Suburban Catholic Conference 4-1

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

The old Suburban Catholic conference went 4-1 during the 1st round of action during the playoffs.

Winning - IC, ACC, Marian Central, Montini

Losing - Marmion

"Maybe time to bring the band back together"

-Hint, Join the Chicago Catholic League

 

[eagles2k3]

The old Suburban Catholic conference went 4-1 during the 1st round of action during the playoffs.

Winning - IC, ACC, Marian Central, Montini

Losing - Marmion

"Maybe time to bring the band back together"

-Hint, Join the Chicago Catholic League

Strongly feel like ic is ready. This might be their best team ever but we'll never know how they match up since they play cupcakes all season. Krefft has done an amazing job keeping the tradition going!

 

[Cat Box]

The CCL would be greatly improved if there were more teams.
Step #1 - recruit IC, ACC, St. Eds and Wheaton Academy at minimum back to the CCL.
Step #2 - condense CCL from 4 down to 3 divisions, looks like this...

Blue - Loyola, Rice, Rita, MC, Provi, add Fenwick (6 teams)
Green - Montini, Marmion, St. Francis, DLS - add Larry & Iggy (6 teams)
White - Leo, DePaul, St. Joe's - add Aurora Christian and B-Mac (5 teams)

Plug IC, ACC, St. Ed's, Wheaton Academy appropriate into appropriate division.

Step #3 - eliminate Blue/White crossover games. A school with football enrollment of 400 kids should never play a school of 2000-3500. This will give the incoming schools the security they need to make the jump.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

The CCL would be greatly improved if there were more teams.
Step #1 - recruit IC, ACC, St. Eds and Wheaton Academy at minimum back to the CCL.
Step #2 - condense CCL from 4 down to 3 divisions, looks like this...

Blue - Loyola, Rice, Rita, MC, Provi, add Fenwick (6 teams)
Green - Montini, Marmion, St. Francis, DLS - add Larry & Iggy (6 teams)
White - Leo, DePaul, St. Joe's - add Aurora Christian and B-Mac (5 teams)

Plug IC, ACC, St. Ed's, Wheaton Academy appropriate into appropriate division.

Step #3 - eliminate Blue/White crossover games. A school with football enrollment of 400 kids should never play a school of 2000-3500. This will give the incoming schools the security they need to make the jump.

Now, throw in the entire ESCC and create a mega conference as follows:

Loyola, Rice, Rita, MC, PC, Marist, Benet, Fenwick

JCA, Naz, Montini, Marian Central, Notre Dame, Pats, Viator, Carmel

Iggy, Larry, Francis, Marmion, DLS, Wheaton Academy, ICCP,

ACC, AC, Leo, Ed's, St. Joe, DePaul, Marian Catholic, LFA

One non-con and one crossover game between top two divisions. Same for bottom two, but one school in the fourth division can't schedule a crossover.

Suck it up, Fenwick.

 

[Voodoo Tatum 21]

That would take some major voodoo for a complete tear down and build up and get all the cats corralled.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

That would take some major voodoo for a complete tear down and build up and get all the cats corralled.

Agreed, but I think the end result is worth whatever voodoo is necessary to attain it.

 

[Voodoo Tatum 21]

Agreed, but I think the end result is worth whatever voodoo is necessary to attain it.

I'm Hip,... but do you think the Benet Boys would be up for an entry into the Big Baddie Division - Marist/Loyola/MC etc. etc.?

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

I'm Hip,... but do you think the Benet Boys would be up for an entry into the Big Baddie Division - Marist/Loyola/MC etc. etc.?

Dunno. Maybe.

I will say this about Benet, though. I think they run one of the best private school athletics operations in the state. They are at or near the top of just about every ESCC sport year in and year out and they compete very well in IHSA playoffs in other sports.

I also think that a very healthy and fun football rivalry would develop between them and Fenwick.

 

[chirocal44]

Strongly feel like ic is ready. This might be their best team ever but we'll never know how they match up since they play cupcakes all season. Krefft has done an amazing job keeping the tradition going!


