Playoff Question

[blackknight_pride]

So I know it's not certain which regions will match up, but let's just say it's A-B and C-D for this year. Will it go down like a normal bracket?
#1 A vs #8 B
#2 A vs #7 B
#3 A vs # 6 B
etc....

Just curious, and the season is just around the corner!

 

[DinwiddieProud]

No. Almost certainly it will not cross bracket to that extent, if at all.

I know of at least one region that desires to produce only a regional champion with no cross bracketing at all. Which is the logical process. The Regions will individually decide if they want to decide that champion from two teams or all teams the teams in their region. But, if a region says, "nope, we will not cross bracket", then the region they are paired with has no choice but produce their own regional champion. Again, I can't see why in the world any region would want to cross bracket? Just a dumb idea.

The bigger argument seems to be about rotating regional pairings for football. Some want to rotate each year, others want the matchup to be fixed for all four years. For instant A vs B for four years.

But remember, nothing is final yet. The only think that is a fact is that there will be four regions, and the teams in each region, (at all six "Class levels"), are final for two years starting this fall.

It's important to remember this. The VHSL tells the member schools, "send us four teams for the two semi-final games", and "we don't care how you arrive at these four teams".

 

[CRF4Dan]

No. Almost certainly it will not cross bracket to that extent, if at all.

I know of at least one region that desires to produce only a regional champion with no cross bracketing at all. Which is the logical process. The Regions will individually decide if they want to decide that champion from two teams or all teams the teams in their region. But, if a region says, "nope, we will not cross bracket", then the region they are paired with has no choice but produce their own regional champion. Again, I can't see why in the world any region would want to cross bracket? Just a dumb idea.

The bigger argument seems to be about rotating regional pairings for football. Some want to rotate each year, others want the matchup to be fixed for all four years. For instant A vs B for four years.

But remember, nothing is final yet. The only think that is a fact is that there will be four regions, and the teams in each region, (at all six "Class levels"), are final for two years starting this fall.

It's important to remember this. The VHSL tells the member schools, "send us four teams for the two semi-final games", and "we don't care how you arrive at these four teams".

I think team with higher ratings should host.

 

[DinwiddieProud]

I think team with higher ratings should host.[/QUOTE

Within the region, that is almost a certainty.

 

[CRF4Dan]

Yes but I'm referring to once you get to state semifinals....

 

[DinwiddieProud]

I'm reasonably confident that will be the format. I guess you could have a pre-selected site, but that would be a horrible choice.

(I assume we are both speaking of "end of regular season" VHSL power points total?)

Now that I think about it, I guess you could resort to "regional seeding vs regional seeding"? As an example Region A, #3 seed as a semi finalist could have a higher VHSL power point total than the Region B #1 seed as a semi finalist. So I guess seeding could be an appropriate choice.

 

[CRF4Dan]

I'm reasonably confident that will be the format. I guess you could have a pre-selected site, but that would be a horrible choice.

(I assume we are both speaking of "end of regular season" VHSL power points total?)

Now that I think about it, I guess you could resort to "regional seeding vs regional seeding"? As an example Region A, #3 seed as a semi finalist could have a higher VHSL power point total than the Region B #1 seed as a semi finalist. So I guess seeding could be an appropriate choice.

Yeah I don't mind how they do it as long as it's not pre-determined for example how it was for a number of years where the Eastern and Central Region would meet in the state semis and North and Northwest would meet.

 

[DinwiddieProud]

Agreed. "Cut" made mention on your "back in time" post how the old system screwed some 9-1 teams. I know that you know how several Richmond area teams suffered from the old system. I think Bird got dinged by the system one year? I hope whatever is decided, they make sure we never go back to anything like that.

You do understand that it will be pre-determined? It most likely will be A vs B and C vs D this year. And most likely rotate to A vs C, and B vs D and so forth afterwards. (Some argument to not rotate regional matchups.) Essentially the four Regional champions play down for the championship. Not really different from recent years.

All other sports will have a somewhat different playoff format. I hear basketball may have a "play in" format that gives every regional team at least one playoff game. I like that idea a lot.

Generally speaking, assuming no extenuating circumstances, I thing all regional playoff games, in all sports, need to be played at the home of the higher seed.

 

[SpartanOfYore]

Agreed. "Cut" made mention on your "back in time" post how the old system screwed some 9-1 teams. I know that you know how several Richmond area teams suffered from the old system. I think Bird got dinged by the system one year? I hope whatever is decided, they make sure we never go back to anything like that.

You do understand that it will be pre-determined? It most likely will be A vs B and C vs D this year. And most likely rotate to A vs C, and B vs D and so forth afterwards. (Some argument to not rotate regional matchups.) Essentially the four Regional champions play down for the championship. Not really different from recent years.

All other sports will have a somewhat different playoff format. I hear basketball may have a "play in" format that gives every regional team at least one playoff game. I like that idea a lot.

Generally speaking, assuming no extenuating circumstances, I thing all regional playoff games, in all sports, need to be played at the home of the higher seed.

