I knew that mother17 for Arkansas was going to hit a home run. Why? Because everyone except for our coaches, who got outcoachedtonight, could see that Stratton had nothing left. He should have been out as soon as the lead off guy got on base. You DO NOT EVER allow a starting pitcher to lose a game like that. Disgusting. Piss poor. And don't get me started on our ****** jitters or why we overslide second base every game at least once. Just horseshoe.
This one is on Cohen
- Thread starter Todd4State
- Start date
continues his run for the most worthless player ever in MSU history. I mean that guy is completely worthless at everything baseball related. Norris should be our starter at first. Sick of #38, graduate already.
John, please quit being a dumbass!! When your best has given his best, hand it over to your best reliever dammit!! You are responsible for this loss.....ALL you!!!
John, please quit being a dumbass!! When your best has given his best, hand it over to your best reliever dammit!! You are responsible for this loss.....ALL you!!!
I gave him a pass on that last year because the bullpen was non existent, but Stratton shouldn't throw more than seven innings.
G
Goat Holder II
Guest
Just curious. Actually I'm not. I'm fairly certain some of you are just making up **** because you get emotionally distraught like a woman every time we lose. <div>
</div><div>I think you'd have a much better justification of your coach bashing if you concentrated on stupid baserunning and the insistance on playing terrible position players.</div>
</div><div>I think you'd have a much better justification of your coach bashing if you concentrated on stupid baserunning and the insistance on playing terrible position players.</div>
I'd love to hear cohens explanation, especially when he constantly says how the pen is the strength. O and Please get Collins out of the game!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He is anti clutch.
Everyone knows I do not care for Butch (along with other posters). But is Cohen making these decisions to leave/sub pitchers?
Whoever it was that decided to leave Stratton in the game, really is not thinking. Geez, if you were wanting to save Reed, put in Pollerena/Renfroe/Norris earlier.
Although, watching this Oklahoma/Oklahoma State game............. our team is fair compaed to them.</p>
Whoever it was that decided to leave Stratton in the game, really is not thinking. Geez, if you were wanting to save Reed, put in Pollerena/Renfroe/Norris earlier.
Although, watching this Oklahoma/Oklahoma State game............. our team is fair compaed to them.</p>
Stratton's the only guy right now that "eats innings". If you look at the 7th inning he only threw 9 pitches and he should've only thrown 5 if you take into account the two fielding errors on the infield. Don't care what they say, that wasn't a double. When you go to the 8th, the leadoff guy gets a double on a BP fastball where Stratton tries to get ahead. When Robinson comes to the plate he had a bad swing at the first pitch and Van Horn calms him down with a little talk. Contrary to what Dave Baker was saying, Van Horn was emphatic on telling Robinson to go to right field. (easy to read lips) The worse thing that happened was the pitch that was thrown. It was a fastball mid to out. So you've got a guy at the plate with right field on his mind and he gets a fastball up and away. It's just that simple. The pitch you'd like to throw there is a fastball in but with the wind blowing out to left and Robinson opening up on the first pitch takes that out of the equation. So at the end of the day, the thing that stands out for me is Van Horn realizing he had a guy at the plate trying to be a hero and told him to go opposite. It's the same thing as a football coach calling a play and telling the quarterback to "throw it to a certain guy". It takes the pressure off and doesn't make the hitter think. Which is exactly what you want when you're standing in the box looking at a 90 mph fastball. Don't think. Just play. Anyway I didn't think thats what beat us. Bottom line. When you fail to expand a 3 run lead on a night the wind's blowing out, you set yourself up for failure. And at the end of the day, you're going to need Pollorena and Reed tomorrow and Sunday. Yes you play to win tonight and I think that's what Cohen was trying to do with Stratton and Norris. Just sucks when the other guy gets the clutch hit when you don't.
Into that, but it still goes back to Cohen. The head coach takes the blame ultimately. Cohen has the right to overrule the other coaches, and Cohen does have input on the pitchers. It's not all Butch. It's no different than Dan and Les making a bad playcall.
Widespread Dawg said:
Is if he had a shutout or no-hitter going. But otherwise, don't let your pitcher get beat. I do agree with you about the hitting. Reed is our closer. Situations like that are what he is supposed to be for. We have enough of a bullpen to survive had we used Reed. Not having Parks in the lineup hurt as well.
Timely hitting was the reason we lost. Yelp, Stratton was left in to long, but in the seventh inning he was on cruise control except for our sorry senior leadership.
