Was Polk right?
- Thread starter Maroon Blood
- Start date
I mean I am very glad we didn't hire Raffo... but unfortunately I think Cohen is one of those hires that wouldn't have happened before the Internet... Fans look at one thing and don't always understand the reasons a team won or not.. I think message-boards were very involved in the hirings of Diaz (to MSU not UT) and Cohen... batting .500 I guess.
I am baffled that Cohen ever made it to SEC baseball coaching ranks, much less actually had success.
I am baffled that Cohen ever made it to SEC baseball coaching ranks, much less actually had success.
into the depths of hell.
Why do I say that? If we had followed Polk's wishes, guess who was going to stay around? Polk. He was actually going to build a replica of his office next to the head coaches office. Raffo was Polk's "yes man". That also meant that Russ McNickle would have stayed around, which would have actually been the worst thing of all. It also would have opened the door to the possibility of Polk III.
The ONLY way we were ever going to ever start to move forward was to get rid of that regime completely. Regardless of who we hired as the next head coach.
Short term, Raffo might have done better than Cohen- depending on how badly McNickle would have ruined the pitching staff. Long term, no. I don't think that Raffo would have put together two top 25 recruiting classes in a row, either. And the reality is, the only way that we're going to win is with good players- no matter who the coach is. We're at the point now where we have some talented players on campus and playing- Stratton, Norris, Bradford, Renfroe, Demarcus Henderson, Stark, Wes Rea and etc., but now we are at the point where we have to develop them. They just need experience now. That will come.
Why do I say that? If we had followed Polk's wishes, guess who was going to stay around? Polk. He was actually going to build a replica of his office next to the head coaches office. Raffo was Polk's "yes man". That also meant that Russ McNickle would have stayed around, which would have actually been the worst thing of all. It also would have opened the door to the possibility of Polk III.
The ONLY way we were ever going to ever start to move forward was to get rid of that regime completely. Regardless of who we hired as the next head coach.
Short term, Raffo might have done better than Cohen- depending on how badly McNickle would have ruined the pitching staff. Long term, no. I don't think that Raffo would have put together two top 25 recruiting classes in a row, either. And the reality is, the only way that we're going to win is with good players- no matter who the coach is. We're at the point now where we have some talented players on campus and playing- Stratton, Norris, Bradford, Renfroe, Demarcus Henderson, Stark, Wes Rea and etc., but now we are at the point where we have to develop them. They just need experience now. That will come.
G
Goat Holder II
Guest
and Cohen is the right man for the job if for no other reason than the fact that's recruiting at a high level. Look at all the teams we've played - they've all "looked" the part better than us. And we're still 14-6.
One thing though, Cohen whiffed with the JUCO guys taking up scholarships in his first class. In hindsight, we should have gotten high school guys instead of Shepherd, Thigpen, Johnson, etc. - Cohen probably thought we had a chance to win immediately (mistaking Polk's talent he inherited). And damn how much would Runey Davis and Corey Dickerson be helping us right now.
We just have to rebuild the roster. That's it. Now, looking at the idiotic baserunning at times, I think Cohen's taking big risks to try and get wins against these teams with more talent. I don't think we'll be a contender again until 2013 - and there's not a damn thing any other coach could do better right now.
One thing though, Cohen whiffed with the JUCO guys taking up scholarships in his first class. In hindsight, we should have gotten high school guys instead of Shepherd, Thigpen, Johnson, etc. - Cohen probably thought we had a chance to win immediately (mistaking Polk's talent he inherited). And damn how much would Runey Davis and Corey Dickerson be helping us right now.
We just have to rebuild the roster. That's it. Now, looking at the idiotic baserunning at times, I think Cohen's taking big risks to try and get wins against these teams with more talent. I don't think we'll be a contender again until 2013 - and there's not a damn thing any other coach could do better right now.
...after 20 games played, with 28 league games left to play. Who knows.
After all, I vividly remember Polk claiming that Raffo was full of tiger blood & Adonis DNA. And nobody listened.
After all, I vividly remember Polk claiming that Raffo was full of tiger blood & Adonis DNA. And nobody listened.
re-emerge?....the "Sleeping Giant" I'm referring to is our baseball fanbase that back in the day, dwarfed everybody else...
it drew players from all over to come play in front of the biggest crowds in college baseball...
it provided funds that gave us a stadium unsurpassed..
I don't see us getting back to dominating on a regular basis unless we can once again set ourselves apart from the rest of the league with crowd numbers and that atmosphere we had that right now is gone
I still think the sleeping giant is alive... if we had been having seasons even like ole miss has been having, I think those 10k crowds would still be rolling in on a regular basis.... what say you?
it drew players from all over to come play in front of the biggest crowds in college baseball...
it provided funds that gave us a stadium unsurpassed..
I don't see us getting back to dominating on a regular basis unless we can once again set ourselves apart from the rest of the league with crowd numbers and that atmosphere we had that right now is gone
I still think the sleeping giant is alive... if we had been having seasons even like ole miss has been having, I think those 10k crowds would still be rolling in on a regular basis.... what say you?
Back in the Day!...Only Polk, MSU and a few others really cared about College Baseball.Now most of the SEC is into baseball, and it is, and will continue to be more difficult for MSU to take the position that it once enjoyed. But, not impossible.
Disclaimer: MSU played baseball before Polk arrived.
Disclaimer: MSU played baseball before Polk arrived.
I called Raffo in the winter of 2004 and told him who I was. I explained to him Ihad 4 legit D-1 prospects on my squad that were Soph's and that I would help all I could to steer them to State. Tried to rally him to get in touch with them and get them interested in State.
His reply? Get them over to campus for camp so we can evaluate them. I said I would try, but he really needed to get over to visit. He said he would try.
