Primarily running offenses slowly becoming less effective?
- Thread starter WestSuburbanCatholicConference
- Start date
And so did Hetlet. Not sure we have any "giant linemen" this year. I think GW has had a lot of talent over the years, but were never really a loaded team like 2013 MC. Whether GW's talent is natural or developed is subject to debate, but what IMO, it is more than the star talent. GW does a good job of taking "average" kids and inspiring them to work hard, to hit hard, to be better athletes and to mentally focus. IMO few teams are as mentally focused as GW--MC, LZ, Stevie (last year) and WWS (in past years) are the exception-they will not be intimidated and will fight to the last play. The defense and O-line this year are perfect examples of average kids rising to the occasion.. GW has primarily been a running team, but using the pass has really been helpful in the last few years when teams get too focused on a particular player. There are a contingent of GW fans who have been at times frustrated when GW has been too one dimensional.
JCA has had it's share for sure.
I recall a couple from Joliet West. A Defensive end and a tight end if I am not mistaken.
They have had a few over the years, but I don't remember any from Joliet West. If they transfer from West, they have to sit out a year. Don't know many kids/parents willing to do that.
Far more students/players have transferred out than have transferred in.
These are gawdy. Maybe not at Naz, but at most places. Top 3 receivers averaging over 20 per catch. particularly on the top 2, is impressive for the triple.
Jalen Robinette 20 562 28.1 74 (TD) 4
Garrett Brown 26 534 20.5 61 1
Garrett Griffin 8 173 21.6 51 (TD) 3
PJJP,
Why do you continue to ignore the three power 5 running backs JCA had in the backfield and failed with? Not to mention the host of other linemen and athletes on the same team. Guess it doesn't fit you 1 year transfer excuse...right?
Why do you continue to ignore the three power 5 running backs JCA had in the backfield and failed with? Not to mention the host of other linemen and athletes on the same team. Guess it doesn't fit you 1 year transfer excuse...right?
If you read my original post, I agreed with some of what Secondo wrote. I also posted that the transfers are just a small part of the equation. However, I highlighted it because there was not much that separated those teams in the games I listed, with the exception of 2011. Transfers were one reason for the slight difference. IMO, the biggest difference between the schools I highlighted presently is how Montini and recently Naz work harder to get football talent into the school. You've posted about Naz making inroads in the Joliet and Plainfield areas. If that trend continues, the Hilltoppers are in trouble.
IMO, the schematic problems JCA had in previous years were mainly on defense. They've addressed those issues with their coaching and scheme changes. Against Naz this year, turnovers, Julian Love and Naz' defense were the difference, IMO. Obviously, not everyone agrees with that point of view.
Last edited:
Hernandez transferred in after his freshmen year. Sat out his soph year and played two years of varsity football. Again, not a 1-year transfer.
You would struggle list five teams with more talent then Glenbard West over the last decade.
I guess I don't get why you are hung up on the 1 year transfer. Isn't a transfer a transfer? Or are you trying to legitimize yours compared to the one's which you lost to?
Transferred in after his freshman year. Sat out his soph. year. Played two years of varsity football.
Is there a difference between someone who transfers in after their junior or freshmen years? Yes, look at it from a football perspective. Do you think Montini knew John Rhode, Jaleel Jones and Nial Sykes were very good players before they came to Montini? What did JCA know about Jordan Jones and Xavier Hernandez? They played freshmen football at their respective schools prior to transferring. No difference there? Again, I'm not pointing the finger and alleging anything. I'm saying those Jr. transfers contributed to Montini's success and gave Montini a competitive advantage in the years those guys played. The difference was not solely an offensive schematic advantage.
Pretty sure he was from one of the Naperville schools. He went to Pitt. He was a bright kid. He tried to walk on. From what I remember, he received an academic scholarship. Don't know if he ever played there.