We had our chances, Thigpen gets a key hit with the bases loaded and we have a man on third and second and can't get another key hit which would have put us up 7-2. Also, maybe it's me, but I thought in the first inning, Thigpen cost us that first run, seems he just doesn't catch the ball enough, sure there are tough pitches but the ball is out of his mitt a lot. Not blaming him but he is average at best behind the plate, Vickerson shouldn't be playing in the SEC, Ogden has cooled down and seems to being what he was last year, non-SEC material. Collins is just plain bad another non SEC guy, Sheppard is a good outfielder but a ***** for a hitter. Johnson is another non SEC guy, just plain ****** leadership who shouldn't be wearing maroon and white.
Stratton pitched his *** off, he had three bad pitches that cost him the game, two to the same batter plus there may have been 4 hard hit balls off of him all night. Yea I would have taken him out with a lead off double, but in baseball **** happens. To me Horn won the game with a perfect bunt, then a freshmen pitcher (Norris) makes a bad inexperience pitch a breaking ball belt high to a 200 hitter.
Btw, I'm sure Cohen is second guessing himself, but to me his fault is in recruiting a terrible class who just shouldn't be playing in the SEC. Our pitching is much improved from last year, now he has one year to get some clutch hitters in the lineup or else.........before we all jump ship lets play the season out, we have some winnable games AFTER the SC series.
We had our chances, Thigpen gets a key hit with the bases loaded and we have a man on third and second and can't get another key hit which would have put us up 7-2. Also, maybe it's me, but I thought in the first inning, Thigpen cost us that first run, seems he just doesn't catch the ball enough, sure there are tough pitches but the ball is out of his mitt a lot. Not blaming him but he is average at best behind the plate, Vickerson shouldn't be playing in the SEC, Ogden has cooled down and seems to being what he was last year, non-SEC material. Collins is just plain bad another non SEC guy, Sheppard is a good outfielder but a ***** for a hitter. Johnson is another non SEC guy, just plain ****** leadership who shouldn't be wearing maroon and white.
Stratton pitched his *** off, he had three bad pitches that cost him the game, two to the same batter plus there may have been 4 hard hit balls off of him all night. Yea I would have taken him out with a lead off double, but in baseball **** happens. To me Horn won the game with a perfect bunt, then a freshmen pitcher (Norris) makes a bad inexperience pitch a breaking ball belt high to a 200 hitter.
Btw, I'm sure Cohen is second guessing himself, but to me his fault is in recruiting a terrible class who just shouldn't be playing in the SEC. Our pitching is much improved from last year, now he has one year to get some clutch hitters in the lineup or else.........before we all jump ship lets play the season out, we have some winnable games AFTER the SC series.
up in the air with that 40mph wind to left field and some good things would probably happen. This is the weakest hitting bunch I have seen in Maroon in a long time. I know the bats have had a big impact on everyone but we just appear to be a bunch of punchers that can't drive a ball for ****.
I normally agree with you Todd and I really respect your baseball knowledge. But essentially in Stratton's mind frame he was essentially in a shutout. The guy threw 61 pitches the first 3 innings but only threw 41 pitches in innings 4-7. So you have your ace pitcher on the mound, he's in a groove (did you see the hammer he threw on the final pitch of the 7th to get the ground ball back to the box?), you've got the pen unused on a Friday, pitch count is only 103. I'm giving the 8th inning to my starter. Big difference in 8th and 9th inning. I completely agree with you that you don't let your pitcher beat you. But when you've got a starter that will max at 6innings on Saturday, and who knows what on Sunday, you've got to ride the horse till she bucks you. Anyway, I agree Parks not being in the lineup hurt. It gave Arkansas a "pocket for a left-hander" since Frazier was in the 9 hole, Bradford in leadoff, followed by Collins. I thought there were two big
plays tonight. The 2nd wild pitch in the first (Thigpen normally makes that play on a short hop). Runner scores on ground ball. And then Bradford's K right after Frazier's RBI single. But you can't go crazy on Bradford because it was left on left and the guy nutted up and threw the fastball by him when you know CT has to be looking hook. Arkansas was conceding the run so you just have to put it in play. Plus if Bradford gets a base knock you've blown the game open a little. Same scenario at Georgia 2 weeks ago with bases loaded and no outs. Sacks packed and Collins comes to plate left on left. Then Parks becomes the big AB and he strikes out. Thus the pitcher gets back "in his rocking chair". One out strikeouts with a runner at 3rd are killers. Today is a big day for us. If we can survive through next Sunday I think we're ok. Only thing I worry about is the freshmen hitting the 40-gams wall.