Ic football is ready, the rest of the school sports has to be in line. Limit the crossovers to one conference up, great fit for all. Ic played Mac, Laurence, gbs and rb. As a 3A school not enough depth to bang week after week with 6a-8a teams. Krefft has brought old school ic football back. Ic is working hard to be at the ScC level which dominated ihsa mid level state for years. Lots of young kids playing, 3 Sophs on starting o line. 5 Sophs starting on d.

 

[eagles2k3]

Strongly feel like ic is ready. This might be their best team ever but we'll never know how they match up since they play cupcakes all season. Krefft has done an amazing job keeping the tradition going!


Ic football is ready, the rest of the school sports has to be in line. Limit the crossovers to one conference up, great fit for all. Ic played Mac, Laurence, gbs and rb. As a 3A school not enough depth to bang week after week with 6a-8a teams. Krefft has brought old school ic football back. Ic is working hard to be at the ScC level which dominated ihsa mid level state for years. Lots of young kids playing, 3 Sophs on starting o line. 5 Sophs starting on d.

I think the rest of the major sports are there as well. Ic basketball has had some solid teams too... I feel like ic is at the same place where montini was about 6-7 years ago. Raising their level of play to where they have outgrown their conference. I wasn't excited about ic leaving the scc but I think I understand what they were trying to do. Develop into a consistent winner where they can then move back into the catholic league. The time is right for ic to get back to their roots.

 

[mchsalumni]

Would love to see IC in the CCL. Old school, plodding/pounding offense. Square peg needs to find the square hole.

 

[mchsalumni]

Dunno. Maybe.

I will say this about Benet, though. I think they run one of the best private school athletics operations in the state. They are at or near the top of just about every ESCC sport year in and year out and they compete very well in IHSA playoffs in other sports.

I also think that a very healthy and fun football rivalry would develop between them and Fenwick.

I'd say Montini would be more ready in football than Benet. I thought the jump should have been made this year. Other sports? Not sure, but their basketball program can hang in the CPL, so the CCL should be a no brainer.

 

[chirocal44]

New Would love to see IC in the CCL. Old school, plodding/pounding offense. Square peg needs to find the square hole.

Lol, they run the spread, very explosive. ... Old school meaning tough and disciplined football...IC hall of famer Jack Lewis style.

 

[mchsalumni]

Lol, they run the spread, very explosive. ... Old school meaning tough and disciplined football...IC hall of famer Jack Lewis style.

More what I meant, not necessarily running the veer or option old school. Tough and disciplined, yes. And Rowell has some insane numbers.

http://www.maxpreps.com/athlete/jordan-rowell/iHIVig85EeOZ5AAmVebBJg/gendersport/football-stats.htm

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

I'd say Montini would be more ready in football than Benet. I thought the jump should have been made this year. Other sports? Not sure, but their basketball program can hang in the CPL, so the CCL should be a no brainer.

Would they be ready for an 8 school top/large school division with 7 division games, a crossover game against the likes of CCHS, NDCP, Benet, etc. and 1 non con game?

 

[mchsalumni]

Would they be ready for an 8 school top/large school division with 7 division games, a crossover game against the likes of CCHS, NDCP, Benet, etc. and 1 non con game?

Maybe? I'd say more ready than Benet, no question.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

Maybe? I'd say more ready than Benet, no question.

I'd be happy to replace Red Wing with Bronco in that hypothetical division. I had Benet in there because I thought they had the enrollment that would fit in well in that division and keep it a 7A and 8A division. Also like them in the same division as Fenwick.

 

[chirocal44]

Would they be ready for an 8 school top/large school division with 7 division games, a crossover game against the likes of CCHS, NDCP, Benet, etc. and 1 non con game?

Nope not a chance .....not ready for those monsters...3a-6a more likely

 

[Cat Box]

Dunno. Maybe.

I will say this about Benet, though. I think they run one of the best private school athletics operations in the state. They are at or near the top of just about every ESCC sport year in and year out and they compete very well in IHSA playoffs in other sports.

