OT: The PE Exam

[ShineOnYouCrazyBulldog]

I’ve got the PE Exam coming up and I know this board has a ton of engineers on it, so I’d like to pick some brains. I will be taking the Civil breadth exam in the AM and the Civil Transportation exam in the PM.

First off, looking back is there anything that you wish someone had told you about the exam before you took it? Next, what did you use as preparation materials and how long did you prepare? There’s a shitload of prep stuff out there and I have no idea if one is any better than the other. Some of it is pretty high dollar as well and I’d rather not buy it, and then realize that it sucks.

Third, what all resources did you take in with you? Was there something you wish you had taken but you didn’t?

 

[ShineOnYouCrazyBulldog]

I’ve got the PE Exam coming up and I know this board has a ton of engineers on it, so I’d like to pick some brains. I will be taking the Civil breadth exam in the AM and the Civil Transportation exam in the PM.

First off, looking back is there anything that you wish someone had told you about the exam before you took it? Next, what did you use as preparation materials and how long did you prepare? There’s a shitload of prep stuff out there and I have no idea if one is any better than the other. Some of it is pretty high dollar as well and I’d rather not buy it, and then realize that it sucks.

Third, what all resources did you take in with you? Was there something you wish you had taken but you didn’t?

 

[BulldogBlitz]

i didn't take it straight out of school like i should have.

i let 12 years lapse and then thought i'd go take it.

that made for a very rough go.

 

[Buford T. Justice]

i didn't take it straight out of school like i should have.

You can't take the PE straight out of school.

 

[Buford T. Justice]

It's better to be awesome at 50% of the stuff than poor at 90% of the stuff. Don't overthink it. When I took it there were people bringing in 8-10 books. They didn't have time to look through everything, so it was somewhat useless.

Calm down and relax when you take it. Chances are you've done much of the stuff in your everyday work. When I took it you had one-half day section that was multiple choice general civil. You also had one half-day section where you chose something like 4 questions out of 12 (you must get the answer and show your work). You simply choose the stuff in your area of expertise. Don't get bogged down in something that you simply can't do. The test is much too hard to learn how to do a retaining wall design in 2 hours if you work in Traffic Engineering at MDOT. Go to the question about traffic and kick the crap out of it.

When I took it, the multiple choice breadth portion wasn't too bad. General civil stuff across all disciplines. The portion where you picked the 4-6 questions and showed your work was tough as hell. Stay in your area of expertise and you will be okay. That will apply to your everyday life too. As professionals, they expect us to turn down work we aren't really qualified to do. My stamp says I can design a bridge. However, if I get a client at work that asks me to design a bridge, I tell him I'm not qualified. I then help him find someone who is.

Disclaimer: Been about 12-14 years since I took it, so I'm sure it's changed some. Studied less than 8 hours, took one reference book, passed first time with a 90 (only need a 70).

 

[jmbeck]

I used the Mechanical Engineering Reference Manual (MERM) almost exclusively for the AM. Not sure about civil, but you would think the Lindburg manuals were standard issue looking around the testing room.

I got the 6 minute solutions,and they helped quite a bit. I had my ASHRAE books for the PM, and that's about all I used. I took much more though, just never picked it up.

All told, I studied for about 80 hours, and that's because I was incredibly slow for the two weeks prior to my exam at work. I know people that study over 1000 hours. Depends on your style I guess. Thankfully, with my depth, it is pretty much what I worked on every day. There wasn't a problem in the afternoon that I had not seen in the course of my job duties at least a handful of times in my required 4 years experience. I know that's different from others.

Take a wheeled cart, luggage, whatever. Don't be the jackass that has to park 1/2 a mile from the test facility lugging 50 lbs of books in a damned copy paper box you swipped from work.

Bring earplugs. Our facility was in the BJCC, and no ****, about 2 hours into the AM portion, some god-awful band was having a sound check in the facility next to us. After about ten minutes, the chick next to me started crying.

Take 1/2 of an immodium. That stray **** that hits you about 9:30 AM every two or three months, yeah, it will hit you on that Friday. Just go ahead and eliminate that possibility.

Don't freak out over the time. It took me 3 hours to finish the first 20 questions in the AM. I was able to answer the last 20 in less than an hour. It will work itself out.

2007 Mechanical / HVAC depth

 

[sebasram]

The difficulty of this exam depends entirely on where you've been employed. If you've been using the transportation material every day for the last 4 years (min.) then you will already be familiar with most of the manuals and where things are located.

