Realistic expectations for basketball program?

[TheNewMSU]

What do yall think are some realistic expectations for our basketball program? Let us look at a few facts:

1) Our budget is the absolute lowest in the SEC - if we were getting our money's worth we would be 0-16 in league play and 1 and out in the SEC tourney every year, we are obviously exceeding expectations here
2) We are located in the most sparsely populated area in the SEC with the smallest recruiting area - we could actually be considered a tie with UM here, but we are pretty much ahead of them every year so I think we are doing ok here
3) Our facilities are AVERAGE at best - go step in Bud Walton or Rupp arena and ask yourself how in the world we compete with these guys....it is mind boggling in a way
4) Fan support - I think we do pretty well here, MSU has some great fans who are vocal and supportive and actually care about basketball, I would give us the nod over Ole Miss and Auburn but that is about it

So given the facts what would you say are some realistic expectations of our coach? Coming out and saying "hey I want a sweet 16 run every year" is ignorant beyond all reason given what we are facing as a program. I would say a tourney appearance every 5-6 would be far exceeding any realistic expectations we have set for ourselves. Any other thoughts?

 

[TheNewMSU]

What do yall think are some realistic expectations for our basketball program? Let us look at a few facts:

1) Our budget is the absolute lowest in the SEC - if we were getting our money's worth we would be 0-16 in league play and 1 and out in the SEC tourney every year, we are obviously exceeding expectations here
2) We are located in the most sparsely populated area in the SEC with the smallest recruiting area - we could actually be considered a tie with UM here, but we are pretty much ahead of them every year so I think we are doing ok here
3) Our facilities are AVERAGE at best - go step in Bud Walton or Rupp arena and ask yourself how in the world we compete with these guys....it is mind boggling in a way
4) Fan support - I think we do pretty well here, MSU has some great fans who are vocal and supportive and actually care about basketball, I would give us the nod over Ole Miss and Auburn but that is about it

So given the facts what would you say are some realistic expectations of our coach? Coming out and saying "hey I want a sweet 16 run every year" is ignorant beyond all reason given what we are facing as a program. I would say a tourney appearance every 5-6 would be far exceeding any realistic expectations we have set for ourselves. Any other thoughts?

 

[TheNewMSU]

What do yall think are some realistic expectations for our basketball program? Let us look at a few facts:

1) Our budget is the absolute lowest in the SEC - if we were getting our money's worth we would be 0-16 in league play and 1 and out in the SEC tourney every year, we are obviously exceeding expectations here
2) We are located in the most sparsely populated area in the SEC with the smallest recruiting area - we could actually be considered a tie with UM here, but we are pretty much ahead of them every year so I think we are doing ok here
3) Our facilities are AVERAGE at best - go step in Bud Walton or Rupp arena and ask yourself how in the world we compete with these guys....it is mind boggling in a way
4) Fan support - I think we do pretty well here, MSU has some great fans who are vocal and supportive and actually care about basketball, I would give us the nod over Ole Miss and Auburn but that is about it

So given the facts what would you say are some realistic expectations of our coach? Coming out and saying "hey I want a sweet 16 run every year" is ignorant beyond all reason given what we are facing as a program. I would say a tourney appearance every 5-6 would be far exceeding any realistic expectations we have set for ourselves. Any other thoughts?

 

[dawgstudent]

I would say a tourney appearance every 5-6 would be far exceeding any realistic expectations we have set for ourselves.

That's reaching for the stars. My goal is 3 out of 5 years - make the tourney.

 

[Hanmudog]

Or so I heard from a guy nicknamed after a fuzzy fruit.

 

[TheNewMSU]

So, given what we are facing relative to our peers, you are expecting the rest of the SEC to make the tourney every single year outside of Ole Miss and Auburn? I am just trying to understand how you come to that conclusion. Holding on to a stock and telling yourself "I really hope this goes up" will in reality not change a damn thing. What makes you think, given our history and support, we should make the tourney every 3 out of 5 years? Could you please back that up with a few facts that would support your expectations? Thanks

 

[Coach34]

its a damn wonder we can afford uniforms and a basketball with any leather on it....too bad we dont have a budget like George Mason, Davidson, or Cleveland St

 

[TheNewMSU]

comparing to some school in rural Indiana isn't a fair or accurate comparison. Compare to how we do against our peers relative to what we have to work with and let's set our expectations based on that. I don't think that is being unfair and we could accurately guage how well we are doing. Care to give us what you think we should be achieving and let's go from there? Please back it up with a few facts.

