The left's new story. It was the right wing that started the riots at Cal Berkeley

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
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Awesome. Keep us posted.

A question for you. Is it a problem when the left on college campuses including faculty, shut down speakers they oppose, frequently using violence? If so, does that bother you?
 

WVUCOOPER

Redshirt
Dec 10, 2002
55,555
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A question for you. Is it a problem when the left on college campuses including faculty, shut down speakers they oppose, frequently using violence? If so, does that bother you?
Sure, but it doesn't really move the needle for me. I can think of a few other things to care about.
 

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
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Sure, but it doesn't really move the needle for me. I can think of a few other things to care about.

It should come as no surprise that I take this much more seriously. Faculty encouraging students to disregard our fundamental freedom to protect them from speech they don't like. And at some of our very best universities. Are they preparing these kids for life? And when these kids become our future leaders, do they, like our forefathers, protect our basic freedoms?

Secondly, this is just a symptom of a much bigger problem. Diversity on campus. Ideological diversity. Schools are supposed to provide information on both sides of an issue and let the students decide. Not anymore. Students are receiving basically only one side, the side of liberalism. That is not education, it is indoctrination. Each of my 4 daughters have been exposed to this and it has had a big impact on many students.

Our future leaders. The country's future in the balance. Far too many people have fought and died for our Bill of Rights, our freedoms to let college professors hold sway.
 

moe

Sophomore
May 29, 2001
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It should come as no surprise that I take this much more seriously. Faculty encouraging students to disregard our fundamental freedom to protect them from speech they don't like. And at some of our very best universities. Are they preparing these kids for life? And when these kids become our future leaders, do they, like our forefathers, protect our basic freedoms?

Secondly, this is just a symptom of a much bigger problem. Diversity on campus. Ideological diversity. Schools are supposed to provide information on both sides of an issue and let the students decide. Not anymore. Students are receiving basically only one side, the side of liberalism. That is not education, it is indoctrination. Each of my 4 daughters have been exposed to this and it has had a big impact on many students.

Our future leaders. The country's future in the balance. Far too many people have fought and died for our Bill of Rights, our freedoms to let college professors hold sway.
When will you quit wetting your pants over this? I spent 4 years in college and no one "indoctrinated" me about anything and I seriously doubt that it is happening to a discernible degree now. If the masked "Black Bloc" folks with their flammable bombs etc. hadn't shown up yesterday then we wouldn't be talking about this today. These students aren't stupid and they know that they'd get thrown out of school if they got caught destructing property, assaulting police, etc.

The university blamed "150 masked agitators" for the unrest, saying they had come to campus to disturb an otherwise peaceful protest.
Two Berkeley College Republicans "were attacked while conducting an interview" on the campus on Thursday, UC Berkeley also said in a prepared statement. The attackers, who were not affiliated with the university, were taken into custody by UC Berkeley police.
Black-clad protesters wearing masks threw commercial-grade fireworks and rocks at police. Some even hurled Molotov cocktails that ignited fires. They also smashed windows of the student union center on the Berkeley campus where the Yiannopoulos event was to be held.

At least six people were injured. Some were attacked by the agitators -- who are a part of an anarchist group known as the "Black Bloc" that has been causing problems in Oakland for years, said Dan Mogulof, UC Berkeley spokesman.


http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/01/us/milo-yiannopoulos-berkeley/
 
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WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
28,197
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When will you quit wetting your pants over this? I spent 4 years in college and no one "indoctrinated" me about anything and I seriously doubt that it is happening to a discernible degree now. If the masked "Black Bloc" folks with their flammable bombs etc. hadn't shown up yesterday then we wouldn't be talking about this today.

The university blamed "150 masked agitators" for the unrest, saying they had come to campus to disturb an otherwise peaceful protest.
Two Berkeley College Republicans "were attacked while conducting an interview" on the campus on Thursday, UC Berkeley also said in a prepared statement. The attackers, who were not affiliated with the university, were taken into custody by UC Berkeley police.
Black-clad protesters wearing masks threw commercial-grade fireworks and rocks at police. Some even hurled Molotov cocktails that ignited fires. They also smashed windows of the student union center on the Berkeley campus where the Yiannopoulos event was to be held.

At least six people were injured. Some were attacked by the agitators -- who are a part of an anarchist group known as the "Black Bloc" that has been causing problems in Oakland for years, said Dan Mogulof, UC Berkeley spokesman.


http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/01/us/milo-yiannopoulos-berkeley/

You are but one person so your personal experience has little relevance to the discussion. This is happening on campuses all over the country.

Secondly, I am sure there were agitators there. But two things are important. One, there were over 1,000 people there. Were students also involved? and two, didn't Cal Berkeley have a responsibility to provide security knowing what was likely to happen?

Here is what was said prior to Milo's scheduled talk:

Berkeley Mayor Jesse Arreguin tweeted that Milo’s “hate speech” was not “welcome in our community.” UC Berkeley Chancellor Nicholas Dirks said that the university not only opposed Milo’s views, but also his ostensibly harmful presence on campus.