Not only is he a good coach,having my son play for his program was probably one of my sons best experiences and best memories of his life.Before we entered his program and played for different programs all I used to hear about MR difusco was he's a cheat,he'd an arrogant piece of crap he recruites player from other states and the story's go on and on until we started playing for him,there is nobody I mean nobody I would want my son to play for other than Doug when it comes to youth football.Just to see how he treats his kids and how they respond to him is like nothing I have ever seen.Why do you think kids follow him wherever he goes becuase kids and family's adore this man.Is he a cock MF absolutely but so would I if I had one the best youth programs in the country.i can go on and on about this but I leave it at that but one more thing his football IQ is second to none and to watch how he runs an offense is an amazing thing to watch trust me the HYPE is real.
no finger pointing but pointing straight at him.[/QUOTE]
What is the strength of your program? At JCA over the years, they always seem to have big, strong linemen. Until recently the college-type running backs have not been the norm. I would never suggest that their scheme is wrong. For what they have traditionally had to work with, a power running game has been very successful. To suggest that another scheme would be more successful is purely speculation.
Bingo. Now, could things be improved? Yes, but the biggest need for improvement was the defense until recent years.
I think the coaching staffs that have played SHG from north of I-80 have tremendous respect for the program. The fanbases, not so much. I went to college and worked with a SHG grad, he mentioned the clinic at SHG and the number of coaches that attended it.
PJJP,
But the passing defense has NOT improved. When Naz slow played the first half and also committed mistakes there were problems, 31-0 problems. After the half and adjustments were made the passing attack light up the JCA defense. JCA was able to hold on, but as others from JCA and elsewhere have pointed out, when JCA is having to play from behind adjustments don't come. I've been told that when coach Sharp arrived some 30 years ago he threw the ball quite a bit, while it might have been "only" a variety of screens, it allowed for change of pace and caused the opponent to scheme for more and prevented teams from stuffing 7-11 in the box.
If the scheme currently being used couldn't work with the talent I pointed out before, failure to win the big ones are not because of kids that transfer into any given school for 1,2, or 3 years but rather because of some systemic issue. I am sure coach Sharp is looking at every option and I wish him the best...a strong JCA is best for the ESCC!
But the passing defense has NOT improved. When Naz slow played the first half and also committed mistakes there were problems, 31-0 problems. After the half and adjustments were made the passing attack light up the JCA defense. JCA was able to hold on, but as others from JCA and elsewhere have pointed out, when JCA is having to play from behind adjustments don't come. I've been told that when coach Sharp arrived some 30 years ago he threw the ball quite a bit, while it might have been "only" a variety of screens, it allowed for change of pace and caused the opponent to scheme for more and prevented teams from stuffing 7-11 in the box.
If the scheme currently being used couldn't work with the talent I pointed out before, failure to win the big ones are not because of kids that transfer into any given school for 1,2, or 3 years but rather because of some systemic issue. I am sure coach Sharp is looking at every option and I wish him the best...a strong JCA is best for the ESCC!
Maybe they came to learn his philosophy so they could stop SHG. That's what I would have done if I was a "northern" team.
IMO, Sharp got very conservative after the pick-six. Naz limited the JC running game by getting in gaps and blowing up plays, evidenced by the number of negative plays. The Tribune article credited Love with 6 TFL's. JC was not able to counter that. They tried to vary their cadence early and had some success slowing down the timing of the Naz run blitzes. Then, they started picking up false start penalties and went away from that. Maybe Sharp thought it was a bad matchup in the passing game. Maybe he just got too conservative. But, their TE's were more blockers than receivers, as they usually are, so options are limited. If you say that's part of an archaic scheme and personnel deployment, I'm not going to argue.
The 2nd half of the first meeting was the worst pass defense they played all year. A lot of that had to do with Naz' athletes, and some had to do with injuries and momentum of the game....and possibly playing too passive with the lead. I'm not saying JC's pass defense is top notch. Clearly, it's not. But, believe it or not, it's improved since the time prior to the 2013 season. They don't have the quality of athlete in the defensive backfield that a team like Naz has. I liked some of their DB's this year, but it's never a strength of their team. Look at #16 Christian Davis for Naz. You knew of him. I didn't, until the playoff game. He recovered the first fumble. Caught the subsequent TD pass. Then intercepted the pass on the next series and took it to the house. I believe I have that right. If so, that's a nice contribution in the first 4 minutes of the game from someone who is not one of Naz' "name" players to those outside the program. Nice to have athletes like that eh?