Responding with emotions really doesn't add much to the discussion.</p>

 

[dawgstudent]

so we are easily on track for that 60% clip. Keep it up Stansbury.

Your posting reeks of "The Old MSU".

 

[TheNewMSU]

Than all of his peers in the conference? I happen to agree with that AND think we are greatly exceeding any realistic expectations we can expect given our situation. If he makes it 3 out of 5 years at MSU he should have a statue of himself put up outside the Hump.

 

[patdog]

NCAA tournament appearance - 40% of the time.

NIT appearance - 30% of the time.

Worse - 30% of the time.</p>

 

[seshomoru]

*****.

 

[gtowndawg]

which if you are...nevermind.

Our budget is the absolute lowest in the SEC - if we were getting our money's worth we would be 0-16 in league play and 1 and out in the SEC tourney every year, we are obviously exceeding expectations here

How many times must this be explained? Yes, we have a lower budget. But, we don't compete in much of the sports that other SEC schools compete in. Dollar for basketball dollar we're not much different from most of the others. Save a Kentucky, Florida or Arkansas, but that's to be expected.

We are located in the most sparsely populated area in the SEC with the smallest recruiting area - we could actually be considered a tie with UM here, but we are pretty much ahead of them every year so I think we are doing ok here

What does a sparsely populated area have anything to do with signing 1, 2 or maybe 3 guys per year? We're not talking football here. Plus, we recruit a state that historically has some of the best basketball talent in the world. Epic fail.

Our facilities are AVERAGE at best - go step in Bud Walton or Rupp arena and ask yourself how in the world we compete with these guys....it is mind boggling in a way

Yes, our facilities are average compared to Rupp and Bud Walton. But compared to most of the others (Ole Miss, Georgia, Alabama, LSU, etc) we're just as nice if not better and once the indoor facility is done we will be in the top 1/3.

Fan support - I think we do pretty well here, MSU has some great fans who are vocal and supportive and actually care about basketball, I would give us the nod over Ole Miss and Auburn but that is about it

We have pretty good fan support. Again, better than most outside of a few.

Bottom line is we have every reason in the world to expect a consistent tourney team with the occasional great year. We have a decent history with tradition and for crying out loud we have been to the freakin' final four. It's not like it can't be done at poor ole' MSU.

 

[Coach34]

basketball is not football- ****, you only need about 5-6 good players with some well-placed subs. Those teams I mentioned also compete in the NCAA and play teams larger than themselves. Your statements are pretty much ******** for the most part.

A. Budget? We may be last, but its still a nice one. Our budget isnt a Mercedes, but its a damn Ford Expedition. And that aint a bad ride

B. Small recruiting area? We have players had players from New York, Virginia, Texas, Florida....and lots of campuses are located in small areas

C. Facilities are average? We need a practice facility but the Hump is an outstanding place to play and watch basketball. And it holds more people than Cameron Indoor if i'm not mistaken.

D. Fan Support? Shaq mentions us in a Sports Illustrated article on toughest places he has ever played, as did the Fla team that won a NC....sounds like pretty good damn support to me...

your whole whiny-***-woe-is-us-********-post makes me want to punch you right in the forehead

 

[dawgstudent]

I get frustrated with Stansbury's coaching ability but to be happy with 1 NCAA Tourney appearance out of 5 or 6 is crazy. So if Byrne let Stansbury go because of that, you would be pissed at Byrne? Amazing.

 

[TheNewMSU]

I am just trying to understand how you came to that expectation. Could you provide any type of facts that would back that to up to even think that it SHOULD be possible?

Anyone can say "Sweet 16 80% of the time"....doesn't mean it is very intelligent to do so....just trying to understand how you came to that conclusion given our history and present situation. Looking forward to a response.

 

[Hanmudog]

"your whole whiny-***-woe-is-us-********-post makes me want to punch you right in the forehead"

Priceless.........Oh and I agree with you for once.

