SO THIS IS WHAT THE END LOOKS LIKE

PAgeologist

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Oct 19, 2021
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Hi Meats,
I don't know.
Someone in a previous post mentioned we don't recruit enough 4's & 5's. To recruit better, PSU will have to cough-up more $$$.
Another reason why Kraft has to nail the coaching hire. Get the donors excited and willing to pay more. But Kraft is likely going to need to guarantee a pretty hefty sum towards NIL to get a good coach. Not to mention the coaches contracts.

Kraft definitely has his hands full with this one. One of the reasons I like the mid-season move. He buys a little more time to get everything together.
 

Bison13

All-Conference
May 26, 2013
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Marshall always brings up his time being an athletic director, well I’ve done it for a long time too. any athletic director that knows his coaches, knows James has been different all year, especially in the last three weeks. If anything, they needed to have a sit down meeting to talk about that and probably give James at least some time off. It’s obvious that mentally he was not there, his actions on the sidelines during the last couple games were not like the previous ones.

Maybe that was offered to him and he said no, but when you make that much money, I don’t care if it was 17th ranked, they weren’t playing like the 17th ranked team. Also, when you make the comments that he makes regarding this being the best team they ever had, at some point you have to put your money where your mouth is.
 
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Nitt1300

Heisman
Nov 2, 2008
6,080
11,332
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Another reason why Kraft has to nail the coaching hire. Get the donors excited and willing to pay more. But Kraft is likely going to need to guarantee a pretty hefty sum towards NIL to get a good coach. Not to mention the coaches contracts.

Kraft definitely has his hands full with this one. One of the reasons I like the mid-season move. He buys a little more time to get everything together.
So Kraft was lying when he said Terry Smith has a chance to win the job?
 
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Cali_Nittany1

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Dec 11, 2019
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PSU fanbase no different than any other, always going to have nut jobs out there that say and do things that aren't representative of the masses.

Exactly. You might find a higher concentration of nut jobs at Lincoln Financial Field on Sundays but they are indeed part of every fan base.
 

rudedude

Heisman
Sep 28, 2002
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IMO: Manny Diaz

Come Let Me Love You GIF
 

BostonNit

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I think being jeered off the field after a double overtime loss can take the starch out of a team and its coaching staff.
My issue isn't searching for a new coach and direction. That sort of thing is routine. My outrage is centered around the entitled fans that treated Franklin like he was trash. 1 year after making the final four. My contention is that without the stadium outrage, he would have finished the season and there could have been an orderly and dignified transition, if needed. Anyone who can't see that this is a stain on PSU athletics, isn't paying attenion.
The guy made >$8M per year. If being booed after dropping from 4-20 to 4-21 against top 10 teams was the turning point, I'd argue the change was made too late, not too early.
 

JVP_Yahweh

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Nov 29, 2004
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Couldn't agree more. It's professional football. Reality is upon us. Tradition or even a sense of values (other than money) can no longer be invoked. Next years roster will be comprised of mercenaries purchased from the portal. Go State!
We drove a coach out of town that more often than not won 9,10.11 games. Why? Because he didn't beat Ohio State. Count me among those who are waiting to see the savior who will win 10 and 11 and beat Ohio State. I'm 76, Is it next season? LOLLOLLOLLOL
If the next guy can't beat Ohio St then he too should get canned. You're either leading or trailing. This is a tough business
 
Oct 13, 2025
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First post. I am an OSU fan but not here to troll. I started lurking here when the stuff started going down just to see how everyone here has reacted to the past few weeks.

To me, I think Franklin wanted out just as much as fans wanted him gone. I think his demeanor in the post-game presser following the recent losses speaks as such. He looked both zoned out and burned out. He looked like someone who had just given up.

