The New Lounge
- Thread starter hpnole
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What does this have to do with what I asked? All you did was got somewhat pissed off sounding, asked three questions and threw out some random, "you liberals!" stuff. Why didn't you just save yourself some typing time and say, "F*** you?" It would have made basically the same point.
Why?
Because they aren't stupid, and they see the obvious... that he is a blustering, incompetent idiot who kisses up to dictators and attacks American law enforcement, and who sows discord and disharmony.
Oh, and they aren't looking for votes.
I mean.... FFS, how much more proof do you need than the actual comments made by the current Republicans supporting him when they WEREN'T worried about votes? They called him exactly what all of us who oppose him call him...
Sen. Graham: “I don’t know who (Trump supporters) are and I don’t know why you like this guy.”
Sen. Ted Cruz: “Whatever (Trump) does he accused everyone else of doing. The man cannot tell the truth but he combines it with being a narcissist. A narcissist at a level I don’t think this country’s ever seen.”
Sen. Rand Paul: “My concern is that he would grab up that power and really treat the country as sort of his little bully fiefdom.”
Nikki Haley: “Donald Trump is everything I taught my children not to do in kindergarten.”
Sen. Marco Rubio: “Donald Trump has been exploiting working Americans for forty years.”
Lindsey Graham: “He’s a race-bating xenophobic religious bigot.”
Kellyanne Conway: “(Trump) says he’s for the little guy but he’s actually built a lot of his businesses on the backs of the little guy.”
Mike Pompeo: “Donald Trump said the other day that if he ‘told a soldier to commit a war crime he would go do it.’ ”
Glenn Beck: “I don’t think Donald Trump has even read the constitution, knows what’s in the constitution.”
Rick Perry: “(Trump is) a toxic mix of demagoguery and mean-spiritedness and nonsense.”
Sen. Susan Collins: “I just cannot support Donald Trump.”
Rand Paul: “Donald Trump is a delusional narcissist and orange-faced windbag.”
Marco Rubio: “Donald Trump is a con artist.”
Ted Cruz: “He doesn’t know the difference between truth and lies. He lies, practically every word that comes out of his mouth.”
Lindsey Graham: ”I think he’s a kook. I think he’s crazy. I think he’s unfit for office.”
And yes, we have never, in HISTORY, seen as many members of previous administrations of the same political party attack a sitting President. Bush I and II, Reagan... and not just lower level people, but actual CABINET LEVEL people. I mean, we have A FORMER CHAIRMAN OF THE RNC speaking out against him.
And we've never seen so many members OF A SITTING PRESIDENTS OWN ADMINISTRATION come out against him!
Go ahead, find me a SecDef or a SecState or a NSA who have spoken about a SITTING PRESIDENT THEY WORKED FOR the way Mattis or Kelly or Tillerson or Bolton speak about Trump... and those are just the top level guys.
It isn't because they are jealous of all of his winning, or because they are part of a deep state conspiracy, or because they hate America.
It is because they realize that Donald Trump should not be president.
And many of them realize it after having worked with Donald Trump more closely than anyone else on earth.
Look at what Ben Sasse said. Realize that it is the same stuff many of us who oppose Trump has been saying, and it is the exact same stuff that many Republicans have said about him when they weren't worried about pissing off his base, which Sasse doesn't have to worry about bc he will definitely win his election.
"The way he kisses dictators' butts. I mean, the way he ignores that the Uyghurs are in literal concentration camps in Xinjiang right now. He hasn't lifted a finger on behalf of the Hong Kongers. The United States now regularly sells out our allies under his leadership. The way he treats women and spends like a drunken sailor. The ways I criticized President (Barack) Obama for that kind of spending I've criticized President Trump for as well. He mocks evangelicals behind closed doors. His family has treated the presidency like a business opportunity. He's flirted with White supremacists."
This isn't rocket science.
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Of all those people thedude quoted, only Susan Collins will not be voting for Trump.
Who's pissed off? Certainly isn't me. Actually seems as though you're pretty upset at my post and all I did was ask legit questions.