The two areas I wasn't prepared for was the Traffic Capacity Manual and Construction Techniques. As a designer, these are the two area I worked in the least.

I would download all the info. you can from the NCEES website. One of my question was identical to one I printed out.

As far as other materials, you can spend as little or as much money as you want. I'd say the most important thing is downloading questions and prep materials that are formatted in the way the exam questions will be asked. Most of your prep manuals phrase questions in ways that are extremely confusing and have many more steps than will be included on the exam. The questions can't be too long or time becomes a factor.

I know I didn't give many specifics but hope it helps.

 

[LandsurveyorDawg]

Bobbylabonte is right, in that it has changed. It changed from a knowledge based to a more academic based test.

You need to study all the material and get your points in the morning breath, because the afternoon depth session is way harder. You better get every book on the Lindberg list.
The Cerm, HCM, Green Book, traffic manual .... ect. Also get the 6 min solutions and work every problem. Have the cerm tabbed to all the usual stuff like pipe flows, runoff .... ect.

In the morning, I bet I got 90% of the problems correct. At lunch I was thinking "who could fail this test?" The second session I skipped 10 questions before I could answer one.
The afternoon will use obscure crap out of the Highway capacity manual ans similar books, so you have to have them.

Good luck

 

[KurtRambis4]

*

 

[Imadick]

Youarerequiredto have 5 years engineering workexperience before taking the test. You can take the EIT your senior year in school or right after. I waited about 6 years before taking the EIT and found it harder to prepare for than the PE.

 

[bulldogcountry1]

- Get a "6 Minute Solutions" for every subject. I've heard many people say there was an identical (with different #s) problem or two on the test, and many others are very similar. I even took the time to make an idex with all the key words in front to reference problem numbers to save time - Like horizontal curve, retaining wall, intersections, etc.

- Either pace yourself by making sure you are about half through after 2 hours or answer all the short and sweet questions first and then go back to the sight distance, retaining wall, and curve problems. My test started out with those, and I burned 45 minutes on the first three questions. With 5 minutes left, I had 5 more questions, and they were the easiest ones. I dang near lost it.

- Don't take too much in there. You will waste valuable time flipping through them. You can find info for 75% of it in the reference manual and most of the rest in a few more key books. Save the obscure questions for the very end when you have everything else answered, then you can dig out that huge green traffice road sign manual. I forget what that beast is called.

 

[Negative Waves]

The sample questions in the material put out by Lindeburg (they publish the reference manual) are much harder than what you will find on the test. Get the sample questions and solutions book from NCEES. Those in there are much more like what you'll find on the exam. I wish somebody had told me that. I opened up those sample tests put out by Lindeburg, and thought that there was absolutely no way I would pass the exam. The test turned out to be much easier than I thought. I'm not saying you shouldn't work through them, but don't expect to see such in depth problems on the test. Also, take in plenty of references. I took the water/wastewater portion in theafternoon, and one of my references answered about 8 questions very quickly. Answer those first. The easy ones are worth the same as the harder questions. Go to www.engineerboards.com to find out some of the references you should carry into the exam.

 

[BulldogBlitz]

so, yes, you can.

 

[GloryDawg]

On a side note my best three mile run time while in the Marine Corp was 17 Minutes and 42 Seconds and shot expert with both the riffle and pistol every year.</p>

 

[UpTheMiddlex3Punt]

I know that being a PE doesn't matter much in computer engineering, but I'm thinking about taking the test while all the material is still on my mind. Is the Computer Engineering exam difficult? Also, for any Computer Engineer with a PE, does having a PE open up new job opportunities? I know that my employer doesn't consider it important to have, but I'm wondering if there is a (small) world of jobs that might open up to me. I'm planning on taking the exam this fall.

 

[disappointeddawg]