I also think that a very healthy and fun football rivalry would develop between them and Fenwick.

Benet rivalry also with St. Francis in Wheaton and Montini in Lombard. Sparty (800) and Bronco (720) are smaller than Benet (1300) but Lisle is close to both.

 

[Cat Box]

Strongly feel like ic is ready. This might be their best team ever but we'll never know how they match up since they play cupcakes all season. Krefft has done an amazing job keeping the tradition going!


Ic football is ready, the rest of the school sports has to be in line. Limit the crossovers to one conference up, great fit for all. Ic played Mac, Laurence, gbs and rb. As a 3A school not enough depth to bang week after week with 6a-8a teams. Krefft has brought old school ic football back. Ic is working hard to be at the ScC level which dominated ihsa mid level state for years. Lots of young kids playing, 3 Sophs on starting o line. 5 Sophs starting on d.

I agree with what you and eagles2k3 are saying with one exception. The "timing" of things. I am not a big fan of changing conferences because a program is "up" or "down". A school needs to be in the right conference and stay there regardless of being up or down.

IC should have followed the SCC schools to the CCL like Aurora Christian did. Both are 3A schools that have had a lot of success - at times. AC won 3A titles in 2011 and 2012 (best teams ever - sound familiar?) and almost 3-peated in 2013. Then the bottom fell out with back-to-back losing seasons of 4-5 in 2015 and 2-7 in 2016. Is it time for AC to now leave the CCL since they've had a few down years? Find a conference that "makes better sense" for them? Absolutely not.

You go where you belong and stay where you belong. It's called commitment. When you have down seasons, you don't go to a weak conference until you become strong again, then move back to the CCL. You tough it out. IC and AC belong in the CCL. I would argue that St. Ed's and ACC do, too. The CCL isn't such a scary place if you have other schools your size committed to the conference and reduce crossover games vs. the Blue.

Time to shore up the CCL with former SCC schools first. Don't even talk about ESCC teams migrating over. Not yet. Get the family back together first.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

Time to shore up the CCL with former SCC schools first. Don't even talk about ESCC teams migrating over. Not yet. Get the family back together first.

The problem with that approach (adding just a handful of schools), is that there still wouldn't be enough schools to field competively similar and healthy sized divisions from top to bottom.

Without healthy sized divisions, you will still have pressure for crossover games. Without competitively similar divisions, you will still have schools that will refuse to be at the far low end of an imbalanced division.

There needs to be a critical mass to make things optimal, and adding only those former SCC schools doesn't get us there.

The winds of change are blowing. Private schools have become the minority scapegoat for all that ails the IHSA, and they will soon be shunted aside by the majority. It's long past time that we band together and realize our strength as a whole and stop settling for the fractional status quo. Far better to manage your own change than to let those who would marginalize you do it for you.

Give me the NIPL!

 

[DeanOfSelection]

The CCL would be greatly improved if there were more teams.
Step #1 - recruit IC, ACC, St. Eds and Wheaton Academy at minimum back to the CCL.
Step #2 - condense CCL from 4 down to 3 divisions, looks like this...

Blue - Loyola, Rice, Rita, MC, Provi, add Fenwick (6 teams)
Green - Montini, Marmion, St. Francis, DLS - add Larry & Iggy (6 teams)
White - Leo, DePaul, St. Joe's - add Aurora Christian and B-Mac (5 teams)

Plug IC, ACC, St. Ed's, Wheaton Academy appropriate into appropriate division.

Step #3 - eliminate Blue/White crossover games. A school with football enrollment of 400 kids should never play a school of 2000-3500. This will give the incoming schools the security they need to make the jump.

6 teams is ideal but Fenwick, DLS will not join Blue. Montini also declined.

 

[Cat Box]

The problem with that approach (adding just a handful of schools), is that there still wouldn't be enough schools to field competively similar and healthy sized divisions from top to bottom.

