OT: What did Nike do wrong to cause this?
- Thread starter GloryDawg
- Start date
would it be ok to just say they became to societally political, and given some of their add campaigns as a consumer, and looking at what I pay for their product and the quality......I could spend more money, and have better quality, so they lost my "I'm in hurry, I'll just buy NIKE" snap decision, and made me look elsewhere
How much have Hoka/OnCloud/etc grown in that time period? 78% is a big ol drop, not sure any one thing is going to explain that,
From reading, it sounds like its focus on direct to consumer (which I personally like) and struggles with cheaper competition in the China market are the biggest issues.
They did the opposite of what Michael Jordan did.
I'm not so sure the swoosh symbol and the jump man logo resonate with the current generation. To the current generation Michael Jordan is one of their fathers' heroes but not necessarily theirs. Other shoe brands have caught up in both design, comfort and value.
Nike hit an all time high within weeks of the Kaep ads and wouldn’t see the absolute peak for another 3 years. I don’t think it really has anything to do with any of that.
They could double as the jurors on the Clancy trial.Nike marketing team
Agreed.
Its the second most recognized brand on the planet. They made a huge blunder overplaying the D2C model (the marketing team I reference above) and they refused to budge once it went bad. Retailers gave up their space to HOKA, On, and others. They will come back, and its probably one of the best stocks to buy right now in the high 30s. They made $1.1 billion last quarter despite all the mistakes.
Then there is the athleisure brands that are cutting into their sales.
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I think NIke has always been inferior quality so I don't think that has suddenly started hurting them.
I think deprioritizing traditional retailers to push direct to consumer and nike owned retail outlets was a big hit? I think all those retailers that were partly doing Nike's marketing for them suddenly had a vested interest in pushing other brands that weren't intent on cutting them out as much as possible?
But I'm not sure that really explains that much. Some of it is probably just that it wasn't realistic to maintain their dominance at the same level indefinitely.
Of course some of it is pushing the woke ****. The marketing exec that signed off on Dylan Mulvaney after Budlight should be in jail for embezzlement. Zero upside to that and lots of potential downside. I suspect a decent number of affluent consumers are like me. I'm too busy to boycott ****, but if you make me look at Dylan Mulvaney or listen to somebody like Kapernick that grew up rich and wants to whine about oppression, that's an immediate loss of any tiebreaker if I have another decent option.
How's this different from every other marketing team? That industry is like 90% women.Nike marketing team
I disagree to an extent. I think most people see Nike as a lifestyle brand now because of their desire to get involved in "cultural issues." Because they shifted their priorities, they aren't viewed as a technical company like they once were. Outside of their $300+ marathon shoes, they really aren't market leaders at anything. Once upon a time, getting a pair of Nikes meant you were getting the best running/basketball/cleats on the market. That is no longer the case. Much like North Face. They were once market leaders in technical gear. Now they are a lifestyle brand for college kids.
Like I said, I have no clue why their sales are down. All of their marketing choices in that tweet seem to align perfectly with their long time core customers. I’m shocked those ads didn’t lead to long term success. Shocked.
Nike’s fall has been really interesting to watch over the last couple of years.
They vocally and aggressively exited the midtier level retail as a way to better position the brand, they focused on increasing direct online sales, and all that resulted in worse numbers.
And I believe a year or so ago they announced they would be expanding back into midtier level retail.
What I do know about Nike is their basketball shoes are embarrassingly bad across the board. They have like 15+ basketball shoe models right now, and only a couple of them are worth a damn. The rest are total dogshit for various reasons.
(earmuffs for those easily triggered)The two actually good Nike basketball shoes right now are signature shoes from WNBA players.
Anta, 361, LiNing, and even Adidas are destroying Nike in both tech and design.
They vocally and aggressively exited the midtier level retail as a way to better position the brand, they focused on increasing direct online sales, and all that resulted in worse numbers.
And I believe a year or so ago they announced they would be expanding back into midtier level retail.
What I do know about Nike is their basketball shoes are embarrassingly bad across the board. They have like 15+ basketball shoe models right now, and only a couple of them are worth a damn. The rest are total dogshit for various reasons.
(earmuffs for those easily triggered)The two actually good Nike basketball shoes right now are signature shoes from WNBA players.
Anta, 361, LiNing, and even Adidas are destroying Nike in both tech and design.
Yeah maybe take Kap out of it, his BS was in 2016/17. Three years later would have been 2020.