...Last month. To clear some things up others have said: It's four years between passing the FE and taking the PE, not five. Co-op time and graduate time can count some towards this (masters is 1 year experience). <div>
</div><div>Now, to the question. I took Civil, Water resources/Enviro in the afternoon. I studied a lot and I thought it was pretty damn hard, to be honest. There were more qualitative questions than I expected, most of the workout problems weren't too bad but there were a few out of left field that I was lost on. Some things I spent a lot of time studying weren't on there and some things I spent no time studying were on there. I thought the transportation (geometric design), geotech stuff was easy but got stumped on a structural question which I thought was pretty advanced to be on the breadth section. I didn't have the traffic green book and wish I did, there were a few questions that I had no clue on that I think would have been easily answered with it. The CERM reference is a MUST. If there is a conceptual question, it most likely can be found so look it up. I had a coworker's old Testmasters stuff and that was helpful for working example problems to prepare. Supposedly the Lindburg 6 minute solutions book is way harder than it needs to be but I suppose if you can do them you should be fine. Don't think that just because you worked a bunch of examples that you will be able to find a similar worked example for every question on the exam. I had roughly 40 worked examples for every topic and there were a lot on the exam that I had never seen. Some very easy, some not so much.</div><div>
</div><div>One of the most helpful things was a handmade reference book handed down from people in my company. One of your best resources can be your coworkers, so talk to them. </div><div>
</div><div>I was surprised by the number of people taking it for the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. time. I think what gets a lot people taking it the second time is that it is a good bit different every time. So if you fail it the first don't think you can just look over what you had trouble on and think you'll be okay. </div><div>
</div><div>My test had more construction, scheduling type stuff than I expected. Most seemed like they should be easy but I didn't spend much time with it so I had to make educated guesses on some. I would learn how the scheduling stuff works, some simple econ stuff, and some construction equipment basics and probably not much else.</div><div>
</div><div>The water treatment/wastewater and hydraulics stuff wasn't too bad. Mostly conversions and common sense but that's the kind of work I do...</div><div>
</div><div>I thought a huge weight would be lifted after walking out but it took me about a week before I could stop thinking about it. It was driving me crazy. Still have a good month before I'll get the results. I feel okay but it could go either way. Most people say you'll know you failed right when you walk out but not everyone. Damn it, now I'm thinking about it again.</div><div>
</div><div>PM me if you have any more questions, I won't get into problem types but I can steer you in the right direction on study material.</div><div>
</div><div>
</div>

 

[fairweatherfan]

Lindeburg's CERM should be standard issue for the PE. I can't imagine not having that book.You will needthe CERM, HCM, Green Book, MUTCD, and NCEES Sample Questions and Solutions, at a minimum. I studied for about 5-6 weeks forabout anhour on weekdays and3-5 hours on Saturdays and Sundays. Try to get your hands on as many sample questions from NCEES, Testmasters, etc.. that you can.

PM me for more info.</p>

 

[ShineOnYouCrazyBulldog]

Thanks for the responses everyone. I’m just going to reply to the thread instead of individual replies.

I used the Lindeburg materials for the morning session of the FE and I cleaned up. Like someone said, I went to lunch thinking “I got all worked up over this”? I proceeded to get humbled in the afternoon, still passed though. Last I checked though, I think his PE manual is quite dated. But I have no doubt that it’s more difficult than what is actually on the test.

I’m a firm believer that these things about time management almost as much as knowledge of the material. The replies have solidified that belief.

I must say that I’m a little shocked at how little some prepared for this test but if your job requires you do a wide range of **** you may not need as much preparation. One of my problems is that my job doesn’t require that and I’d actually be pretty shocked if anything that I do shows up on the exam. Hell, I’m not even taking it until April ’13 and I’m already looking at getting prepared. I’ve got all the reference material I could possibly need for the afternoon portion at my disposal so it’s mostly a matter of becoming familiar with them and knowing where to find what.

And to jmbeck, about the band doing sound checks; I took the FE in McCool, on the Saturday of Homecoming. It was bad enough watching people tailgating out the window but the band came through at least once and possibly a few times. That **** sucked.

 

[disappointeddawg]

We probably took the FE at the same time, 2006? I remember the canons going off when we scored and it was driving me crazy. I guess that happens fairly regularly during the fall test though.<div>
</div><div>I started studying in early January for the April test. I studied about an hour a day average on weekdays and took off the weekends. I studied for 4 hours bothSaturdayandSundayon the weekend before the exam but other than that I didn't crack a book nor think about it on the weekends. I felt like this kept me from burning out although I ran out of things to look at with about a month left, so I would recommend this same plan for 3 months. I did most of my studying at work. If I was waiting on something to be printed or one of the millions of other things I have to wait on every day, instead of jumping on the internet or bullshitting with someone, I would work a couple practice problems. Which reminds me, tab your books and most importantly your examples so they can be easily and quickly found. I would write the problem type and specifically what the problem is asking for. For example: Groundwater Flow - Seepage Velocity </div><div>
</div><div>The way I worked the test was I would skip anything that I was stumped on or didn't recognize and I finished with what I did know in about 2 hours. By that time I was more relaxed and some of the problems I was lost on earlier all of sudden were much clearer. I skipped the first four on the afternoon test and started to get worried but hit an easy streak and ended up finishing it in 2 hours before going back also. I still used the whole 4 hours on both sections and only had to straight up guess on 2-3 due to running short on time. In hindsight I probably spent too much time trying to confirm a couple problems I already felt okay about and lost track of time. In all I was pretty happy with my time management. If you are familiar with your material I would say you should be fine on time. There was a problem that I had no clue on in the morning and during the afternoon I came across the answer in my homemade reference manual. So again, be familiar with your material and where to find stuff.</div>

