Rutgers Athletics bleeding red ink

[PSUFTG]

Rutgers was brought in to secure the East coast TV market. Same reason for expanding to the West coast. $$$

That can be repeated 1,000 times - it still will never make it true.

Last year, for example, Rutgres was on a tier one network (ABC/CBS/NBC/FOX) just three times - and those three only because of the teams they were playing. That is the same deal every year.
Rutgres does LESS than zero wrt TV market - not only does "No one watch them", but they drag down ratings for the limited number of games played by the big boys, when they are scheduled against Rutgres.

When you then account for the big chunk of revenue share $ they are given, it is a HUGE loss for the other programs.


Too early to tell wrt the West Coast programs, but having USC and Oregon (and, to a lesser extent, Washington) out there makes the possibility of being accretive to earnings at least arguable. Not so for Rutgres, and it never was.

 

[PSUFTG]

yes, but in the B1G? we are probably 5th- 6th at best right now

Focusing only on football (which is the overwhelming lead dog):
Assuming last year was an outlier (I think that is fair), you could make an argument for anywhere from 3rd (maybe even 2nd) - to 4th (maybe 5th). Over the last decade, and projecting likely outcome for the decade to come.
In any case, still well-placed enough to, I think, be considered a Big Dog and a "have"

 

[step.eng69]

Canary in the coal mine. This isn't good for anyone.

My Grandparents raised me and my grandfather worked as a dynamite blaster in the deep tunnels of the mines, thanks for mentioning 1933. The canary warned of danger ahead.

"Throughout much of the 20th century, chirping canaries were staples of the coal mining industry. As coal miners descended into the earth—entering a harsh environment often home to poisonous gases like carbon monoxide—they would bring the yellow birds along as safety mechanisms. Because carbon monoxide is clear and odorless, miners needed a method for detecting a leak before it killed them. In the mine, a canary’s collapse let workers know there was poisonous gas in the air and gave them some warning time to evacuate."

 

[Nitt1300]

Focusing only on football (which is the overwhelming lead dog):
Assuming last year was an outlier (I think that is fair), you could make an argument for anywhere from 3rd (maybe even 2nd) - to 4th (maybe 5th). Over the last decade, and projecting likely outcome for the decade to come.
In any case, still well-placed enough to, I think, be considered a Big Dog and a "have"

that's fair- the question is which way are we heading, we'll have to wait and see

 

[PSU87]

With Rutgers, there was something about the fee the BTN charges cable companies to carry. The get more money per subscriber if there is a Big Ten school in the state. I don't know if that is still the case given there are so may ways to get TV now.

Yes. As you say, things have changed a great deal, but at the time BTN and other networks could charge a higher per subscriber fee if there was a member school "in the footprint".

So it did not matter if anyone watched Rutgres. Everyone in Queens was paying more for BTN just because Rutgres was in the Big Ten.

It wasn't about "delivering the NY market". It was about higher fees for the NY market. Nobody was stupid enough to think that a million TVs in NYC were going to tune in to Rutgres-Purdue.

 

[NittPicker]

What does Reuters do with all their B1G TV Money? Hookers and booze?

 

[PSUFTG]

Yes. As you say, things have changed a great deal, but at the time BTN and other networks could charge a higher per subscriber fee if there was a member school "in the footprint".

So it did not matter if anyone watched Rutgres. Everyone in Queens was paying more for BTN just because Rutgres was in the Big Ten.

It wasn't about "delivering the NY market". It was about higher fees for the NY market. Nobody was stupid enough to think that a million TVs in NYC were going to tune in to Rutgres-Purdue.

And even then, the BTN "carriage fees" was no more than rounding error in the entire media $$ landscape. And the fiscal "price" paid (in revenue share, degradation of schedules, etc) was far more expensive than anything that rounding error provided.
(And now, as was obvious even then, has become utterly insignificant. Not to even mention: That the "carriage fees" could have been negotiated anyway - based on the teams that people actually, you know, watched "Wut?")
Bottom line: Adding Rutgres was an ego trip for Jim Delaney. A HUGELY expensive one, that continues to submit bills.