Last edited:
PJJP,
My point is it wasn't because of 1year transfers there are other issues. CD is a great kid, will be sad to see him graduate this year. That said he's always been an Athlete and impact player.
My point is it wasn't because of 1year transfers there are other issues. CD is a great kid, will be sad to see him graduate this year. That said he's always been an Athlete and impact player.
IMO, Lemont is not in the title game without Nagel. Unfortunately for Lemont, he ran into the coverage skills of Julian Love in the title game.
I agree JC needs to get better at the transfer game. Only a handful of impact players over the years. With lower enrollment, getting soph, junior, and senior transfers (football players and otherwise) can only help the school and program.
As long as we're on the topic of transfers, I see Naz's sole sophomore starter on defense did not attend Naz last year. In fact, I believe he attended a different school for his freshman year and didn't play football, just for the pee-wee team that's been discussed here. I assume there had to be a change in residence for him to play, right? Or has the IHSA rule changed?
I honestly don't know if that rule has changed or not. I'm sincerely curious about it. Just shows you that JC legitimately needs to get more exposure on the transfer market and then maybe I would know the current rules.
As long as we're on the topic of transfers, I see Naz's sole sophomore starter on defense did not attend Naz last year. In fact, I believe he attended a different school for his freshman year and didn't play football, just for the pee-wee team that's been discussed here. I assume there had to be a change in residence for him to play, right? Or has the IHSA rule changed?
I honestly don't know if that rule has changed or not. I'm sincerely curious about it. Just shows you that JC legitimately needs to get more exposure on the transfer market and then maybe I would know the current rules.
There is a reason why they don't run these type of schemes in college and nfl.. That's why I think it's just starting now to trend away at the high school level
I think every school mentioned as having one year transfers has also lost kids transferring out.
Sole? Naz has 2 sophs starting, 1 frosh. And as long as you don't play for your school you are free to transfer and play without sitting.
I see what you mean JCHillmen. The sole soph. starter on defense looks to share the name of one of the directors of said pee wee team.
http://ihsa.org/SportsActivities/Bo...formationResults.aspx?url=/data/fb/5info1.htm
Yes, sole. As listed by the starting lineup provided by the Naz football program to the IHSA. Look at the site. 1 offensive and 1 defensive soph starter. If it's wrong, it's a clerical error on the IHSA or Naz's part.
Correct, I would do it regardless of where I would be in the state. I would also take some notes and see if there was anything I could incorporate into my own offense. Ken Leonard and staff know what they are doing with the spread offense.
Hope you're joking jwar. I have a lot of respect for most of the stuff you have posted, but certainly don't like the recent condescension. And who is looking for excuses? Some people got overzealous and said the entire JC system needs to be scrapped because it's a "dinosaur." The opinion of most JC supporters ranges from needing minor systematic tweaks to significant changes. I am of the former opinion as are most posters on here. It was also stated, and rightfully so, that JC could definitely benefit itself by getting more involved in the transfer game.
Once again, I can only assume you were saying it tongue in cheek, but if those above reasons are "excuses," you're clearly reading it wrong. Kind of like a few weeks ago when a guy from another school tried to say JC was handing Naz the game and you got all bent out of shape (apologies if I am mistaken and it was a different Naz poster I'm thinking of). He wasn't a JC guy and he wasn't making excuses for why Naz was winning, just stating the obvious that JC was making too many mistakes and shooting themselves in the foot.
Not every statement needs to be taken as an affront, just like the "sole sophomore defensive starter" statement. It wasn't an attack and it turns out the statement was 100% true based on the information Naz submitted to the IHSA.
Good luck Saturday. Beat LWW. Win another state championship. Winning is great but it does not validate an entire football philosophy. It just means you had the best team that year. Every program learns that when they hit the dry spells that every team hits and schools like MS and JC just happen to be a few years into now.