 

[UpTheMiddlex3Punt]

We probably took the FE at the same time, 2006? I remember the canons going off when we scored and it was driving me crazy. I guess that happens fairly regularly during the fall test though.

Probably was a rarity in 2006.

 

[LandsurveyorDawg]

A friend of mine took the Civil PE about 12 years ago and got the results as failed. He studied his *** off for the second time. He shows up to take the test and they inform him that they regraded his last test and he actually passed. Could you image the sheer anger and jubilation.

I passed the 2 national engineering tests and 2 national surveying tests the first time, but failed the 2 hour Mississippi state specific surveying test the first time. That's the easiest one, supposedly.

The first time I took the MS state specific test we were outside waiting for it to start. All of us were talking with a 50 year old PLS that informed us he was licensed in 16 states. He was not cramming for the test like everyone else and was real cocky about it. The next fall when I was retaking it, guess who was there again? Mr 16 states.

 

[ShineOnYouCrazyBulldog]

I took it in '08. The game was a night game but I skipped it because I had already been through enough frustration that day.

Thanks, you've been a big help.

 

[woozman]

It's 4 years of experience under a licensed PE, when you took the FE has nothing to do with it.

The PE was much, much easier in my opinion than the FE. Luckily I passed the FE the 1st time right out of school. It was a ***** and the longer you wait the harder it gets. I knew a guy who took the FE 9 times and failed every time (and he studied his *** off each time). He was a good engineer, but gave up and switched careers.

Now with the PE, I took some key textbooks from key classes and flagged pages with common formulas/info based on my experience (water resources) and what I expected on the general portion of the test. Several people taking it with me had purchased a reference book that had all this info in one place, but I didn't want to spend the money. I have always been good at taking tests and only spent about 4-hours prepping for it and that was only flagging the pages of the books that I took.

 

[LandsurveyorDawg]

You only studied for the PE for 4 hours and passed? You must have made a 28 on your math section of the ACT. **

 

[woozman]

Actually made a 29 in math on the ACT****.

Yeah, like I said, I have always been good at taking tests. I didn't study for the FE at all (but took it in the last semester of school so a some of it was fresh on my mind) and didn't study for the PE (the 4-hours was spent putting flags on pages of reference books - I didn't study or work any practice problems). Maybe I was just lucky on both tests.

I came out of the FE feeling like a 10 pound bag of beat dicks (it was that hard in my mind), but I thought he PE was pretty easy.

 

[disappointeddawg]

What I meant is 4 years of qualifying experience since taking the FE. I don't think work under a PE before you've passed the FE counts, although you're applicable co-op time would sense you likely wouldn't have taken the FE yet, so it does matter when you take the FE. And different States have different requirements anyway. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[disappointeddawg]

but I definitely wouldn't recommend that study method to others.<div>
</div><div>I felt the same coming out of both the FE and PE as far as I can remember: very cautiously optimistic. I only knew of a couple people who failed the FE in my group. I don't know the pass rate but I rarely hear of people failing. The PE pass rate is about 65% percent for first timers and something like 25% for second timers. </div>

 

[catfishalicious]

Co-Oping gives you six months credit toward your PE, as long as you worked under a PE. Once you have a total of 4 working years under a PE you can take the PE exam regardless of when you passed the FE.

If you started working in April '08, you could take the FE in Oct '11 and the take the PE in April '12

 

[LandsurveyorDawg]

You can sign up to take the PE 4 years after your graduation date if you have a PE that will sign for that time. It doesn't matter when you take your FE. You could take the FE in the fall and the PE next spring.

Another crazy story I heard was a Colorado PE, who has been licensed for 20 years took his PE test 3 years 8 months after his graduation date, years ago. He passed. Louisiana wont let him get his LA license from commity because he didn't have 4 years between grad and test.

 

[woozman]

Didn't mean to imply that I was "awesome". I had some family circumstances at the time that didn't allow me to study, so I did what I could and rolled the dice. Like I said, I was probably lucky.

