Note to self: Stay out of Saudi Arabia. Link. *
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My wife's cousin married a Muslim man and she went to Saudi Arabia to visit his family for a month. She was terrified. Before she deplaned, she had to put on the hijab. The rules regarding women are so very strict. For example, she was constantly followed to ensure she complied with Wasabi Law. If some of her hair fell out from under the hijab accidentally, she could be arrested. She had to walk a certain distance behind her husband. There were only certain male family members she could be seen with. And of course, she could not drive herself anywhere.
Yeah, I know what you mean. This one time, I went to a church and afterwards they had prepared a nice dinner for everyone. Then I found out that my wife was not allowed to eat until I had FINISHED my meal. All men were told to eat, and sit, while the women served us and then they got what was left over. Oh, this wasn't in Saudi Arabia either.
Not defending Saudi Arabia at all, my point is clearly that ALL religious sects have peculiar "rules" regarding women.
Which just makes this that much more ridiculous.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/25/world/saudi-arabia-un-womens-commission-trnd/
Yeah, I know what you mean. This one time, I went to a church and afterwards they had prepared a nice dinner for everyone. Then I found out that my wife was not allowed to eat until I had FINISHED my meal. All men were told to eat, and sit, while the women served us and then they got what was left over. Oh, this wasn't in Saudi Arabia either.
Not defending Saudi Arabia at all, my point is clearly that ALL religious sects have peculiar "rules" regarding women.
Not sure what church you went to and I have gone to various churches and denominations all my life and have never seen that. Do these women get stoned to death for adultery? Can they drive? Do they get punished if they accidentally show their hair? Can they drive or go outside without a man?
You are conflating two very, very different religious cultures in an shallow attempt to make Wasabi Law look better, so you statement that you are not defending Saudi Arabia rings very shallow indeed.
Yeah, I know what you mean. This one time, I went to a church and afterwards they had prepared a nice dinner for everyone. Then I found out that my wife was not allowed to eat until I had FINISHED my meal. All men were told to eat, and sit, while the women served us and then they got what was left over. Oh, this wasn't in Saudi Arabia either.
Not defending Saudi Arabia at all, my point is clearly that ALL religious sects have peculiar "rules" regarding women.
I have never seen anything like that my entire life. We always have women and children get their food first.
No, I was agreeing with you if you would have READ my post completely. In fact, I believe I started out with "yeah, I know what you mean"......taken for meaning that I think that stuff is STUPID in Saudi Arabia. I merely added a personal experience, like you had. Sorry that I have never been to the Middle East to add an example directly relating to your experience.....gee whiz. [eyeroll]
You were attempting to equate the two, even if it was in a minor way. Like I said, I have been to many, many churches and denominations, including Pentecostal which is quite orthodox, and have never seen that.
Did they get whipped, stoned, or be-headed if they didn't follow that rule?Yeah, I know what you mean. This one time, I went to a church and afterwards they had prepared a nice dinner for everyone. Then I found out that my wife was not allowed to eat until I had FINISHED my meal. All men were told to eat, and sit, while the women served us and then they got what was left over. Oh, this wasn't in Saudi Arabia either.
Not defending Saudi Arabia at all, my point is clearly that ALL religious sects have peculiar "rules" regarding women.
Different people have different definitions for this stuff. What I am depends on your definition. But I know that by Saudi Arabia standards I'm plenty atheist enough to be executed.
If I posted in Saudi Arabia what I post on here I long ago would have been executed. Seriously.
That's a law that if you don't follow, it burns your tongue and throat![cheers]
Please, let us know where in the US that that happened. You are probably the only person I know that equates the US with SA.
That doesn't even sound remotely true. It would have to be some cult. And comparing some grain-of-sand church to a Sahara-sized religion is beyond nonsensical.Yeah, I know what you mean. This one time, I went to a church and afterwards they had prepared a nice dinner for everyone. Then I found out that my wife was not allowed to eat until I had FINISHED my meal. All men were told to eat, and sit, while the women served us and then they got what was left over. Oh, this wasn't in Saudi Arabia either.
Not defending Saudi Arabia at all, my point is clearly that ALL religious sects have peculiar "rules" regarding women.
100-125 probably.....give or take a few......but that was in the late 90's. And I did NOT compare the two....I simply used a personal experience involving women and religious beliefs or traditions.......
I don't have a lot of experience with free will Baptists, but I seen nothing like that.
I go to a Baptist church now and have never seen that. I am not calling you a liar by any means, but it must have been some kind of tradition or just an outlier at that church (certainly not in the Bible). Jesus surrounded himself with women which was widely ridiculed by the Jewish religious leaders of the time.
I have read about some strange practices in rural Appalachian churches, such as snake handling. Certainly not mainstream in any sense of the word and not widespread.
Good for you.....that was first, and ONLY time for me as well......I refused to eat, and when asked by another member "why, is the food bad?"....I stated "doesn't appear to be bad, but I'm waiting for my wife to eat with me".
The President of the United States grabs women by the p*ssy. Being the last to eat isn't that bad. Y'all need to calm down.
And your former President, Billy Boy, raped and assaulted women, including interns. If you want to talk about another great Dem president, JFK and women, let's do it. Not to mention LBJ. Nice try.
It's a big country so I'm sure there are outliers here and there but by and large Christians don't do the extremely crazy stuff like they do in SA.
Here's the problem in an outline.
1. For a long time we had a Christian-dominated country. And we had the gender roles we had.
2. Then came the 60s and 70s and the feminist movement (among other changes in society, but I'm focusing on this one for now). By those particular feminism standards the gender roles in our Christian-dominated country were archaic and sexist and all that stuff. And the feminist movement let everyone know it, and without finesse. It was in your face.