I think just about every school out there that's been a regular playoff participant has at least one "we wuz robbed!" story to tell. Salem's had teams stay home at 9-1 ('84) and 8-2 ('03). I think that 2003 team might have been able to make a good run at the whole ball of wax, too, so that one really hurt.

With the return to four regions, I can't imagine there will be anything other than four separate eight-team playoffs, to produce a champion within each of the regions. That will be three rounds of regional play, followed by two weeks for the state semis and final. Unless I'm mistaken, there will still only be five weeks allotted to complete all playoff games. I seem to recall devils saying that Region A was considering allowing ten teams into the playoffs, but I don't see how that would work, as that regional playoff would take four weeks instead of three. For that to happen, either all of Region A would have to start their seasons a week earlier, or none of those schools would have an open date during the season, thus allowing all Region A schools to finish up a week earlier than everyone else in the state. All so they could get a ten-team playoff started. Of course, he knows infinitely more about the workings of Region A than I do, but I can't see any of that taking place just to include ninth-seeded and tenth-seeded teams - both of whom would be extreme long shots, given that there are thirteen teams total in the region. Unless there is some other solution I'm overlooking.

 

[one man]

I think just about every school out there that's been a regular playoff participant has at least one "we wuz robbed!" story to tell. Salem's had teams stay home at 9-1 ('84) and 8-2 ('03). I think that 2003 team might have been able to make a good run at the whole ball of wax, too, so that one really hurt.

This. That was my junior year, when we lost to Fleming in the R3-D4 Championship. Fleming ended up losing to Powhatan 6-0 for the title that year. I know you guys beat Fleming that year and lost to Blacksburg in the season finale which ultimately cost you that spot in the playoffs. Who else did you guys lose too that year?
Playoff teams were 10-0 Heritage(Sem champ), 8-2 Blacksburg(RRD champ), 8-2 Fleming(BRD champ), 9-1 Liberty(wildcard). We beat Staunton River in the season finale but were all huddled in the locker room listening to the end of the Amherst-Heritage game on the radio. Had Amherst won, would have been a 3 way tie for Seminole with 3 9-1 teams and powerpoints would have been the tiebreaker which would have left us(Liberty) as the odd team out at 9-1. Fortunately Heritage beat Amherst, 26-21, who finished 8-2 that year and missed the playoffs also. Any of the four who made the playoffs and probably both Salem and Amherst who just missed out were all capable of winning the whole thing that year. Good memories. If we didn't have so many inter-region matchups in the regular season this year, I'd bet you'd see 6 teams with 8 wins in our region this year. With Amherst, GW, Salem, BBurg all having pretty tough non district slates, many verse each other, I'm guessing will see 4 or 5 teams with 8-2 or better records and another 2 or 3 with 7-3 records. Going to be a great year for our region! While I'm on it, can we torch the whole A,B,C,D thing and go East, Central, North and West?

 

[SpartanOfYore]

This. That was my junior year, when we lost to Fleming in the R3-D4 Championship. Fleming ended up losing to Powhatan 6-0 for the title that year. I know you guys beat Fleming that year and lost to Blacksburg in the season finale which ultimately cost you that spot in the playoffs. Who else did you guys lose too that year?
Playoff teams were 10-0 Heritage(Sem champ), 8-2 Blacksburg(RRD champ), 8-2 Fleming(BRD champ), 9-1 Liberty(wildcard). We beat Staunton River in the season finale but were all huddled in the locker room listening to the end of the Amherst-Heritage game on the radio. Had Amherst won, would have been a 3 way tie for Seminole with 3 9-1 teams and powerpoints would have been the tiebreaker which would have left us(Liberty) as the odd team out at 9-1. Fortunately Heritage beat Amherst, 26-21, who finished 8-2 that year and missed the playoffs also. Any of the four who made the playoffs and probably both Salem and Amherst who just missed out were all capable of winning the whole thing that year. Good memories. If we didn't have so many inter-region matchups in the regular season this year, I'd bet you'd see 6 teams with 8 wins in our region this year. With Amherst, GW, Salem, BBurg all having pretty tough non district slates, many verse each other, I'm guessing will see 4 or 5 teams with 8-2 or better records and another 2 or 3 with 7-3 records. Going to be a great year for our region! While I'm on it, can we torch the whole A,B,C,D thing and go East, Central, North and West?

Salem lost to Byrd in the third game of the season, 24-20. Of all the upset losses to Byrd, that's really the only one that ever came home to roost. But boy, did it ever - that's probably what kept the Spartans at home. Salem lost that one, and a one-pointer at Blacksburg in game nine, on a field goal with about seventeen seconds to play. None of the other eight games was close, at all. Salem waxed Fleming pretty good.

Yes, from the late 90's until '07, Region III Division 4 was a Murderer's Row, every year. I'd say more than a couple of those years, that region very likely had the three best teams in the state in Division 4, IMHO.

When I hear Region A, B, etc. I still think of the old single A set-up. I guess they didn't go with the directional names because they don't quite work for all of the classes. Class 6, for instance, has very few central teams, and only poor ol' Franklin County, out here in Siberia, anywhere close to "western."