So theoretically the other three examples of marketing would have been since then, however.
Kap was Sept 2018. The all time highs was Nov 2021. He certainly didn’t hurt the stock. The pride shoes were produced from 2012 -2024. I don’t know why anyone is offended by the “own the room” ad (but maybe there is something I don’t know about it), and I don’t know anything about the fourth one.
Allow me to self deprecate- nothing I posted about the reasons for the drop in stock price are my independent thoughts. They are the analysts. It’s been issues in china with cheaper competition and direct to consumer being a bust as the primary drivers as far as I can tell. I love DTC though- free shipping. All the styles, all the sizes always available.
On the flip side, it became the #1 most recognized brand on the planet during the Jordan era, and has held one of the top spots since then by always having the most popular superstar athletes of the time in their ads (Bo Jackson/Andre Agassi/Tiger/Lebron/etc.)
So you can't really say anything they've done since 2000 has been what "built" or improved their brand. There's no denying their brand is ubiquitous, but it's not like that's news. The news is that they are losing position now for some reason... and their ads definitely took on a political bent since 2021 - that's undeniable. Maybe it's related, maybe not.
This is the answer. They decided that they didn't need brick and mortar partnerships and now the shelves are full of things not Nike.
I won't argue all the other stuff, but he first sat out the national anthem in August 2016, then officially took a knee instead on September 1, 2016.
Regardless if you want to count his "NFL-is-slavery" rhetoric as part of this or not, there's no doubt in my mind that Nike's decision to be more political in their ads did affect some people's opinion of them. They went from a cool athletic brand (with Jordan famously saying, "Republicans buy sneakers too") to now mainly a political advocate in some people's minds. Put that together with more and better options out there recently, and here we are.
ha ha, move on dude.
It’s been 3 1/2 years since that one single advertisement was posted online.
It was a single advertisement and nobody made you look at it…you never saw it online.
The only time you saw it was after outrage media decided it needed to be a culture war story.
How are you still so worked up by a single online ad from 3 1/2 years ago that you never even saw?
You just forced it into a conversation about a totally different company in a completely different industry.
It would be amazing if you got this outraged over genuinely important stuff.
Seriously, dude wants somebody in jail for using a picture of a trans person in an ad once. Deeply weird behavior.
Based on all the lazy 17ers I see out and about, they didn't buy Crocs and don't devote a lot of inventory to PJs.
Read an article about this earlier this week. Think the gist of it was abandoning retail partners, like others have mentioned. The second factor was a marked pivot towards women, to the exclusion of their historically male customer base (instead of adding women’s soccer/plus-sized athleisure models/Dylan Mulvaney to their existing icons like MJ, they basically replaced the male-skewing stuff with it completely).
The main reason this article jumped out at me was because I ran in Nike shoes for prob 20 years. When iPods came out and Nike came out with Nike+ for running, I was hooked and loved the whole ecosystem. There was a lot of advertising to runners and a ton of interlocking stuff to buy. Then more and more runner friends talked about NB and Brooks being so much better, and I woke up one day feeling like there wasn’t any reason to stay with Nike anymore. Looking back, maybe it was because I wasn’t their target demographic anymore. Bought my first pair of Brooks about 5 years ago and haven’t looked back.
The political stuff wasn’t really a deal-breaker - to me it’s just silly and off-putting. If I pulled into an oil change place tomorrow and the guy said, “Look: before I change your oil, I need to tell you why [Obama/Trump/Whoever] is the greatest president in American history,” I‘m going to nod politely and think to myself, “This guy’s a 17’n idiot.” I’m here to pay you to change my oil, not hear your political opinions, and if you don’t understand that then you’re a special kind of stupid.
The main reason this article jumped out at me was because I ran in Nike shoes for prob 20 years. When iPods came out and Nike came out with Nike+ for running, I was hooked and loved the whole ecosystem. There was a lot of advertising to runners and a ton of interlocking stuff to buy. Then more and more runner friends talked about NB and Brooks being so much better, and I woke up one day feeling like there wasn’t any reason to stay with Nike anymore. Looking back, maybe it was because I wasn’t their target demographic anymore. Bought my first pair of Brooks about 5 years ago and haven’t looked back.