 

[Warlerski]

That can be repeated 1,000 times - it still will never make it true.

Last year, for example, Rutgres was on a tier one network (ABC/CBS/NBC/FOX) just three times - and those three only because of the teams they were playing. That is the same deal every year.
Rutgres does LESS than zero wrt TV market - not only does "No one watch them", but they drag down ratings for the limited number of games played by the big boys, when they are scheduled against Rutgres.

When you then account for the big chunk of revenue share $ they are given, it is a HUGE loss for the other programs.


Too early to tell wrt the West Coast programs, but having USC and Oregon (and, to a lesser extent, Washington) out there makes the possibility of being accretive to earnings at least arguable. Not so for Rutgres, and it never was.

-While that may be true, I would have to think TV markets was the original motivation. Think in terms of the fact that there are many sports besides football and the B1G network. Admitting teams from the coasts greatly increases travel expenses for all sports. The Big Ten was historically a Midwest conference.

 

[PSUFTG]

-While that may be true, I would have to think TV markets was the original motivation. Think in terms of the fact that there are many sports besides football and the B1G network. Admitting teams from the coasts greatly increases travel expenses for all sports. The Big Ten was historically a Midwest conference.

Agreed, with a couple caveats:
TV Market was not the real motivation (It certainly was parsed as such, but it was primarily an ego trip)
While plenty of other sports are on BTN (and I, and probably a lot of other Penn Staters, appreciate that), outside of football the rest don't generate any meaningful positive revenue (not enough eyeballs) - and are zero or negative wrt P/L (from a business standpoint, all the "others" just provide air time filler from February through August, to sustain the life support system for football)

 

[Warlerski]

Agreed, with a couple caveats:
TV Market was not the real motivation (It certainly was parsed as such, but it was primarily an ego trip)
While plenty of other sports are on BTN (and I, and probably a lot of other Penn Staters, appreciate that), outside of football the rest don't generate any meaningful positive revenue (not enough eyeballs) - and are zero or negative wrt P/L (from a business standpoint, all the "others" just provide air time filler from February through August, to sustain the life support system for football)

Whether or not inclusion was an ego trip is impossible to know for sure. Perhaps the thinking was Maryland and Rutgers, with a B1G schedule, would develop into FB powers . If so, it hasn't happened to the extent hoped for.

 

[rigi19040]

Other than football and basketball is there any sports ant any schools making money?

Since you all are so concerned with Rutgers making money should psu cut sports that are losing money?

 

[PSU87]

Other than football and basketball is there any sports ant any schools making money?

Since you all are so concerned with Rutgers making money should psu cut sports that are losing money?

I don't think its the losing money....yeah, I would argue few sports actually make money....its the magnitude of it. Losing a million is one thing. Losing $500 million...unsustainable.

For comparison, looks like the operating budget for Penn State College of Engineering is around $130 mil. So to run a $78 million deficit, you’re talking half the operating budget of a flagship major.

 

[84lion]

Agreed, with a couple caveats:
TV Market was not the real motivation (It certainly was parsed as such, but it was primarily an ego trip)
While plenty of other sports are on BTN (and I, and probably a lot of other Penn Staters, appreciate that), outside of football the rest don't generate any meaningful positive revenue (not enough eyeballs) - and are zero or negative wrt P/L (from a business standpoint, all the "others" just provide air time filler from February through August, to sustain the life support system for football)

I was curious what some typical numbers are. This article provides some context:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2026/01/college-basketball-ratings-nfl-lead-in-strong-start-season/

Worthwhile to note that even with the NFL games as a lead-in, the college basketball games received only 15% of the NFL audience (granted, it's the NFL, but still). Otherwise, national games on OTA networks are drawing relatively small numbers.