I just find it odd that so many liberals think it should matter who others endorse for president. The only thing that matters to me on who I vote for, are my own thoughts and analyses of the candidates. Who celebrities, old governmental workers or armed forces people mean absolutely zero to me.
I'll ask it again. Why should it matter to me who others endorse?
My question wasn't inspired by the McRaven comments as much as it was by the dismissal of them.
A few of the conservatives I know who voted against him and will do so again cite pretty much the same three things, in various orders:
1) Do not like the climate of the country with him as president
2) Zero trust in him to serve the country in front of himself (or trust in him period)
3) Feel he has basically stripped away all meaning from being a conservative
Even in your post, you partially explain away military figures who criticize him as the result of him "rattling the cages of people who have been leaching off government money for years."
I never thought I'd hear conservatives categorize military folks as government leaches but here we are.
It shouldn't matter what somewhat else's opinion is. However, to use the example from his own cabinet, I do think if people who work directly for and with someone tell me, someone who has done neither, that the man can f*** up a one-car funeral, their opinion might be worth listening to.
There, I answered it. Your turn. Why do you think so many recognizable, name Republicans have come out in opposition to Donald Trump?
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You have to understand, these same people simultaneously say "I SUPPORT LAW ENFORCEMENT!!!" but then bash the FBI, which is law enforcement, as being part of a deep state plot to destroy Donald Trump.
Never mind that the FBI is made up of some of our most devoted and capable law enforcement officers, men and women dedicated to our country and our Constitution.
Can you imagine attacking James Mattis and Bill McRaven and Stan McCrystal nd John Kelly and all of these guys who have led our men and women in combat and in war, who have given their ENTIRE LIVES to our country, because they say things like "Donald Trump is a terrible president?"
Insane.
They are just delusional. Trump has broken the brains of so many of these people.
I don't know, and I don't care. I focus on policies. I don't care if the president is an ******* or the nicest guy in the world. I don't care if he yells at people or holds hands with everyone. I don't care what others think. I focus on things that will impact me and my family. That is the most important factor to me.
I've worked with many people in my career that I don't like personally. I thought they were ********. However, they were good at their jobs and getting things done and impacting the business in a positive manner. Just because they're an *******, should I not work with them? Just because other people don't like working with them, should that impact me and what I choose to do? Should that influence me at all? The answer is no. As an individual, I can assess those things on my own and come to my own conclusions.
The law enforcement thing is confusing, but not totally inexplicable. I would say it is similar to the bashing of the intelligence community (various reports show anywhere from 30 percent to 50 percent being ex-military) while simultaneously saying, "do we love our troops or what?"
At it's core, it's simply an environment that welcomes bashing of those who are either critical of Trump or those who report things he doesn't want to hear. It's made easier because the whole Trump-movement seems to be based in opposition to those his followers view as the elite.
Basically, a cop is OK because that is an attainable profession for most of his supporters. FBI? Nah, most of them couldn't get with the Bureau so they represent the enemy, the judgemental liberal elite, if you will.
Same thing when looking at being a Marine versus being employed by the CIA.
I might be wrong, but then very little makes sense of the face of the Family Values party being a guy who got caught raw-dogging a porn star at Lake Tahoe while his third wife was home caring for their newborn son.
Not everyone that is going to vote for Trump would label themselves as a traditional conservative. I am certainly not going to pretend that Trump hasn't flipped parties to whichever suits him at the time. He is more of an opportunist than a democrat or republican.
My opinions aren't based off of being a conservative more than anti establishment and anti liberal. People who fight for this country and spend their lives in the military deserve a lot of respect and honor. They are not above critique, however. And many of the generals and other high ranking military folks that have spoke out against Trump have monetary interests in war. They were for him when he was this loose cannon a button away from WWIII, but now that he has done the opposite, there is no war money to be had. That's not the only reason why they don't like him. He has also said some stupid things and disrespected many military people. I don't fault any of them for their disdain for Trump. That is not what I was saying.
Excellent point. Trump makes them feel like even THEY could become president... that they deserve it.
Yep... same as him saying that a POW war hero is in hell, or him pretending to be religious but not knowing how to reference a psalm, or saying things about his daughter being sexy and hot... things that his converts should really be against, but which they accept.