3. And the thing is, it worked. The country is now very different with regards to women's roles. Even people that are socially conservative today would consider the roles of women 60 or 80 years ago to be backwards. In other words, feminism (in the form of equality of the sexes) won. And that's a good thing. We're better off for it.
4. Then eventually Islam becomes an issue. The reality is that, the way Muslims treat women as a whole today is not only as bad as the Christian-dominated US treated women 60 or 80 years ago, it's much worse. I'm talking on the whole. There are progressive Muslims here and there but "conservative Christian" and "conservative Muslim" mean two completely different things. By the standards modern feminism has put into place in the US, Muslims attitudes towards women on the whole (again, "on the whole") are backwards and extremely sexist.
5. But some people in the US for some strange reason don't think the standard for treating women that has become firmly established in this country should apply to Muslims. This comes off as (1) sexist, because feminism won in the US and thus treating women this way is seen as sexist and (2) hypocritical, because we've just come off of several decades of Christians getting battered for treating women 10 units of bad but now people are being called Islamophobes for saying it's wrong for Muslims to treat women 10,000 units of bad.
It comes down to having standards. Do you have them or don't you? If you don't apply your standards uniformly then you don't have standards at all. You can't call someone sexist for a little bit of sexism and then not call someone else sexist for a lot of sexism.
And I think that is why so many are angry with the Left and it's one reason Hilary lost the election. She's having her picture taken wearing a hijab to somehow show solidarity? Really? The hijab is probably the single most prominent symbol of female oppression in the world today. You can't go through a political career championing women's rights and then start normalizing social behavior that forces women to wear a tent without getting a negative reaction.
Here's the problem in an outline.
1. For a long time we had a Christian-dominated country. And we had the gender roles we had.
2. Then came the 60s and 70s and the feminist movement (among other changes in society, but I'm focusing on this one for now). By those particular feminism standards the gender roles in our Christian-dominated country were archaic and sexist and all that stuff. And the feminist movement let everyone know it, and without finesse. It was in your face.
3. And the thing is, it worked. The country is now very different with regards to women's roles. Even people that are socially conservative today would consider the roles of women 60 or 80 years ago to be backwards. In other words, feminism (in the form of equality of the sexes) won. And that's a good thing. We're better off for it.
4. Then eventually Islam becomes an issue. The reality is that, the way Muslims treat women as a whole today is not only as bad as the Christian-dominated US treated women 60 or 80 years ago, it's much worse. I'm talking on the whole. There are progressive Muslims here and there but "conservative Christian" and "conservative Muslim" mean two completely different things. By the standards modern feminism has put into place in the US, Muslims attitudes towards women on the whole (again, "on the whole") are backwards and extremely sexist.
5. But some people in the US for some strange reason don't think the standard for treating women that has become firmly established in this country should apply to Muslims. This comes off as (1) sexist, because feminism won in the US and thus treating women this way is seen as sexist and (2) hypocritical, because we've just come off of several decades of Christians getting battered for treating women 10 units of bad but now people are being called Islamophobes for saying it's wrong for Muslims to treat women 10,000 units of bad.
It comes down to having standards. Do you have them or don't you? If you don't apply your standards uniformly then you don't have standards at all. You can't call someone sexist for a little bit of sexism and then not call someone else sexist for a lot of sexism.
And I think that is why so many are angry with the Left and it's one reason Hilary lost the election. She's having her picture taken wearing a hijab to somehow show solidarity? Really? The hijab is probably the single most prominent symbol of female oppression in the world today. You can't go through a political career championing women's rights and then start normalizing social behavior that forces women to wear a tent without getting a negative reaction.
You conveniently left out Republican Dwight D. Eisenhower and Warren Harding.....
Eisenhower had an affair while serving in WWII. I am talking about abuse, absolute abuse of women, including interns. This abuse in the form of assaults, rape and the like. If you really want to get down to facts, we can go there, but I don't think you do. You would lose.
Freewill is independent, not Southern Baptist. You'll get snake handling and all kinds of neat stuff in some of them.
So, affairs that were:
1. During the time of fighting the Nazis
2. prostitutes (Harding)
are fine............[thumbsup]
Stop splitting hairs......an affair is an affair. The last time I checked, Bill Clinton was never convicted of raping or assaulting anyone.......
I am not saying affairs are fine. I am saying that rape, assault, abuse of interns is much, much worse. Do you want to get into some of those details with your boys, Billy, LBJ and JFK? I don't think we want to even start this debate.
BTW, I do remember a payment of $850K to Paula Jones, right? But I am sure he did this out of the goodness of his heart. You do know he lost his law license for lying to a federal judge in this case, right?
Interesting.......here is a list I got on all the federal sex scandals.....and believe it or not, there are some Republicans on it....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_federal_political_sex_scandals_in_the_United_States
Ok, I see you want to get into this. Billy Clinton was accused of rape by Juanita Broaddrick. She has contemporaneous witnesses that buttress her story. Lisa Myers of NBC is still very upset with NBC because they would not air her reporting on the rape. Then we have the assaults. Paula Jones, $850K richer. Kathleen WIlley, accosted in the Oval Office. Intern sex in the Oval Office.
You can read about LBJ's demented behavior below:
http://potus-geeks.livejournal.com/694586.html
JFK, many, many affairs. Then we have Mimi Alford telling that while an 18 year old intern she had sex with JFK and he even forced her to have sex with other men while he watched. Sick. I can get more if you like.