We also ragged on him as 'Big Game James' but he always seemed like a decent guy. I honestly think he got to the point where he became so anxious about losing the big games that he played to not lose rather than to win those games. I kind of sensed that from our game last season. As the game started winding down in the fourth, instead of being aggressive, he would resort to a conservative run play. I just think the fear of losing led to many decisions. When you are playing another top-ten opponent, you just can't do that. You have to go for broke. He never did. He retreated to safety when the moment called for aggression.

My $.02
 

AvgUser

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So I ask all the "we deserve better" faithful. Would the 50 million owed to James (and additional to assistants) have been better spent on on field talent?
Franklin had talent.

Was it not blindingly obvious that Franklin could not lead them to achieve more? Have you not watched over the years the utterly mind-numbing (dumb) decisions he has made?

Can you explain why Singleton gets more carries than Allen?
Why did Drew Allar never reach anywhere near his potential?
Since it’s Iowa week, who failed to prepare Taquon Robinson as a backup QB in case the starter gets injured?
A 4-21 record against top 10 teams is well below the Mendoza line of coaching.
The list of these type decisions is too long, and became too frequent, to ignore any longer.



I wanted CJF to succeed. But he helped to make this a no-brainer decision.
 

AvgUser

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I used to care. Free at last.......thinking PSU football and its fanbase had the moral high ground,well, it was my mistake. I see my error and admit it.
Your whining and crying is very unbecoming of a man your age.

It is impossible to justify retaining CJF as head coach. He really should have done the honorable thing and voluntarily stepped aside.
 
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Jul 1, 2025
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Lot of great thoughtful posts in this thread.

Franklin-PSU relationship worked for the most part for 12 years-it was a Win-Win for everyone for that time period.

Its not just about Winning, its how he lost to Teams he should have beaten-his lack of in-game coaching, being somewhat creative. If you look at all the games he lost that PSU should have Won-how many other coaches would have Won those games? Just becaosue you are down a LB or a WR or whatever excuse it was at the time doesn't mean you just keep doing the same thing and expect a different outcome. How many games was Franklin out coached that PSU was expected to win?

Recruiting, he was a just an Above Average Recruiter--he wasn't Great. Great is averaging Top10 every year. Scale 1-10 a 7

Jimmies & Joe's--always we need 5* players...heard about this for Years. You think just cuz you have 5* players you Win? You got to coach them up and you got to make in-game decisions that put the players in a position of success. Franklin simply didn't do that. e.g. Brett Bielema beats us in 2021-outcoached. Question, if Narduzzi was coaching this team-you think he looses the same games Franklin lost-the ones he was supposed to Win? Be Objective.

Coordinators, did we ever figure out why or if Franklin meddled with the Offense? Doesn't matter now but my point is this. Know your Weaknesses. Franklin should have let his OC's coach the game their way. I believe he meddled, and as a OC play caller you need to have rhythm and a strategy. In watching our Offensive series didn't everything seem so difficult? We never seemed to have consistent success it was always here and there. We ruined and didn't develop a lot of QBs it seems. Dabo Sweeney and Franklin are similar IMHO in so many ways--except Dabo let his coordinators run things. Their is direct correlation of OCs he had and their success--yes they have a great QBs and WRs but hey the OC's called the plays against great teams they beat e.g. Alabama, GA etc.

Franklins overall arrogance in press conferences and his lack of changing--a 80-year old man changed his stubborn approach--why not a 50 year old with a Psyche degree and a lot of money and comfort? I think this is called Cognitive Dissonance right?

It was time for a Change and yes its going to be painful. Its dangerously scary on the next hire--it could very well turn out to be a disaster. Things weren't going to get better with Franklin loosing the team and continue to be just above average.

There is only 1 man who can fix this for near term success and thats Urban Meyer. No other coach can grab the baton from Franklin and keep PSU football program on the track of success. I dont like his past background and we certainly don't want his issues at PSU but he can recruit, he can set the program up for success. We need 2 years, get Hartline as OC and guarantee him the next HC job after Meyer's 2 year stint.
Last 2 sentences nails it
 
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PSUForever

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First post. I am an OSU fan but not here to troll. I started lurking here when the stuff started going down just to see how everyone here has reacted to the past few weeks.