I thought he was crazy when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th ave and not lose support... turns out the guy is f'ing brilliant, when it comes to understanding blind loyalty.
But so many of the people who have worked with Trump since he's been in office have basically alleged that he's incompetent and puts the his own interests above that of the country.
When you hear people like Mattis, Kelly, Coats and so many others criticize him, the fact he's a terrible human being isn't usually the first thing out of their mouths.
You mentioned things that he does or enacts that will positively impact your family. What has he actually done that will impact your family?
What has Biden done to swing conservatives to him? What is he promising that tells people that he is the right choice just because he isn't Trump? What about Kamala Harris makes you feel comfortable with her being president in the somewhat likely event that Biden doesn't serve a term? Why are we supposed to base our decision on Trump the person?
The fact he isn't Trump is the biggest part of it. The fact that Trump has done nothing but divide and wreck this country in four years would make it an easy decision for me even if I wasn't a left-leaning individual.
None of Trump's rhetoric speaks to me. His call for a return to America's glory years doesn't sell well to my family.
My professional career and financial well-being grew just as much under the Obama administration as it did under the Trump administration. The fact that one didn't come with a leader who seems to embrace people who hate me makes the any additional market growth not necessarily worth it. I know someone on here laughed when I referenced not wanting to explain Trump's rhetoric and his "go back where you come from," stuff to my child but that's a real thing for me.
I don't have near the issues with Harris as a leader as I do Trump. I have a great respect for someone who has achieved as many firsts as she has. I agree with the idea that we must think about the welfare of the planet and clearly I don't think she's "weak on crime," based on the fact that she was a prosecutor. As far as the economy goes, I can only base on my lifetime and the Clinton economy was strong as was the Obama economy, once it got over the mess that was left to it. I have no economic fears for a Biden/Harris or Harris economy based on that historical precedent.
To go back to your initial question, yes I would think simply being the anti-Trump is enough for most sensible people. He has been an utter disaster as President and the only positive thing he can point to is a market that continued the trajectory it was already on when he took office. That's literally it. Almost any other accomplishment he cites can easily be fact-checked as anywhere from highly embellished to outright fiction.
Really tough piece about Donald Trump and his history of covering for, and aligning with, dictators.
And this is from the top conservative media outlet in the nation, which isn't shocking because there was a time when conservatives REALLY hated dictators.
And this is from the top conservative media outlet in the nation, which isn't shocking because there was a time when conservatives REALLY hated dictators.
That's cool. From my standpoint:
His tax cuts did very little for me personally, and all the other **** that goes along with him wasn't worth the handful of dollars a paycheck.
Corporate entities, especially ones who provide services that can affect the well-being of the humans, need regulating. Trump's habit of putting people in cabinet positions that oversee areas of life they are diametrically opposed to is a head-scratcher.
I'm a liberal, so you got me there. Personally I like a mix of people on benches. What I don't understand is that the Senate held so many federal spots open from 2013 to 2017, conservatives could have gotten anyone in the White House and they filled the vacancies. They didn't have to mortgage their values to do so.
Military? So you think the military was weak prior to Trump. I mean, I know what he says, but he also asked about nuking a hurricane.
What was the military weak in comparison to?
The idea that the military was weak before Trump and that he somehow changed that is ridiculous.
As for Trump being good for our wallets... sure. That's the ticket.
As it relates to the economy and finance, you and I both know you should probably just sit this one out...
No matter which side of the political spectrum you fall this is completely unacceptable and the man should be reprimanded for it. The story states the department plans to, but as we know this will probably amount to a slap on the wrist for the officer in question. Personally, I would fire him, but that's me:
https://www.newsandguts.com/video/m...HJSRHoHrD09o7k0mpCNkqV4WV-57U8AHWGwCBy9CkmWI4
https://www.newsandguts.com/video/m...HJSRHoHrD09o7k0mpCNkqV4WV-57U8AHWGwCBy9CkmWI4
Thank you for your response. I don't share the same opinions, but I can see where some people form some of the opinions that you have. I personally think that a lot of the divisive stuff and stuff about him being a disaster for our country is overblown and no offense, a little dramatic. It would seem that you, like many others are voting with your feelings. I am not like that. That may seem like an insult and in some cases it is used as an insult, but that's not what I am trying to do.
