WVSPORTS.COM West Virginia QB Marchiol will be ready if Greene can't suit up
- Thread starter Vernon
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He's never won 3 straight here and he's never beaten Texas Tech. Odds are not with him.
Agreed. Nicco was heavily recruited and highly rated. Need to open the offense up. Don’t understand why it wasn’t opened up for him against Pitt, especially if we truly had an open qb competition this past offseason, but whatever the case, now is the time.
It wasn't opened up as WVU was dominating the line of scrimmage with the run game and the goal of every game is to win, regardless if it is flashy or can satisfy whining pretend fans. The goal is not to be the most explosive offense with the second string QB in a game the game plan was not set for him. Very simple if one has any knowledge of the sport.
There is a big difference between not opening the offense because the bland run game is chewing up yards and not opening the offense because you think the other team's offensive ineptitude will allow you to hang on for a win. WVU could've won against Duquense by kneeling the entire second half or only running between the tackles, but we didn't. The reason is obvious and you know it. Against the Dukes there was no fear of a loss if the offense practiced like it was a need to score situation. Against Pitt the staff was terrified, and likely justifiably so, that trying to open the offense had a much higher chance of losing the game than comfortably putting it away. The latter does not bode well.
Because the game plan was not featured for him. You just don't toss a QB into the mix with starters and say here you go. The timing will be off as well.
Not really as the back up does not practice with starting team nor game planned around him. Once they saw Pitt had nothing WVU was running well then no need to change. Had Greene still been in WVU would have scored double what they had if not more.
That proves my point. They were so scared that running an offense to try and put the game away carried more risk than just grinding out a bland offense and hoping a big special teams play or busted coverage did not bail out Pitt's hot garbage offense. If Greene can get on the field, but not run like he used to then Nicco is an equal or likely better option that the coaching staff will need to have faith in. If he is worse than Greene with a busted wheel, then this season is absolutely lost.
According to the experts on this board and the nation the season was an absolute loss before it began.
I appreciate the discussion but you are wrong with the opinion in my view and most that removes the hatred for the coach and can understand the big picture.
True. I'll admit I think the last 4 years are enough to say the writing is on the wall for Brown. Even if he can improve, it is highly unlikely to be to an average .666-.750 seasonal win percentage with an occasional magical shot to be in the playoff. But if new evidence presents itself, I am always willing to weigh it. So far 3 games into this season and I don't see how anyone can call it much of an improvement over last season which was worse than year 3 and year 3 worse than year 2. The next 2 games should give us a better idea when we play a home and away split with teams closer to average than the further ends of the bell curve as we have played thus far.
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Shouldn’t be the case with Nicco. Unless Nicco is THAT far behind. Is he not also considered a mobile qb? We still ran some qb RPO and designed runs. I fail to see where or why this offense would run any different between Greene and Nicco. Perhaps Greene is slightly more athletic while Nicco may be a better passer but that’s just my opinion. Guess we will see a glimpse this weekend.
How can you attribute my criticism to hatred of the coach? If Brown was suddenly winning 9-10 games and I were being just as critical as I am now, then that claim might hold water.
I had high hopes for Brown after being critical of Holgorsen. I felt Holgorsen had the ceiling of being on the cusp of competing for a conference championship, but never actually being able to deliver it. I also thought laziness was his limitation which is worse than incompetence/stupidity as the former is much more of a choice. Primarily I had hopes because Brown seemed to talk a big game in regards to discipline and fundamentals.
I'd love nothing more than for Brown to have success at WVU for WVU's sake alone. I just do not believe that WVU is such a low program that a competent coach should struggle to be better than .500 in year 5. History in the last 4-5 decades shows that it is vanishingly rare for a coach to take over a program, excluding those that have never been nationally relevant or those suffering a generation of irrelevance, to have significant success at that program when struggling to break .500 after year 3. That doesn't mean that same coach may not go on to have success elsewhere, but that doesn't help the current program.
Brown hasn't had a game where he at least made a top 10 team sweat. Hell Cignetti did that with Pitt his first year and then beat 11th ranked Maryland in his second. Stewart made top 10 Cincy sweat in his second year. Holgorsen (Tavon) made Oklahoma sweat in his 2nd year only to then beat Okie State and Baylor his 3rd and 4th years respectively. We all know what Nehlen and RR have done. No coach since 1950 at WVU has failed to either break .667 or at least threaten a top 10 team by year 3 including coaches not universally viewed as good in Cignetti, Stewart, and Holgorsen.
With all that history, how anyone can think Brown has a good chance to be on the level of Cignetti, Stewart, or Holgorsen currently, much less if he still can't clear .667 when this season is over, is baffling. And even if he defies the odds to be on slightly better than the aforementioned trio, that is still not worth keeping around.
For all of FBS:WVU is tied for 6th in the nation in rushing first downs
-WVU is 77th in total offense
-WVU is 29th in rushing offense
-WVU is 109th in passing offense
-WVU is 71st in scoring offense (our lone FBS win is against the 92nd scoring offense)
-WVU is 45th in total defense (see above regarding our lone FBS win)
-WVU is 53rd in scoring defense
That rushing offense or scoring defense better be top 10 if success is to be had with a 109th passing offense and 71st scoring offense.
You are correct, that was in year 3. That oversight on my part does not invalidate the entire argument which is Brown has still done less than what any coach at WVU was able to accomplish in their first 4 seasons within the last 73 years.