I made two more calls, and each time it was about getting them on campus to camps. When they didnt go, he and Polk never contacted them or me their last 2 years.
2 of them pitched at LSU- one of those beating us in Starkville. He actually ended up transferring to UPig and pitching for them too.
Another is one of NW State's all-time best players (he went there and turned down others offers because his brother played at NW St)and is now in the Pirates farm system.
What Polk and Raffo did to our program the last few years is just a damn shame- and its sad Cohen has to bear the burden of such a rebuilding job
His reply? Get them over to campus for camp so we can evaluate them. I said I would try, but he really needed to get over to visit. He said he would try.
I made two more calls, and each time it was about getting them on campus to camps. When they didnt go, he and Polk never contacted them or me their last 2 years.
2 of them pitched at LSU- one of those beating us in Starkville. He actually ended up transferring to UPig and pitching for them too.
Another is one of NW State's all-time best players (he went there and turned down others offers because his brother played at NW St)and is now in the Pirates farm system.
What Polk and Raffo did to our program the last few years is just a damn shame- and its sad Cohen has to bear the burden of such a rebuilding job
that being that Raffo was just an extension of Polk. I mean that's all Raffo knew. He had played for and coached under ONLY Ron Polk. It only makes sense he would have run the program in a manner similar to Polk including his recruiting philosophy. I'm sorry but at the time Cohen was hired I believe our program deserved something better than that. Now it may turn out that Cohen won't work out but nobody will ever convince that Raffo would have gotten the job done that we wanted in any form or fashion.
G
Goat Holder II
Guest
Our fans are just sick of us losing. Our attendance has been pathetic ever since McMahon left. Then suddenly, we set the Super Regional record for attendance. Our fans just need something to show up and cheer for right now.
I showed up a few weekends ago, and all I saw was a pathetic crowd, an ugly field, terrible base running, and a team that may contend in 2 years.
I showed up a few weekends ago, and all I saw was a pathetic crowd, an ugly field, terrible base running, and a team that may contend in 2 years.
Because I think I know where you are coming from with yours.
I know that Raffo was looking at other pitching coaches. In fact, one of them was Butch Thompson. So, you are correct that he was looking at other people.
But, Polk is very loyal to his people, and when it came time for Raffo to make a change, you better believe that Polk is going to be in McNickle's corner. We all saw the hissy fit he pitched when we didn't pick Raffo- that's what Tommy would have had to deal with by getting rid of McNickle. Remember- one of Polk's reasons for picking Raffo was because then "the other assistants wouldn't have to look for jobs". That was in Polk's resignation letter that was made public a few years ago. Getting rid of McNickle also would have meant that Raffo would have to deal with Polk's croonies.
I know that Raffo was looking at other pitching coaches. In fact, one of them was Butch Thompson. So, you are correct that he was looking at other people.
But, Polk is very loyal to his people, and when it came time for Raffo to make a change, you better believe that Polk is going to be in McNickle's corner. We all saw the hissy fit he pitched when we didn't pick Raffo- that's what Tommy would have had to deal with by getting rid of McNickle. Remember- one of Polk's reasons for picking Raffo was because then "the other assistants wouldn't have to look for jobs". That was in Polk's resignation letter that was made public a few years ago. Getting rid of McNickle also would have meant that Raffo would have to deal with Polk's croonies.
McNickle was already going to leave
In fact, he had planned on not being back for the 2008 season but some things fell through at the last minute
Raffo would have brought in a new pitching coach ... it would not have been Butch Thompson either
But that is water under the bridge
Raffo was not the correct hire .... Very doubtful that the current coach was the correct one, either
In fact, he had planned on not being back for the 2008 season but some things fell through at the last minute
Raffo would have brought in a new pitching coach ... it would not have been Butch Thompson either
But that is water under the bridge
Raffo was not the correct hire .... Very doubtful that the current coach was the correct one, either
Nothing brings people out more than a winning baseball team. I think baseball is a huge part of MSU- I think it always will be. We still to this day have more fans that follow it than a lot of schools- even SEC schools. We probably have three times as many threads about baseball on this board than most schools.
BUT you have to give people something worth watching. Who wants to drive two hours from Jackson or even further to see a bunch of toolsheds make a bunch of errors and look like chumps? I think the average fan right now is "I'll go watch them play SBW, but that's about it". Once we start beating teams that are good, people will show up.
I have absolutely no doubt about that.
Also, we have an organization that is forward thinking now and is willing to spend money. That's why the stadium is in the shape that it is in.
BUT you have to give people something worth watching. Who wants to drive two hours from Jackson or even further to see a bunch of toolsheds make a bunch of errors and look like chumps? I think the average fan right now is "I'll go watch them play SBW, but that's about it". Once we start beating teams that are good, people will show up.
I have absolutely no doubt about that.
Also, we have an organization that is forward thinking now and is willing to spend money. That's why the stadium is in the shape that it is in.
the fan base will wake up and start putting up attendence numbers far above all the rest in the league... we will once again be known for that and we'll end up winning some crucial recruiting battles because of it..
those last regional numbers we put up were flat out sick.. the advantage I see with us potentially is that we could lead the league by far in attendence just by finishing above .500 in SEC play... putting more fans in the seats than the teams at the top of the league... after that happens, we're on our way to dominating again
there's just something about the MSU baseball fan base like no others in my opinion..
those last regional numbers we put up were flat out sick.. the advantage I see with us potentially is that we could lead the league by far in attendence just by finishing above .500 in SEC play... putting more fans in the seats than the teams at the top of the league... after that happens, we're on our way to dominating again
there's just something about the MSU baseball fan base like no others in my opinion..