Consider this, from the Berkeley campus newspaper, the Daily Californian: while there were three arrests made Wednesday — two in connection with violence earlier in the day — only one of them was made by campus police at the protest itself, despite the violence. As for the city police, “[a]ccording to Berkeley Police Department spokesperson Officer Byron White, the city of Berkeley did not make any arrests in connection with the protests Wednesday night,” the Daily Californian reported.

In an open letter sent Jan. 3 to high-level UC Berkeley administrators, 13 faculty members urged the cancellation of his upcoming talk, and many more have since signed on to the letter.

“Yiannopoulos’ deplorable views pass from protected free speech to incitement, harassment and defamation once they publicly target individuals in his audience or on campus, creating conditions for concrete harm and actually harming students through defamatory and harassing actions,” the faculty letter said. “Such actions are protected neither by free speech nor by academic freedom.”

A student reporter who witnessed the Berkeley riots says he heard people in the “peaceful” crowd who were glad that violent agitators had succeeded in shutting down a conservative speaker’s appearance. From the NY Times:

It was clear early on that the majority of violent protesters most likely were not from the campus. Still, in the aftermath, I heard people say that peaceful demonstrations would not have succeeded in preventing Mr. Yiannopoulos from speaking.


Cal Berkeley shares culpability is this disaster.
 

moe

Sophomore
May 29, 2001
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This is happening on campuses all over the country.
Well your opinion on the matter means nothing either and I call ******** on your claim because it does not reflect reality. I doubt it they want anyone from the KKK to speak there either. Those people in that community and at that school are free to express their views and have done so. Obviously they had a bad feeling about the event and seeing how it turned out, they were right, it was a bad idea having him there. I can see that you have a soft spot for hate speech, maybe you could get Milo to speak in your community. Disaster? lol You should learn what a real disaster is.
 

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
28,197
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Well your opinion on the matter means nothing either and I call ******** on your claim because it does not reflect reality. I doubt it they want anyone from the KKK to speak there either. Those people in that community and at that school are free to express their views and have done so. Obviously they had a bad feeling about the event and seeing how it turned out, they were right, it was a bad idea having him there. I can see that you have a soft spot for hate speech, maybe you could get Milo to speak in your community. Disaster? lol You should learn what a real disaster is.

No, I have a soft spot for free speech, even hate speech. Since when did hate speech violate the first amendment. Either you stand for it or you don't. Kaepernick kneeled on the flag. In my opinion, that was extremely offensive to many, many Americans, equivalent to hate speech. But he had every right to do so.

Once you begin to pick and choose who gets to talk based on how you perceive that talk, we are in very dangerous territory. But increasingly I see liberals, like yourself, very comfortable with the silencing of speech you don't like and yes that is dangerous.
 
Dec 17, 2007
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You are but one person...

The last I checked that applied to you as well.

Take away the violence, we should all find abhorrent and rightly so, and you have another group of people on the other side of the issue who had the same right to protest the event. The 1st Amendment applies to them as well. Remember, it also include that little part about peaceable assembly (remember, I said eliminate the violence).
 

moe

Sophomore
May 29, 2001
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No, I have a soft spot for free speech, even hate speech. Since when did hate speech violate the first amendment. Either you stand for it or you don't. Kaepernick kneeled on the flag. In my opinion, that was extremely offensive to many, many Americans, equivalent to hate speech. But he had every right to do so.

Once you begin to pick and choose who gets to talk based on how you perceive that talk, we are in very dangerous territory. But increasingly I see liberals, like yourself, very comfortable with the silencing of speech you don't like and yes that is dangerous.
Ever get tired of being wrong? Apparently not. I could not give one **** about who talks when, where or what about. To me, the UC Berkley incident is not a bad reflection on the school because outsiders came to campus to cause violence and disruption, nothing to see here, keep moving. Be upset with the anarchists if you like, they caused the problems. Who said hate speech violated the first amendment? If no one said it, why are you saying it? If you can't find something to complain about, you invent it.
 

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
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The last I checked that applied to you as well.

Take away the violence, we should all find abhorrent and rightly so, and you have another group of people on the other side of the issue who had the same right to protest the event. The 1st Amendment applies to them as well. Remember, it also include that little part about peaceable assembly (remember, I said eliminate the violence).

Protests are fine as long as they are peaceful and allow the speaker to speak uninterrupted. But how many times this year and years prior, were conservative speakers either cancelled or simply not being permitted to speak due to mob rule? Even Obama mentioned how illiberal this was.
 

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
28,197
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Ever get tired of being wrong? Apparently not. I could not give one **** about who talks when, where or what about. To me, the UC Berkley incident is not a bad reflection on the school because outsiders came to campus to cause violence and disruption, nothing to see here, keep moving. Be upset with the anarchists if you like, they caused the problems. Who said hate speech violated the first amendment? If no one said it, why are you saying it? If you can't find something to complain about, you invent it.