plays tonight. The 2nd wild pitch in the first (Thigpen normally makes that play on a short hop). Runner scores on ground ball. And then Bradford's K right after Frazier's RBI single. But you can't go crazy on Bradford because it was left on left and the guy nutted up and threw the fastball by him when you know CT has to be looking hook. Arkansas was conceding the run so you just have to put it in play. Plus if Bradford gets a base knock you've blown the game open a little. Same scenario at Georgia 2 weeks ago with bases loaded and no outs. Sacks packed and Collins comes to plate left on left. Then Parks becomes the big AB and he strikes out. Thus the pitcher gets back "in his rocking chair". One out strikeouts with a runner at 3rd are killers. Today is a big day for us. If we can survive through next Sunday I think we're ok. Only thing I worry about is the freshmen hitting the 40-gams wall.
I would also like to add that I, for one, am SICK of us trying to steal. Not only are we stealing at stupid times, whoever it was in the 6th or 7th that tried to steal second had about a 2 inch lead on the first base bag. WHY IN THE HELL WOULD YOU SEND HIM TO STEAL SECOND??? We did that against Auburn and Florida. Why would you sacrifice a baserunner in a tight game, especially we got a walk the very next pitch???? I mean there wasn't even a chance he was going to make it to second without getting picked, and their catcher didn't even make a good throw. So instead of maybe hanging on an inning with 2 guys on base and one out, we get stupid and try to steal and get picked by 2 months and end up with a guy on first with 2 outs. Changes the situation a lot. I don't get it.
J
JimHalpert.nafoom
Guest
but he left Stratton in too long against Georgia too. You criticizing anyone for posting emotionally is hilarious.
The only thing we disagree on is when Stratton should have been taken out. In addition to the fact that we were facing their top home run guy, who was also two for three at that point off of Stratton- That also factored in to my comment. Reed would have only had to get five outs. He probably could have been used on Sunday as well.
You say there is a big difference in the 8th and the 9th. I don't agree with that. Stratton was up in his pitch count and it was time to end the game by bringing in Reed.
Who do you think has a better chance of getting the 5 outs needed? A pitcher that is up in the count that they have seen for seven innings, or our closer that has been on his game? It is not even a question.
We can blame it on timely hitting all we want and I agree that we need timely hitting. Here is a news flash for you, we suck at the plate, especially with runners in scoring position. Your job as a coach is to realize that you are probably not going to put any more runs on the board, or at least that you cannot count on that.
You are going to have to beat them on the mound and in the field. My problem is that we had that opportunity and Cohen did not set us up to win by bringing in Reed. Caleb could have easily thrown for 5 outs and then thrown again this weekend.
I am amazed that this is even being debated. Caleb Reed is a CLOSURE, what the hell do we have a closure for?
Who do you think has a better chance of getting the 5 outs needed? A pitcher that is up in the count that they have seen for seven innings, or our closer that has been on his game? It is not even a question.
We can blame it on timely hitting all we want and I agree that we need timely hitting. Here is a news flash for you, we suck at the plate, especially with runners in scoring position. Your job as a coach is to realize that you are probably not going to put any more runs on the board, or at least that you cannot count on that.
You are going to have to beat them on the mound and in the field. My problem is that we had that opportunity and Cohen did not set us up to win by bringing in Reed. Caleb could have easily thrown for 5 outs and then thrown again this weekend.
I am amazed that this is even being debated. Caleb Reed is a CLOSURE, what the hell do we have a closure for?
G
Goat Holder II
Guest
No use in splitting hairs. In the end it's a crapshoot. You leave him in and get beat and you're too hardheaded to go to your CLOSER. You go to your CLOSER and they get a ball up in a 20 mph jet stream and you're an idiot for pulling your pitcher who's in a groove and thrown only 103 pitches and 41 in the past 4 innings. Not 123. Kinda like a basketball team cutting up a defense on dribble penetration and the coach goes to a 2-3 zone. First time somebody hits a 3 , some guy behind the bench yells "why in the hell are we in a zone." Like Crash Davis says, "sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, and sometimes it rains." Hell I wish it would've rained in the top of the 8th. Then it's clearcut you come out with Reed in the 8th. I would almost guarantee if you had talked to Butch Thompson after the 8th he would've said "we should've gone to the pen". In the end we didn't. I was mad as hell and evidently so were you. You know why, we give a ****. Which is a dramatic improvement over the past few years.