 

[TheNewMSU]

"How many times must this be explained? Yes, we have a lower budget. But, we don't compete in much of the sports that other SEC schools compete in. Dollar for basketball dollar we're not much different from most of the others. Save a Kentucky, Florida or Arkansas, but that's to be expected. "

Please back that up with some facts.

"What does a sparsely populated area have anything to do with signing 1, 2 or maybe 3 guys per year? We're not talking football here. Plus, we recruit a state that historically has some of the best basketball talent in the world. Epic fail. "

It has EVERYTHING to do with it. Why do you think UCLA, Florida, Texas, etc....consistently have top teams? I'll give you a hint - they are located in some of the best recruiting areas in the country. Why isn't North Dakota State and Wyoming running head to head with UCLA every year? Are you really that naive? Idiot.....

"Yes, our facilities are average compared to Rupp and Bud Walton. But compared to most of the others (Ole Miss, Georgia, Alabama, LSU, etc) we're just as nice if not better and once the indoor facility is done we will be in the top 1/3. "

"We have pretty good fan support. Again, better than most outside of a few."

Could you provide some attendance figures for that one? Not that it makes that much of a difference but I seriously doubt we are above many here.

I don't see any reason to expect much better than a tourney appearance 1 out of 5-6 years given our situation. I am a fan and HOPE we do every single year, but we should at least be realistic about it.

I love State as much as the next guy but we are nowhere even close to most of our peers in this regard. Have you even been outside of Starkville?

 

[patdog]

I say we should make the NCAA tournament 40% of the time. Since the SEC expanded to 12 teams in 1991, the conference has gotten a total of 97 bids to the NCAAT. That works out to a 42.5% average per team per year. Given our history in all other sports besides baseball, I think holding us to an expectation of 40% is, if anything, maybe a little high and it's certainly not low at all.

 

[BlindDawg]

Why do you think UCLA, Florida, Texas, etc....consistently have top teams? I'll give you a hint - they are located in some of the best recruiting areas in the country.

Dude, you need to remove UCLA from that list. I understand the point you're trying to make, but you're not helping yourself by putting UCLA in that list. UCLA's success has everything to do with a Mr. John Wooden, not so much the state he coached in.

 

[OEMDawg]

comparing to some school in rural Indiana isn't a fair or accurate comparison. Compare to how we do against our peers relative to what we have to work with and let's set our expectations based on that. I don't think that is being unfair and we could accurately guage how well we are doing. Care to give us what you think we should be achieving and let's go from there? Please back it up with a few facts.

Responding with emotions really doesn't add much to the discussion.</p>

There have been several examples comparing us to the rest of the SEC. It's been pointed out here several times that 9 of the 12 teams in the SEC have made the Sweet 16 at least once since 2000. But many of you don't care to pay attention to that little fact. B-b-b-b-but we are poor ol MSU so continue on with your pity party.

 

[gtowndawg]

This has to be a joke. No way this is real. No one is this stupid/insane...unless you're the good Dr. himself.

It has EVERYTHING to do with it. Why do you think UCLA, Florida, Texas, etc....consistently have top teams? I'll give you a hint - they are located in some of the best recruiting areas in the country. Why isn't North Dakota State and Wyoming running head to head with UCLA every year? Are you really that naive? Idiot.....

You said we should be happy with making the tourney once every 5 years. You based that on the fact we're located in Starkville, MS. I called BS. I never said we should have a national powerhouse like the schools you all of the sudden threw in the argument. I said we can make the tourney consistently and have an occasional great year. Don't change your argument mid-stream dipstick.

We have pretty good fan support. Again, better than most outside of a few."

Could you provide some attendance figures for that one? Not that it makes that much of a difference but I seriously doubt we are above many here.

Again, I didn't say we have the highest attendence. But we have great fan support. We've freakin sold out the hump for what 3 or 4 years in a row? That's pretty good support. And coach made some good arguments on this subject as well.

I want to ask you a question. What do you expect to get out of this? What do you hope to accomplish by coming here and saying we should only expect to make the tourney once every five years? Please explain.

Have you even been outside of Starkville?

Seriously???? Again, epic, epic fail.

 

[fishwater99]

Why do you think UCLA, Florida, Texas, etc....consistently have top teams? I'll give you a hint - they are located in some of the best recruiting areas in the country.

Dude, you need to remove UCLA from that list. I understand the point you're trying to make, but you're not helping yourself by putting UCLA in that list. UCLA's success has everything to do with a Mr. John Wooden, not so much the state he coached in.