You need to read you own posts:

I doubt it they want anyone from the KKK to speak there either. Those people in that community and at that school are free to express their views and have done so. Obviously they had a bad feeling about the event and seeing how it turned out, they were right, it was a bad idea having him there.

That is called a heckler's veto. The very antithesis of the First Amendment. We have no idea if only anarchists (e.g. non students) and/or students were involved in the violence and the forced cancellation. The campus forced to hosts to pay for security. The school should have provided such security since their own words before the event ginned up antagonism. BTW, the KKK, as abhorrent as they are, are granted first amendment rights, the same as you. Westboro Church, as abhorrent as they are, are given first amendment rights at the funerals of our soldiers. Only the left seems to want to silence speech with which they disagree through violent means. Wonder why?
 
Dec 17, 2007
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Protests are fine as long as they are peaceful and allow the speaker to speak uninterrupted. But how many times this year and years prior, were conservative speakers either cancelled or simply not being permitted to speak due to mob rule? Even Obama mentioned how illiberal this was.
One trend I've seen for a while is that when Conservatives don't get their way they love to point a finger at some outside agency; Liberals, RINOs, etc. The thought that "hey, maybe this is an unpopular point of view" never crosses their mind; preferring to know what is right for everyone. It happens inside the Conservative movement as well as outside, especially with the Religious Right.

Maybe it would be better for Conservatives to spend more time introspectively and spend less time whining about Liberals. I like some ideas that Conservatives bring to the table (mostly economic issues and national defense), and I'll admit that certain Liberal points of view appeal to me as well (environmental issues mostly). But the heavy-handedness of the Conservative movement is very off-putting; including you my friend.

Step back and smell the roses.
 

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
28,197
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One trend I've seen for a while is that when Conservatives don't get their way they love to point a finger at some outside agency; Liberals, RINOs, etc. The thought that "hey, maybe this is an unpopular point of view" never crosses their mind; preferring to know what is right for everyone. It happens inside the Conservative movement as well as outside, especially with the Religious Right.

Maybe it would be better for Conservatives to spend more time introspectively and spend less time whining about Liberals. I like some ideas that Conservatives bring to the table (mostly economic issues and national defense), and I'll admit that certain Liberal points of view appeal to me as well (environmental issues mostly). But the heavy-handedness of the Conservative movement is very off-putting; including you my friend.

Step back and smell the roses.

OMG, you complain about heavy handedness of the conservative movement and yet seem absolutely blind to the other side. Only one side is rioting. Only one side is preventing speakers from their free speech rights.

And so what if a view is unpopular? What are you getting at? Does that give someone the right to violently stop that unpopular view from being expressed? It seems in the process of stopping these "unpopular views" from being expressed, the left is determining what is right for everyone (as per your observation above).

Should libs be more introspective? Should they turn off their hatred, their vitriol? Should they be more open to other ideas? Should they be willing to let someone they reject speak?

The heavy handedness my friend is not coming from the right.
 
Dec 17, 2007
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OMG, you complain about heavy handedness of the conservative movement and yet seem absolutely blind to the other side. Only one side is rioting. Only one side is preventing speakers from their free speech rights.

And so what if a view is unpopular? What are you getting at? Does that give someone the right to violently stop that unpopular view from being expressed? It seems in the process of stopping these "unpopular views" from being expressed, the left is determining what is right for everyone (as per your observation above).

Should libs be more introspective? Should they turn off their hatred, their vitriol? Should they be more open to other ideas? Should they be willing to let someone they reject speak?

The heavy handedness my friend is not coming from the right.
You just told me that my opinion was wrong, pretty heavy-handed.

Buh-Bye!
 

WVPATX

Freshman
Jan 27, 2005
28,197
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You just told me that my opinion was wrong, pretty heavy-handed.

Buh-Bye!

Again, reading comprehension not your strength. Where did I say your opinion was heavy handed? I said the heavy handedness is coming from the left. Read the entire post and it is obvious to which group I was referring.

And is Buh-Bye you way of putting your fingers in your ears and running home?
 
Dec 17, 2007
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Again, reading comprehension not your strength. Where did I say your opinion was heavy handed? I said the heavy handedness is coming from the left. Read the entire post and it is obvious to which group I was referring.

And is Buh-Bye you way of putting your fingers in your ears and running home?

 

WVMade

Redshirt
Aug 23, 2016
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And this supposed "intellectual" liberal, served in the Clinton Administration. Does he really buy the crap he is spewing? Did conservatives start all of the other campus incidents where speakers were denied the chance to speak?

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...s-blaming-right-wing-violence-berkeley-riots/
Riot and a protest are not interchangeable words. If you don't know that look up the definition of both. Let's hear your evidence that an actual "riot", not a "protest" mind you, was caused by "the left" at U.C. Berkeley.
 
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moe

Sophomore
May 29, 2001
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I am left with no choice but to come to the conclusion that the left supports the suppression of free speech, congratulations.
lol You were there a long time ago but thanks for reminding us.