He should be reprimanded and it was absolutely inappropriate. But give me a break with this being voter intimidation. Jesus Christ. How soft are we? Because he has a badge and a gun somehow that means he is intimidating people? How is it possible that he even knows who people are voting for? I am sorry, but this is some soft batch cookie **** here.
I would hope so, but I am sure some Trump folks will see no problem with it.
A cop should know better.
Also shaking my head at the actual mask. Trump mask on a cop at a polling place is bad enough, but a No ******** mask? Come on... get a clue, and not just because ******** defines Don.
this garbage is also part of the reason why the third party candidate voters should get off the fence and do everything in their power to keep Drumpf from getting another term. We can't keep going down this road and while it has never been rainbows and lollipops, what we have seen over the past four years is terrifying. Right now, a third party vote is, quite frankly a vote for Trump, and we can't afford to throw votes away.
There is a reason that there are strict rules about what can be done at the polls and how close the candidates surrogates can get to the voters. You may not be intimidated but I can think of a lot of people who would be.
It was inappropriate and he should be reprimanded or even charged with a misdemeanor. That's about as far as you can take it. We really have to stop acting like everything is terrifying, everything is so bad we can't even go outside. OMG a police officer who has a badge and a gun has a Trump mask on. I am so scared that if I don't vote for Trump he might shoot me. Give me a break man. Who is intimidated by this?
Personally, I would laugh at that guy and walk on in to vote. I wouldn't let anyone stand in the way of me voting. That said, I do know some older folks who would be put off by someone like this and rethink voting because of it. I went today to vote and was accosted by a very aggressive Trump guy walking in. I politely spurned him and continued on my way. So, it doesn't faze me, but that's me.
Wow. Are you that much of a puss? I’m sure you wouldn’t any issue if it were a Biden mask. But then again, no conservative is that much of a snowflake to say it’s voter intimidation.
Good grief. You libs are something else. Lol.
A vote for Trump, is a vote for Trump. A vote for Biden, is a vote for Biden. A vote for Hawkins, is a vote for Hawkins. A vote for Jorgensen, is a vote for Jorgensen. See the pattern here? I despise voter shaming. People should vote for whomever they please. This includes those I disagree with. That's what it is all about in the end. Vote your values.
I guess you missed the response where I said that it personally wouldn't stop me. Awesome to see you immediately went with a personal attack on my masculinity though. I guess we all can't be "tough" like Trump. Of course, I'd much rather be a ***** than be "tough" like Trump. Because unlike Trump, a ***** is strong, resilient, and tough as hell.
I didn't take offense with anything you said. To my recollection, you've been respectful with me any time we have interacted.
I don't think it's overblown to say has been an incredibly divisive President. Every speech he makes, every interview he does he basically reminds the audience that if you didn't vote for him or don't support him, he doesn't give a damn about you. That is divisiveness, not national leadership.
His candidacy and presidency is very emotional for a lot of people. I understand, why it wouldn't be for you, but again (it is my impression) that you fall into the demographic who is never the target of his (direct or veiled) rhetoric.
I've voted for multiple conservatives over the years, so I don't know if that shows more that I'm open to listening to what individuals can and will do, if I vote for who I personally like or if it shows some bridge between the two.
The reason I could never support Trump, or any of the minions who copy him, could probably be summed up in watching him, as well as Sen. Perdue of Georgia, mock the pronunciation of Kamala Harris's name. I know that plays to the type of folks who are showing up to his rallies these days, but I expect a higher level of leadership, specifically in public, from the President of the United States.
I definitely respect your opinion and your reasons to feel the way you feel. We just don't share the same concerns. Mainly because I am not one to put a lot of weight on words. Though I acknowledge that there is a lack of leadership when the POTUS speaks negatively about people, sometimes in vile ways. But, I don’t find that just because someone doesn't use rhetoric and insults, it means they would make a good leader themselves. I have no hope that Biden would be a better leader. But it is your right to support him.