OT: Conan vs Jay...

[dawgstudent]

What has partly killed Conan O'Brien was him moving from NYC.

 

[dawgstudent]

What has partly killed Conan O'Brien was him moving from NYC.

 

[8dog]

is doing better than Conan.

Conan is funnier than Leno and Fallon combined. Fallon is awful.

 

[dawgstudent]

that I will actually watch him.

 

[DerHntr]

another thing that killed conan is the blue hairs don't really get his humor that much, or at least the ones i know don't.

as for the new Leno show, it was awful. the format sucked, the skits sucked, and the only good thing was the huge names he had on the first week.

edit to add: Jimmy Kimmel is better than Fallon and the newer version of Leno.

 

[ckDOG]

if Fallon is genuinely uncomfortable as he appears to be or if he's just really good at "acting" nervous. I don't really like the guy, but for some reason I catch myself watching the show just because he's so awkward. It's hard to describe what "it" is, but his awkwardness is almost hypnotic...

 

[8dog]

or whatever its called. Its unbearable for me.

 

[DerHntr]

it's either that or he drinks a shitload of redbull before the show. my old man said it looks like he is on drugs and is about to jump on the floor at any minute and scratch all of the imaginary bugs off of him.

 

[gdogg]

They had a itch to move Jay because ratings continued to slip, now Conan is the absolute worst and they fear losing what is left of late night market share. Craig Ferguson should get the job. Every time I happen to hear him he is funny.

 

[birdZdawg]

I've thought Conan has progressively gotten better than Jay since he began.

As a sidenote, Bill Simmons tweeted this NYT article from the Leno/Letterman ordeal in 1993. Called Leno a hypocrite.

http://bit.ly/6qNA88

"I am disappointed," Mr. Leno said. "I feel like a guy who has bought a car from somebody, painted it, fixed it up and made it look nice and then the guy comes back and says he promised to sell the car to his brother-in-law." Go Elsewhere? 'Of Course'

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

Leno and Conan.

Conan is definitely #2 though. I have never thought Leno was funny.

 

[biguglyjoe]

Out of the 3, I would have to go with Conan.

 

[EmoryBellard]

has been Dave essentially devoting his whole show to skewering Leno/NBC.

 

[Irondawg]

Fallon is awful and his interview skills are putrid. I have no idea why NBC is killing Conan. He actually won the coveted 25-39 demographic most of the time.

Leno much have pictures.

 

[DerHntr]

also, Kimmel's Leno impersonation with the fake chin and wig is funny

 

[AssEndDawg]

to complain about how they are treating Conan. I was surprised that a normal person actually answered the phone and said they would pass it on. I like the guy and the show was getting better and better. I think any time a show changes hands the ratings are going to dip. Regardless of all that, it's just shady what they are doing.

 

[UpTheMiddlex3Punt]

And that was 10 years ago before you could find any number of blogs devoted to the same sort of material, which by the way he did not write.

 

[benatmsu]

 

[LightninInside]

I was at a private party recently where Leno performed for about an hour as a stand up comic. He started off good, people were laughing but it really lasted too long and before long you could tell people were laughing just to be polite. It was the funniest I have seen him which really says a lot since I think he was just average.

Jay should just bow out, let Conan have the spot he has earned and deserved.

 

[jakldawg]

in an almost scary kind of "these people are out there taking up good space, and probably breeding" kind of way. But I'd have to go with Conan in terms of better overall show and type of humor I like.
edit: looks like The Tonight Show is for sale on Craigslist now.

 

[DerHntr]

all of those "Jaywalking" people post here and for some reason he is the only person intelligent on the ENTIRE board. it truly is amazing that the rest of us can actually read and type.

 

[kired]

If I had to rate them, I'd say Fallon, Conan, Leno. I hated Fallon on SNL, but his show is just plain entertaining. He gets the guests to loosen up more - or maybe he just has more entertaining guests.

Leno seems to be just okay all around - his skits, standup, and interviews are all ok. Letterman is best with his jokes & skits, but not always good with guests. But Fallon and Conan are great entertainers and are good in all aspects of the show.

 

[dickiedawg]

I love Jimmy Fallon. Ferguson, too. I used to watch Leno, then switch over to Ferguson. Now, I find myself watching whichever one is not on commercial. The Jay Leno Show sucks.

 

[MSUCostanza]

[No message]

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

that nobody here thinks Leno is funny. I mean of the three being discussed his ratings are by far the best.

For the record, I kind of like Conan, but I never thought his brand of humor would play well before late nite. I mean, a masterbating bear? Seriously? He's got some funny material, but too much of it only appeals to the Beavis and Butthead generation.

And I agree with everyone on Fallon. Watching him is like watching a car wreck unfold.

 

[patdog]

But it's hard to still be funny after being seen for 5 hours a week for 20 years by the whole nation. At some point, your act gets old.</p>

 

[dawgstudent]

[No message]

 

[Hotel Roosevelt]

Leno is an abomination. He pushed Johnny Carson off The Tonight Show. Then he stole it from Letterman. Now he's stealing it from Conan. And worst of all, he isn't funny. There is a reason comedians loathe him and every talk show host is lining up to take shots at him now. He hides behind a nice guy persona, but he's a schemer ready to swindle anyone out of everything. And the thing is, he used to be funny. Back before he ever had a talk show. He was a pretty good comedian. Then he sold out to embrace his bland, robotic, lowest common denominator humor that has unfortunately garnered an audience.