Without healthy sized divisions, you will still have pressure for crossover games. Without competitively similar divisions, you will still have schools that will refuse to be at the far low end of an imbalanced division.

There needs to be a critical mass to make things optimal, and adding only those former SCC schools doesn't get us there.

The winds of change are blowing. Private schools have become the minority scapegoat for all that ails the IHSA, and they will soon be shunted aside by the majority. It's long past time that we band together and realize our strength as a whole and not as fractions.

Give me the NIPL!

Ramblin - I agree with your point about critical mass. We are arguing for the same thing. The first step to achieving critical mass is dumping one of the 4 divisions and skinny it down to 3 divisions as such...

Blue - Loyola, Rice, Rita, MC, Provi, add Fenwick (6 teams)
Green - Montini, Marmion, St. Francis, DLS - add Larry & Iggy (6 teams)
White - Leo, DePaul, St. Joe's - add Aurora Christian and B-Mac (5 teams)

Then make one more key move. Add Immaculate Conception. Now you have 3 even divisions of 6 teams each. This would be a huge step in the right direction.

Now imagine the opposite. What if AC decides they are unhappy with all the mismatches and bails? Now things are going in the wrong direction. It is amazing how the complexion of things can change with the adding or taking away of just one school.

I will say it again, the key to success in the CCL is moving from 4 down to 3 divisions and adding teams - even if it is only one team.

 

[Oddy]

I don't see the advantage of taking perfectly good conferences and merging them into the CCL. Especially if non-con games would be intra-league. Don't like it. Why do it?

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

I don't see the advantage of taking perfectly good conferences and merging them into the CCL. Especially if non-con games would be intra-league. Don't like it. Why do it?

Don't call it the CCL then. Call it something else. Call it the ESCC if you want. I'm partial to the NIPL, but I really don't give a crap what it's called.

It really all boils down to this: Do you want to manage your own change or have it managed for you?

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

6 teams is ideal but Fenwick, DLS will not join Blue. Montini also declined.

Yeah, yeah, we know. I'm getting real tired of that situation.

This year, Fenwick likely would have qualified for the playoffs playing a Blue schedule. In the past four seasons, Fenwick has posted a 3-4 record against Blue teams in the regular season, with three of those four losses coming to Loyola. How the Friars got stuck playing LA 3 times in 4 yrs is a mystery. Regardless, Fenwick has proven that they can be competitive against Blue teams.

There are plenty of options.

Call Fenwick's bluff. Put them in the Blue and tell them to love it or leave it. Or, you can allow Fenwick to save face and expand the Blue beyond just adding Fenwick. Throw Montini in there and give them the same ultimatum as Fenwick. Force their hand. Make 'em play the hand they are dealt or fold it and leave the table. Seriously, where would those two schools go if their bluffs were called? You could try to entice Marist away from the ESCC and put them in the Blue as well. Or, just merge the two conferences and create the NIPL/CMC/WHATEVER, and start from scratch.

We are limping along and reacting to change. We are not thinking big and managing our own change.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

Blue - Loyola, Rice, Rita, MC, Provi, add Fenwick (6 teams)
Green - Montini, Marmion, St. Francis, DLS - add Larry & Iggy (6 teams)
White - Leo, DePaul, St. Joe's - add Aurora Christian and B-Mac (5 teams)

Then make one more key move. Add Immaculate Conception. Now you have 3 even divisions of 6 teams each. This would be a huge step in the right direction.

Go ahead and add IC into the Green, because they aren't going to either of the other two divisions. Also, you are forgetting about LFA. Add them to the White.

You are still going to have a situation where the Blue and White divisions are playing only five intra division games a season. Where do those other four games come from?

Again, with divisions of six schools, you are going to see schools from the Blue wanting crossover games against schools that don't want them. And the White will not want crossovers against anyone. So, assume just one crossover game or no crossovers for the White. Do you want to be the AD at AC or Mac and have to scrounge around for three or four non-con games each year?

You need to create larger divisions of similarly competitive teams. Doing so will give you flexibility and will make moving to the Blue more palatable for Fenwick or whoever you want to move in there.