That's what UCLA did 2006, 2007, 2008....

 

[BlindDawg]

Did you read the rest of the thread or the post I was replying to? What's that have to do with it? Are you trying to say John Wooden is not why UCLA is the power that they are?

 

[PosterFormerlyKnownAsRFAA]

.

 

[jbulldog]

1. Compete for the SEC Championship every year

IF we do that then the rest takes care of itself.....most of the time.

 

[TheNewMSU]

I really didn't expect you to anyway. It is obvious you aren't very smart. I guess the point I am trying to make is that we are going through one of the best stretches in our history with in all likelyhood the greatest coach that we have ever had or ever will have at MSU in any sport and by judging from some posters here you would think we are in the Croom years in football. A tourney one out of 5-6 years is about the best we SHOULD expect and we are obviously greatly exceeding those expectations. I am thrilled with the way things are going personally.

Some of the Stans haters are the same type of people who were complaining when Sherrill was here, and you can see how it is now compared to those years. Probably some of the same type of people that wanted McKeen run off. Idiots, plain and simple......it is not going to be funny, but one day he will be gone and you will see 2-14 in SEC play on a consistent basis and we will see how some of you feel about it then. I simply don't think most people fully appreciate his accomplishments at MSU. Stans' record speaks for itself in my honest opinion. Better enjoy it while we can instead of whining and complaining like a bunch of babies, because one day he will no longer be at MSU.

 

[Coach34]

"A tourney one out of 5-6 years is about the best we SHOULD expect and we are obviously greatly exceeding those expectations"

Since 1990, we have been in the NCAA Tourney 9 times. The last 20 years of basketball at State has been way better than you are trying to make it out to be Coach Stansbury. I'm glad you made it home safe and congrats on your great run you guys got on by playing Augustus finally. Tell all that **** to the blue hairs, it aint gonna fly here.

"it is not going to be funny, but one day he will be gone and you will see 2-14 in SEC play on a consistent basis and we will see how some of you feel about it then"

Or we just might find a coach that is extremely innovative and he goes on to win 10 games a season in the SEC 10 straight years. aGAIN Coach Stansbury, you are at the wrong site for that BS.

 

[TheNewMSU]

I am going to assume he is attributed to the majority of those appearances. Can you name a time in our history when we didn't have Stans when we were competing for national titles? You are just digging your hole deeper and deeper. Compare his winning percentage to our other coaches and see where he ranks on the list.</p>

 

[Coach34]

and fathered Charlie Sheen's twins. While he does deserve some credit, there were other coaches on that staff out recruiting as well.

And we have yet to be as well-coached on the floor as we were under Williams. Since Stansbury started coaching, we havent seen anything remotely resembling a double screen for one of our shooters to get 3 pt shots like Williams did for Wilson.

If Stans recruited that FF team, why cant he recruit another? He's had 14 years, was that a once in a lifetime group he recruited in?

 

[TheNewMSU]

the planets and stars have to align just right. If you look at our history of ALL those years of playing basketball, how many times has MSU fielded consistent winners? The sad truth is that most of us will likely never see another Final 4 appearance in our lifetimes. Like I said, I HOPE we do but I am at least realistic about it considering what we compete against. Look at the population of our state, the fact we must compete with Ole Miss, and our budget and the city of Starkville compared with other SEC schools. We have the deck stacked against us. Hell you can go two states over in any direction and the large majority of people don't even know the difference between State and Ole Miss.

I think we can have a solid program. Overachieving for us would be doing less than what we are doing now. I say enjoy it and be supportive while we can. Being stupid and having delusional expectations really doesn't help anybody in the grand scheme of things. All it does it make us look like idiots to the rest of the conference.</p>

 

[chewgumm]

Elite 8, minimum. We should run away with the SEC.</p>

 

[Coach34]

when we decided we were going to move our program into the modern era by putting money into it and get rid of the rubber floor. What we did in 1975 doesnt make a monkey-17 to these guys entering college today. All they know is that we have a solid program that competes in a power conference.

And with the new TV contract, our prestige just went up even higher over other schools around the country for at least the next 5 years.

 

[Coach34]

.