Conan and Letterman are fantastic. Talented entertainers who care about their shows and the legacy of the medium. Both tried to play fair, and both got stabbed in the back by Leno. Letterman twenty years ago, by his buddy Jay. Conan today. And Conan isn't getting fired because of his numbers. He is losing his job because Leno was an abysmal failure in primetime. His show was terrible and his ratings were destroying the network and the local affiliates. It was the local affiliates, whose newscasts were being decimated by Leno's lead-in, that got Leno's primetime show canceled. But Leno had a $100 million buyout in his contract that NBC can't pay. So they wanted to bump The Tonight Show out of the time slot it has held for 60 years to accomodate Leno's new show. Conan refused to do it for the sake of The Tonight Show. Since Conan's buyout is by far smaller, he and his staff and crew get ****-canned after 7 months.

Ferguson is good too. And Kimmel gets points for going on Leno's own show last night and eviscerating him in front of his own crowd.

 

[ArrowDawg]

........funny as hell though. NBC is so much of a 17 up network that I love seeing when they do something else to further destroy themselves.

 

[PosterFormerlyKnownAsRFAA]

Leno and Letterman suck. Fallon is getting better but it is still awkward.

Conan is getting royally screwed by NBC. He has turned down offers from FOX in the past so I hope they go after him again. If Conan isn't on NBC, I can't think of a show on NBC I'll actually watch on a regular basis. I'll catch an occasional SNL but that is about it. NBC is going to come out of this much worse than they entered.

I made my statement with my new sig a day or two ago. I'm with CoCo!

 

[TR.sixpack]

and David Letterman drops off the face of the earth.

 

[patdog]

What the 17 are you talking about? You have no 17ing idea how powerful Johnny was all the way up till he quit. Nobody, but nobody, pushed him out. If he would have wanted to do another 5 years, NBC would have said, "How much money will it take? We'll send an armored truck to your house, just tell us what time to be there."

 

[Chesusdog]

To hell with that network.

 

[jamdawg96]

but also you have to question Conan's move to the Tonight Show to begin with. His humor and style are better suited for the 12:30ET slot. When you tone him down, he's average like Leno and Letterman. Add the reasons you mentioned concerning Leno's dreadful prime time effort, and you have the full explanation for his ratings.

Even though it's ridiculous and desperate for NBC to consider moving their time slots around, I think a return to later time is what Conan will ultimately need. He had basically created his own niche anyways. Who needs to follow in Carson, Letterman, and Leno's footsteps when you've put your own mark on the business?

 

[Hotel Roosevelt]

For full details read Bill Carter's "The Late Shift." It isn't in print anymore, but copies can be found easily on Amazon, eBay, etc.

By the time the 90s rolled around NBC execs were starting to feel that Carson was too old. But because Johnny was still so big, NBC wouldn't touch him. Letterman had been doing Late Night for a decade and was waiting in the wings. He was Johnny's chosen successor and refused any contract that offered him The Tonight Show upon Carson's retirement because he didn't want to be seen as pushing Johnny out. Letterman idolized Johnny. But Jay Leno, Johnny's current guest host, wanted The Tonight Show and didn't want to have to wait for Carson to retire. So Leno's agent drafted a fake news story and had it published in The New York Post. The story proclaimed that Carson was out as host and Leno was in. NBC denied the story. But not very strongly, because secretly, it's what they really wanted. Johnny got pissed at the network and retired early.

So ended Johnny Carson's career. Not because he was ready to retire, but because Leno's people planted fake stories in the press. It was all a backhanded move to get Carson out of the way so Leno could take over. Then he only had to screw Letterman out of the job. Which he did. Leno hid in closets to eavesdrop on NBC meetings and his manager browbeat the execs (most notably Warren Littlefield) into giving the job to Leno, instead of Johnny's guy, Letterman.

I always thought, by reputation, that Carson was bulletproof too. He was powerful, but not so powerful that a fake news leak couldn't get him out of the way. Leno did that. That's what the 17 I'm talking about.

 

[Hotel Roosevelt]

on another network. NBC is in the process of firing him right now. Hopefully he will end up on Fox by the end of the year. But for all of the hiccups Conan had on The Tonight Show, which were minor, he still put on a program that was better than anything Leno ever did with it. The thing with late night talk shows, they aren't built in a day, or even seven months. Leno had his own problems when he took over The Tonight Show. He lost a ton of Johnny's audience and NBC tried to replace him with Letterman, even after they had already spurned Letterman for Leno in the first place. Johnny had to talk Letterman out of staying at NBC and waiting to get screwed by the execs. And then when Letterman went to CBS he beat Leno for years until Leno finally built up his audience. And it isn't like Leno was an unknown. He was a popular comedian and had been Carson's guest host for years (meaning he did at least a show a week). These shows are a long-term commitment. You don't bring in a new host and fire him immediately. You bring in someone like Conan because they are going to be with the network for 10, 15, even 20 years. It takes a couple years to adjust, even for experienced hosts, but that's the business.

Like you said, Conan has made his own mark on the business now. And with the NBC situation, he's going to be forced to blaze his own trail just like Letterman did twenty years ago.

 

[anon1751035439]

Just wait.

 

[Hotel Roosevelt]

...but I don't see it happening. Conan will be out of the door a week from today. Got a lead on some super-secret info?

From everything I've seen, Conan is employing scorched earth tactics and NBC has gone nuclear.