The political stuff wasn’t really a deal-breaker - to me it’s just silly and off-putting. If I pulled into an oil change place tomorrow and the guy said, “Look: before I change your oil, I need to tell you why [Obama/Trump/Whoever] is the greatest president in American history,” I‘m going to nod politely and think to myself, “This guy’s a 17’n idiot.” I’m here to pay you to change my oil, not hear your political opinions, and if you don’t understand that then you’re a special kind of stupid.
Nike stuff just doesn’t fit me, shoes especially. I just don’t buy shoes that I can’t try on. A few years ago while in Starkville for a game I bought a pair of maroon Adidas like the coaches were wearing at the time. Best most comfortable shoe I’ve ever put on my feet. I liked them so much that a few months later I went back and bought a pair of black and a pair of gray shoes just to have. Same shoe model, same size and everything. The black ones were at least a size too big and while the gray ones fit, they didn’t even feel like the same shoe as the maroon ones. That’s why I try shoes on and don’t order them.
Things don't happen immediately. I know people my age grew up with Nike. With Mike and Bo and Spike and Tiger they captured the lions share of the market. They were cool and basically fine as a shoe. It became ingrained in the culture. Then they decided that half the people that bought their shoes were not worth it. It took each of us awhile to reach their own breaking point. Mine was the withdrawal of the Betsy Ross American Flag shoe and the statement that it would offend people. They didn't care if I became offended. From that point on I figured they were more than just being trendy and didn't want my business anymore. Haven't bought any Nike since. I'm sure there were folks of my generation that jumped off the train before and after that plus it's not like I really need shoes to run in anymore. I need more comfortable shoes or shoes I can put on easily like slip-ins. They basically intentionally decreased the American people they market to.
They went from a formula of feeling the real pulse of the USA to feeling a formula of a political agenda. I'm old enough to know that the Bo knows and Jordan stuff. Even being sued by the fricking dipshit beatles for a revolution commercial for their namesake shoe using the song the Beatles had. They stood tall through some of the crap but also suppported it. Not sure the DEI or other mess has began to kill their business model. It may be just trying to be the Amazon of shoe selling and that's not gonna work in my opinion. I need to try on a pair of shoes to be able to stand behind your brand.
Lululemon is going through the same thing. It’s just hard to dominate so much retail space for so long. Even with the biggest brands in the world.
I don’t think either company’s market share slides have really been the result of Cancel Culture:
I don’t think either company’s market share slides have really been the result of Cancel Culture:
Michael Jordan=Chuck Taylor to anyone younger than gen X. They can't rest on jumping man's laurels forever, but they do need to repeat the formula of having the best quality, innovative gear and a dominant pro athlete spokesperson with broad appeal. I don't see a lot from them aimed at retaining their historic core of people that like sports as a fan or as a participant.
They still have some great high end running shoes, but their everyday stuff is just not very good. On the high en though, the market is extremely competitive. Adidas is kicking their butts in the marathon space and just about every company has quality carbon plated shoes now.
i did a tennis shoe inventory… I have 3 pairs of Hoka’s and 2 pairs of oncloud’s. My wife does have a couple pairs of Nike’s she bought from Amazon, but has mostly New Balance and Adidas.
Not a shoe expert my any means but I am in touch with next gen. Next gen influences practically EVERYTHING. Youth today aren’t into Nike like most of us were. That’s your difference. It has next to nothing to do with a partnership with a particular person or some 50 IQ dummy with 2 teeth in a trailer park not liking Kaepernick (those people are in the EXTREME minority). I don’t care for Kaepernick but whatever doesn’t matter.
You put your typical next gen kid in a shoe store they are looking at On-Cloud, Hoka, Birkenstock, etc… first and foremost. Nike is just not as popular with next generation. I can assure anyone that 99% of kids today could careless about an ad campaign with Kaepernick or anyone else. The ONLY ones that care about stuff like that are the dried up idiots who wouldn’t be cool enough to buy anything mainstream either way… a complete non-issue in my view.
You put your typical next gen kid in a shoe store they are looking at On-Cloud, Hoka, Birkenstock, etc… first and foremost. Nike is just not as popular with next generation. I can assure anyone that 99% of kids today could careless about an ad campaign with Kaepernick or anyone else. The ONLY ones that care about stuff like that are the dried up idiots who wouldn’t be cool enough to buy anything mainstream either way… a complete non-issue in my view.
Not going woke worked so well for the MAGA stores!
Two major Trump-themed stores have closed as sales slow
High-profile Trump merchandise stores in Tennessee and Pennsylvania have closed amid fading postelection demand.
www.newsweek.com
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