To me, I think Franklin wanted out just as much as fans wanted him gone. I think his demeanor in the post-game presser following the recent losses speaks as such. He looked both zoned out and burned out. He looked like someone who had just given up.

We also ragged on him as 'Big Game James' but he always seemed like a decent guy. I honestly think he got to the point where he became so anxious about losing the big games that he played to not lose rather than to win those games. I kind of sensed that from our game last season. As the game started winding down in the fourth, instead of being aggressive, he would resort to a conservative run play. I just think the fear of losing led to many decisions. When you are playing another top-ten opponent, you just can't do that. You have to go for broke. He never did. He retreated to safety when the moment called for aggression.

My $.02
His conservative not to lose approach in big games plagued him for most of his tenure. Versus OSU was the worst. It did not just start with OSU last season. In fact since 2017 I think he approached every OSU game not to lose and that is exactly what he did....
lose every single game vs OSU since '17. In my opinion this firing was 3 years late but we had that albatross contract. Plus, not sure when Kraft arrived but Franklin didn't have a boss until Kraft came because the previous AD, Sandy Barbour, was completely incompetent.
 
Oct 13, 2025
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His conservative not to lose approach in big games plagued him for most of his tenure. Versus OSU was the worst. It did not just start with OSU last season. In fact since 2017 I think he approached every OSU game not to lose and that is exactly what he did....
lose every single game vs OSU since '17. In my opinion this firing was 3 years late but we had that albatross contract. Plus, not sure when Kraft arrived but Franklin didn't have a boss until Kraft came because the previous AD, Sandy Barbour, was completely incompetent.
I was just using that as an example. I just think it's the pucker factor. We see that here in our game with michigan. Instead of crushing them with our
best assets, the staff opted to go conservative. The gameplan was to not lose. We let fear of losing another get to our head. Coming out of the tunnel the entire staff looked clenched so tight they could crack walnuts with their buttcheeks. It's all in the head. To me, Franklin always had this same look in big games I have seen.
 
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Calabrin

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If the hump is the national championship.....LOL
If the hump is getting in the playoffs, he got over the hump last year.
The real issue is that PSU over its entire history has proven to be a 7-12 program.
Wanting it to be a top 5 is wonderful. It isn't.
You speak like someone who has no idea that everything was building to this season. This was the moment. They spent a ton of money beacuse 2025 was supposed to be their shot.

And then they lost to 0-4, coach-less UCLA. And then they lost to a bad Northwestern team.

You're talking as though you're unaware that these things happened.

James Franklin, himself, lobbied for Jim Knowles to be brought here on a record contract. James Franklin, himself, said this was the most talented team, and the most talented staff he ever had. He personally hyped up this season. He, personally, told people this was the year everything was going to come together.

You can't do that and then go 0-3 in your first three conference games and then shrug and say, "I deserve no consequences."
 

Calabrin

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I think being jeered off the field after a double overtime loss can take the starch out of a team and its coaching staff.
My issue isn't searching for a new coach and direction. That sort of thing is routine. My outrage is centered around the entitled fans that treated Franklin like he was trash. 1 year after making the final four. My contention is that without the stadium outrage, he would have finished the season and there could have been an orderly and dignified transition, if needed. Anyone who can't see that this is a stain on PSU athletics, isn't paying attenion.
He wasn't jeered off the field because of a 2-OT loss.

He was jeered off the field because he never beats good opponents. If their record against Michigan and Ohio State during his tenure was 5-wins better, no one would've batted an eye at the outcome of that game. Anyone can lose to a good opponent. But SOMETIMES you have to win those games.
 

Nitt1300

Heisman
Nov 2, 2008
6,080
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He wasn't jeered off the field because of a 2-OT loss.