I was really happy to hire Brown, as I felt the exact same about Holgs. He was lazy and runnng on the previous success of WVU, and not really building upon it. But he was a decent enough coach to field a team who could compete in the upper half of the B12 most seasons though and in hindsite WVU is missing that.
Brown never will. He may get lucky here and there with a good season (7-8 wins), but this dude is a .500 caliber coach for the most part. I have given up on him not just because of his actual results, but also imo, he hasnt displayed the character of a winning head coach at all. He complains, makes excuses, whines, throws certain players under the bus. He obviously plays favorites in the locker room. His demeanor is not strong or leader-like at all. I cant imagine these kids getting very pumped up to give 110% effort for this guy. It almost seems like Brown doesnt even care sometimes. He would be gone already without the buyout. Anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding themselves.
And many people on this board are kidding themselves or are charlatans trying to convince people of what they know is bullsh*t.
Bottom line is that the WVU administration's goal and fan expectations should be to find a coach capable of replicating what Nehlen or RR accomplished. Brown's track record thus far, in light of historical data, makes him replicating what Stewart or Holgorsen accomplished highly unlikely. And even if he makes that unlikely accomplishment, it would still be noticeably below the goal. All data should lead a rational person to think Brown's coaching tenure at WVU is much more likely to be on par with Cignetti than Nehlen or RR. Thus he should be gone as soon as financially possible unless his teams get well above average real fast.
I still cant wrap my head around what it could be that some people have seen to make them think Brown is more than he has already shown himself to be? I have literally seen nothing, no evidence that makes me think he can field a team who competes in the B12 every year. Those fans can call me a bad fan all they want. At least I want my school, team, hometown and home state to have the best football team they can have. I want to win and be the best. Apparently to some folks, that makes me a bad fan,
The NIL doesnt just apply to WVU though. All teams are dealing with that. Yet TCU still played in the championship game last season. Kansas kicked our asses and would again this season. Why not WVU? Because of bad coaching thats why. No more excuses. This has been Brown's thing here, is excuses. Poor fella needs a loli and a plane ticket outta here.
You are correct. Those weren't much of a factor in his first 2 years, but much more the last 2. The question is does that mean it should take more or less time to see results? Or are you saying those limitations mean WVU should just expect to be worse than historically? Are you suggesting WVU is unlikely to find a better coach than Brown in the era of the NIL?
Let's stop dancing around the real questions.
Do you think Brown is on his way to accomplishing the same level of success as RR or Nehlen? If so why and why is it reasonable for him to be given much more time to get there? If not, why should he be held to a lower expectation?
You can't have a rational reason to think WVU is better off keeping Brown than hiring a new coach without having a reasonable answer to those questions.
don't feel bad for me..I'm fully aware that I'm a happier person than you are
a shiny new coach like Holgorsen..master of death and destruction of football programs..Houston is learning an expensive lesson...here's something rational...Donaldson and Lathan will transfer to a new school together, Gallagher to ND or Penn St, Nicco back to FSU where he verballed, J White to Pitt, T Ray to Miami
Let's see. One lefty one righty different sides for tackles. Yeah their same. The backup always gets 100 percent practice time with starting group. Yep identical twins.
How did TCU do in that final? I'll tell you it showed them how far behind they are and how lucky they were to get there. There was 7 games for TCU that could have been losses including WVU game.
And that’s just a dumb response, complete with misspelling they’re, but ok. We usually agree on a lot but I disagree here.
Never did I indicate that they are the same. I just don’t agree that it should have constituted throwing out the entire playbook. Was Pat White and Adam Bednarik the same? We managed to swap quarterbacks before without crippling the offensive game plan. Perhaps a good coach would be better prepared for the occasion his dual threat quarterback goes down.
Never mind the fact that we were two whole games into the season from a supposed open quarterback competition.
Ok teacher. Nothing like an a-hole to correct spelling better than spell check. Thanks oh mighty one but Root is the master spell checker.
I think you are 100% wrong. Pat White played during the season and often. Practiced with the starters and UL was not first time. How many teams go on to win after losing their starter? Didn't work for TCU a couple of years ago. Kansas lost their starter last year and fell apart after starting 6-0 and finished 6-7. I can name 100's that lost a starter and failed. Never mind you have no clue Greene was the starter from the beginning. Never mind that Greene was the game plan for Pitt game. Difficult enough to make 1 game plan let alone 2 different ones.
Bednarik and White both were RPO QB's. White was faster.
I would argue that Nicco and Greene are much more similar that Bednarik and White than you give them credit for. I’m also not talking about success vs failure. I’ll also concede that comparing any qb transition white Pat White involved is not fair, it was just the first that came to mind.
My main point and issue was the BS statement and approach by Brown once Greene went down. You don’t agree and that’s fine.
Since Nicco isn’t a RPO qb, I’m sure we won’t see any designed qb runs tomorrow or RPO in the game plan (assuming he plays)
You forgot to check my grammar and spelling teacher.
Nicco and Greene are not similar. Nicco can hit the mid range pass and Greene can not. Nicco is pass first run 2nd. Your main point is you hate Brown so therefore you hate every player on the team. Brown recruited them. Brown does a poor job at improving or using their skill sets. He will be gone soon and you can ***** at the next coach.
I didn’t say anything bad about any player on the team? Why are you so sensitive today Karen?
Also, I don’t hate Brown. I think he does everything right Sunday through Friday. It’s Saturdays that drive me nuts and his record speaks for itself.