hey BlueDevils725, I will do my best to give you optimism for next season: We are Duke, we have Coach K, and you'll have to trust me on this one; Hang in there my friend, IT'S GONNA BE OK!!!
Go Duke!
OFC
Were we a more talented team with Tatum? Without a doubt. I just think we MIGHT have been a better TEAM without him. I think we would have been at our best with Luke and Grayson as our top two scorers. They have experience and are both really good scorers. My guess is that a freshman coming in and K allowing him to somewhat "overtaking" them caused chemistry issues. I honestly don't think Tatum is comfortable being on any team in which he is not the "go to guy". Typically those type of players don't fit in very well at Duke. I just don't think it was a very good fit. IMO, the Kansas game is just a glimpse of what we could have been.
Early on, yes, it didn't mesh. I think as Jayson went forward, particularly from the Wake game, a lot of that disappeared. As for the Kansas game, it's hard to use that as the glowing example. That was in November. We weren't as good and neither was Kansas.
In all honesty, it's hard to draw parallels from this past season. It was the single, most disruptive and frustrating season, maybe in the history of the program. And yes, in a perfect world, Grayson as the number two scorer is an attractive option. As much as I love the kid, let's not pretend he didn't play a huge impact on the direction of the season, as well. Besides, I thought Jayson became relegated to picking his spots more as the season went on. In January? Not so much. But that was the learning curve. We became a really good team at times, and when we were really good Jayson was playing a pretty big part. I just can't ignore that.
Laughable, but understandable. I think a lot of basketball fans watching one-and-dones will make the mistake of "he played for himself".
These kids come FROM high school as the TOP player on their team and use to putting everything on their shoulders. I think we saw some of that with Tatum and with Jackson. This is the big challenge for Krzyzewski. How do you get 18 year kids who are very, very good who less than a year prior was "THE GUY" on their team to curb his ego enough to function within a team.
Fault Tatum? Hardly. The kid plays to win and did that for Duke quite well. I watched both Grayson and Luke make that transformation. I hope Frank and Marques do the same thing.
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Jayson Tatum would have been the best player on almost every team in the country, including the 16-17 Kentucky Wildcats, the kid was a stud and we were fortunate to have him for 1 year.
Talent wasn't an issue last season. It was injuries and defense, which was abysmal at times. Especially for a Krzyzewski coached team. Lack of a true PG was also an issue, although to a lesser extent IMHO.
Next season's team has a good chance to be more successful if those areas improve, even if the talent level is lower.
Next season's team has a good chance to be more successful if those areas improve, even if the talent level is lower.
A uk fan watching us play NCSt. Further proof we live in their heads. The only time I watched uk this season, and I mean the ONLY time was vs unx in the tourney. Watch uk play a regular season game? Not interested.
It doesn't matter what's I say cause you will automatically think the worst it was Super Tuesday or big Monday and I caught the game. Anytime a blueblod is playing someone inferior to them I watch the game not just duke. I watched va clobber unc as well. Like I said I enjoy watching the best teams and how they fair against inferior competition and when they are the heavy favorites
Defense was a huge Achilles heel for Duke. I want to see that vintage Duke D but I'm not sure Coach can make a one year player buy into playing in your face D. Kids now a days are all about showtime because that is what the NBA sells
I thought as the year progressed, Tatum progressed into meshing w/the team! The Elon game was a disaster for him (7-22) and of course the State game we would all rather forget. Move forward to his performance at ND, home game vs UNC, AND Brooklyn....He was magnificent down the stretch of the Championship game!!
Your point about K getting kids to mesh into a system (OAD types) is quite good! Its going to be critical next year as we could potentially have 4 (freshmen OAD's)in the top 7 of rotation(I am not counting Bamba as I dont think we get him). Still working 4 into the top 7 of these types is a delicate task.
Its why I think we need Grayson back so bad as our senior leader. He could be the "Quinn Cook type" in leading us to #6.....
OFC
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Yeah 95 was brutal lol. I think if we get Duval we're a sweet 16 team for sure IMO and possibly better if Knox commits. Jackson coming back would be huge but I'm growing less hopeful of that by the day. (Hope I'm wrong). Also DeLaurier could really bust out this year, and I like what I saw out of White and esp. Vrank this year. Go Duke!