I hope I’m not the only one that will say this but I’ll like mark pope regardless of how he does as a coach here. I know the man’s trying his best to put a good team on the floor and that’s why I still haven’t lost hope. You make good points with your post
Pope’s defense of Garrison
- Thread starter Wunky
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That’s the thing that frustrates me the most about BG… he has this golden opportunity to really be a team leader and show what he’s made of with JQ out, and he just gives us nothing. As a Junior.
I wish BG the best, but if he doesn’t get it by now, he isn’t going to.
I get you dont want to throw anyone under the bus, but damn Mark.. thought Cal was gone?
There is a time and a place for analytics, coaching basketball in the trenches is not one of them. You have to coach in the moment. I was sky high on popes hire initially but he is losing favor very quickly. I have zero tolerance for BS coaching with the money they make.
I know you don’t like me but I’m being sincere when I say chill out man. It’s just a message board dude
That’s kinda the problem. Neither does he. Just a bunch of mindless babble with feel good words. For the record, it has been this way since day one. Just a lot of BBN was still in PTSD from the last five or so years of Cal. And for good reason. But here’s the thing…they are both FOS. Just in vastly different ways.
People are who they are. Mark Pope the coach and the person is NOTHING even close to Rick Pitino. A great deal of that is a good thing. The part that wins basketball games, not so much.
Oh, I get what he said. He’s just inaccurate. Just reference the pic I posted and the explanation of the stat he referenced. Numbers don’t lie. Interpretations of said numbers can certainly be misrepresented though. That’s exactly what Pope did. Now, you can toss out some passive agressive comment, or simply try to refute the interpretation I gave. I’m good either way.
If hes 2nd in our offense analytics, we're obviously using the wrong metrics. Hes awful.
He’s not. He’s first or second on the team in points per possession when he’s on the court. If you go to Sports Reference, you can see a game by game breakdown. He gets fat on the three cupcakes and because he plays with the starters in those games. That’s state isn’t a measure of “total offensive efficiency” for an individual.
Be upset about air-balling threes, but Garrison’s criticism is well deserved this year. He looks both less skilled and less inspired on the court. Guy is getting way too many minutes to have as little positive impact as he’s having.
It’s been said especially in baseball. We’ve seen it ruin many good teams. “Analytics” has no pulse of reality. It says nothing about the future. You must have human decisions made in real time. Analytics are meant for a purpose but making full blown decisions around your entire program isn’t it.
BG is a great example. On the court he’s awful. On a piece of paper he’s okay. He’s not okay he’s terrible. This is not algebra. This is human, and baseball has been totally ruined by head offices demanding coaches play what the numbers bear out. Then they stick with a pitcher who’s trash that day because the math says he needs to throw. I’ve seen my team absolutely tank since this has taken place.
You need the human eye and human emotion to understand what needs to be done. If Mark thinks he’s going to read a piece of paper and it’ll tell him how to coach? He won’t make it here long at all.
“Anal”lytics do not measure every single step a player makes to understand what’s going on. Math dorks have ruined sports. “Analytics” told Mark this is a dynamite team that crunches his numbers. Well, looks like analytics don’t show half of what is real here.
Pope has to stop spending so much on analytics and he needs to look in the mirror and figure out what he’s doing wrong recruiting. He’s missing on way to many players to be successful here.
Maybe that’s another problem and why Mark is looking lost. The math tells him this isn’t possible and he doesn’t understand it. Quit looking at that, coach the team. Throw the math away. Watch the court. Call Pitino. Do something but quit looking at those stupid numbers.
Pope has to justify overpaying him $2-3 million in NIL.
Honestly, I haven't seen anyone say anything that was untrue. Most of the criticism is pretty close to what you just said.
Keep in mind, these dudes are making millions, because they are at UK and the money is available.
That money is available partly because the fanbase is what it is. If you're going to take that money, you really need to perform. These guys are pro athletes now, not unpaid college kids.
Thing is, Pope had to overlook so much data and dig very hard to find numbers that sorta made BG look like he deserved praise, but even then, he had to cover one eye and squint with the other.
Then, he pissed on us in the presser and told us it was raining.
I know why he did it, but after these two blowouts and seeing the lack of effort, he has to sack up and call a spade a spade.
Jeff, I don't post much on here, and if you are who I think you are, you know of me, a simple man.