Basketball appears to be a side-light to football (whether NFL or college), with the really big BBall numbers happening with March Madness (which is also a big betting event). I would imagine the other non-revenue sports are, as FTG says, "filler."

 

[BobPSU92]

rutgres needs Sandy.

 

[PSUFTG]

rutgres needs Sandy.

IIRC, Rutgres just hired a new AD.



EDIT: Yes, they did, last fall (Not Sandy )

Why Keli Zinn is the Right AD for Rutgers Athletics

I think they went approximately a year with no permanent AD (rumor there was that they - Rutgres - really fubar-ed the search for a long time). Zinn, the new AD, was previously the Assoc AD at LSU)

 

[bbrown]

Bob and Jersey-ites, do you have different math in the Garden State ?

So what are they spending their money on?

 

[bbrown]

What does Reuters do with all their B1G TV Money? Hookers and booze?

and blow, don't forget the blow.

 

[rigi19040]

I don't think its the losing money....yeah, I would argue few sports actually make money....its the magnitude of it. Losing a million is one thing. Losing $500 million...unsustainable.

For comparison, looks like the operating budget for Penn State College of Engineering is around $130 mil. So to run a $78 million deficit, you’re talking half the operating budget of a flagship major.

RU probably has the highest travel costs due to location and the highest costs total because they are in the NYC'NJ market.

 

[PSUFTG]

RU probably has the highest travel costs due to location and the highest costs total because they are in the NYC'NJ market.

West coast schools would have much higher travel costs

Among the traditional B10 schools, the western outliers (think Nebraska) also have higher costs, even than the eastern B10 schools - the eastern schools have a lot more relatively close trips, even though the coast-to-coast trips are longer.

That all said, travel XP are a "relatively" small number.... as that article pointed out. It is the salaries and personnel costs (including, as of next year's reckoning, costs for players - revenue share etc), that are the 800 pound gorilla.
In some cases, facilities service (ie debt on things like stadiums) is also huge - but that varies from program to program (with PSU now setting the new "standard" )

 

[doctornick]

I was curious what some typical numbers are. This article provides some context:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2026/01/college-basketball-ratings-nfl-lead-in-strong-start-season/

Worthwhile to note that even with the NFL games as a lead-in, the college basketball games received only 15% of the NFL audience (granted, it's the NFL, but still). Otherwise, national games on OTA networks are drawing relatively small numbers.

Basketball appears to be a side-light to football (whether NFL or college), with the really big BBall numbers happening with March Madness (which is also a big betting event). I would imagine the other non-revenue sports are, as FTG says, "filler."

regular season college basketball games have become relatively meaningless. I mean, obviously you need to win games to make the tournament but any individual game has a miniscule amount of impact on anything. And TV viewership corresponds to that. Why would lots of people watch a game that doesn't have much impact to the sport overall? Casual fans - the ones that drive ratings - really only care about March Madness.

 

[op2]

I think it's FOMO. It's what keeps the gambler coming back to the table because he just knows his next play will hit the big one.

Thing that gets me is that school sports were originally not intended to be moneymakers for the schools or the athletes, but rather mens sana in corpore sano, or healthy mind in a healthy body. I understand why the Ivy League did what they did with their varsity sports.

I think it is just a matter of time (I suspect in the not too distant future, next Sunday A.D.) before a school effectively goes bankrupt because of this insanity. I wonder how the taxpayers will react?

I caught that reference.

He worked at Gizmonic Institute,
Just another guy in a red jump suit,
He did a good job cleaning up the place,
But his bosses didn't like him so they shot him into space

I still have a MST 3K t-shirt.

 

[Catch1lion]

So what are they spending their money on?

IROC Camaros with T tops, and gold chains with a gold Cornicello

 

[rigi19040]

West coast schools would have much higher travel costs

Among the traditional B10 schools, the western outliers (think Nebraska) also have higher costs, even than the eastern B10 schools - the eastern schools have a lot more relatively close trips, even though the coast-to-coast trips are longer.