He was jeered off the field because he never beats good opponents. If their record against Michigan and Ohio State during his tenure was 5-wins better, no one would've batted an eye at the outcome of that game. Anyone can lose to a good opponent. But SOMETIMES you have to win those games.
He was jeered off the field because we have a classless fanbase.
 

kgilbert78

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From 1950 - 2000, Penn State was arguably the # football program - im tne aggregate. It csn be again with the right hire. Will be fun to see if we can find it as it is certainly not guaranteed or deserved.
But perhaps not in the new reality of NIL and free agency. We're not in a big market, which gives a lesser opportunity for NIL deals.
 
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Catch1lion

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The guy made >$8M per year. If being booed after dropping from 4-20 to 4-21 against top 10 teams was the turning point, I'd argue the change was made too late, not too early.
IIRC, also has the distinction of being the only coach to lose 4 games when favored by over 20 points
 
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BobPSU92

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Aug 22, 2001
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But perhaps not in the new reality of NIL and free agency. We're not in a big market, which gives a lesser opportunity for NIL deals.

Allar is in a couple national TV commercials. Granted, few players can get those deals, but they still aren’t limited to the local area.
 
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Big_O

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But perhaps not in the new reality of NIL and free agency. We're not in a big market, which gives a lesser opportunity for NIL deals.
Exactly. Ohio State is in a city with a huge amount of corporate (banking and insurance) wealth with money flowing like a waterfall to OSU. It is pretty much impossible to compete with that in a middle of nowhere town that does not have the financial resources like Columbus.

The tailgating atmosphere is significantly different at Happy Valley compared to Columbus. At Penn State there are primarily individual fan tailgates surrounded by a rural atmosphere and scenic mountains. In Columbus there are several corporate tents in the middle of an urban area with a lot of corporate employees roaming around as bandwagon “Ohio State“ fans even though they never attended the university. The big money there is very evident.

For example, the last time I went to a game at Ohio State, courtesy free tickets from someone I knew, my wife and I were looking for something to eat before the game and saw a big Outback Steakhouse tent, so got in line there to get something to eat. When we got to the front of line, a very large young guy, who I thought would direct us to a table, asked us if we worked for a certain corporation (don’t remember which one). When I replied that I didn’t, he forcefully and roughly pushed both my wife and me out of the tent stating that this was a private party and we were not welcome. Now I knew what it was like to be physically removed from a bar by a bouncer.

We were so upset and pissed off that we just drove back home and didn’t go to the game, one of an early season matchup against an overly inferior opponent (probably why the free tickets). The worst game atmosphere ever in my life. Never been back since. That is the big money, corporate atmosphere in Columbus. Apparently money and corporate bravado is the thing there. And I am not even going to mention the treatment I had received in the past as a Penn State fan attending games there.
 
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Psu00

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Why did he need a statement of support after again failing?
If he needed a statement of support to keep the locker room then he's an awful leader.
Remember Franklin was the one that admitted it was no longer a narrative but a fact

Yeah, that seems like serious grasping of straws. Franklin needed a statement of support from both the AD and university prez after losing to Oregon? Really? How many ADs and university presidents give statements of support after random losses during the season? It’s pretty rare unless a coach is on the hot seat. Plus, once made, the vultures start circling for the inevitable firing after the dreaded “vote of confidence”.
 
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Mufasa94

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Not dealing with computer chips. We are dealing with human beings. Franklin was hung out to dry after the Oregon game. No statement of support by the Athletic Director....certainly no statement of support from the president. At that point (before the UCLA game) players were packing their bags.
You can't believe that suddenly....without any explanation, the man who was perhaps the best in the country at beating teams he was favored to beat.....forgot how to coach.
So after 11 seasons, James Franklin, strickly thru his own incompetence......lost the locker room? If that's what you choose to believe, ok.
In your last sentence you are questioning another poster about thinking Franklin lost the locker room, yet earlier in this post you wrote the players were packing their bags before the UCLA game.