And, again, you are wrong with regards to the time frame for taking the PE(at least in Alabama where I took the PE). I know because I called the AL PE board to ask before I signed up for the PE. What they told me was that as long as you had been supervised by a licensed PE for 4-years, you could pass the FE and immediately apply for the PE exam.

 

[disappointeddawg]

I din't realize that. I also know a few people with similar issues. Co-worker with 25 years experience can't get a license because the State tried a special program for a couple years where you could go ahead and take the PE right out of school and then earn the experience. He can't get licensed in AL and probably anywhere else without retaking it. I know that MS only gives 6 months for co-op experience and Tennessee give a year I think so that could cause a similar problem for someone moving from TN.

 

[dawgbydesign]

The year I took the PE (mechanical), 10 people took it and only 3 passed.

 

[prairiedawg]

take his only carry around the end for 61 yard to beat Auburn that day 24-17. Suck it Auburn.

To answer your questions, I studied 3 weeks, I used one of the study guides of the day but I am sure is different now, I took a lot of books but only used a Cameron's Hydraulic and BK Hodge's Energy Systems Design book. I know that is not relevant because it was 20 yrs ago and it was Mechanical not Civil, but only mention because you aren't going to have time to pour through a lot of books. Take your most relevant ones, get to know them really well again, use the prep material, and get a good nights sleep.

 

[vhdawg]

When I took it, there were 66 people in the room taking the test.

Eleven of them were female.

Four of them were engineering hot.

One of them might have been actual hot.

Pretty much the ratio you'd expect.


As far as actual advice, I'd say:

1) Go ahead and get the calculator you'll be forced to use, and learn to use it. Use it for all your test preparation and studying. Know it like the back of your hand.

2) Don't do like I did and waste three months trying to relearn calculus. You won't need it.

3) Go to www.ppi2pass.com and order everything they offer for your chosen discipline. Your company might reimburse this if you're lucky. Their bigass reference manual was very handy. Practice tests and questions didn't hurt either.

4) Order the official NCEES practice test(s) for whatever you're planning to take. Also print and bind a copy of the FE reference book. It's much more concise than the big reference manual from ppi2pass, and handy if you know what you're looking for.

5) When you get about two days out from the test, you're not going to learn or relearn anything new, just chill out and let your brain relax, especially the day before.

6) Eat steak after its over.

Good luck!

 

[vhdawg]

....simply having passed the FE test doesn't mean you're registered as an Engineer Intern with the state. You actually have to submit the paperwork for that before they'll let you sit for the PE. In my case, I took the FE the day State lost to Arkansas in Little Rock in 1999, and it was three years later that I happened to START working for a licensed PE. Another four years later for the required experience and I'm seven years out from the FE. I thought I was registered as an EIT but I was not. Fortunately it was a pretty simple thing to get that done, but you will have to make sure that has happened.

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

...there are some things you CAN do today. First off, whoever on this post said that knowing 50% of the stuff very well is better than 90% of of the stuff poorly is correct. I graduated Petroleum Engineering, but took the Civil Exam because that's where I worked for the four years prior to the test. The first time I took the test, I spent way too much time studying Structures (3 solid months) and I could barely understand the Statics I took in school. However, I was an expert in other facets of Civil. It's structured differently today, but you need to concentrate on studying what you do know.<div>
</div><div>Secondly, preparing mentally is like preparing physically....be ready to take an 8 hour exam. When I first opened my help books, I could barely study 15 minutes, because I had been out of school for over 6 years. However, you work at it and work at it, and eventually you can mentally be ready to work 4 hours in the morning, take a 1 hour lunch break, and work 4 hours in the afternoon.</div><div>
</div><div>Finally, take a practice exam two weeks prior to the test. Do this at the house or the library. Begin at 8 in the morning, take your break at noon, resume at 1, and finish at five. After that, look at how well you did and see where you can improve, where you did well, etc. I knew I would finally pass ( took it two times), when I did much better on the practice exam.</div>

 

[memphisbulldog]

i didn't take it straight out of school like i should have.

You can't take the PE straight out of school.

Since several posters agree with this, things may have changed but let me tell you my experience:

I took the EIT at State. Passed.
Everyone said you had to wait 4 years to take the PE. In the fine print (again, may have changed over the years), I figured out that I could take the PE immediately but if I passed (which I did), I could not become a PE until I had the four years experience. The PE exam was hard but I felt it was easier straight out of school. I took the exam a few months out of MSU, passed, waiting four years, got my PE license.