That all said, travel XP are a "relatively" small number.... as that article pointed out. It is the salaries and personnel costs (including, as of next year's reckoning, costs for players - revenue share etc), that are the 800 pound gorilla.
In some cases, facilities service (ie debt on things like stadiums) is also huge - but that varies from program to program (with PSU now setting the new "standard" )

What is the distance from UWashington to Rutgers vs Rutgers to UWashington?

 

[LB99]

Canary in the coal mine. This isn't good for anyone.

They were bankrupt before they joined the B1G. This isn’t new. It was a trend with them.

 

[LB99]

Much like government. Difference is that Rutgres can't print greenbacks.

Then stop spending the greenbacks.

 

[RolexKong]

Much like government. Difference is that Rutgres can't print greenbacks.

Sure they can. It's called raising tuition.

 

[bbrown]

IROC Camaros with T tops, and gold chains with a gold Cornicello

Don’t forget the tanning booths.

 

[G3624]

You have to wonder if there is any real leadership left anywhere in our society.

So sad, but extremely true to the point of existence. Soon survival dieting will be trendy.

 

[Pennst8]

Rutgers athletics hits record $78 million deficit. New AD says ‘It’s got to get better.’

The school spent a record $193 million on athletics even as its deficit grows

www.nj.com

Awwwwww.

 

[LB99]

IROC Camaros with T tops, and gold chains with a gold Cornicello

And spray tans.

 

[PSU87]

And even then, the BTN "carriage fees" was no more than rounding error in the entire media $$ landscape. And the fiscal "price" paid (in revenue share, degradation of schedules, etc) was far more expensive than anything that rounding error provided.
(And now, as was obvious even then, has become utterly insignificant. Not to even mention: That the "carriage fees" could have been negotiated anyway - based on the teams that people actually, you know, watched "Wut?")
Bottom line: Adding Rutgres was an ego trip for Jim Delaney. A HUGELY expensive one, that continues to submit bills.

Oh, the maths don't exist to show adding Rutgres to the conference was a good financial move.
Come to think of it, was there any good reason to add them?
Classy fans? Nope.
Raise the competition level? Sure, in women's hoops and soccer maybe.
A perpetual homecoming opponent for the blue bloods? Check.

 

[ApexLion]

Sure they can. It's called raising tuition.

They don't have a fundraising arm that can pay for athletics. Very few schools do. Basically you have about 25 schools that can fund their athletics programs. NIL just adds more operating expense, even though it's 'separately raised' to pay athletes. On top of being in the red I don't think Rutgers can do NIL effectively other than have some businesses just pay their 10 best players outright. Without the tv contract, I'm not sure they could field a full athletics department.

 

[laKavosiey-st lion]

It exists - just not at scale in enough places.

Moms almost joined PSU leadership 6-7 years ago. It would have been the best thing to happen to State since I joined the student body in ‘82

 

[PSUFTG]

Sure they can. It's called raising tuition.

Actually, they already have done that. I will go back and dig up those specifics numbers when I get a chance. It is significant.

 

[PSU4U]

What benefit for them would there be for them to leave the B1G?

None zero zip nada. Dammed if they and dammed if they don't. Their only choice is to stay and win more games.

 

[PSUFTG]

Their only choice is to stay and win more games.

Well, that - and to not spend so much more $ than they bring in (and, yes, they need - desperately to remain in the Big Ten - although even with that, IMO, they are likely to see their shares of revenue share being cut below pro-rata "equal") .

Their income increased significantly after joining the Big Ten (with no effort or accomplishments or investments on their part, aside from "getting in")

Their operating expenses - the things that they have full control over - have exploded in recent years (much as they have at many other programs, including PSU).
They did that. They should not have. They should cut back (and I am sure they could, without any significant downside)