You are doing a good job undermining your point of view.
 
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Mufasa94

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You are right. They didn't look great. If I had to make a somewhat educated guess.......I would blame the decision (which ultimately was Franklins) to "manage the reps" and workloads of the veteran players. This was a theme that James shared in the spring and even into fall camp. He was certainly also taking the advice of his strength and conditioning staff on this as well. At the time, it sounded logical. You want your best players healthy and peaking at the right moment. However, in hindsight, we all have lived by the adage that you can't turn it on and off. When the bright lights came on, the key players were still managing their workloads. It's simple. To get stronger in the weight room....doing reps with weights you can already manage will maintain strength.....but to increase strength, one must rep to momentary muscular failure. Only when all the available muscle fibers have been recruited and exhausted, does rest and repair allow for an increase in strength.
You don't get better or prepared for peak competition, by going half speed, managing workload etc.
I once scouted a team that led 38-0 at half time. The coach subbed in his bench at halftime. They won that game 38-35.
I never forgot this. No matter what the lead, I never subbed until my team established dominance in the second half. Subbing at half sends a subliminal message to your player that the game is over.
I think that James and the training staff, sent a similar message to some of the veteran players. Personally, I think that's the best explanation for the uneven play early and the late wake up against Oregon.
Simply put, PSU could have been very good. But, perhaps they weren't as good as they thought they were! LOL
Another long explanation by you explaining Franklin’s failure this year. This year was not set up to be a mulligan season like 2020 ended up being.
 
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kgilbert78

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Exactly. Ohio State is in a city with a huge amount of corporate (banking and insurance) wealth with money flowing like a waterfall to OSU. It is pretty much impossible to compete with that in a middle of nowhere town that does not have the financial resources like Columbus.

The tailgating atmosphere is significantly different at Happy Valley compared to Columbus. At Penn State there are primarily individual fan tailgates surrounded by a rural atmosphere and scenic mountains. In Columbus there are several corporate tents in the middle of an urban area with a lot of corporate employees roaming around as bandwagon “Ohio State“ fans even though they never attended the university. The big money there is very evident.

For example, the last time I went to a game at Ohio State, courtesy free tickets from someone I knew, my wife and I were looking for something to eat before the game and saw a big Outback Steakhouse tent, so got in line there to get something to eat. When we got to the front of line, a very large young guy, who I thought would direct us to a table, asked us if we worked for a certain corporation (don’t remember which one). When I replied that I didn’t, he forcefully and roughly pushed both my wife and me out of the tent stating that this was a private party and we were not welcome. Now I knew what it was like to be physically removed from a bar by a bouncer.

We were so upset and pissed off that we just drove back home and didn’t go to the game, one of an early season matchup against an overly inferior opponent (probably why the free tickets). The worst game atmosphere ever in my life. Never been back since. That is the big money, corporate atmosphere in Columbus. Apparently money and corporate bravado is the thing there. And I am not even going to mention the treatment I had received in the past as a Penn State fan attending games there.
My first thought was I guess that bouncer didn't go there to "play school". ;) ;)

But seriously most people do not realize that Columbus is now a big city. 15 largest +/-. Nationwide, the remnants of the Limited, Borden. Wendys, White Castle, Huntington Bank. Lots of money there.
 
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Bison13

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yep 10+ wins each year would be great but being able to beat OSU/UM/Oregon regularly or at least 1/3 of the time would be nice. But if you aren't doing that, you cant drop games to cupcakes who you are favored by 3 TD's and look like you dont even care
 
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razpsu

Heisman
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Franklin put all his chips in the middle for this year and lost. Hopefully he realizes he is a football coach and not a 30,000 foot ceo. Don’t know why he went that route but he did. With losing everyone this year and maybe top 20 class coming In this year, the next two years didnt look good either. Didn’t he say if playoffs expanded we would be there every year? Instead one and done.

So time for next man up!!
 
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