But Mark is facing some tuff times at the present. But do you think maybe he was using some reverse psychology to fire him and other players up?
Who knows, but times are bad now, we can only hope he gets it turned around.
Personally speaking, id like to be honest. All I talked about all summer was how much improved Brandon Garrison was gonna be. No greater evaluation miss than that one. Spent a many hour debating intensely with Eagles Ball on that one. I might have gotten him on the Collin Chandler deal, but I’d sure like to have my time back that I spent hyping up this failure of a “second year Brandon Garrison.” I can handle mistakes, but not lack of effort. I can’t sell my stock fast enough and I don’t say it with pride. I’d sure love for the kid to figure out how his head can be surgically removed from his own anus and we see something resembling a useful player.
Yeah, I do think Mark is trying to talk to BG through the media. It’s really the only thing thst makes sense.Jeff, I don't post much on here, and if you are who I think you are, you know of me, a simple man.
But Mark is facing some tuff times at the present. But do you think maybe he was using some reverse psychology to fire him and other players up?
Who knows, but times are bad now, we can only hope he gets it turned around.
However, he painted himself into a corner, because now, after those comments, he has to play BG, because if he cuts his minutes, everyone, including BG, will know he was blowing smoke.
Mark wanted this. He knew this wasn't going to be easy and there will be many more times like this, so he needs to get it together and handle it.
But if he wants to fix this, he's going to have to make some tough decisions and some guys won't like those decisions.
Or, he can just keep on doing what he's doing and not hurt players feelings. I don't think this is a good idea, but it's ones Pope might go with.
I’ll admit to being wrong on Chandler if it makes you feel better.
None of our returners except for Chandler have improved. In fact, they all seem worse. That may be the biggest surprise, and concern, for me.
If Pope paid him that kind of money, I can’t support him as coach. And I’ve given everything I have to try and wish this through. I’ve gone full support mode. Had I been AD and seen that kind of money for Garrison, I’d have put a stop to it immediately.
He’s not a drunk is he?
because we need to break that pattern.
I have a feeling Pitino will jerk a knot in Pope's tail after the St. John's game. Win or lose. One more sage lesson from the old coach.
"Use your f***in eyes when the numbers lie to you."
The fact that we're even using analytics this early in the season is concerning. Central Limit Theorem is taught in every stats class for a reason. Sure, there are stats that can account for small sample sizes, but when the eyeball test is telling us that no, not everything is hunky dory, it gets concerning.
I'm still on the Pope train, but he's got to understand that this cutesy stuff gets old when we're losing. I know he cares about the program, but fans want results, not stats.
Cal didn't use any analytics and just went off of handlers and vibes. Pope might rely on analytics too much. Pope needs to find a happy medium if he wants to succeed. He's talked about finding that happy medium before, too.
"Use your f***in eyes when the numbers lie to you."
The fact that we're even using analytics this early in the season is concerning. Central Limit Theorem is taught in every stats class for a reason. Sure, there are stats that can account for small sample sizes, but when the eyeball test is telling us that no, not everything is hunky dory, it gets concerning.
I'm still on the Pope train, but he's got to understand that this cutesy stuff gets old when we're losing. I know he cares about the program, but fans want results, not stats.
Cal didn't use any analytics and just went off of handlers and vibes. Pope might rely on analytics too much. Pope needs to find a happy medium if he wants to succeed. He's talked about finding that happy medium before, too.
Got that right.
Need somebody on this staff that is just a bb Junkie
and knows what he's doing.
You can take stats & make them show anything
as a man of faith and science I’m all about using numbers. But my eyes are also a factor.
Had a boss do this to me in sales once. Said we weren’t busy because we had only done X amount of dollars. Raked me over the coals for not getting other things done that day. I said look at the transactions. It was double our usual amount just a bunch of small stuff.
He shut up real quick. Sorry. My numbers told the truth. Yours didn’t.
And in basketball the ultimate number truth is the W-L column and the scoreboard.
Anybody can put up #'s to boost analytics against Athletes in Action. What did he do against UL or Mich St? Nothing on offense or defense.
^^^This^^^ I've been screaming it from the Appalachian mountain tops and posting it on every video and message board.
I don't think that is a fair assessment. We aren't entitled to his dismantling. I think Pope did what a coach should do to the public, which is at the very least, present a united front. Public embarrassment wont help the situation