 

[DeanOfSelection]

Go ahead and add IC into the Green, because they aren't going to either of the other two divisions. Also, you are forgetting about LFA. Add them to the White.

You are still going to have a situation where the Blue and White divisions are playing only five intra division games a season. Where do those other four games come from?

Again, with divisions of six schools, you are going to see schools from the Blue wanting crossover games against schools that don't want them. And the White will not want crossovers against anyone. So, assume just one crossover game or no crossovers for the White. Do you want to be the AD at AC or Mac and have to scrounge around for three or four non-con games each year?

You need to create larger divisions of similarly competitive teams. Doing so will give you flexibility and will make moving to the Blue more palatable for Fenwick or whoever you want to move in there.

My nefarious sources tell me Pats and Viator

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

My nefarious sources tell me Pats and Viator

That's nice, but all that does is increase the number of schools in the middle of the CCL pack.

Why are we taking these baby steps? I say go big or go home.

I was also thinking of a potential solution to the reluctance of schools to play in a division that's a step up. Borrow a page from the English Premier League. At the end of each year. switch the the bottom team in one division and the champ in the division immediately below so that, the following year, the defending champ gets to see what they can do in a more competitive division and the former cellar dweller gets a chance at glory in a less competitive division.

 

[DeanOfSelection]

Just go back to promotion like the CMC did after 2 years. ie in '98 Rice was dropped and PC was up. Marist was next to be dropped and JC up but it got disbanded.

 

[stonedlizard]

Quiz time. How many consecutive years did an SCC school win a state championship?

 

[Simon "GHOST' Riley]

Benet rivalry also with St. Francis in Wheaton and Montini in Lombard. Sparty (800) and Bronco (720) are smaller than Benet (1300) but Lisle is close to both.

CatBox,

I wouldn't say Benet has a big rivalry with SF or Montini. Sure they are right near each other but they don't compete in many sports. I mean it just isn't often they play one another in sports. I am pretty sure Montini had a series with them about 10 years ago and after Benet got beat real bad they said no to playing again.

If you are saying there is a rivalry between Benet and SF or Montini in getting kids this may be true. I think SF would lose more kids to Benet than Montini to Benet. The main feeder school in Wheaton is St. Mikes and I would say in a good year for SF they will get 70% of students. But there are years where Benet gets more.

 

[UlbKA91]

New Blue - MC, SR, LA, PC, BR, Fenwick, Montini,
New Green - DLS, SF, MARM, STL, BMAC, SI, ICC
New White - AChris, LEO, DPP, STJ, ACath, St. Ed, LFA as an ND-ACC type team

Marian of the Heights might be circling the drain but they might jump at the White Division if they are #8 to LFA #7, key is keeping the White at 6 or 8 to lessen need for crossovers.
Marist/Benet or Viator/Pats or other combo would be good as #8 Blue/#8 Green pairs, but Blue Green crossovers not as big a mismatch. And nows a good time for the west suburban schools to take advantage of downturn in the South Side Diaspora schools.

 

[MR. "T"]

Quiz time. How many consecutive years did an SCC school win a state championship?

12 years straight that they had a champion. 6 years during that stretch you had 2 champions a year, and 1 year 3 champions!

 

[mc140]

Only way to go is break up Blue and go by Geography. No one will ever join those 5.

 

[Cat Box]

key is keeping the White at 6 or 8 to lessen need for crossovers.

This. Exactly.

 

[mpercie]

IC will win big this weekend, ACC will lose big this weekend.

 

[ramblinman_rivals165935]

This. Exactly.

Six teams in ANY division creates the need to schedule 4 more games, be they crossovers or non-cons. Larger divisions allow conferences the flexibility to schedule fewer crossovers or none at all.

 

[Wassup13_rivals219252]

Only way to go is break up Blue and go by Geography. No one will ever join those 5.

SHG?

 

[mc140]

SHG?

So a school comparable to Montini that is 3 hours away would join the Blue but Montini would not? Makes sense.