 

[TheNewMSU]

Yes and the other schools in our conference are putting no money into their programs while we pass them by. LOL This is ridiculous how stupid you are... it is like debating a pile of s$#*, you really wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two. I suggest getting out a little bit more.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

From Indystar.com's NCAA Financial Reports1:

Looking at the Basketball Columns... Vanderbilt is not listed since being a private institution they didn't have to submit to a public records request.

SEC Univ. --- Revenues --- Expenses --- Difference
Alabama -- $6,486,054 -- $3,743,119 -- $2,742,935
Arkansas -- $11,504,327 -- $6,000,030 -- $5,504,297
Auburn -- $4,090,066 -- $3,619,519 -- $470,547
Florida -- $6,747,311 -- $4,874,529 -- $1,872,782
Georgia -- $4,216,910 -- $2,797,705 -- $1,419,205
Kentucky -- $13,744,749 -- $6,348,164 -- $7,396,585
LSU -- $4,561,559 -- $2,217,358 -- $2,344,201
Mississippi -- $3,357,925 -- $2,325,341 -- $1,032,584
MSU -- $4,755,466 -- $2,614,204 -- $2,141,262
USC -- $5,340,648 -- $3,290,138 -- $2,050,510
Tenn. -- $5,360,050 -- $4,503,083 -- $856,967

MSU had a $2.1 million profit, ranking 5th in the SEC in 2005 as far as basketball revenues. I believe your concerns are, for the most part, unfounded. Now if he had brought up nonprogram specific revenues and expenses, you might have a point; however, the argument given was Dollar for basketball dollar we're not much different from most of the others, and that argument is a winning one.

__________
1 This is the most detailed, publicly available database of college athletic department financial information ever assembled. It came from forms required by the NCAA for the 2004-05 school year. While the NCAA reports such information only in aggregate, the data is presented here by individual school --- with the ability for users to sort by category and conference, and to compare two schools. The Star obtained the forms through freedom of information requests to the 215 public schools that compete in Division I. There were 164 responses, 76 percent. (Requests also were sent to Division I's 112 private schools, which had no obligation to release the information. None did. In addition, state law in Pennsylvania and Delaware does not require its public schools to comply.) The numbers are presented here as they were reported to the NCAA. No attempt was made to change or research anomalies. The NCAA does that. Despite improvements in accounting procedures, schools still differ in how they report certain information. For example, some placed all contributions in the "non-program specific" category, while others broke them down by football, men's basketball, etc.

 

[hatfieldms]

I really didn't expect you to anyway. It is obvious you aren't very smart. I guess the point I am trying to make is that we are going through one of the best stretches in our history with in all likelyhood the greatest coach that we have ever had or ever will have at MSU in any sport and by judging from some posters here you would think we are in the Croom years in football. <span style="font-weight: bold;">A tourney one out of 5-6 years is about the best we SHOULD expect and we are obviously greatly exceeding those expectations. I am thrilled with the way things are going personally.</span> <br style="font-weight: bold;">
Some of the Stans haters are the same type of people who were complaining when Sherrill was here, and you can see how it is now compared to those years. Probably some of the same type of people that wanted McKeen run off. Idiots, plain and simple......it is not going to be funny, but one day he will be gone and you will see 2-14 in SEC play on a consistent basis and we will see how some of you feel about it then. I simply don't think most people fully appreciate his accomplishments at MSU. Stans' record speaks for itself in my honest opinion. Better enjoy it while we can instead of whining and complaining like a bunch of babies, because one day he will no longer be at MSU.

This is one of the dumbest things I have ever read on here. Once out of every 5 to 6 years? Try not to set your sights to high

 

[HD6]

you care to wager on us being preseason top 10 next year. And in case you want to debate that being a reasonable barometer for how you finish, the final top 10 poll released by the AP featured 7 teams that were in their preseason top 10. Two were ranked 12th and 13th preseason, and one, Missouri, was unranked. You up for it?</p>

 

[chewgumm]

be ranked in the top 10. The question was what we should expect. The rest of the SEC is oging to blow next year, and theoretically we have everyone back. Our players hsould improve, we should expect to be one of the top 10 teams next year, imo. I officialy expect that. I am not betting that we will be in the top 10, because we won't. I think we should be that good, which is reasonable.

 

[Coach34]

Stansbury should send you an autographed offensive playbook